Rare spells [Archive] - Wizards Community

Rare spells [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
Boda
06-29-07, 01:09 PM Was wandering about some spells that apparently only it's creators have(like soulfire from shoon). Are they stated anywhere, and if they existed, would Mystra and possibly Ohgma know about it?
The_Wrath_of_Talos
06-29-07, 04:04 PM The place to look for that info would be magic of faerun.
Bloodtide_the_Red
06-29-07, 04:59 PM There are only a couple spells in FR books that are known to a single person or a small group of people. Most feel it's a waste of time to give a couple of pages of spells that can't be used, so they don't bother. There are naturaly thousands of spells in the Realms, and at least a couple hundred rare ones. Typicaly, any spell caster with a couple levels takes the time to make a new spell for themselfs. That is where spells come from, after all.

Some examples-
-Manshoon has hia clone spell
-Elminster has dozens of unique spells
-The Simbul has dozens of unique spells
-Khelben has his BlackStaff spell
-Lareal has her Crowning touch spell
-Danilo has his Cream Pie spell

Mystra, the other gods of magic, Oghma, Shar, and plenty of the other gods would know every spell that existed anywhere, even secret unique ones.
MerrikCale
06-30-07, 08:22 AM Was wandering about some spells that apparently only it's creators have(like soulfire from shoon). Are they stated anywhere, and if they existed, would Mystra and possibly Ohgma know about it?

"Elminster's Babe Magnet Ointment". Personally, I cannot find any other explanation for the old coot to keep getting chicks
Boda
06-30-07, 02:46 PM But are some of these ancient anywhere other then the mind of it's creators and the Gods? Like in candlekeep?

For instance, why are there more know spells (of the arcane kind) that of the (divine kind). Shouldnt the churches have a record of spells developed by it's members?

About the soulfire spell. Apparently it needeed to sacrifice people to fuel the spell. But was it willing people or not. If not, then it killed the sacrified and it's target? I'm asking this because there's this discussion about mages combat capabilities and Shoon(the lich turned elf) was reputed to be a expert on magic combat.
boards
07-01-07, 06:39 PM If you have a look at the old Magister source book, a number of the spell books in there describe unique spells.
Zsych
07-01-07, 07:32 PM I'm not sure about Oghma also having knowledge of all mortal created magic.

I think he's more a general knowledge, books, ideas, kinda god.
Lord Karsus
07-03-07, 11:12 AM But are some of these ancient anywhere other then the mind of it's creators and the Gods? Like in candlekeep?

-That depends on if the creator of said spell decided to share it with others, or if his spellbook was somehow appropriated, and his spell reproduced by someone else. Certain individuals, such as the Magister, or Larloch, make it their business to "spread the word" concerning magic and spells, so to speak.
Steropes
07-04-07, 06:34 AM -That depends on if the creator of said spell decided to share it with others, or if his spellbook was somehow appropriated, and his spell reproduced by someone else. Certain individuals, such as the Magister, or Larloch, make it their business to "spread the word" concerning magic and spells, so to speak.

As does church of Azuth and Mystra. Azuths church even goes so far that it steals spells from spellcaster who don't want to share spells so that they would not be lost when creator dies.
Boda
07-04-07, 08:24 AM As does church of Azuth and Mystra. Azuths church even goes so far that it steals spells from spellcaster who don't want to share spells so that they would not be lost when creator dies.

Steals?! How do they do that?
Aldareth
07-04-07, 08:29 AM the easy way: sending a rogue/wizard/divine seeker
Lord Karsus
07-04-07, 06:07 PM the easy way: sending a rogue/wizard/divine seeker

-Yeah, that would work. Theoretically, they could also scry on said individual, to learn the secrets of their spell(s).
Karsus the Mad
07-05-07, 12:20 AM I find it amusing that Azuth's church, so associated with Mystra's church, would even require stealing spells. Mystra's church, given their patron, should already have copies of all known spells.
Oh damn, I just opened my own gag sig...that's pretty big...I must really suck.....
Boda
07-05-07, 12:43 PM That's not actually stealing, more like copying.

By that logic of churches having acess to their patron lore, noone could match the church of oghma(maybe sharans).

So even spells that are very specific (like those that the ice queen created), could in the lore of other churches or organizations?
Lord Karsus
07-05-07, 06:23 PM That's not actually stealing, more like copying.

-Copying without permission is stealing, though.

So even spells that are very specific (like those that the ice queen created), could in the lore of other churches or organizations?

-Theoretically, yes, if they've "appropriated them for the good of all mages across Faerūn."
Karsus the Mad
07-05-07, 07:29 PM That's not actually stealing, more like copying.

By that logic of churches having acess to their patron lore, noone could match the church of oghma(maybe sharans).

So even spells that are very specific (like those that the ice queen created), could in the lore of other churches or organizations?
I was responding to this
As does church of Azuth and Mystra. Azuths church even goes so far that it steals spells from spellcaster who don't want to share spells so that they would not be lost when creator dies.
Why does Azuth's church even need to steal spells? Mystra, being who she is, already knows ALL spells, and Azuth, being who he is, should not need to steal spells.
Aldareth
07-06-07, 01:21 AM I was responding to this

Why does Azuth's church even need to steal spells? Mystra, being who she is, already knows ALL spells, and Azuth, being who he is, should not need to steal spells.

and they deities sure dont "steal" them, but their followers have too.
if azuth/mystra/ogma just pass the knowledge on their followers ( because they allready know anything magical) what sort of research will happen?
exactly none and this is against their dogma, ogma teaches that you have to seek out and spreed knowledge, mystra and azuth require research from their followers , so how can you research something if your deity just pass you the knowledge?
Alleran
07-06-07, 01:31 AM Why does Azuth's church even need to steal spells?
Because Azuth doesn't exactly just go around handing out copies of every single spell to his church - instead, he works through agents by having mortals run around and steal them.

Though I'd be impressed if anybody had managed to penetrate Khelben's defenses to steal a copy of the Blackstaff spell.
Zireael
07-07-07, 04:45 AM But I thought Blackstaff is well known around, just most commonly used by Khelben...:D And scrying is a good idea. If they want to get all known spells,they have to steal some, not all mages would grant them permission to copy... :)
captaincarot
07-07-07, 06:00 AM now that would be a lark, sneak in to mystras library and get a look at her spell books. even the ghostly backwards echoes of tomes not yet written, woohooo who needs spell research you could learn every spell ever written or every spell yet to be written.

either that or deneir or oghmas library one of em is bound to have it in.
Arzair
07-07-07, 05:32 PM ooh, to have access to that library! Think of it, all the magic that ever existed.

Even 10th level spells?
Alleran
07-09-07, 12:00 AM But I thought Blackstaff is well known around, just most commonly used by Khelben...
Nah, I'm pretty sure Magic of Faerun states that Khelben only shares/shared knowledge of the spell with people he trusted implicitly or something like that. It's very much an "elite" spell that doesn't have a very widespread use.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Boda 06-29-07, 01:09 PM	Was wandering about some spells that apparently only it's creators have(like soulfire from shoon). Are they stated anywhere, and if they existed, would Mystra and possibly Ohgma know about it?
The_Wrath_of_Talos 06-29-07, 04:04 PM	The place to look for that info would be magic of faerun.
Bloodtide_the_Red 06-29-07, 04:59 PM	There are only a couple spells in FR books that are known to a single person or a small group of people. Most feel it's a waste of time to give a couple of pages of spells that can't be used, so they don't bother. There are naturaly thousands of spells in the Realms, and at least a couple hundred rare ones. Typicaly, any spell caster with a couple levels takes the time to make a new spell for themselfs. That is where spells come from, after all. Some examples- -Manshoon has hia clone spell -Elminster has dozens of unique spells -The Simbul has dozens of unique spells -Khelben has his BlackStaff spell -Lareal has her Crowning touch spell -Danilo has his Cream Pie spell Mystra, the other gods of magic, Oghma, Shar, and plenty of the other gods would know every spell that existed anywhere, even secret unique ones.
MerrikCale 06-30-07, 08:22 AM	Was wandering about some spells that apparently only it's creators have(like soulfire from shoon). Are they stated anywhere, and if they existed, would Mystra and possibly Ohgma know about it? "Elminster's Babe Magnet Ointment". Personally, I cannot find any other explanation for the old coot to keep getting chicks
Boda 06-30-07, 02:46 PM	But are some of these ancient anywhere other then the mind of it's creators and the Gods? Like in candlekeep? For instance, why are there more know spells (of the arcane kind) that of the (divine kind). Shouldnt the churches have a record of spells developed by it's members? About the soulfire spell. Apparently it needeed to sacrifice people to fuel the spell. But was it willing people or not. If not, then it killed the sacrified and it's target? I'm asking this because there's this discussion about mages combat capabilities and Shoon(the lich turned elf) was reputed to be a expert on magic combat.
boards 07-01-07, 06:39 PM	If you have a look at the old Magister source book, a number of the spell books in there describe unique spells.
Zsych 07-01-07, 07:32 PM	I'm not sure about Oghma also having knowledge of all mortal created magic. I think he's more a general knowledge, books, ideas, kinda god.
Lord Karsus 07-03-07, 11:12 AM	But are some of these ancient anywhere other then the mind of it's creators and the Gods? Like in candlekeep? -That depends on if the creator of said spell decided to share it with others, or if his spellbook was somehow appropriated, and his spell reproduced by someone else. Certain individuals, such as the Magister, or Larloch, make it their business to "spread the word" concerning magic and spells, so to speak.
Steropes 07-04-07, 06:34 AM	-That depends on if the creator of said spell decided to share it with others, or if his spellbook was somehow appropriated, and his spell reproduced by someone else. Certain individuals, such as the Magister, or Larloch, make it their business to "spread the word" concerning magic and spells, so to speak. As does church of Azuth and Mystra. Azuths church even goes so far that it steals spells from spellcaster who don't want to share spells so that they would not be lost when creator dies.
Boda 07-04-07, 08:24 AM	As does church of Azuth and Mystra. Azuths church even goes so far that it steals spells from spellcaster who don't want to share spells so that they would not be lost when creator dies. Steals?! How do they do that?
Aldareth 07-04-07, 08:29 AM	the easy way: sending a rogue/wizard/divine seeker
Lord Karsus 07-04-07, 06:07 PM	the easy way: sending a rogue/wizard/divine seeker -Yeah, that would work. Theoretically, they could also scry on said individual, to learn the secrets of their spell(s).
Karsus the Mad 07-05-07, 12:20 AM	I find it amusing that Azuth's church, so associated with Mystra's church, would even require stealing spells. Mystra's church, given their patron, should already have copies of all known spells. Oh damn, I just opened my own gag sig...that's pretty big...I must really suck.....
Boda 07-05-07, 12:43 PM	That's not actually stealing, more like copying. By that logic of churches having acess to their patron lore, noone could match the church of oghma(maybe sharans). So even spells that are very specific (like those that the ice queen created), could in the lore of other churches or organizations?
Lord Karsus 07-05-07, 06:23 PM	That's not actually stealing, more like copying. -Copying without permission is stealing, though. So even spells that are very specific (like those that the ice queen created), could in the lore of other churches or organizations? -Theoretically, yes, if they've "appropriated them for the good of all mages across Faerūn."
Karsus the Mad 07-05-07, 07:29 PM	That's not actually stealing, more like copying. By that logic of churches having acess to their patron lore, noone could match the church of oghma(maybe sharans). So even spells that are very specific (like those that the ice queen created), could in the lore of other churches or organizations? I was responding to this As does church of Azuth and Mystra. Azuths church even goes so far that it steals spells from spellcaster who don't want to share spells so that they would not be lost when creator dies. Why does Azuth's church even need to steal spells? Mystra, being who she is, already knows ALL spells, and Azuth, being who he is, should not need to steal spells.
Aldareth 07-06-07, 01:21 AM	I was responding to this Why does Azuth's church even need to steal spells? Mystra, being who she is, already knows ALL spells, and Azuth, being who he is, should not need to steal spells. and they deities sure dont "steal" them, but their followers have too. if azuth/mystra/ogma just pass the knowledge on their followers ( because they allready know anything magical) what sort of research will happen? exactly none and this is against their dogma, ogma teaches that you have to seek out and spreed knowledge, mystra and azuth require research from their followers , so how can you research something if your deity just pass you the knowledge?
Alleran 07-06-07, 01:31 AM	Why does Azuth's church even need to steal spells? Because Azuth doesn't exactly just go around handing out copies of every single spell to his church - instead, he works through agents by having mortals run around and steal them. Though I'd be impressed if anybody had managed to penetrate Khelben's defenses to steal a copy of the Blackstaff spell.
Zireael 07-07-07, 04:45 AM	But I thought Blackstaff is well known around, just most commonly used by Khelben...:D And scrying is a good idea. If they want to get all known spells,they have to steal some, not all mages would grant them permission to copy... :)
captaincarot 07-07-07, 06:00 AM	now that would be a lark, sneak in to mystras library and get a look at her spell books. even the ghostly backwards echoes of tomes not yet written, woohooo who needs spell research you could learn every spell ever written or every spell yet to be written. either that or deneir or oghmas library one of em is bound to have it in.
Arzair 07-07-07, 05:32 PM	ooh, to have access to that library! Think of it, all the magic that ever existed. Even 10th level spells?
Alleran 07-09-07, 12:00 AM	But I thought Blackstaff is well known around, just most commonly used by Khelben... Nah, I'm pretty sure Magic of Faerun states that Khelben only shares/shared knowledge of the spell with people he trusted implicitly or something like that. It's very much an "elite" spell that doesn't have a very widespread use.