How old is the Triad [Archive] - Wizards Community

How old is the Triad [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
Suin Bahhar
05-18-07, 09:22 AM When did the gods Ilmater, Torm an Tyr form the Triad? Why did they do it? Was it in responce to the Evil gods deeds?

Also why are Torm and Helm's clergy having disputes as of lately? Because of the atrocities in Maztica? Where can I read about those...
BadCatMan
05-18-07, 09:35 AM Tyr, Ilmater and Torm got together following the fall of Jhaamdath. Tyr arrived to pacify the remnants in -247, Ilmater joined him in -243, and Torm joined in years later. This is detailed in Faiths & Pantheons.

EDIT: In Tyr's entry.
Old Sage
05-18-07, 10:11 AM Here's some compiled thoughts from both Garen Thal and Steven Schend on the early years of the Triad...

Firstly, Garen -

"As for the date, there's no hard, published Realmslore on the subject, but I'd wager that the first temples containing shrines to all three deities (there aren't really any temples "to the Triad" anywhere) cropped up some time around -200DR."

...

And Steven -

"I don't recall where the Triad was first mentioned, but I know I made a lot with them in Lands of Intrigue. Just in terms of historical placement (and some personal bias, I'll admit ), I would probably place some of the first organized churches/temples to the Triad somewhere around the LOI/Calimshan/Deepwash areas as places to which escaped slaves could flee from the genies/efreet/Coramshite/Calishite slavers. Given the ages of those civilizations down thataway, chances are the earliest temples are also long since rubble.

Then again, I could be wrong and forgetting some crucial Realmslore that's tied to the gods--a segment I almost always left for Julia and Eric, as it gets too complicated for me at times.

Steven"

...

And then Garen again -

"There are some things to be considered when dealing with the Triad as a unified whole:

-Faiths and Pantheons dates the arrival of Tyr in Faerūn at -247 DR. His absorbtion of the older Calishite deity Anachtyr likely took place after the end of the Procession of Justice (-238 DR), when he was already allied with another southern deity, Ilmater.

-Torm was a mortal following the Fall of Netheril, and did not reasonably ascend to godhood until at least -300 DR.

-There are very, very few temples that form a unified worship of the Triad. More often, a temple is primarily dedicated to the worship of one of the deities (usually Tyr), with shrines to the other two. Only certain, remarkable locations--such as the abbey of Barakmordin--are truly dedicated to the Triad as a unified force.

My understanding (some of which I've made up to fill in blanks, of course) is that the former superior of Ilmater was in fact Anachtyr. As Anachtyr grew older and tired of his divine duties (something very difficult for a deity), he became more withdrawn from his allies and followers, no longer the symbol of armed justice he once was. With the coming of Tyr, Anachtyr saw a younger, more vigorous version of himself, and allowed himself to be absorbed following the success of the Procession of Justice, tempering the war-like nature of the interloper god with his own wiser thoughts. With the end of his campaign and the tempering of his nature, Tyr sought out a war captain to oversee his more military efforts, both on Faerūn and throughout the planes: Torm.

Because the largest, oldest, and most lavish temples to Tyr at the time were actually dedicated to Anachtyr, they would, as Steven suggests, be in the area of Calimshan's former empire. Such temples would likely have contained shrines to Ilmater, as well, and following the ascension of Torm, would have gladly added the worship of Tyr's lieutenant to their complexes."
BrennonGoldeye
05-18-07, 10:37 AM Ok, GD better get out of the way. I'm marrying this man. :D
GothicDan
05-18-07, 11:39 AM No! Rawr! I like my men geeky!
BrennonGoldeye
05-18-07, 12:10 PM Hmmm. Well, we could make it a Sharessan ceremony. That way Mrs. Sage might not be quite as miffed. :)
GothicDan
05-18-07, 12:22 PM Hawt.
Lord Karsus
05-18-07, 02:09 PM -Yeeeeah, I don't know if I want to perform this wedding ceremony anymore...
Old Sage
05-18-07, 09:12 PM Hmmm. Well, we could make it a Sharessan ceremony. That way Mrs. Sage might not be quite as miffed. :)I'm sure she'd probably agree with that... as the Lady K is always trying to encourage the Lady Hooded One to involve herself in any of the divine ceremonies [though, the ceremonies of the Lovites can be somewhat frightening] we discuss at Candlekeep. :P
GothicDan
05-18-07, 09:41 PM Mmm, Lovites...

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Suin Bahhar 05-18-07, 09:22 AM	When did the gods Ilmater, Torm an Tyr form the Triad? Why did they do it? Was it in responce to the Evil gods deeds? Also why are Torm and Helm's clergy having disputes as of lately? Because of the atrocities in Maztica? Where can I read about those...
BadCatMan 05-18-07, 09:35 AM	Tyr, Ilmater and Torm got together following the fall of Jhaamdath. Tyr arrived to pacify the remnants in -247, Ilmater joined him in -243, and Torm joined in years later. This is detailed in Faiths & Pantheons. EDIT: In Tyr's entry.
Old Sage 05-18-07, 10:11 AM	Here's some compiled thoughts from both Garen Thal and Steven Schend on the early years of the Triad... Firstly, Garen - "As for the date, there's no hard, published Realmslore on the subject, but I'd wager that the first temples containing shrines to all three deities (there aren't really any temples "to the Triad" anywhere) cropped up some time around -200DR." ... And Steven - "I don't recall where the Triad was first mentioned, but I know I made a lot with them in Lands of Intrigue. Just in terms of historical placement (and some personal bias, I'll admit ), I would probably place some of the first organized churches/temples to the Triad somewhere around the LOI/Calimshan/Deepwash areas as places to which escaped slaves could flee from the genies/efreet/Coramshite/Calishite slavers. Given the ages of those civilizations down thataway, chances are the earliest temples are also long since rubble. Then again, I could be wrong and forgetting some crucial Realmslore that's tied to the gods--a segment I almost always left for Julia and Eric, as it gets too complicated for me at times. Steven" ... And then Garen again - "There are some things to be considered when dealing with the Triad as a unified whole: -Faiths and Pantheons dates the arrival of Tyr in Faerūn at -247 DR. His absorbtion of the older Calishite deity Anachtyr likely took place after the end of the Procession of Justice (-238 DR), when he was already allied with another southern deity, Ilmater. -Torm was a mortal following the Fall of Netheril, and did not reasonably ascend to godhood until at least -300 DR. -There are very, very few temples that form a unified worship of the Triad. More often, a temple is primarily dedicated to the worship of one of the deities (usually Tyr), with shrines to the other two. Only certain, remarkable locations--such as the abbey of Barakmordin--are truly dedicated to the Triad as a unified force. My understanding (some of which I've made up to fill in blanks, of course) is that the former superior of Ilmater was in fact Anachtyr. As Anachtyr grew older and tired of his divine duties (something very difficult for a deity), he became more withdrawn from his allies and followers, no longer the symbol of armed justice he once was. With the coming of Tyr, Anachtyr saw a younger, more vigorous version of himself, and allowed himself to be absorbed following the success of the Procession of Justice, tempering the war-like nature of the interloper god with his own wiser thoughts. With the end of his campaign and the tempering of his nature, Tyr sought out a war captain to oversee his more military efforts, both on Faerūn and throughout the planes: Torm. Because the largest, oldest, and most lavish temples to Tyr at the time were actually dedicated to Anachtyr, they would, as Steven suggests, be in the area of Calimshan's former empire. Such temples would likely have contained shrines to Ilmater, as well, and following the ascension of Torm, would have gladly added the worship of Tyr's lieutenant to their complexes."
BrennonGoldeye 05-18-07, 10:37 AM	Ok, GD better get out of the way. I'm marrying this man. :D
GothicDan 05-18-07, 11:39 AM	No! Rawr! I like my men geeky!
BrennonGoldeye 05-18-07, 12:10 PM	Hmmm. Well, we could make it a Sharessan ceremony. That way Mrs. Sage might not be quite as miffed. :)
GothicDan 05-18-07, 12:22 PM	Hawt.
Lord Karsus 05-18-07, 02:09 PM	-Yeeeeah, I don't know if I want to perform this wedding ceremony anymore...
Old Sage 05-18-07, 09:12 PM	Hmmm. Well, we could make it a Sharessan ceremony. That way Mrs. Sage might not be quite as miffed. :)I'm sure she'd probably agree with that... as the Lady K is always trying to encourage the Lady Hooded One to involve herself in any of the divine ceremonies [though, the ceremonies of the Lovites can be somewhat frightening] we discuss at Candlekeep. :P
GothicDan 05-18-07, 09:41 PM	Mmm, Lovites...