Mythal Spellcraft DC [Archive] - Wizards Community

Mythal Spellcraft DC [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
Ifthir
04-17-08, 08:06 PM In a campaign I am running, I am leaning towards having an evil lich create a mythal, but I am not sure if I am calculating the spellcraft DC correctly to even be able to tell if the NPC and his followers that I am using can create said mythal. The effects and what I think are the multipliers are as follows:

Prevalent Spells:

(Unhallow - Evocation [Evil] Clr 5, Drd 5) (5 x CL x100) (4,500)
(Unholy Aura - Abjuration [Evil]) Clr 8, Evil 8) (Keyed to undead) (8 x CL x100) (24,000)
(Life Ward - Abjuration Clr 4) (Keyed to undead) (4 x CL x100) (5,600)
(Detect Scrying) (4 x CL x100) (2,800)
(Deeper Darkness - Evocation [Darkness] Clr 3) (3 x CL x100) (1,500)

Arointed Schools:

Conjuration (Healing) (15,000)
Good (15,000)
Teleportation (Keyed to any non-undead) (30,000)

The mythal is anchored to an evil node.

My calculations currently come to:
98,400 / 1,000 = 98 + 25 Base = 123 / (Anchored 3/4) = 92 DC

Am I way off, or is this correct? I am simply poor at calculating mythal spellcraft DC and I would love if someone could guide me. Thanks.
Khaelieth
04-18-08, 07:39 AM Mythals cannot be created unless the lich's an elf, and don't think High Magic allows it. Also think you'd need a circle of High Magi for it, due to it being a ritual, fluff wise at least. i'm not expert though, ask LK or MT, as GD's not been around lately. You could create a Mythallar, i suppose.

Aside from that, it looks good=)
Lord Karsus
04-18-08, 08:41 AM Also think you'd need a circle of High Magi for it, due to it being a ritual, fluff wise at least. i'm not expert though, ask LK or MT, as GD's not been around lately.

-In the lore of the Forgotten Realms, there are two kinds of Mythals: Wizardly Mythals and True Mythals. Wizardly Mythals are created by a caster, and True Mythals are created by a circle of Elven Selu'Taar.
Stigger
04-18-08, 03:09 PM Interesting build, but it'd probably be easier to make the Detect Scrying effect a permanent one on the lich, rather than tying it into the mythal... should knock a bit off the DC, and you get the benefit of minions not knowing when the master is looking.

Looking over it though, did you remember to figure in the duration cost modifiers for the prevalent spells? That could up the DC considerably, and require a few more mitigating factors to get it down to something more manageable. Other than that it looked about right.
Ifthir
04-18-08, 11:51 PM Interesting build, but it'd probably be easier to make the Detect Scrying effect a permanent one on the lich, rather than tying it into the mythal... should knock a bit off the DC, and you get the benefit of minions not knowing when the master is looking.

Hmm, good point, the idea is that the lich will be able to detect the players scrying, and consequently respond :)

Looking over it though, did you remember to figure in the duration cost modifiers for the prevalent spells? That could up the DC considerably, and require a few more mitigating factors to get it down to something more manageable.

No, I sure didn't, and now, having said that, here is a recalculation that seems a bit high though perhaps not impossible to make for a lich and his minions. I think having the lich's minions die during the creation process might be a way to overcome the high spellcraft DC.

Prevalent Powers:
(Unhallow - Evocation [Evil] Clr 5, Drd 5) (Medium Prevalent Power) (20,000)
(Unholy Aura - Abjuration [Evil]) Clr 8, Evil 8) (Keyed to undead) (Major Prevalent Power, Keyed) (50,000) (X2) (100,000)
(Life Ward - Abjuration Clr 4) (Keyed to undead) (Medium Prevalent Power, Keyed) (20,000) (X2) (40,000)
(Detect Scrying) (Wiz 4) (Keyed to lich) (Medium Prevalent Power, Keyed) (20,000) (X2) (40,000)
(Deeper Darkness - Evocation [Darkness] Clr 3) (3 x CL x100) (1,500)

Arointed Schools:

Conjuration (Healing) (15,000)
Good (15,000)

The mythal is anchored to an evil node.

My calculations currently come to:
231,500 / 1,000 = 231 + 25 Base = 256 / (Anchored 3/4) = 192 DC
Stigger
04-19-08, 02:23 AM Karsus the Mad, we shall miss him, had a thread over on the epic level forums that listed some absolutely fantastic mitigating factors that could easily drop that in half if you want to use them. Some really good stuff from around the community compiled into one handy place here (http://forums.gleemax.com/showthread.php?t=432709). Hope it helps some.
Lord Karsus
04-19-08, 01:19 PM Karsus the Mad, we shall miss him, had a thread over on the epic level forums that listed some absolutely fantastic mitigating factors that could easily drop that in half if you want to use them. Some really good stuff from around the community compiled into one handy place here (http://forums.gleemax.com/showthread.php?t=432709). Hope it helps some.

-Yeah...He was the aspect that understood the Epic Spellcasting rules. I have photocopies of the book, but I haven't really studied it, and only understand the most basic things concerning Epic Levels and Epic Spellcasting.
Stigger
04-19-08, 02:52 PM I'm actually quite fond of the epic spellcasting rules... not as good as M:tA magick, but close enough to feel almost as free form.
Alediran
04-21-08, 12:41 PM I'm actually quite fond of the epic spellcasting rules... not as good as M:tA magick, but close enough to feel almost as free form.

Yep, they provided rules on how to make spells, I usually refer to them for ideas when I create new spells, which is something Alediran is going to do after CotSQ ends.
Stigger
04-21-08, 06:03 PM Was even better if you used the stuff on the Epic boards to cover some of those areas ignored by the 'official' rules, although some of the 'fan' seeds were a little obtuse at first read. Useful as a baseline though, regardless.
Khaelieth
04-21-08, 06:44 PM -Yeah...He was the aspect that understood the Epic Spellcasting rules. I have photocopies of the book, but I haven't really studied it, and only understand the most basic things concerning Epic Levels and Epic Spellcasting.

Your 12th level spell did go a bit awry, yeah. ;p
Lord Karsus
04-21-08, 11:14 PM Your 12th level spell did go a bit awry, yeah. ;p

-That wasn't an Epic Spell. It was a True Dweomer.
Stigger
04-22-08, 12:49 PM Tiny wee bit of a difference... ;)
Lord Karsus
04-22-08, 02:46 PM Tiny wee bit of a difference... ;)

-Though, theoretically, Karsus' Avatar could be developed as an Epic Spell...:plotting:
Stigger
04-23-08, 01:39 PM Sure... anything could be really given the right seed combination and a high enough Spellcraft ability.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Ifthir 04-17-08, 08:06 PM	In a campaign I am running, I am leaning towards having an evil lich create a mythal, but I am not sure if I am calculating the spellcraft DC correctly to even be able to tell if the NPC and his followers that I am using can create said mythal. The effects and what I think are the multipliers are as follows: Prevalent Spells: (Unhallow - Evocation [Evil] Clr 5, Drd 5) (5 x CL x100) (4,500) (Unholy Aura - Abjuration [Evil]) Clr 8, Evil 8) (Keyed to undead) (8 x CL x100) (24,000) (Life Ward - Abjuration Clr 4) (Keyed to undead) (4 x CL x100) (5,600) (Detect Scrying) (4 x CL x100) (2,800) (Deeper Darkness - Evocation [Darkness] Clr 3) (3 x CL x100) (1,500) Arointed Schools: Conjuration (Healing) (15,000) Good (15,000) Teleportation (Keyed to any non-undead) (30,000) The mythal is anchored to an evil node. My calculations currently come to: 98,400 / 1,000 = 98 + 25 Base = 123 / (Anchored 3/4) = 92 DC Am I way off, or is this correct? I am simply poor at calculating mythal spellcraft DC and I would love if someone could guide me. Thanks.
Khaelieth 04-18-08, 07:39 AM	Mythals cannot be created unless the lich's an elf, and don't think High Magic allows it. Also think you'd need a circle of High Magi for it, due to it being a ritual, fluff wise at least. i'm not expert though, ask LK or MT, as GD's not been around lately. You could create a Mythallar, i suppose. Aside from that, it looks good=)
Lord Karsus 04-18-08, 08:41 AM	Also think you'd need a circle of High Magi for it, due to it being a ritual, fluff wise at least. i'm not expert though, ask LK or MT, as GD's not been around lately. -In the lore of the Forgotten Realms, there are two kinds of Mythals: Wizardly Mythals and True Mythals. Wizardly Mythals are created by a caster, and True Mythals are created by a circle of Elven Selu'Taar.
Stigger 04-18-08, 03:09 PM	Interesting build, but it'd probably be easier to make the Detect Scrying effect a permanent one on the lich, rather than tying it into the mythal... should knock a bit off the DC, and you get the benefit of minions not knowing when the master is looking. Looking over it though, did you remember to figure in the duration cost modifiers for the prevalent spells? That could up the DC considerably, and require a few more mitigating factors to get it down to something more manageable. Other than that it looked about right.
Ifthir 04-18-08, 11:51 PM	Interesting build, but it'd probably be easier to make the Detect Scrying effect a permanent one on the lich, rather than tying it into the mythal... should knock a bit off the DC, and you get the benefit of minions not knowing when the master is looking. Hmm, good point, the idea is that the lich will be able to detect the players scrying, and consequently respond :) Looking over it though, did you remember to figure in the duration cost modifiers for the prevalent spells? That could up the DC considerably, and require a few more mitigating factors to get it down to something more manageable. No, I sure didn't, and now, having said that, here is a recalculation that seems a bit high though perhaps not impossible to make for a lich and his minions. I think having the lich's minions die during the creation process might be a way to overcome the high spellcraft DC. Prevalent Powers: (Unhallow - Evocation [Evil] Clr 5, Drd 5) (Medium Prevalent Power) (20,000) (Unholy Aura - Abjuration [Evil]) Clr 8, Evil 8) (Keyed to undead) (Major Prevalent Power, Keyed) (50,000) (X2) (100,000) (Life Ward - Abjuration Clr 4) (Keyed to undead) (Medium Prevalent Power, Keyed) (20,000) (X2) (40,000) (Detect Scrying) (Wiz 4) (Keyed to lich) (Medium Prevalent Power, Keyed) (20,000) (X2) (40,000) (Deeper Darkness - Evocation [Darkness] Clr 3) (3 x CL x100) (1,500) Arointed Schools: Conjuration (Healing) (15,000) Good (15,000) The mythal is anchored to an evil node. My calculations currently come to: 231,500 / 1,000 = 231 + 25 Base = 256 / (Anchored 3/4) = 192 DC
Stigger 04-19-08, 02:23 AM	Karsus the Mad, we shall miss him, had a thread over on the epic level forums that listed some absolutely fantastic mitigating factors that could easily drop that in half if you want to use them. Some really good stuff from around the community compiled into one handy place here (http://forums.gleemax.com/showthread.php?t=432709). Hope it helps some.
Lord Karsus 04-19-08, 01:19 PM	Karsus the Mad, we shall miss him, had a thread over on the epic level forums that listed some absolutely fantastic mitigating factors that could easily drop that in half if you want to use them. Some really good stuff from around the community compiled into one handy place here (http://forums.gleemax.com/showthread.php?t=432709). Hope it helps some. -Yeah...He was the aspect that understood the Epic Spellcasting rules. I have photocopies of the book, but I haven't really studied it, and only understand the most basic things concerning Epic Levels and Epic Spellcasting.
Stigger 04-19-08, 02:52 PM	I'm actually quite fond of the epic spellcasting rules... not as good as M:tA magick, but close enough to feel almost as free form.
Alediran 04-21-08, 12:41 PM	I'm actually quite fond of the epic spellcasting rules... not as good as M:tA magick, but close enough to feel almost as free form. Yep, they provided rules on how to make spells, I usually refer to them for ideas when I create new spells, which is something Alediran is going to do after CotSQ ends.
Stigger 04-21-08, 06:03 PM	Was even better if you used the stuff on the Epic boards to cover some of those areas ignored by the 'official' rules, although some of the 'fan' seeds were a little obtuse at first read. Useful as a baseline though, regardless.
Khaelieth 04-21-08, 06:44 PM	-Yeah...He was the aspect that understood the Epic Spellcasting rules. I have photocopies of the book, but I haven't really studied it, and only understand the most basic things concerning Epic Levels and Epic Spellcasting. Your 12th level spell did go a bit awry, yeah. ;p
Lord Karsus 04-21-08, 11:14 PM	Your 12th level spell did go a bit awry, yeah. ;p -That wasn't an Epic Spell. It was a True Dweomer.
Stigger 04-22-08, 12:49 PM	Tiny wee bit of a difference... ;)
Lord Karsus 04-22-08, 02:46 PM	Tiny wee bit of a difference... ;) -Though, theoretically, Karsus' Avatar could be developed as an Epic Spell...:plotting:
Stigger 04-23-08, 01:39 PM	Sure... anything could be really given the right seed combination and a high enough Spellcraft ability.