Post/Author/DateTime	Post
wayward_sage 04-01-04, 12:16 AM	Hey everyone, Lets her some discussion about this one: A friend of mine told me the Wizards of the Coast store is shutting its doors in San Francisco, Ca. He says everything is 50% off! And, last i checked WotC books are selling for cheeper on barnes and noble.com. I've also heard that they fired a ton of FR writers and staffers!! Whats going on? Is WotC going the way of TSR? But primarly, why is WotC sitting on a goldmine of amazing character properties that could be devopled into very successful movies? Elminister? Drizzt? Azoun IV? and even beyond FR, like the Heroes of the Lance? The Dragonlance chronicles are ripe for a film adaption! Primarily i'm talking about FR characters. But all of their characters in general. In contrast, Marvel comics bungled their handling of all their comic properties in the 80's by licensing them to terrible film companies. But in the last few years, Marvel has really managed their properties toward a string of super successful films: X-Men 1&2, Spiderman, Hulk, Daredevil, Punisher, etc. Basically, why is WotC sitting on all its great characters! Lord of the Rings was a phenominal success. Fantasy has gone main stream people! Lord of the Rings proved that fantasy films can even rise to the realm of *gasp* the academy awards! I emplore WotC to be smart. Start finding filmmakers out there who will make faithful adaptions of its major iconic characters. Nows the time. There is a goldmine of characters they are sitting on. Find some screenwriters and start making deals. The D&D movie should not be the sign to shy away from the movie market. WotC should take it as a cautionary tale: good movies are about interesting characters. And people will go watch films about the iconic characters of Forgotten Realm and Dragonlance. Let the discussion commence.. JON
The Simbul 04-01-04, 03:13 AM	Lord of the Rings was a phenomenal success because the books were a phenomenal success. A faithful adapatation of the Forgotten Realms into a film (aside from being next to impossible since there is no over-arching single story, no single set of characters, or single primary plot in all of Faerun that could be translated into a maketable film) would only have appeal for a small group of fans and the occasional flocks of movie goers during key "blockbuster" times of the year.
Autosponge 04-01-04, 09:28 AM	Not to mention would probably not out-gross its enormous budget for special effects, costumes, and location.
Cunning Linguist 04-01-04, 10:58 AM	I don't know.. Movies are not that costly to make, unless you make them in the US. Take movies like La Cité des enfants perdus (The City of Lost Children (USA)) or Le Pacte des Loups (Brotherhood of the Wolf (USA)). These movies have everything a fantasy film needs, and it was made for 18 million dollars (La Cité des enfants perdus) and 28 million dollars (Le Pacte des Loups), while Lord of the Rings had a 300 million dollar budget.. that got expanded with another 93millon, and on top of that had a 150 million marked buget. You can make cheep movies, that look great.. but you don't need to spend 542 million dollars to make it work.
Faraer 04-01-04, 11:08 AM	It would be in WotC's short-term financial interests to sell Realms movie rights It might be in WotC's longer-term interests as exposure for their brands It's almost inconceivable that such a film could turn out authentically Realmsian, unlikely that it would be artistically substantial It would be damaging for the already grossly overexposed Drizzt and Elminster to be further fetishized and called out from hundreds of equally good characters on the big screen. 'Iconic character' is marketing cant, not anything actual human beings should respect or be concerned with.
Kossuth 04-01-04, 11:58 AM	Please don't say Daredevil and The Hulk were blockbuster movies.
Alac Luin 04-01-04, 01:54 PM	Originally posted by wayward_sage Hey everyone, Lets her some discussion about this one: A friend of mine told me the Wizards of the Coast store is shutting its doors in San Francisco, Ca. He says everything is 50% off! And, last i checked WotC books are selling for cheeper on barnes and noble.com. I've also heard that they fired a ton of FR writers and staffers!! Whats going on? Is WotC going the way of TSR? JON It's not just the Wizards store in San Francisco. I'ts all of them. They are getting out of the retail market. To call this mismanageing, while I understand the sentement, does not take the big picture into account. Lets be honest, only 1/4 of the store (if that) was actually dedicated to Wizards and became an outlet to sell board games from other Hasbro subsadies(sp?) (maybe thats just what I saw as it being a GameKeeper store, but they are cloasing also). Wizards wants to get back to focusing on designing the games we love and play, rather then selling someone elses games. As for WotC books selling cheaper on B&N web site has more to do with B&N then with WotC, enjoy the saveings.
WizO_BigSister 04-01-04, 02:26 PM	Hiya people. It's fine for you to say you don't like what is happening to the marketing/publishing side of the Realms, but please remember to try and follow the suggestions in the Guidelines thread (http://boards1.wizards.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=198299) Here are the relevent parts. Assigning Motives to WotC Staff, Writers and Designers I have a request for you all. When you talk about the actions of the various designers, editors, executives, authors and other assorted WotC staff please don't assign motives as outright statements. You do not know why they do things, you can only guess. Saying "I think that maybe they published this because of x, y or z" or "it looks as if this may have happened because the designers wanted to yis ok. However it is not to say "The editors made these changes because of x"... especially if what you are claiming to be fact is highly uncomplimentary. Yes, stating such an opinion as fact does not necessarily break the CoC, but depending on the nature of the opinion it may not only be against the rules it can even be libel! We know that making such "this is true" statements about employees of WotC often offends, irritates or down right infuriates them ... and we all want to see these people giving their input to the board. Let's not drive anyone else away. Remember when the CoC says you shouldn't harass people on these boards, that includes harassing writers and artists who contribute to the various books. Hey ... they are people too! Ignoring the concept of constructive criticism and being downright insulting or rude about someone’s work is harassment. Directing your comments at the artist or writer rather than at the work is also harassment!
wayward_sage 04-01-04, 07:38 PM	Libel? So, me discussing my opinions about WotC can be considered Libel? I know what libel is, and no people cannot sue you for libel for posting your OPINION on a bulletin board. And, if your read my original post I don't say anything insulting about anyone at WotC. I'm not talking about the writers and artists. Those are great people, I wish them well! In fact, my statement is directed solely at those in management. And that statement is constructive criticism. Also, responding to all the posts about the "tiny market and audience" the films would attract is wrong in my opinion. Hmm..i beleive theres another film out there based on a obscure comic book character comming out this summer....HELLBOY. It will make $, most likey quite a bit of $ if its decent. And i'll bet very few people in the audience will know anything about the comic book. So, saying that a character is not known by the wide audience means nothing. A good director and writer can introduce a character in 10 pages on paper and 10 mins. on screen. But since everyone on these boards keeps walking in circles, how about Dragonlance? It is perfect to make a film out of. In fact, the entire story is world ecompassing, and all of the characters play an important part in the story. The Chronicles would make outstanding movies. So yes, there are properties in Wizards libraries that could make them alot of money. JON
WizO_BigSister 04-02-04, 03:14 AM	wayward_sage ... that post was not aimed at you. Your name is not mentioned, and I didn't refer to any aspect of your post. Besides, in the vast majority of cases when I need to say something to an individual it is done in private. Experience has shown that in almost all the threads on this sort of topic end up with posts accusing management/writers/whoever of being idiots; or posts making highly uncomplimentary statements about maqnagement/writers/whoever's motives as fact rather than as opinion. That's why we had to write this particular section of the Guidelines. Since prevention is always better than cure, I posted a general reminder to all about what is o.k. and what isn't o.k. Moving this over to the general forum :)
Purple Dragon Knight 04-02-04, 06:07 AM	Originally posted by Cunning Linguist I don't know.. Movies are not that costly to make, unless you make them in the US. I agree... all films should, by imperial decree, be filmed in Canada. Especially RPG movies. Especially FR movies. And especially if they involve the Spine of the World or RAS in any way shape or form. Feast you eyes, mortals! http://www.western-leisure.com/pages/images/canadian%20rockies.jpg http://www.dragonridge.com/rockies/morainlake.jpg http://www.rockymountainphotoadventures.com/images/be-morain.jpg[/IMG] http://www.bbc.co.uk/50/destinations/banff_50/images/1.jpg http://home.planet.nl/~grijns/canada/can008.jpg http://away.com/images/guides/idea_images/rockies/250/11-Canadian-Rockies.jpg http://www.justamerica.co.uk/site/regions/pacific-north-west/gfx/81.jpg http://images.webshots.com/ProThumbs/51/21051_wallpaper280.jpg http://www.on-the-matrix.com/north_america/images/CanadianRockies_01.jpg// http://www.canada.co.nz/media/images/19-Alta-Rkies-canoes.jpg http://www.backofbeyond.ab.ca/images/rockwall_big.JPG
City6 04-02-04, 12:09 PM	Is it libel to say that in my opinion these boards seem to be becoming increasingly mismanaged, no doubt due to pressure from above (in my opinion, of course), and many of the recent actions (which we're not allowed to name, of course) are resulting in floods of users going to places like Candlekeep, which frankly (and in my opinion) don't seem to be run, like here, as an advertising space which is attempting to edit public opinion until it becomes completely unrepresentative? If a board's atmosphere becomes poisonous, let’s just pull the plug, or ban people until the only people left are those who are employed to be here...and not listen to why such a atmosphere has developed in the first place (usually shoddy quality control and disrespect to the customer through product line cancellation). In my opinion. Perhaps if those who worked here (unnamed of course....and in my opinion...) went to a board hosted (in my opinion) by a respected company know for its customer relations, such as www.bioware.com, there may be a few lessons to learn in basic board maintenance. In my opinion, of course.
Manshoon Prime 04-02-04, 12:27 PM	Purple Dragon Knight, I had no idea Canada was so...beautiful...so...breathtaking...so. ..lovely...I...I think...I'm gonna move... :D Ed Greenwood lives in Canada, doesn't he?
druid berrymore 04-02-04, 01:04 PM	Yup, Canada is stunningly beautiful...and the perfect location for the "Savage North".
Ranger REG 04-02-04, 09:23 PM	I'd rather shoot in New Zealand. Because after several hours of shooting up on the mountains, I can head down to the beach for some tropical surf and sun (not to menion, babes in bikinis). Plus, we can hire the same armorer who did LOTR. :smirk:
Purple Dragon Knight 04-03-04, 06:12 AM	Originally posted by Manshoon Prime Purple Dragon Knight, I had no idea Canada was so...beautiful...so...breathtaking...so. ..lovely...I...I think...I'm gonna move... :D Ed Greenwood lives in Canada, doesn't he? Yes, Ed lives in Canada too... Now that I think of it, I can probably estimate pretty accurately that there's at least 50% of Canada's population who are rangers... (if we tag a "national class," that's it) Even most city-dwellers (like me), run for the hiking trails come the weekend... Canadians are a lot like a bunch of Cormyrean rangers... obedient, generous, no-trouble folks mostly neutral good in outlook, but with a few LGs thrown in the mix to keep us in line with the Sembia... err... U.S. policies! :) (wow... lot like Cormyr and Sembia actually... Canada clinging to an outgoing Royal house and not minding being taxed until nothing is left in one's pocket while US putting their chips on the individual entrepreneur, new money, etc.)
davelozzi 04-03-04, 02:35 PM	Originally posted by Cunning Linguist I don't know.. Movies are not that costly to make, unless you make them in the US.... Lord of the Rings had a 300 million dollar budget.. that got expanded with another 93millon, and on top of that had a 150 million marked buget. Are you aware theat LotR was made in New Zealand, not in the U.S.?
Alac Luin 04-03-04, 07:08 PM	What I was reiterateing, and partly adding to some of my own stuff was stateing what apeared to be WotC's offical press statement that read something like (I'm working from memory here) We are getting out of the retail market so we can focus of Game Design (what I heard on NPR news in january of this year) I just wanted to qualify that what I said was based on this press statement :D
CzarGarrett 04-03-04, 08:04 PM	Plus, after the wonderous outcome of 'Dungeons and Dragons: The Movie', I don't know how many people would want to come anywhere near a D&D related movie.
WizO_BigSister 04-03-04, 08:13 PM	*edits thread!* You may notice a few missing posts from this thread. Thats because my request to stop the meta-board type argument about how the boards are run, and get back on topic fell on deaf ears :(
ender 04-03-04, 09:27 PM	Back on topic (as per request)... :) The idea of a FR movie is a good one, I think... if it is properly handled. (That's the key phrase, of course, because even a mediocre idea can be made into a good movie with the proper treatment, and a great idea can be tanked with improper treatment). On the same point, I have often wondered why WotC (or at least some subdivision of Hasbro) has not made more of an effort to market various aspects of D&D and its related products (such as FR). Even small things, like a harper pin. Or a hat with the FR logo. Keychains in the shape of various holy symbols. "Forgotten Realms the breakfast cereal! Forgotten Realms the coloring book! Forgotten Realms the FLAME THROWER!" :D I can only assume that they have good reasons for not doing so; I make no claims to understand business or the deceisons pertaining thereof. Personally, I would welcome some small merchandising efforts beyond the production of game products. Oh yes, and movies too. :)
Capn Charlie 04-03-04, 11:02 PM	No one can say canada is not beautiful to do so is either lies, bad taste, or foolishness. However, I must say that to say that anywhere besides Oklahoma is the best place in the entire world to live is, in my opinion, not true. However, that is just likely because I live here. Any who, I think the main problems wit hshooting films anywhere, US included, is the area of a country where it is shot. I can really see no way that many movies spend what they do in shooting, if they tapped Rural resources, then they could film in wonderful places for a pittance comparably. I know of so many places around the US that films could be shot for very, very, little. Most places in many of the less urbanized states would practically let uyou film for free, and even essentially pay one to shoot there. THen there is the extremely low local prices for just about all of the supplies, labor, and extras that it is just an incredible oppurtunity. But then, I guess, so much of movies today feel they must be shot in the big, expensive, and famous places.
WizO_BigSister 04-04-04, 01:04 AM	Originally posted by Capn Charlie But then, I guess, so much of movies today feel they must be shot in the big, expensive, and famous places. As a New Zealander I can tell you NZ isn't big, it isn't expensive, and up till the Oscars it wasn't all that famous ;)
Cunning Linguist 04-04-04, 08:06 AM	Originally posted by davelozzi Are you aware theat LotR was made in New Zealand, not in the U.S.? I don't think I said that Lord of the Rings was made in the US? I was trying to point out the cost of making movies in the US. A big budget movie in France, Korea or Japan (all of these contries make great fantasy movies by the way) is between 5-20 million dollars. Lord of the Rings actually had a small cost, it is after all a 12 hour movie, and it's shot in a place where the set is low cost area. But it's still not something you should put up as your "avarage fantasy movie cost". Titanic had its worst budget crises from the rental cost of the set, same thing with Waterworld.
Lord Nat 04-04-04, 02:40 PM	The thing is that after the DnD Movie I don't think they want to EVER try that again. It's hard to make a movie about somthing that is not really a story before hand. DnD is just a set of rules. So they'ed have to base a movie off the books (As said before). But there is not the huge number of people that read stuff like Hellboy and stuff. With the comic book movies they can bet on that most the people that read them will go. But the DnD books don't have as huge a fan base so that does not work as well. It's all about how many people they know will go before they even start writing it.
Ssussunriyh 04-04-04, 03:30 PM	Originally posted by ender ...Even small things, like a harper pin. Or a hat with the FR logo. Keychains in the shape of various holy symbols. "Forgotten Realms the breakfast cereal! Forgotten Realms the coloring book! Forgotten Realms the FLAME THROWER!" :D The kids LOVE that one! There are already licensed replicas of Drizzt's scimitars available (although IMHO, the designer missed by a friggin' mile...) I wouldn't mind seeing a licensed replica of Arilyn's Moonblade, though. (As long as it's not one of those clunky stainless steel monstrosities like the LotR swords...)