How do you become a Shade? [Archive] - Wizards Community

How do you become a Shade? [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
First_Legion
09-17-07, 11:21 AM If you were trapped on the Plane of Shadow how would you become a shade. I know there is a spell because thats what the people of Shade Enclave used and divine interference could do it but what other ways are there if you are stuck there?
lavekkia
09-17-07, 02:38 PM By epic magic (for example many of the shades of Shade Enclave)
or by VERY prolonged exposure to the (demi)Plane Of Shadows (as probably happened to High Prince Telamont).

Or making a pact/bargain/being coerced by a powerful entity of the Shadow Plane or linked with shadows/shadow magic/shadow weave to exchange a part of soul with shadowstuff (the other likely option for the High Prince).

Finally you could have been exposed to a SW/shadow magic artifact (see wht happened to Erevis Cale).

Or maybe you simply have a NASTY DM ;)
SmartPaladin
09-17-07, 06:21 PM By epic magic (for example many of the shades of Shade Enclave)
or by VERY prolonged exposure to the (demi)Plane Of Shadows (as probably happened to High Prince Telamont).

Or making a pact/bargain/being coerced by a powerful entity of the Shadow Plane or linked with shadows/shadow magic/shadow weave to exchange a part of soul with shadowstuff (the other likely option for the High Prince).

Finally you could have been exposed to a SW/shadow magic artifact (see wht happened to Erevis Cale).

Or maybe you simply have a NASTY DM ;)

Or you can try using your vampiric dagger and drain the life force/soul of a Shade. Worked for Artemis Entreri.
First_Legion
09-17-07, 07:34 PM By epic magic (for example many of the shades of Shade Enclave)
or by VERY prolonged exposure to the (demi)Plane Of Shadows (as probably happened to High Prince Telamont).

Or making a pact/bargain/being coerced by a powerful entity of the Shadow Plane or linked with shadows/shadow magic/shadow weave to exchange a part of soul with shadowstuff (the other likely option for the High Prince).

Finally you could have been exposed to a SW/shadow magic artifact (see wht happened to Erevis Cale).

Or maybe you simply have a NASTY DM ;)

What if you had a vampire that roamed the plane of shadow for about a hundred or more years and fed off of the creatures there. Could that vampire after some time become a shade as well. The vampire would be drinking their blood but it seems to me that when a creature from that plane gets hurt the bleed shadow as well so the vampire would feed off of that as well.
Green Elven Vampire
09-18-07, 12:26 AM What if you had a vampire that roamed the plane of shadow for about a hundred or more years and fed off of the creatures there. Could that vampire after some time become a shade as well. The vampire would be drinking their blood but it seems to me that when a creature from that plane gets hurt the bleed shadow as well so the vampire would feed off of that as well.

Undead cannot become Shades! You must trade some of your life essence for shadowstuff. You must have a soul to become a Shade and Undead don't have souls.
1 ton ghost
09-18-07, 02:01 AM there isn't a published modus that i know of, so it's DM's discretion. that alone is a compelling plot hook to be sure of.

all i remember from FRCS is that it's reserved for Shadovar hotshots. and we're talking about a protracted and probably morally "flexible" tenure w/ a great deal of tests to prove one's loyalty. they don't hand out such a blessing to any old Shadovar. a very small percentage of Shade are Shades.

it's a totally decent template, but having it realistically means you're in the pocket to some superior from Shadovar which will undoubtedly cause conflict w/ most parties. perhaps a delegation, someone's a Krinth, others could be regular Shadovar citizens, etc.

on a side note, is it me, or is the shape and flavor of many Anauroch campaigns involving the Bedine, Zhentarim (black road), and Shadovar an allusion or 4 to Dune?
First_Legion
09-18-07, 07:15 AM Undead cannot become Shades! You must trade some of your life essence for shadowstuff. You must have a soul to become a Shade and Undead don't have souls.

I have a way around that. My vampire has an item in his possession that allows his to take the souls of others, so could he trade that soul and life essence for shadowstuff.
Green Elven Vampire
09-20-07, 01:43 AM I have a way around that. My vampire has an item in his possession that allows his to take the souls of others, so could he trade that soul and life essence for shadowstuff.

That life essence isn't connected to flesh and blood and soul to be given over for shadowstuff. I would say no.
First_Legion
09-20-07, 07:24 AM Well where does the soul of a vampire go when he is turned, and what would happen if he could get his soul back? Would he still be a vampire or would he turn back into a human, if he stayed a vampire he could then trade his entire soul or half of it for shadowstuff.
1 ton ghost
09-20-07, 11:02 AM i didn't think vamps were soulless. true, they are abomination as undead and henceforth unnatural, but sentience and so forth kinda' makes me lean towards the soul.
they are stuck outside the mortal coil, but given the great lengths it takes to slay one, especially the stake/heart metaphor, it would allude to the (a) soul.
normally, you shouldn't play a vamp, but if provisions were made, i don't see why you couldn't much less have a shade template...especially given several hundred years on sabbatical in the Plane of Shadow; interesting plot hook.
First_Legion
09-20-07, 12:25 PM That was my first idea. I was going to have a vampire trapped on the Plane of Shadows for at least a century and having to feed off of the shadow beings there. I was hoping that being exposed to the realm itself and feeding there would bring the shadowstuff into his body. Maybe not a true shade in the end but at least a being that can control the shadows and use them to travel both on Toril and to the different planes altogether.
daimyotx
09-21-07, 08:27 AM i didn't think vamps were soulless. true, they are abomination as undead and henceforth unnatural, but sentience and so forth kinda' makes me lean towards the soul.
they are stuck outside the mortal coil, but given the great lengths it takes to slay one, especially the stake/heart metaphor, it would allude to the (a) soul.

I tend to agree, mainly because fantasy settings (various D&D ones included) are rife with stories of Vampires who feel regret and there have been a few who actually manage to use their undead state to accomplish some worthwile goals.

Their soul may be corrupt and black, but it's still there.

As for a Vampire becoming a shade - I'm not sure if its possible. Shade is a template and IIRC can only be applied to Humanoid or Monstrous Humanoid types.

Vampire is a template that can be added to any Humanoid or Monstrous Humanoid type. They then become Undead type with Augmented Humanoid or Monstrous humanoid as a subtype. subtle but very real difference.
Telagaunt
09-23-07, 06:27 AM Undead cannot become Shades! You must trade some of your life essence for shadowstuff. You must have a soul to become a Shade and Undead don't have souls.

Ah yes but can an undead become a shade! I haven't read anything saying an undead could not further himself by becoming a shade (though vice-versa I don't think it's possible). Also in Lords of Darkness it mentioned Telamont (with his prolonged life-span from being a shade) has used multiple wish spells to keep himself alive and hasn't decided to become an undead yet. :eek:

As far as with what happened to Entreri, there's no 'rules' per say, saying that Vampiric drains or things like that make you a shade. Entreri is the only example. I love RAS, but that short story ticked me off. If they advance the possibility in a game mechanic sense, what's stopping a wiz/sor from casting Vampiric Touch or something on a shade and then you get a bunch more shades running around.... :rolleyes:

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
First_Legion 09-17-07, 11:21 AM	If you were trapped on the Plane of Shadow how would you become a shade. I know there is a spell because thats what the people of Shade Enclave used and divine interference could do it but what other ways are there if you are stuck there?
lavekkia 09-17-07, 02:38 PM	By epic magic (for example many of the shades of Shade Enclave) or by VERY prolonged exposure to the (demi)Plane Of Shadows (as probably happened to High Prince Telamont). Or making a pact/bargain/being coerced by a powerful entity of the Shadow Plane or linked with shadows/shadow magic/shadow weave to exchange a part of soul with shadowstuff (the other likely option for the High Prince). Finally you could have been exposed to a SW/shadow magic artifact (see wht happened to Erevis Cale). Or maybe you simply have a NASTY DM ;)
SmartPaladin 09-17-07, 06:21 PM	By epic magic (for example many of the shades of Shade Enclave) or by VERY prolonged exposure to the (demi)Plane Of Shadows (as probably happened to High Prince Telamont). Or making a pact/bargain/being coerced by a powerful entity of the Shadow Plane or linked with shadows/shadow magic/shadow weave to exchange a part of soul with shadowstuff (the other likely option for the High Prince). Finally you could have been exposed to a SW/shadow magic artifact (see wht happened to Erevis Cale). Or maybe you simply have a NASTY DM ;) Or you can try using your vampiric dagger and drain the life force/soul of a Shade. Worked for Artemis Entreri.
First_Legion 09-17-07, 07:34 PM	By epic magic (for example many of the shades of Shade Enclave) or by VERY prolonged exposure to the (demi)Plane Of Shadows (as probably happened to High Prince Telamont). Or making a pact/bargain/being coerced by a powerful entity of the Shadow Plane or linked with shadows/shadow magic/shadow weave to exchange a part of soul with shadowstuff (the other likely option for the High Prince). Finally you could have been exposed to a SW/shadow magic artifact (see wht happened to Erevis Cale). Or maybe you simply have a NASTY DM ;) What if you had a vampire that roamed the plane of shadow for about a hundred or more years and fed off of the creatures there. Could that vampire after some time become a shade as well. The vampire would be drinking their blood but it seems to me that when a creature from that plane gets hurt the bleed shadow as well so the vampire would feed off of that as well.
Green Elven Vampire 09-18-07, 12:26 AM	What if you had a vampire that roamed the plane of shadow for about a hundred or more years and fed off of the creatures there. Could that vampire after some time become a shade as well. The vampire would be drinking their blood but it seems to me that when a creature from that plane gets hurt the bleed shadow as well so the vampire would feed off of that as well. Undead cannot become Shades! You must trade some of your life essence for shadowstuff. You must have a soul to become a Shade and Undead don't have souls.
1 ton ghost 09-18-07, 02:01 AM	there isn't a published modus that i know of, so it's DM's discretion. that alone is a compelling plot hook to be sure of. all i remember from FRCS is that it's reserved for Shadovar hotshots. and we're talking about a protracted and probably morally "flexible" tenure w/ a great deal of tests to prove one's loyalty. they don't hand out such a blessing to any old Shadovar. a very small percentage of Shade are Shades. it's a totally decent template, but having it realistically means you're in the pocket to some superior from Shadovar which will undoubtedly cause conflict w/ most parties. perhaps a delegation, someone's a Krinth, others could be regular Shadovar citizens, etc. on a side note, is it me, or is the shape and flavor of many Anauroch campaigns involving the Bedine, Zhentarim (black road), and Shadovar an allusion or 4 to Dune?
First_Legion 09-18-07, 07:15 AM	Undead cannot become Shades! You must trade some of your life essence for shadowstuff. You must have a soul to become a Shade and Undead don't have souls. I have a way around that. My vampire has an item in his possession that allows his to take the souls of others, so could he trade that soul and life essence for shadowstuff.
Green Elven Vampire 09-20-07, 01:43 AM	I have a way around that. My vampire has an item in his possession that allows his to take the souls of others, so could he trade that soul and life essence for shadowstuff. That life essence isn't connected to flesh and blood and soul to be given over for shadowstuff. I would say no.
First_Legion 09-20-07, 07:24 AM	Well where does the soul of a vampire go when he is turned, and what would happen if he could get his soul back? Would he still be a vampire or would he turn back into a human, if he stayed a vampire he could then trade his entire soul or half of it for shadowstuff.
1 ton ghost 09-20-07, 11:02 AM	i didn't think vamps were soulless. true, they are abomination as undead and henceforth unnatural, but sentience and so forth kinda' makes me lean towards the soul. they are stuck outside the mortal coil, but given the great lengths it takes to slay one, especially the stake/heart metaphor, it would allude to the (a) soul. normally, you shouldn't play a vamp, but if provisions were made, i don't see why you couldn't much less have a shade template...especially given several hundred years on sabbatical in the Plane of Shadow; interesting plot hook.
First_Legion 09-20-07, 12:25 PM	That was my first idea. I was going to have a vampire trapped on the Plane of Shadows for at least a century and having to feed off of the shadow beings there. I was hoping that being exposed to the realm itself and feeding there would bring the shadowstuff into his body. Maybe not a true shade in the end but at least a being that can control the shadows and use them to travel both on Toril and to the different planes altogether.
daimyotx 09-21-07, 08:27 AM	i didn't think vamps were soulless. true, they are abomination as undead and henceforth unnatural, but sentience and so forth kinda' makes me lean towards the soul. they are stuck outside the mortal coil, but given the great lengths it takes to slay one, especially the stake/heart metaphor, it would allude to the (a) soul. I tend to agree, mainly because fantasy settings (various D&D ones included) are rife with stories of Vampires who feel regret and there have been a few who actually manage to use their undead state to accomplish some worthwile goals. Their soul may be corrupt and black, but it's still there. As for a Vampire becoming a shade - I'm not sure if its possible. Shade is a template and IIRC can only be applied to Humanoid or Monstrous Humanoid types. Vampire is a template that can be added to any Humanoid or Monstrous Humanoid type. They then become Undead type with Augmented Humanoid or Monstrous humanoid as a subtype. subtle but very real difference.
Telagaunt 09-23-07, 06:27 AM	Undead cannot become Shades! You must trade some of your life essence for shadowstuff. You must have a soul to become a Shade and Undead don't have souls. Ah yes but can an undead become a shade! I haven't read anything saying an undead could not further himself by becoming a shade (though vice-versa I don't think it's possible). Also in Lords of Darkness it mentioned Telamont (with his prolonged life-span from being a shade) has used multiple wish spells to keep himself alive and hasn't decided to become an undead yet. :eek: As far as with what happened to Entreri, there's no 'rules' per say, saying that Vampiric drains or things like that make you a shade. Entreri is the only example. I love RAS, but that short story ticked me off. If they advance the possibility in a game mechanic sense, what's stopping a wiz/sor from casting Vampiric Touch or something on a shade and then you get a bunch more shades running around.... :rolleyes: