XPs / GPs for Eating Mods - Really??? [Archive] - Wizards Community

XPs / GPs for Eating Mods - Really??? [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
chesspiece
03-01-08, 05:45 PM Personally, I had written this idea off as contrary to the fundamentals of Living Campaigns. But then I read the following in a 4e playtester's review:
http://www.aintitcool.com/node/35799

And nothing, I repeat, NOTHING, takes away XP anymore. No more level loss. No more XP to fuel abilities or make magic items. Nothing. In fact the book encourages you to award XP to absent players, just so everyone always has the same amount and is playing at the same level. I’ve been doing this, and the players love it. That lame idea of reward for attendance gets outweighed by the reward of everyone being equally useful. Besides, loot for attendance works just as well.

At the moment, I doubt that in-depth discussion among the Player base would sway the outcome. But I believe now that the Administrators might actually consider it. Wait and see, eh?
darrell_uk
03-01-08, 05:55 PM No disrespect, but how the hell can you link one playtester's comment that nothing in 4E results in level loss, to DMs receiving XP rum rinning a LFR adventure?
kenobi65
03-01-08, 09:49 PM No disrespect, but how the hell can you link one playtester's comment that nothing in 4E results in level loss, to DMs receiving XP rum rinning a LFR adventure?

Exactly. This quote, "the book encourages you to award XP to absent players, just so everyone always has the same amount and is playing at the same level," has, IMO, nothing to do with a Living campaign, where "my PC" and "your PC" aren't necessarily part of the same group.
MatteBlack
03-02-08, 03:35 AM Exactly. This quote, "the book encourages you to award XP to absent players, just so everyone always has the same amount and is playing at the same level," has, IMO, nothing to do with a Living campaign, where "my PC" and "your PC" aren't necessarily part of the same group.

I think using the quote here is a bit of a stretch but, players falling behind the rest of the party is actually an issue for homegame versions of LG now. There are a number of other ways to address this but, it is one more straw in the xp/gold for DMing argument.
MwaO
03-02-08, 10:42 AM I think using the quote here is a bit of a stretch but, players falling behind the rest of the party is actually an issue for homegame versions of LG now. There are a number of other ways to address this but, it is one more straw in the xp/gold for DMing argument.

Unless you're averaging more than 2 mods a week, no one should be having problems with eating mods because you simply aren't going to be able to play them all.

If each region has 8 mods per year and 20 cores, that's 116 playable mods...that's not including adaptables, specials, and the fact that many people are likely to finish out LG first, then start LR - meaning they're unlikely to clear out the mods from 2008 before 2009 hits.

In other words, in a home group, everyone should be eating mods because that's the way to ensure you're always playing.
Sieylianna
03-02-08, 07:55 PM If each region has 8 mods per year and 20 cores, that's 116 playable mods...that's not including adaptables, specials, and the fact that many people are likely to finish out LG first, then start LR - meaning they're unlikely to clear out the mods from 2008 before 2009 hits.

Some one said that LFR regions will not put out as many modules as LG, because you can play modules from any region. I can't recall if it was anyone "official".

Ed
MwaO
03-02-08, 10:47 PM Some one said that LFR regions will not put out as many modules as LG, because you can play modules from any region. I can't recall if it was anyone "official".

That isn't as many mods as LG, not by a longshot. Basically, that's eliminating around half the regional mods and all the metaregional ones. Maybe they go down to 6 mods each, but that's still a really big number.

I think any less than that and you start to have regions without a lot of definition.
Puggle Halfwine
03-02-08, 11:00 PM Less than that.

Word from our GAs is that, at least for the Asia-Pacific region (Dragon Coast), we will have *four* mods, with a bonus one if we meet our publishing deadlines...

Which is ridiculous given that the equivalent LG area supported TWO LG regions from TWO different Metaregions, which both had a waiting list for module spots and more writers than they knew what to do with... the only acceptable solution (which is what our GAs have done) is to host auditions. The audition guidelines will be up shortly. Thusly, I imagine no continuity is allowed between modules, because we just don't have the authors to write even trilogies (given that a trilogy would take up almost all our mods for the year...)

It's going to get pretty boring/confusing playing one-shot modules. I hope we get four mods in our FIRST YEAR (2008) and eight->sixteen a year after that (or even, as many as we can get out there- anyone can play anything, remember?)... otherwise, well, yeah. Far, far too many authors...

Cheers,

Dave.
Keith53
03-03-08, 03:09 PM Don't know about LFR granting XP or GP for eating mods. Might be discussed by the admins when the campaign standards are developed in March/April. (Yes, I am aware of the 4E wording.)

AS Chris Tulach announced at DDXP, I can repeat:

Each of the 12 regions will produce (in a normal year) 4-5 modules. The 5th is a bonus for meeting our deadlines. So that is 60 per year.

There will be 12 or so "cores" per year.

There will be unknown number of specials per year. I think these will be two round adventures. Specials will be disseminated to cons through some RPGA method, but I think will be limited to such con play.

There will be unknown number of quest adventures per year.

There will be unknown number of adaptables -- WotC FR Adventures which will be adapted for home play in LFR.

His goal is to have 15 or so LFR adventures available for play by September 2008. Gencon -- go and play LFR probably the entire con.

Keith Hoffman
LFR USA-NC Co-Writing Director (Waterdeep)
chesspiece
03-03-08, 04:08 PM There will be unknown number of quest adventures per year.

What exactly is a quest adventure?
Keith53
03-03-08, 05:11 PM What exactly is a quest adventure?

Hopefully Chris Tulach will post a more complete explanation than what I have, but as I understand it, a player decides his/her PC wants to pursue a quest offered on specific RPGA player rewards (quest) card. There are conditions on the card which must be met, which will occur in selected (meaning more than one, but not all) LFR adventures. When the conditions are met, the player (PC) can play the quest adventure. I think the concept tries to address a bit of the special mission flavor with still allowing global access. Details need to be worked, I suspect, so details may change. There is a quest card in the upcoming player rewards card release (out in April).

Keith
NiTessine
03-03-08, 11:53 PM Hopefully Chris Tulach will post a more complete explanation than what I have, but as I understand it, a player decides his/her PC wants to pursue a quest offered on specific RPGA player rewards (quest) card. There are conditions on the card which must be met, which will occur in selected (meaning more than one, but not all) LFR adventures. When the conditions are met, the player (PC) can play the quest adventure. I think the concept tries to address a bit of the special mission flavor with still allowing global access. Details need to be worked, I suspect, so details may change. There is a quest card in the upcoming player rewards card release (out in April).
That's interesting.

I'll have to see how it works in practice, but you guys may finally have found an intelligent use for those cards.

As long as the adventures don't require that all the players have the card, because that'd royally shaft sparsely populated regions.
MwaO
03-04-08, 08:09 AM That does sound pretty cool having the quest cards.

That does have to be my major request for LR - can someone please tone down the cards? I'd much rather see cool, interesting cards like that than what LG has. Unsavory Contacts should be an example card of what cards should look like, but most of the others are way overpowered for what they should be doing.
Madfox11
03-11-08, 01:06 PM The fact is that the LG amount of adventures is impractiable both on an organizational and financial level for LFR. Remember, authors will get paid for all LFR adventures and as a result WotC/RPGA is going to keep a closer look on quality and deadlines than was the case for LG. I certainly know a couple of authors that are going to get a cold shower in this regard who I know can write great adventures, but who are a pain when it comes to deadlines (especially during the review process). I am not saying this is going to be the case in Australia and Asia, but it will likely be true to some extent for many regions. In any event, since you can play in all regions, hopefully people will want to write for all regions. Europe certainly can use additional writers above the five we have right now...
MatteBlack
03-11-08, 03:14 PM The reduction in the number of overall regional mods makes me wonder if they may have changed the length of a standard regional mod to 8 hours (2 con slots) It would allow more cohesive plotlines and reduce mustering slightly. If cores were 4 hours then convention schedulers could adapt more easily especially if the 2-slotters were designed with a mid-point break.

Just a thought.
kenobi65
03-12-08, 03:10 PM The reduction in the number of overall regional mods makes me wonder if they may have changed the length of a standard regional mod to 8 hours (2 con slots)

Given that many conventions run 3 4-hour slots a day, I'm not sure that'd be a great idea; what do you do with the remaining 4-hour slot?
WolfStar76
03-12-08, 03:29 PM Given that many conventions run 3 4-hour slots a day, I'm not sure that'd be a great idea; what do you do with the remaining 4-hour slot?

Dude. Haven't you seen the lines at the food vendors? :rimshot:
kenobi65
03-12-08, 04:42 PM Dude. Haven't you seen the lines at the food vendors? :rimshot:

:D He'll be here all weekend. Tip your waitresses!
MatteBlack
03-13-08, 09:42 AM Given that many conventions run 3 4-hour slots a day, I'm not sure that'd be a great idea; what do you do with the remaining 4-hour slot?

I was only thinking the regionals would be double-length. Cores and interactives might be shorter or you could split up the segments like with some of the adaptives. I tend to doubt they have changed the format, it just made me think.
Keith53
03-13-08, 06:26 PM The reduction in the number of overall regional mods makes me wonder if they may have changed the length of a standard regional mod to 8 hours (2 con slots)
Just a thought.

No. Standard game session length.

Keith
stumpydwarf99
03-14-08, 07:07 AM The fact is that the LG amount of adventures is impractiable both on an organizational and financial level for LFR. Remember, authors will get paid for all LFR adventures and as a result WotC/RPGA is going to keep a closer look on quality and deadlines than was the case for LG. I certainly know a couple of authors that are going to get a cold shower in this regard who I know can write great adventures, but who are a pain when it comes to deadlines (especially during the review process). I am not saying this is going to be the case in Australia and Asia, but it will likely be true to some extent for many regions. In any event, since you can play in all regions, hopefully people will want to write for all regions. Europe certainly can use additional writers above the five we have right now...

Well I must admit that if 4E lives up to expectations and hoping to be involved from the start, I'm thinking of offering to write european adventures.

Then again i may not come up to teh required standard.

the main things that stopped me offerig for LGR were my lack of knowledge of plotlines and the difficulty sometimes of balancing encounters under 3e, when i write home adventures i know i can balance it on teh fly, couldnt really do that with LGR adventures.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
chesspiece 03-01-08, 05:45 PM	Personally, I had written this idea off as contrary to the fundamentals of Living Campaigns. But then I read the following in a 4e playtester's review: http://www.aintitcool.com/node/35799 And nothing, I repeat, NOTHING, takes away XP anymore. No more level loss. No more XP to fuel abilities or make magic items. Nothing. In fact the book encourages you to award XP to absent players, just so everyone always has the same amount and is playing at the same level. I’ve been doing this, and the players love it. That lame idea of reward for attendance gets outweighed by the reward of everyone being equally useful. Besides, loot for attendance works just as well. At the moment, I doubt that in-depth discussion among the Player base would sway the outcome. But I believe now that the Administrators might actually consider it. Wait and see, eh?
darrell_uk 03-01-08, 05:55 PM	No disrespect, but how the hell can you link one playtester's comment that nothing in 4E results in level loss, to DMs receiving XP rum rinning a LFR adventure?
kenobi65 03-01-08, 09:49 PM	No disrespect, but how the hell can you link one playtester's comment that nothing in 4E results in level loss, to DMs receiving XP rum rinning a LFR adventure? Exactly. This quote, "the book encourages you to award XP to absent players, just so everyone always has the same amount and is playing at the same level," has, IMO, nothing to do with a Living campaign, where "my PC" and "your PC" aren't necessarily part of the same group.
MatteBlack 03-02-08, 03:35 AM	Exactly. This quote, "the book encourages you to award XP to absent players, just so everyone always has the same amount and is playing at the same level," has, IMO, nothing to do with a Living campaign, where "my PC" and "your PC" aren't necessarily part of the same group. I think using the quote here is a bit of a stretch but, players falling behind the rest of the party is actually an issue for homegame versions of LG now. There are a number of other ways to address this but, it is one more straw in the xp/gold for DMing argument.
MwaO 03-02-08, 10:42 AM	I think using the quote here is a bit of a stretch but, players falling behind the rest of the party is actually an issue for homegame versions of LG now. There are a number of other ways to address this but, it is one more straw in the xp/gold for DMing argument. Unless you're averaging more than 2 mods a week, no one should be having problems with eating mods because you simply aren't going to be able to play them all. If each region has 8 mods per year and 20 cores, that's 116 playable mods...that's not including adaptables, specials, and the fact that many people are likely to finish out LG first, then start LR - meaning they're unlikely to clear out the mods from 2008 before 2009 hits. In other words, in a home group, everyone should be eating mods because that's the way to ensure you're always playing.
Sieylianna 03-02-08, 07:55 PM	If each region has 8 mods per year and 20 cores, that's 116 playable mods...that's not including adaptables, specials, and the fact that many people are likely to finish out LG first, then start LR - meaning they're unlikely to clear out the mods from 2008 before 2009 hits. Some one said that LFR regions will not put out as many modules as LG, because you can play modules from any region. I can't recall if it was anyone "official". Ed
MwaO 03-02-08, 10:47 PM	Some one said that LFR regions will not put out as many modules as LG, because you can play modules from any region. I can't recall if it was anyone "official". That isn't as many mods as LG, not by a longshot. Basically, that's eliminating around half the regional mods and all the metaregional ones. Maybe they go down to 6 mods each, but that's still a really big number. I think any less than that and you start to have regions without a lot of definition.
Puggle Halfwine 03-02-08, 11:00 PM	Less than that. Word from our GAs is that, at least for the Asia-Pacific region (Dragon Coast), we will have four mods, with a bonus one if we meet our publishing deadlines... Which is ridiculous given that the equivalent LG area supported TWO LG regions from TWO different Metaregions, which both had a waiting list for module spots and more writers than they knew what to do with... the only acceptable solution (which is what our GAs have done) is to host auditions. The audition guidelines will be up shortly. Thusly, I imagine no continuity is allowed between modules, because we just don't have the authors to write even trilogies (given that a trilogy would take up almost all our mods for the year...) It's going to get pretty boring/confusing playing one-shot modules. I hope we get four mods in our FIRST YEAR (2008) and eight->sixteen a year after that (or even, as many as we can get out there- anyone can play anything, remember?)... otherwise, well, yeah. Far, far too many authors... Cheers, Dave.
Keith53 03-03-08, 03:09 PM	Don't know about LFR granting XP or GP for eating mods. Might be discussed by the admins when the campaign standards are developed in March/April. (Yes, I am aware of the 4E wording.) AS Chris Tulach announced at DDXP, I can repeat: Each of the 12 regions will produce (in a normal year) 4-5 modules. The 5th is a bonus for meeting our deadlines. So that is 60 per year. There will be 12 or so "cores" per year. There will be unknown number of specials per year. I think these will be two round adventures. Specials will be disseminated to cons through some RPGA method, but I think will be limited to such con play. There will be unknown number of quest adventures per year. There will be unknown number of adaptables -- WotC FR Adventures which will be adapted for home play in LFR. His goal is to have 15 or so LFR adventures available for play by September 2008. Gencon -- go and play LFR probably the entire con. Keith Hoffman LFR USA-NC Co-Writing Director (Waterdeep)
chesspiece 03-03-08, 04:08 PM	There will be unknown number of quest adventures per year. What exactly is a quest adventure?
Keith53 03-03-08, 05:11 PM	What exactly is a quest adventure? Hopefully Chris Tulach will post a more complete explanation than what I have, but as I understand it, a player decides his/her PC wants to pursue a quest offered on specific RPGA player rewards (quest) card. There are conditions on the card which must be met, which will occur in selected (meaning more than one, but not all) LFR adventures. When the conditions are met, the player (PC) can play the quest adventure. I think the concept tries to address a bit of the special mission flavor with still allowing global access. Details need to be worked, I suspect, so details may change. There is a quest card in the upcoming player rewards card release (out in April). Keith
NiTessine 03-03-08, 11:53 PM	Hopefully Chris Tulach will post a more complete explanation than what I have, but as I understand it, a player decides his/her PC wants to pursue a quest offered on specific RPGA player rewards (quest) card. There are conditions on the card which must be met, which will occur in selected (meaning more than one, but not all) LFR adventures. When the conditions are met, the player (PC) can play the quest adventure. I think the concept tries to address a bit of the special mission flavor with still allowing global access. Details need to be worked, I suspect, so details may change. There is a quest card in the upcoming player rewards card release (out in April). That's interesting. I'll have to see how it works in practice, but you guys may finally have found an intelligent use for those cards. As long as the adventures don't require that all the players have the card, because that'd royally shaft sparsely populated regions.
MwaO 03-04-08, 08:09 AM	That does sound pretty cool having the quest cards. That does have to be my major request for LR - can someone please tone down the cards? I'd much rather see cool, interesting cards like that than what LG has. Unsavory Contacts should be an example card of what cards should look like, but most of the others are way overpowered for what they should be doing.
Madfox11 03-11-08, 01:06 PM	The fact is that the LG amount of adventures is impractiable both on an organizational and financial level for LFR. Remember, authors will get paid for all LFR adventures and as a result WotC/RPGA is going to keep a closer look on quality and deadlines than was the case for LG. I certainly know a couple of authors that are going to get a cold shower in this regard who I know can write great adventures, but who are a pain when it comes to deadlines (especially during the review process). I am not saying this is going to be the case in Australia and Asia, but it will likely be true to some extent for many regions. In any event, since you can play in all regions, hopefully people will want to write for all regions. Europe certainly can use additional writers above the five we have right now...
MatteBlack 03-11-08, 03:14 PM	The reduction in the number of overall regional mods makes me wonder if they may have changed the length of a standard regional mod to 8 hours (2 con slots) It would allow more cohesive plotlines and reduce mustering slightly. If cores were 4 hours then convention schedulers could adapt more easily especially if the 2-slotters were designed with a mid-point break. Just a thought.
kenobi65 03-12-08, 03:10 PM	The reduction in the number of overall regional mods makes me wonder if they may have changed the length of a standard regional mod to 8 hours (2 con slots) Given that many conventions run 3 4-hour slots a day, I'm not sure that'd be a great idea; what do you do with the remaining 4-hour slot?
WolfStar76 03-12-08, 03:29 PM	Given that many conventions run 3 4-hour slots a day, I'm not sure that'd be a great idea; what do you do with the remaining 4-hour slot? Dude. Haven't you seen the lines at the food vendors? :rimshot:
kenobi65 03-12-08, 04:42 PM	Dude. Haven't you seen the lines at the food vendors? :rimshot: :D He'll be here all weekend. Tip your waitresses!
MatteBlack 03-13-08, 09:42 AM	Given that many conventions run 3 4-hour slots a day, I'm not sure that'd be a great idea; what do you do with the remaining 4-hour slot? I was only thinking the regionals would be double-length. Cores and interactives might be shorter or you could split up the segments like with some of the adaptives. I tend to doubt they have changed the format, it just made me think.
Keith53 03-13-08, 06:26 PM	The reduction in the number of overall regional mods makes me wonder if they may have changed the length of a standard regional mod to 8 hours (2 con slots) Just a thought. No. Standard game session length. Keith
stumpydwarf99 03-14-08, 07:07 AM	The fact is that the LG amount of adventures is impractiable both on an organizational and financial level for LFR. Remember, authors will get paid for all LFR adventures and as a result WotC/RPGA is going to keep a closer look on quality and deadlines than was the case for LG. I certainly know a couple of authors that are going to get a cold shower in this regard who I know can write great adventures, but who are a pain when it comes to deadlines (especially during the review process). I am not saying this is going to be the case in Australia and Asia, but it will likely be true to some extent for many regions. In any event, since you can play in all regions, hopefully people will want to write for all regions. Europe certainly can use additional writers above the five we have right now... Well I must admit that if 4E lives up to expectations and hoping to be involved from the start, I'm thinking of offering to write european adventures. Then again i may not come up to teh required standard. the main things that stopped me offerig for LGR were my lack of knowledge of plotlines and the difficulty sometimes of balancing encounters under 3e, when i write home adventures i know i can balance it on teh fly, couldnt really do that with LGR adventures.