Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Butterface 12-04-07, 09:41 PM	Here's an interesting response from Designer Richard Baker over at the Forgotten Realms General forums for those of you interested in the canon lore of FR: The RPGA games should have at least a moderate impact on the game setting, which updates things at a constant pace, at least with high-level games. Or will Living FR have little impact on the campaign setting? A good point, and one that I can't easily address off the top of my head. I'm not well versed in what the Living Realms campaign is planning (hey, there's only one of me!) but I think you're right--we would want to treat major plot arcs in Living Realms as canon events for the world. My hope is that we'd avoid real RSE-plot threads in any format for a while, and make sure that canon advances are mirrored across all formats at a reasonable pace--so novels, game product, Living Realms, and D&D Insider material all pull in more or less the same direction. Personally, I think this is great that our games will affect the canon of FR - but I know alot of people would feel quite differently about it. Thoughts?
NiTessine 12-04-07, 11:27 PM	I like the idea. It's really the only smart way to do it, because otherwise you end up with two divergent canons, which is confusing and annoying. Of course, this would mean that game products, novels and LFR all affect each other, which would mean they need to coordinate the stuff better than they have thus far to prevent contradictions and keep people up to date. There are a few different ways of going about this, but one of the ideas I've heard was the appointment of political officers Realmslore experts to make sure the ideology canon is pure accurate. A person in such a position could serve as a canon consultant not only to the campaign but also to the novel department. If nothing else comes of it, avoiding Realms-Shaking Events for a time is a good idea.
Madfox11 12-05-07, 03:49 AM	It is one of the reasons why the number of regions has been reduced. All adventures have to pass by the global administrators and RPGA HQ and if there are too many regions it becomes too much work. One of their jobs is to make sure the adventure fits FR lore and that it interacts properly with new FR lore (whether creating it, changing it, or it doesn's clash with future products). Mind you, this is really not different from LG where the Circle does check whether an adventure fits within Greyhawk canon. It is just taken one step further. It is also in the designing phase, as is the whole campaign, so how it will look like is not yet certain.
Butterface 12-05-07, 10:41 AM	It is one of the reasons why the number of regions has been reduced. All adventures have to pass by the global administrators and RPGA HQ and if there are too many regions it becomes too much work. One of their jobs is to make sure the adventure fits FR lore and that it interacts properly with new FR lore (whether creating it, changing it, or it doesn's clash with future products). Mind you, this is really not different from LG where the Circle does check whether an adventure fits within Greyhawk canon. It is just taken one step further. It is also in the designing phase, as is the whole campaign, so how it will look like is not yet certain. I imagine this will be a little more difficult and time consuming to check adventures with FR canon compared to what that task would involve in the Greyhawk setting, as FR is packed with so many years of canon material. I wonder if a basic knowledge of FR lore was a factor in who they picked for the Writing Director spots? I really hope so.
Sieylianna 12-05-07, 05:49 PM	I wonder if a basic knowledge of FR lore was a factor in who they picked for the Writing Director spots? I really hope so. It doesn't much matter because the realms will be basically unrecognizable after the update. Ed
Butterface 12-05-07, 06:44 PM	It doesn't much matter because the realms will be basically unrecognizable after the update. Ed Not true, unless you have some information that isn't available to avid readers of the FR forums and general public. I *think* that the new Realms will still feel alot like the old Realms, more or less depending on how far the time jump is (which has not been announced). We won't know how different it is until we have more information, but according to the designers (Rich Baker, Chris Perkins), there's efforts being made to keep the good stuff thats accumulated over the last 30 years, and throw out the "baggage." (Check out the podcast Gamer Radio Zero interview with Chris Perkins for more on that). You know what *would* make the campaign setting unrecognizable? Giving too much weight to Living FR as canon material, if the LFR authors come in and write a bunch of Greyhawk storylines. FR is its own world, and its stories need to be written with that in mind.
gomeztoo 12-06-07, 02:32 AM	I have no idea what you mean with 'Greyhawk storyline'. People sometimes seem to think that 'their' game world is so special that you need rocket science to write a scenario for it. It's not. FR has other NPCs, other continents, and some extra critters, but it is till D&D. You still have the same races, the same classes, and people are not fundamentally different - they still scheme, plot, have romances, try to protect the innocent or seek to gain power, depending on their alliances. Any plot idea that worked in LG could work in LFR. Having Elminster instead of the Circle of Eight doesn't change that.
Butterface 12-06-07, 10:22 AM	I have no idea what you mean with 'Greyhawk storyline'. People sometimes seem to think that 'their' game world is so special that you need rocket science to write a scenario for it. It's not. FR has other NPCs, other continents, and some extra critters, but it is till D&D. You still have the same races, the same classes, and people are not fundamentally different - they still scheme, plot, have romances, try to protect the innocent or seek to gain power, depending on their alliances. Any plot idea that worked in LG could work in LFR. Having Elminster instead of the Circle of Eight doesn't change that. You don't have to be a rocket scientist to write Realms adventures. The setting is different from Greyhawk though. Greyhawk has it's own feel, and so does FR, and adventures should be written to incorporate that. Look at the article that was put up on Dragon Magazine recently, "Realmslore: The Cavern of Death." http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/drfe/20071205 Yes, the overall story of that article could be used in any campaign setting. But it's not set in some random location that the author created, it's set in the stonelands, west of tilverton - both well established places in the Realms. And the lich's kingdom that he once hailed from, Anauria, is tied to the ancient realm of Netheril. Asbaron has an ongoing feud with the Zhentarim, a power group in the Realms. And finally, he is a practitioner of Gem Magic, a type of magic outlined in Magic of Faerun. So yes, the overall story could be used anywhere, but careful thought has been given to incorporate Realms places, people, and themes. RPGA chose Forgotten Realms to be the home of this Living game for a reason - it's not generic D&D, it's a rich setting that is beloved to its fans. And the authors of FR adventures for this game would do well to remember that and make an attempt to make the adventures feel as Realms-oriented as they can, otherwise, what's the point? If you're not going to do that you might as well have the RPGA just make it's own generic setting for it's games. You have to remember, the circumstances under which the RPGA got creative control over Greyhawk were very different than today's situation with FR. Greyhawk was a scrap from WotC's dinner table that they had no intention of doing anything with any longer, and so they tossed it to the RPGA. FR on the other hand, is one of the big money makers for the company. It was chosen to be the next Living campaign setting because its a badass setting, not because it was what Wizards didn't feel like messing with anymore. And as such, we should try to write adventures that incorporate that Realms feel, because it obviously works for a lot of people! Maybe you don't think its a big deal, but a lot of FR fans really care about the canon material, and they're worried that the RPGA is going to damage their setting.
ankhwearer 12-06-07, 04:04 PM	...we should try to write adventures that incorporate that Realms feel, because it obviously works for a lot of people! Maybe you don't think its a big deal, but a lot of FR fans really care about the canon material, and they're worried that the RPGA is going to damage their setting. That's great, I want that too. But I don't understand what the "Realms feel" is and how it is different than a "Greyhawk feel". Of course a game set in FR is going to feature FR locations, background and NPCs. That leaves 'theme'. Are FR adventure themes different than Greyhawk themes? From the published mods I have read I wouldn't say that this is the case. But I'm sure you are talking about something concrete that you are concerned about. I just didn't read anything concrete in your last post. So if you could give it another try and describe what mod writers should avoid doing, some specific example, I might better understand what you are getting at.
Butterface 12-06-07, 07:07 PM	That's great, I want that too. But I don't understand what the "Realms feel" is and how it is different than a "Greyhawk feel". Of course a game set in FR is going to feature FR locations, background and NPCs. That leaves 'theme'. Are FR adventure themes different than Greyhawk themes? From the published mods I have read I wouldn't say that this is the case. But I'm sure you are talking about something concrete that you are concerned about. I just didn't read anything concrete in your last post. So if you could give it another try and describe what mod writers should avoid doing, some specific example, I might better understand what you are getting at. Sure :) My concern is that some DMs feel intimidated by the amount of lore that is out there for FR, and so tend to ignore it and make very generic D&D games that just happen to be set in Forgotten Realms. This concern that many players and DMs view the lore as a hurdle to enjoy the Realms is part of the reason for the changes to FR in 4E, according to designers Rich Baker and Chris Perkins. Nevertheless, I'd like to see the LFR authors really step up to the plate and build upon existing lore as well as writing their own stuff. I don't want to play in adventures where, if you were to take the name "Living Forgotten Realms" off of the adventure, no one at the table would be able to tell they were playing in Faerun. If I'm in Cormyr, and I'm not part of a chartered adventuring group, and I untie my peace-bonded weapon, I want the possibility of having a run-in with a War-wizard or a Purple Dragon patrol. That sort of thing. I'm not saying that I want the LFR authors to have to choose between strictly following all existing FR material and just completely doing their own thing, but my hope is that the authors that will be writing these adventures will know enough about the Realms, and have enough appreciation of it, to do a little bit of both. As for what FR feels like. . . I like how Chris Perkins described it in a recent interview: "A Setting that has a thousand.. a million stories to tell. Lot's of things going on all around the world. High magic setting. A place with a feeling of age and legacy to it."
fgjustice 12-06-07, 10:45 PM	Well...speaking as one of the aforementioned Writing Directors... There was no direct FR test for the writing directors. The closest thing we had was a question asking us to take a piece of lore (our choice) and design an adventure synopsis around it. I suspect though that all of us, including the other admin titles as well, applied in the first place because we're such fans of the setting. The reason I applied to be a Writing Director was the chance to help mold the setting I've enjoyed for the past decade. Do I expect to see my storylines made into novels? Not really (oh, but the chance though!). It's the chance to guide the story of my assigned little corner of the Realms for the next decade that makes me excited to be a member of this project. I don't have any more information than any of you have right now - and that's not the NDA talking. However, I suspect the new campaign will be set around a century from current time. Drizzt will be there, as shown already. I think Elminster will be there too, since he is Ed Greenwood incarnate, but drastically altered. I suspect he'll be even more withdrawn - either on the Material Plane as a distant observer, or perhaps on the Outer Planes (after all, they need a new god(dess) of magic, right?). There are numerous threads here debating and calling for certain regions for certain RW locations - pointless; the Spellplague will change things so radically that you might not recognize your favorite locale. However, some things will have to remain familiar - otherwise, why call it the Realms at all? The challenge for the Directors and the authors under us will be to connect the past of the Realms and all its beloved organizations, locations, and lore to the new present. We have to bring the old-timers and the newcomers to the table alike, and make them all fall in love with the Realms again. Personally, I accept the challenge. Scott Horn Writing Director Southeast USA
Butterface 12-06-07, 11:10 PM	The challenge for the Directors and the authors under us will be to connect the past of the Realms and all its beloved organizations, locations, and lore to the new present. We have to bring the old-timers and the newcomers to the table alike, and make them all fall in love with the Realms again. I agree, and I think that pretty much sums up the challenge for 4E FR in general. I also agree about the timeline jump; Rich Baker keeps talking about eliminating barriers that keep new people from playing in FR, specifically the tons of lore that many people think is necessary for them to learn before they can sit down at the table. I can't see them doing that with only a 10 year time jump. . . Personally, I accept the challenge. Awesome! I look forward to playing in your adventures.
NiTessine 12-07-07, 02:44 AM	I can't see them doing that with only a 10 year time jump. . . Ten years and the Spellplague, mind you. From what I've seen, the problem they face is not making it accessible to new players but keeping enough of the old that the veterans still recognise it as the Forgotten Realms.
gomeztoo 12-07-07, 03:07 AM	My concern is that some DMs feel intimidated by the amount of lore that is out there for FR, and so tend to ignore it and make very generic D&D games that just happen to be set in Forgotten Realms. Ah. Well, in that case I think you should perhaps put a bit more trust in the regional volunteers, specifically the editors. When I started in Greyhawk, I knew next to nothing about it (less than about FR). It proved easy however to catch up, to get info on the setting and find elements to base stories on. I found Greyhawk lore in the most unexpected places. It was fiun to find all the intrigues, NPCs, locations, and history and incorporate it in my plots. Similarly, while I do not yet have as much realms lore as you might, I am reading up, going through the Grand History, the 3rd ed. Campaign Setting, the Volo guides, and the material I have a home (such as some 2nd ed accessories I still own and a selection of novels). I definitely intent to use the setting's background, and any interesting NPCs that survive (or their offspring). Personally, I hope 4e doesn't change TOO much (except off some NPCs), since I am otherwise reading stuff for nought. But if such happens, and taht would be reason to 'loose' flavor (say, no Mirth, cause he's dead, and no Thay, cause it got axed) that is not to blame on the LFR authors. As it happens, I actually already have some plot ideas. I have no idea on whether they'll fly right now, but if so they'll be Realms plots, delving back to historic realms events. I hope to get some friends better known with the Realms to aid me. So I think I can ensure you that you will see Realms lore in the scenarios that are under my supervision. When regions become known, you are welcome to aid us with trivia we can use to make sure our regions are 'realms true'. Until then, it would be nice to see some amount of confidence. As to why I applied: I like writing scenarios. I like gaming. And I like the Living concept. The setting is not directly the motivator - I can play anywhere. But I am reading up on it now and it becomes more interesting as I read on. I never liked the Chosen much (I think Mystra should have kept her pants on), and all the RSE's and deicides make my head spin, but I like the intrigues, the potential for conflict and the possibilities for adventure. So, I am enthusiastic to start, and get myself geared with Realms lore. Now if excuse me, I have to abuse my company's hardware and print some Volo guides... Pierre van Rooden Writing Director for Nothern Europe and Russia.
DerekSTheRed 12-07-07, 09:15 AM	I am a fan of both Greyhawk and Forgotten Realms settings and there is a difference in theme. Greyhawk is .. well very grey. There are very few easy choices and protagonists are forced to choose between the lesser of many evils. This is exemplified by the most powerful organization, the Circle, whose alignment is Neutral. They don't strive for the triumph of good, but instead work to preserve the balance between good and evil. The politics are usually a struggle to maintain the status quo and are very complicated (usually described as wheels within wheels) but generally only affecting the local area. Forgotten Realms on the other hand, has very clear heroes and very clear bad guys. Political upheaval is much more common and the most powerful organizations are clearly good or evil but not neutral. The plots in FR are more sweeping and affect large parts of civilization. For instance, the Time of Troubles, the Tuigan Horde, Lolth going into a slumber, and the Spellplague are all examples of huge plot arcs where most areas of the Realms had some sort of drastic consequences. Derek
NiTessine 12-07-07, 01:38 PM	I disagree about the clear-cut good and bad guys in the Realms. Sure, those exist, too, but they are also present in Greyhawk. For the most part, it is an conception formed by the old TSR's standards of content and strong editorial interference that haven't existed for a decade but that the setting has been slow to shed in the eyes of gamers. If one looks at all the novels they're released during the 3E era and takes out the Salvatores, one ends up with quite a few stories of a darker, less heroic tint. The Priests series features evil clerics as protagonists, the War of the Spider Queen series is about drow doing nasty things to other people, Master of Chains and Ghostwalker are traditional revenge stories, and then there are those Paul S. Kemp novels, starring a professional assassin and his companions from both sides of the alignment divide, doing decidedly non-heroic stuff to achieve their ends. The Realms is vast, and can easily hold a huge variety of themes and tones in different regions. It is something we should keep in mind when writing the first regional modules for the new campaign. The settings lends itself just as easily to epic heroics, dark fantasy, black-and-white morality, grey areas, dungeon crawls, investigations, and difficult choices. We have room to explore all of these in the context of the setting, and to produce a variety of modules. If Shawn Merwin can get away with a kobold paladin in Greyhawk, we should be able to play with conflicting party loyalties in Forgotten Realms.
TWG_Prometheus 12-07-07, 05:29 PM	Nevertheless, I'd like to see the LFR authors really step up to the plate and build upon existing lore as well as writing their own stuff. I don't want to play in adventures where, if you were to take the name "Living Forgotten Realms" off of the adventure, no one at the table would be able to tell they were playing in Faerun. If I'm in Cormyr, and I'm not part of a chartered adventuring group, and I untie my peace-bonded weapon, I want the possibility of having a run-in with a War-wizard or a Purple Dragon patrol. That sort of thing. You're putting far too little faith in the authors. Their quality will of course vary, but the regional flavor you're hoping for has already been present in the Living Greyhawk campaign in spades. Play in the various regions all had their own feel to the extent that long threads have gone on reminiscing about it on the LG boards. I've rarely had a chance to play outside of Nyrond, but even in the few times I did, it was easy to tell the difference between adventures there and adventures in Greyhawk, let alone in the Pomarj itself or off in Tenh. I went off adventuring in the Pale recently, and there's a significant difference there as well. Living Greyhawk adventures were actually set in Greyhawk, and few of them could have been mistaken for being elsewhere in my experience.
Surgebuster 12-07-07, 06:44 PM	I rather not have some of the Realms fans posting on this thread get confused about the background of the admins. A comment was made about coming in with 'Greyhawk storylines' but if you care to look at the people who have been appointed, you'll see a wide range of campaign experience, such as Living Arcanis, Living Death, Xen'drik Expeditions, Living Greyhawk and more. I have not had previous admin experience on a rpga campaign and I'd rather not be warned about coming in with my 'no experience' storylines. :P Joe Fitzgerald Event Manager Asia Pacific
Butterface 12-07-07, 06:50 PM	You're putting far too little faith in the authors. Their quality will of course vary, but the regional flavor you're hoping for has already been present in the Living Greyhawk campaign in spades. Play in the various regions all had their own feel to the extent that long threads have gone on reminiscing about it on the LG boards. Well if this becomes the case with LFR, and I'm simply imagining issues that don't exist, I'll be the happiest player out there. I just started to get discouraged because many of the RPGA players I've talked to that plan to play in LFR aren't really FR fans, just RPGA players, and I wondered if that trend was true for the writing directors as well. Also, I spend a lot of time on the FR forums, and the sky is ALWAYS falling over there. It might've rubbed off on me a wee bit. :)
johnkretzer 12-08-07, 03:09 PM	If you guys don't mind a non-RPGA gamers opinion on this... To me the issue is that a campaign setting is a base that hold many games. Each of those games develope it's own canon over time based on DM and player preference and the actions of PCs. Because of this I just feel no game should have a impact on the official setting. Because the more the RPGA changes things the more it makes that base unstable. Which in turn makes the FR campaign setting more unsuited for game that don't follow the RPGA canon. Well that is my :twocents: on this.
Keith53 12-12-07, 08:44 PM	I recognize that opinions will vary, but this is my take on Forgotten Realms flavor. (I also realize changes may occur to FRCS during 4E.) If you feel I missed something that is important to you, please post it. I don't claim all-knowing insight. :-) Please note that many/most have local or regional variations. In no particular order: History: I think some tie to the history is good. I arbitrarily divide history into ancient history (longer ago than any NPCs, barring a few Chosen or maybe Elves were alive), recent history (capturing current politics, conflicts, intrigue, etc.), "future history" (that between now and 10+ years to the start of the campaign) and history being made. Ancient history may be the source of a key element, to which the forces of recent history and future history swirl around. FR is usually rich in history. I want to think, at least so far as LFR is concerned, and hopefully the larger FR canon (for larger adventures), that the successes (or failures) of the PCs will alter the history being made. This does not translate to most adventures (or any early ones) being Realms Shaking Events (RSE). Geography: FR has rich descriptions of varied terrain and flora and fauna; we should use them. Culture: While the 4E mechanics of interaction may be the same, how one culture approaches a given human activity can vary greatly from another. A good story/adventure brings this flavor into the adventure. Some of this springs from the values of natives as well as their stereotype likes and dislikes. Religion: While the transformation to 4E may cause a fair bit of change, traditionally the gods of FR have been very active and encourage a proactive clergy. While not every adventurer cares about a particular deity, it is a strong element of most communities and NPCs lives. Feel: I don't see much of neutral groups who try to maintain a balance, shifting from helping good to helping evil. Neutral groups are more often sitting on the fence, with open doors to both so long as they obey their rules. (Think of Candlekeep as an example, or temples of Oghma.) I see a lot more of good fighting evil, not always winning mind you. Tymora favors those who trust to luck. (of course, after she weds Tyr, who knows. :P ) High Adventure: I think of a good FR adventure as having lots of action, fast paced, although intrigue is present. Consequences are significant. High Magic: (This may change in 4E.) I think of the FR as a magic rich world, with the history of multiple magic empires creating and leaving magic behind, cluttering up the world. There is probably more, but this should be a good start for discussion and elaboration. :-) Keith Hoffman LFR USA NC Co-Writing Director
kennew 12-13-07, 12:19 AM	If you guys don't mind a non-RPGA gamers opinion on this... To me the issue is that a campaign setting is a base that hold many games. Each of those games develope it's own canon over time based on DM and player preference and the actions of PCs. Because of this I just feel no game should have a impact on the official setting. Because the more the RPGA changes things the more it makes that base unstable. Which in turn makes the FR campaign setting more unsuited for game that don't follow the RPGA canon. Well that is my :twocents: on this. I played in LG for years, but I would agree with the the above statement. There are lots of FR campaigns out there. Singling out the RPGA campaign and making the results of its scenarios FR canon would be a serious mistake. By all means let the LFR build its own self-contained canonicity, but that's it. LG was set in an abandoned campaign world. RPGA had free rein to do whatever they wanted. If LFR will affect FR canon, every story will have to be carefully vetted by WOTC. This will likely slow down the pace of scenario release. Furthermore, this would be one source of canon too many (or two depending on how you view it). FR canon is already affected by the design team, the novelists and the sourcebook authors. This could easily be a case of too many cooks spoiling the soup.
Butterface 12-13-07, 12:23 AM	Feel: I don't see much of neutral groups who try to maintain a balance, shifting from helping good to helping evil. Neutral groups are more often sitting on the fence, with open doors to both so long as they obey their rules. (Think of Candlekeep as an example, or temples of Oghma.) I see a lot more of good fighting evil, not always winning mind you. Tymora favors those who trust to luck. (of course, after she weds Tyr, who knows. :P ) One Neutral, yet very active group that springs to mind is the Emerald Enclave, a power group of Druids out of the Vilhon Reach region. Of course, who knows if they'll be around come 4E. Hopefully so, it would be cool to have a LFR character be part of these militant treehuggers (that's how I've always imagined them). :)
Butterface 12-13-07, 12:30 AM	I played in LG for years, but I would agree with the the above statement. There are lots of FR campaigns out there. Singling out the RPGA campaign and making the results of its scenarios FR canon would be a serious mistake. By all means let the LFR build its own self-contained canonicity, but that's it. LG was set in an abandoned campaign world. RPGA had free rein to do whatever they wanted. If LFR will affect FR canon, every story will have to be carefully vetted by WOTC. This will likely slow down the pace of scenario release. Furthermore, this would be one source of canon too many (or two depending on how you view it). FR canon is already affected by the design team, the novelists and the sourcebook authors. This could easily be a case of too many cooks spoiling the soup. Yeah, I'm really torn on this issue. Part of me really wants to be a part of a campaign that officially affects FR lore. But, it's probably better for the setting to have less "official" canon sources out there. The novels, while mostly riveting, can get out of hand sometimes and result in changes that fans find alter the setting to something they don't like (Lady Penitent, Last Mythal series, for example). I think Eberron probably made the right move when they decided not to have their novels be canon. Some Living City stuff was considered canon (and even got its own sourcebook), but LFR is going to be on a much, much larger scale.
DerekSTheRed 12-13-07, 09:04 AM	I wouldn't be surprised to see the LFR regions being kept separate from the novels so that LFR can affect canon but not affect the novel authors. Basically have little sandboxes all over Faerun that rarely have anything to do with each other. That way LFR canon can be FR canon but neither will get in the way of each other. Derek
Keith53 12-14-07, 07:48 AM	I am not sure how, or if, LFR adventures will affect FR canon (versus only internal to the LFR campaign). I value having adventures which are not pre-determined as to the outcome (i.e., what the PCs do, matters), yet I could see for the FR story designers in WotC, having some short notice left turn in a story might be a show stopper for game products and novels in the works. Of course, I tend to expect (or maybe hope) the guidance to work more the other way; WotC tells us that in x months, the following event will occur in locality y. Hopefully they tell us far enough that we don't have to trash any module in the works. Keith Hoffman LFR NC USA Co-Writing Director
bitznarf 12-14-07, 03:03 PM	Another option I see is for the events of the big Realms Changing Events to influence the direction that series takes in book form. Ie. something happens in LFR, 1 (or 2) years later, it appears in book form in some fashion. Or something.
johnkretzer 12-16-07, 06:33 PM	I wouldn't be surprised to see the LFR regions being kept separate from the novels so that LFR can affect canon but not affect the novel authors. Basically have little sandboxes all over Faerun that rarely have anything to do with each other. That way LFR canon can be FR canon but neither will get in the way of each other. Derek I so hope this is not the case. As like my campaigns(as both a player and a DM) to be much larger base in the Realms. Not contained to one region. (This is one of the readons why I find the RPGA so uninteresting.) But imagine if each region was it's own campaign setting...that is a pure nightmare.
Lord Karsus 12-31-07, 09:38 AM	If you guys don't mind a non-RPGA gamers opinion on this... To me the issue is that a campaign setting is a base that hold many games. Each of those games develope it's own canon over time based on DM and player preference and the actions of PCs. Because of this I just feel no game should have a impact on the official setting. Because the more the RPGA changes things the more it makes that base unstable. Which in turn makes the FR campaign setting more unsuited for game that don't follow the RPGA canon. Well that is my :twocents: on this. -Agreed. The old Green Regent campaign wasn't canon, and thank G-d. I can't tell you how much of a major impact some of that would have caused- a lot of it accomplished in a poor manner, might I add.
DerekSTheRed 12-31-07, 11:08 AM	Speaking as an RPGA fan, having my character's actions affect canon is what the RPGA is all about. I don't want to play LFR if we can't affect canon. I want to be able to read in a FR novel a character saying "Well it's a good thing those adventurers killed that bad guy" and say to myself "That was my character." If I can't get that, then there is no reason for me to play LFR. I might as well just buy published modules and play/dm home games. It seems to me that too many FR fans have too many sacred cows. FR is always changing and it won't necessarily be in ways that everyone agrees with. That's the case regardless of whether the changes are coming from novel authors or module authors. Derek
gomeztoo 01-01-08, 06:25 AM	Personally, I think it is much more pleasant to have changes to the realms be effected by players than by a guy writing a novel. At least then, when we kill of Helm, Mystra, Kiaransalee, Vhaeraun, and several others I missed, we know we did it ourselves...
LGMoses 01-06-08, 02:42 AM	we shall load the FR novels into a canon and fire them out! Its our realm now :P
ulfhirtha 01-12-08, 04:43 PM	As a long-time RPGA member, I appreciate the chance to play in a world. Particularly one whose book(s) I've read or shows I've seen and wanted to try living in a little. That said, I would really hate for anything that happens in games to be considered "canon" outside of the campaign. As has already been noted, that's far too many cooks futzing with the pot already. Not just the game writers, but all the game players too. Also, for myself at least, it'd have a chilling effect on actual play, as when it's just affecting you & your party, do as you like. Making play official...that's something else. I appreciate the campaign having some longevity (and not vanishing into oblivion when it ends, like Living Force and probably LG will) but I'd prefer a specific set of "alternate" stories based off those games, not trying to wrench them into a world already going in directions which are not necessarily compatible with what makes for fun 4-6 person party play. Somehow, I see it as diluting or distorting both enterprises. Like confusing fanfic and pastiches with the real work. Moreover, WHICH play would be canon? The tables that let loose some Hideous Evil or the tables that didn't? Take a poll? As an aside, I am one of those heretics who also asks "Why the ^%#$ should the D&D Corebooks slant towards ANY setting (beyond general fantasy)? World creation is the GMs job." I suppose we'll see soon enough how it all goes though.
Lord Karsus 01-12-08, 04:46 PM	As an aside, I am one of those heretics who also asks "Why the ^%#$ should the D&D Corebooks slant towards ANY setting (beyond general fantasy)? World creation is the GMs job." -You have my support and backing, as I also feel that way.
gomeztoo 01-13-08, 01:39 PM	Moreover, WHICH play would be canon? The tables that let loose some Hideous Evil or the tables that didn't? Take a poll? Generally, the majority of determines the outcome, based on feedback to the author. Where possible though, I intend to make consequences less dependent on success (as, in most scenarios, I will assume that the heroes will prevail).
DerekSTheRed 01-13-08, 08:05 PM	Moreover, WHICH play would be canon? The tables that let loose some Hideous Evil or the tables that didn't? Take a poll? The way LG did it, you took the aggregate results from the tables at the convention where the mod premiered and the results from the gamedays that reported within a month of the premier and viola you have official canon. How the LFR admins and RPGA in general incorporate that into FR canon is their own business. For me, if LFR is its own world with no relation to the official FR canon, then I won't play it and I know many that feel that same way. It's nothing against LFR or 4E, it's just that getting my characters actions and deeds into the canon, no matter how indirectly, is the major draw to the campaign. Without that, I have no reason to play LFR. Derek
LGMoses 01-15-08, 12:48 PM	-You have my support and backing, as I also feel that way. He speaks true
jpchapleau 02-01-08, 11:15 AM	I wonder if a basic knowledge of FR lore was a factor in who they picked for the Writing Director spots? I really hope so. I think it was. But with the amount of FR Canon already in print, its nearly impossible to be a Realms buff and have a life. I consider myself to have basic knowledge of the realm with more specialized knowledge in the areas I played in and campaigned in more extensively... When regions get assigned I'll go through my collection of book and read everything there is about my region to come up with something interesting. JP
jpchapleau 02-01-08, 11:20 AM	Moreover, WHICH play would be canon? The tables that let loose some Hideous Evil or the tables that didn't? Take a poll? Throughout my time as an LG triad, we took the majority result at the premiere event. Whatever happened, happened and the next round of adventures were modified to reflect what happened. With the changes and what they want to do in LFR, like you I don't know (and am dying to know). However I figure a similar format will be used. JP