Post/Author/DateTime	Post
SmartPaladin 09-03-07, 04:00 AM	Disclaimer: It's late, and I cannot sleep. Oh, and I've been playing far more Tenchu Z (http://www.microsoft.com/xbox/tenchuz/) than is healthy for anyone. Seriously, I've walked around Wal-Mart, late at night, and I've spotted many places where I can grab someone, drag them off, kill then, and then more on to the next person. So yes, I'm bored. :P Now then, with that out of the way. I currently have a Chaotic Good Half-Drow Ninja of Selūne up my sleeve, and it being as late as it is, I ended up starting to wonder what other Deities would take a Ninja follower. I've mostly been sticking to human Deities, because I'm not sure I really want to wade through the other pantheons. So here's my list of what I believe to be deities with Ninja worshipers. Bane would clearly have Ninja worshipers. They could quiet easily help keep the people under the thumb of The Black Lord. Cyric would have them as well, him being the patron of murder, lies, intrigue, deception and illusion. Cyric is almost the prefect God for any evil Ninja. Helm (score one point for Tenchu (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tenchu)*) may have Ninja worshipers as well. Serving as silent, dark, guardians and protectors of not just the commoners, but the nobility as well. Malar... I'm honestly a bit iffy about. He has slightly more reason to then Mielikki, which is why you won't be seeing her on this list, but aside for having more reason to. A part of me just isn't sure I see it. Mask would have Ninjas. Many Ninjas... I honestly believe he'd try to get a hold of as many as he could. Seriously. Selūne, as one of, if not the only good aligned human Goddess of the Night (Moon), I could quiet easily see a good number of good aligned Ninja hiding in secret in one of her Monk orders, and striking out at those who would seek harm upon her followers. Shar, like Mask, would have a large number of Ninjas. Probably not just because she is the Goddess of Night, but because she is a Goddess of Dark. Shaundakul could have Ninjas. Though it might be hard to say for sure, most would probably be off wandering Faerūn like their God. Sune has Ninjas. Sune has the fun Ninjas. I'm talking the Ninjas that show up, kill the bad guy, rescue the damsel in distress, sweep her off her feet, seduce her, and then leave her with some trinket to remember them by. Nevermind the fact that the Ninja probably can't remember what the trinket was, who the girl was, what she looked, but the damsel? She'll remember them until her dying day. Kinda makes you wanna run off and make a Ninja of Sune, huh? :P Torm (score another point for Tenchu (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tenchu)*) may have Ninjas. For about the same reason as Helm. Tyr (another point for Tenchu (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tenchu)*) would have some good aligned, if not lawfully aligned Ninjas. Who sought to bring swift justice down upon the wicked. Garagos might have Ninjas, but I believe that to be unlikely. Never the less, you may still find a few in the service of the Lord of War. Hoar (hmm... I think this is another point for Tenchu (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tenchu), but I'm not sure.) would have Ninjas, with their skills, they could rise up quickly in the ranks of the faith. Might even form a band called the Blades of the Doombringer or something. Red Knight would see a great usefulness in having Ninjas. So I doubt she would turn them away. That's pretty much it. Let me know your thoughts. I shall now bid you all good day, or good night. Which ever. *Most of you would get these points if you've ever played any of the Tenchu (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tenchu) games.
Suin Bahhar 09-03-07, 09:18 AM	I'd add the demihuman dieties with trickery and stealth as well. Lolth clearly would use masses of ninjas in wars Shargaas orc ninjas are scary Brandobaris halfling ninjas! watch out! there's another one! (ninja swarms!) Set snake-ninjas (dont get charmed by their forked tongues) Hruggek bugbear ninjas, strong and silent Baravar cloakshadow how do you disguise those big noses? Erevan Ilsensere some hotninja chicks in his ranks
SmartPaladin 09-03-07, 08:06 PM	I'd add the demihuman dieties with trickery and stealth as well. Lolth clearly would use masses of ninjas in wars Shargaas orc ninjas are scary Brandobaris halfling ninjas! watch out! there's another one! (ninja swarms!) Set snake-ninjas (dont get charmed by their forked tongues) Hruggek bugbear ninjas, strong and silent Baravar cloakshadow how do you disguise those big noses? Erevan Ilsensere some hotninja chicks in his ranks I honestly can't see Lolth with Ninjas... Most of her people already sneak around in the dark. I can see Vhaeraun with Ninjas though, Selvetarm too. But not Lolth... I donno why. I'm giving you a free box of Internet cookies though. All of those were just funny. I lol'd when I saw the Halfling Ninjas. :P
MerrikCale 09-03-07, 09:29 PM	Not sure if I'm buying Tyr, Sune or Helm ninjas
SmartPaladin 09-04-07, 12:38 AM	Not sure if I'm buying Tyr, Sune or Helm ninjas Well, I have no problem buying Helm or Tyr for Ninjas. Though that's probably because of to much Tenchu, where the Ninjas are heroric guardians and protecters of their lord, people, and country. Oh, and they are almost always out bring swift and silent justice down upon the wicked and corrupt. As for Sune... It's a romanticized take on Ninjas! Granted, most of it was in jest. But there's a part of me that just finds the concept funny. :P
Lord Karsus 09-04-07, 03:33 PM	-Are we limited to the deities that show up in Faerūn only? Because, if not, there is the entire Celestial Bureaucracy to look at.
SmartPaladin 09-04-07, 05:58 PM	-Are we limited to the deities that show up in Faerūn only? Because, if not, there is the entire Celestial Bureaucracy to look at. Isn't the Celestial Bureaucracy technically already in Faerūn? Because Kara-Tur is in the Forgotten Realms, and I know the Shou pray to them. So, I'd say there's a far about of Ninjas that would belong to them as well.
Lord Karsus 09-04-07, 08:13 PM	Isn't the Celestial Bureaucracy technically already in Faerūn? Because Kara-Tur is in the Forgotten Realms, and I know the Shou pray to them. So, I'd say there's a far about of Ninjas that would belong to them as well. -Kara-Tur is in Faerūn like Asia is in Europe. ;) -Both are seperate, but connected, continents.
Borris 09-04-07, 08:16 PM	I honestly don't see any deity that wouldn't accept ninja worshippers. Deities usually aren't picky. After all, the more followers they gather, the stronger they get. And since ninja abilities don't come from divine powers, they could worship pretty much anyone. A clan of ninjas who believe to be working for justice by eliminating those who have wronged them might very well choose Tyr as the clan's patron. Though Hoar might be a better fit, Tyr is well-known throughout the Realms, but there are many regions where people have never heard of Hoar. The ninja class is really just a set of abilities, falling somewhere between those of the rogue and monk. A ninja character might fight like your typical Japanese ninja, but he doesn't need to have the same mindset. In the Monster Manual IV, there's a Drow Ninja NPC called Lolth's Sting. I'd say the class fits perfectly in a society that favors stealth, poison use, and surprise strikes. Of course, if you wish to develop orders of ninjas devoted to a deity the way orders of monks are in the Realms, then this thread's point is still perfectly valid. But I can still picture orders of Lolth-worshipping ninjas roaming the cities of the Underdark. And I'd add a clan of ninjas following Siamorphe, serving as bodyguards for nobles who can't always afford to be seen with bodyguards.
The Ubbergeek 09-04-07, 09:01 PM	Mask is an obvious choice, as Cyric, Shar, Bane and Vhaurun (spelling?). Laduger would be interesting - fanatic duergar thugs.
1 ton ghost 09-04-07, 11:25 PM	historical accuracy to pseudo-fantasy conversion: smart money is on Celestial Bueracracy in Kara-Tur, but classically, ninja weren't terribly concerned w/ honor and divinity given they are spies, stealers-in, thieves, and assassins. not good. in rare, but specific examples, we said Rokugan (fantasy feudal Japan, Legend of the 5 Rings) is bit East of Kara-Tur (examine large island mass in gulf) since Shou seems mostly Chinese and Hordelands mimic Mongolia circa Genghis Kahn, etc. they'd have Kami, Buddhist or Shinto-esque patron deities, smoke the dung of their anscestors, something... for regular Faerunian ones, any trickery god i guess. Mask is probably best bet all around sketchy guy.
MerrikCale 09-04-07, 11:46 PM	-Kara-Tur is in Faerūn like Asia is in Europe. ;) -Both are seperate, but connected, continents. right. so where the two meet, like in Telflamm, there is a mixing of cultures. Hence, the Celestial Beauracy is in Faerun
SmartPaladin 09-05-07, 12:40 AM	historical accuracy to pseudo-fantasy conversion: smart money is on Celestial Bueracracy in Kara-Tur, but classically, ninja weren't terribly concerned w/ honor and divinity given they are spies, stealers-in, thieves, and assassins. not good. Like most Samurai were better. :rolleyes: In some ways, it comes down to the person them self. Some Ninja might have been seen as heroes of the people, just like some Samurai. For every shadow, there is a light casting that shadow. Mostly, I guess I was just trying to gain thoughts of what deity it would make sense to see a Ninja of. Seeing as how, at least as far as I know, we're not given much info on the Celestial Beauracy. I guess as long as the back story makes sense, then there maybe no wrong reason for any character to be of any deity.
1 ton ghost 09-05-07, 01:08 PM	how idealistic of you. ninja, in the real world, were the answer when samurai failed or were not prudent to feudal lord ie)doesn't want to lose face. if diplomacy fails and public honor is at stake, send a ninja, no one will know. in Faerun, ninjas, they're anyone's guess. they make this $hit so open-ended anybody can do it. as for them being heroes of the ppl, assuming they don't have secret identity ala some FR Batman, ppl aren't usually ones to look up to thieves, killers, and so on. i mean, how many goodly ninjas do you know? fairly rare given dispositions of the class and the freedoms affoded them...w/ the right moral flexibility. as far as spirituallity is concerned, there isn't much if any text on Celestial Bueracracy. i'd poke through an old Dieties and Demigods in the Oriental sections. they could also work the infernal tip given the trickery of oni and so much ancestor worship
SmartPaladin 09-05-07, 09:45 PM	how idealistic of you. ninja, in the real world, were the answer when samurai failed or were not prudent to feudal lord ie)doesn't want to lose face. if diplomacy fails and public honor is at stake, send a ninja, no one will know. in Faerun, ninjas, they're anyone's guess. they make this $hit so open-ended anybody can do it. as for them being heroes of the ppl, assuming they don't have secret identity ala some FR Batman, ppl aren't usually ones to look up to thieves, killers, and so on. i mean, how many goodly ninjas do you know? fairly rare given dispositions of the class and the freedoms affoded them...w/ the right moral flexibility. as far as spirituallity is concerned, there isn't much if any text on Celestial Bueracracy. i'd poke through an old Dieties and Demigods in the Oriental sections. they could also work the infernal tip given the trickery of oni and so much ancestor worship Well, to quote Professor Xavier and Magneto from X-Men Legends 2 "The world needs idealist to give it a soul, and it needs realist to keep it alive." I have no problem being thought of as an idealist, even a fool. It is after all part of what makes me, me. People look up to strange things after all. My grandfather was once told while he was in the army, that he, and all of the other soldiers could not put professional killers down as what their occupation was. And how many of us look up to our armed forces? I don't think a man or womans job makes them a hero. I think they make them selves a hero. Honestly however. I do have some hero worship for Hattori Hanzō, the samurai vassal and head of the Iga Ninja clan serving Tokugawa Ieyasu. I wouldn't mind heading to Japan to visit his grave.
1 ton ghost 09-06-07, 12:48 PM	um, ok. knock yourself out...
Lord Karsus 09-06-07, 01:34 PM	Well, to quote Professor Xavier and Magneto from X-Men Legends 2... -Great game. -While we're on the topic, how are the Tenchu games? I haven't played one since the first one on the Playstation.
SmartPaladin 09-06-07, 08:52 PM	um, ok. knock yourself out... Aye, aye cap'n! *knocks self out* (if one cannot make someone smile and laugh at least once a day, then one has failed.) -Great game. Indeed it was. Especially when you got to the Deadpool boss fight, and you had Deadpool in your party. :rofl: -While we're on the topic, how are the Tenchu games? I haven't played one since the first one on the Playstation. The story it's self of Tenchu isn't that bad. There's a few problems with the games, like the continuity. Here, let me show you. Tenchu 2: Birth of the Stealth Assassins (PS1) Tenchu: Stealth Assassins (PS1) Tenchu: Fatal Shadows (PS2) Tenchu: Wrath of Heaven/Return from Darkness (PS2/Xbox) Tenchu Z (Xbox 360) Please note, I didn't go into the ones on the Nintendo DS and the PSP, and that those are just the ones that came out in the states. One of the biggest draw backs of the series is probably the character controls and the camera. Over time, they seemed to kind of ebb and flow, sometimes one of the games, will just be seemingly perfect, and other in other games, the camera or character controls will come back and bite you in the backside. Now then, Tenchu 2 was a good game, in that it told the story of who these characters are, you start off with Rikimaru and Ayame from the beginning and watch them grow into who they were in the first game. But it still suffered from one of the biggest problems of the whole series. The AI. The AI, doesn't really improve for a long time. I honestly don't think it improved until Fatal Shadows and Tenchu Z. Though there will still be times where you find yourself just shaking your head at how stupid some of the AI is. I never really got much chance to play Tenchu: Fatal Shadows, but it did introduce the simultaneous stealth kills, which was a pretty nice step up from all the times you'd see two enemies together, and be unable to kill one with out alerting the other. Tenchu Z ended up continuing that, as well as letting it continue on to up to four enemies, but the also made it harder. So it wasn't as easy to do as it was in Fatal Shadows. Also, in Tenchu Z, you make your own Ninja. The character creator was as deep as most of us would have liked, but it was still good. All and all, I think if you wanna take a look at some of them, go see about renting any of the ones you missed. You may still be able to run into some place that has Wrath of Heaven (PS2)/Return from Darkness (Xbox) to rent, as well as Fatal Shadows.
MarkusTay63 09-06-07, 09:36 PM	So... lemme get this straight... The Sune Ninjas just go after ugly people, right? :confused: The Ninjas of Ilmater... Hmmm... they use the non-lethal damage rules? And then feel REALLY bad afterwords? Halfling Ninjas are only allowed if they are Halfling Vampire Ninjas (although pirate Ninjas work for me too). The Vedic Pantheon is active in the Malatra (lower K-T) region, so you just KNOW Kali has got some Ninjas. :devil: Hobgoblin and even Gnoll Ninjas would be very cool - Yeenoghu looks like he would be a pretty mean martial artist. Illithid Ninjas are so ridiculous that I might even use them (psionic coupled with Ninja diciplines - YIKES!) Beholder Ninjas would be even more ridiculous - what would they have, Nun-chuks in their eye-stalks? Lizardmen Ninjas would be VERY cool as well as any other serpent race - Set has that whole evil/dark thing going on, and it works for him. And of course, Cobra has Ninjas, everyone knows that (thats how they beat-up the Joes). If we import the Tortles from Mystara, we could have Ninja Tortles. :rolleyes:
MerrikCale 09-06-07, 09:59 PM	If we import the Tortles from Mystara, we could have Ninja Tortles. :rolleyes: ouch. that one hurt
MarkHall 09-06-07, 10:13 PM	You know why you can't find any deities for ninjas? Because the deities themselves are ninjas.
SmartPaladin 09-06-07, 11:01 PM	So... lemme get this straight... The Sune Ninjas just go after ugly people, right? :confused: The Ninjas of Ilmater... Hmmm... they use the non-lethal damage rules? And then feel REALLY bad afterwords? Halfling Ninjas are only allowed if they are Halfling Vampire Ninjas (although pirate Ninjas work for me too). The Vedic Pantheon is active in the Malatra (lower K-T) region, so you just KNOW Kali has got some Ninjas. :devil: Hobgoblin and even Gnoll Ninjas would be very cool - Yeenoghu looks like he would be a pretty mean martial artist. Illithid Ninjas are so ridiculous that I might even use them (psionic coupled with Ninja diciplines - YIKES!) Beholder Ninjas would be even more ridiculous - what would they have, Nun-chuks in their eye-stalks? Lizardmen Ninjas would be VERY cool as well as any other serpent race - Set has that whole evil/dark thing going on, and it works for him. And of course, Cobra has Ninjas, everyone knows that (thats how they beat-up the Joes). If we import the Tortles from Mystara, we could have Ninja Tortles. :rolleyes: You know why you can't find any deities for ninjas? Because the deities themselves are ninjas. You sirs, win an internet. Oh, and two boxes of cookies.:clap: :bow: :heehee