Heretic of the Faith (and/or Servant of the Fallen) and Cleric's Aura Q [Archive] - Wizards Community

Heretic of the Faith (and/or Servant of the Fallen) and Cleric's Aura Q [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
Perun
03-11-07, 06:13 PM When you've got a heresy (Power of Faerūn) that is recognised and tolerated (if not accepted) within the mainstream church (and presumably by the deity itself), but is of different alignment than the deity, what would cleric's aura class feature detect as to appropriate detect [alignment] spells?

For example, one of the heresies that worships Lathander as Amaunator reborn, the Risen Sun heresy. It requires its followers to be LG or LN. However, Lathander is NG, and his clerics radiate an aura of good. What does a heretic of the Risen Sun radiate?
Stigger
03-12-07, 12:40 AM Presumably law... don't recall that as being possible though... been a while since I looked at the cleric aura rules.
AbyssKnight
03-12-07, 10:54 PM According to the Cleric's Aura of Faith class ability, you detect as you diety's alignment.

So a neutral good cleric of Torm would still have a strong aura of law when viewed with a detect law spell, despite not being lawful himself.

For clerics of Amaunator, this means that they only detect strongly of good. I would think they still detect as lawful, but only as a lawful creature and not as a cleric.

Example for clarity.

Neutral Good cleric 9 of Torm detects Strongly as both Lawful and Good (Torm is LG)

Lawful Neutral cleric 9 of Amaunator detects Strongly as Good (Lathander is NG) and Faintly of Law
Stigger
03-13-07, 12:46 AM Questionable though, since Amuanator had a LN aligment, and that's the aspect their worshipping... doesn't make sense they'd radiate the aura of their actual deity in those cases of divine impersonation that occassionally go on in the Realms really.
Perun
03-13-07, 09:00 AM I've thought about this little dilemma, especially since my previous character died, and I made a cleric following the Risen Sun heresy (they believe that "time of Lathander's transformation is nigh, and Amaunator is about to return", Power of Faerūn, p. 47).

The Risen Sun heresy allows only LG ans LN clerics (this is different from Amaunator's clergy as originaly presented in 2e AD&D accessory Faiths and Avatars which allowed clerics of any lawful alignment, but specialty priests (sunlords) could only be LN or LE; Lost Empires of Faerūn allows for any lawful alignment (presumably, since it only lists Amaunator's alignment as LN, and following the one-step rule that's LG, LN, and LE), both for clerics and the sunlords (PrC)).

Now, it's failry obvious that in this case (with the Risen Sun heresy and Amaunator/Lathander thing) there are two different situations:
Servant of the Fallen (Amaunator) Feat: Cleric actually worships the dead Amaunator. He's getting his spells and powers by power of his faith alone, and is bound by all standard rules regarding alignment allowed (any lawful), domains (Law, Nobility, Planning, Sun, Time), and favoured weapon (light mace). I'd consider this a general rule -- if a character chooses this feat, he's bound by the rules of the original (dead or slumbering) deity, regardless whether the said deity is currently being impersonated by another one.
Heretic of the Faith Feat: Although in this particular case similar to the point above, the cleric knows he's worshipping Lathander, who (he believes) will soon be reincarnated as Amaunator. The approach seems to be a mesh of Amaunator's and Lathander's worship and dogma: the alignment allowed (LG, LN), domains available (Fire, Law, Nobility, Renewal, Sun, Time; although oddly enough neither Amaunator nor Lathander normally provide access to the Fire domain), and favoured weapon (light mace).

Therefore, since Amaunator is dead, and Lathander hasn't transformed yet, it stands to reason that followers of the Risen Sun heresy would give off the aura of good (based on Lathander's NG alignment), and they would be unable to use spells with the [Evil] descriptor, regardless of their own alignment.

That one was easy.

The Dark Moon heresy is the tricky one. It teaches that Selūne and Shar are one and the same, two aspects of a single deity. Clerics following this heresy must be LN, N, or CN in alignment. Selūne is CG and Shar is NE in alignment. I believe their clerics would not give off any kind of aura (apart their own ones), since the two deific alignments would cancel each other.
AbyssKnight
03-13-07, 02:33 PM I like the way you deal with Amaunator's worship slightly differently depending on the feat (actually worshipping dead Amaunator, or worshipping Lathander as Amaunator-to-be).

For the Dark Moon heretics, I would go a different way. I would have the clerics detect strongly as both Good and Evil (and Chaos), and faintly of their own alignment is different than those.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Perun 03-11-07, 06:13 PM	When you've got a heresy (Power of Faerūn) that is recognised and tolerated (if not accepted) within the mainstream church (and presumably by the deity itself), but is of different alignment than the deity, what would cleric's aura class feature detect as to appropriate detect [alignment] spells? For example, one of the heresies that worships Lathander as Amaunator reborn, the Risen Sun heresy. It requires its followers to be LG or LN. However, Lathander is NG, and his clerics radiate an aura of good. What does a heretic of the Risen Sun radiate?
Stigger 03-12-07, 12:40 AM	Presumably law... don't recall that as being possible though... been a while since I looked at the cleric aura rules.
AbyssKnight 03-12-07, 10:54 PM	According to the Cleric's Aura of Faith class ability, you detect as you diety's alignment. So a neutral good cleric of Torm would still have a strong aura of law when viewed with a detect law spell, despite not being lawful himself. For clerics of Amaunator, this means that they only detect strongly of good. I would think they still detect as lawful, but only as a lawful creature and not as a cleric. Example for clarity. Neutral Good cleric 9 of Torm detects Strongly as both Lawful and Good (Torm is LG) Lawful Neutral cleric 9 of Amaunator detects Strongly as Good (Lathander is NG) and Faintly of Law
Stigger 03-13-07, 12:46 AM	Questionable though, since Amuanator had a LN aligment, and that's the aspect their worshipping... doesn't make sense they'd radiate the aura of their actual deity in those cases of divine impersonation that occassionally go on in the Realms really.
Perun 03-13-07, 09:00 AM	I've thought about this little dilemma, especially since my previous character died, and I made a cleric following the Risen Sun heresy (they believe that "time of Lathander's transformation is nigh, and Amaunator is about to return", Power of Faerūn, p. 47). The Risen Sun heresy allows only LG ans LN clerics (this is different from Amaunator's clergy as originaly presented in 2e AD&D accessory Faiths and Avatars which allowed clerics of any lawful alignment, but specialty priests (sunlords) could only be LN or LE; Lost Empires of Faerūn allows for any lawful alignment (presumably, since it only lists Amaunator's alignment as LN, and following the one-step rule that's LG, LN, and LE), both for clerics and the sunlords (PrC)). Now, it's failry obvious that in this case (with the Risen Sun heresy and Amaunator/Lathander thing) there are two different situations: Servant of the Fallen (Amaunator) Feat: Cleric actually worships the dead Amaunator. He's getting his spells and powers by power of his faith alone, and is bound by all standard rules regarding alignment allowed (any lawful), domains (Law, Nobility, Planning, Sun, Time), and favoured weapon (light mace). I'd consider this a general rule -- if a character chooses this feat, he's bound by the rules of the original (dead or slumbering) deity, regardless whether the said deity is currently being impersonated by another one. Heretic of the Faith Feat: Although in this particular case similar to the point above, the cleric knows he's worshipping Lathander, who (he believes) will soon be reincarnated as Amaunator. The approach seems to be a mesh of Amaunator's and Lathander's worship and dogma: the alignment allowed (LG, LN), domains available (Fire, Law, Nobility, Renewal, Sun, Time; although oddly enough neither Amaunator nor Lathander normally provide access to the Fire domain), and favoured weapon (light mace). Therefore, since Amaunator is dead, and Lathander hasn't transformed yet, it stands to reason that followers of the Risen Sun heresy would give off the aura of good (based on Lathander's NG alignment), and they would be unable to use spells with the [Evil] descriptor, regardless of their own alignment. That one was easy. The Dark Moon heresy is the tricky one. It teaches that Selūne and Shar are one and the same, two aspects of a single deity. Clerics following this heresy must be LN, N, or CN in alignment. Selūne is CG and Shar is NE in alignment. I believe their clerics would not give off any kind of aura (apart their own ones), since the two deific alignments would cancel each other.
AbyssKnight 03-13-07, 02:33 PM	I like the way you deal with Amaunator's worship slightly differently depending on the feat (actually worshipping dead Amaunator, or worshipping Lathander as Amaunator-to-be). For the Dark Moon heretics, I would go a different way. I would have the clerics detect strongly as both Good and Evil (and Chaos), and faintly of their own alignment is different than those.