Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Rick Day 09-23-07, 04:37 PM	Ive been following the Realms for 15 years now hooked long ago on the mystery and eloquence that ed greenwood and jeff grubbs and others lovingly instilled in the history and depth of this world. I read alot of fantasy as a teen and still do my first love was Dragonlance and I read everything they put out as it grew from Margaret and Tracy to the host of writers that later fleshed out the world and it was still very true to the feeling that they had created then someone along the line said hey we need to shake things up a bit and give the people "something new" The resulting books from the shakeup, chaos and all that mess have never reached anywhere near the distribution and quite frankly quality. They ruined, IMHO, a great thing. Now here we are facing the same thing in the Realms we all love so well. The powers that be at wiz have made decisions that lead us downt eh same path of systematicly taking what we have come to love about the realms and change it. Im in buissness and it just doesnt make sence. They have twice now released other settings feeling the waters so to speak as to where their audience was. Greyhawk, while having a detailed history doesnt have the passion and love that has been poured into the realms. It failed as the official setting for 3rd edition insomuch as not many chose to play there. THen came ebberon, mixing some "modern" ideas into a setting. Ive only met a few players who have been in this setting and they we just not "sold" on the setting. (to qualify this I havnt played in Ebberon). Through it all the Realms have outsold by far and continued to garner more interest for the game and for fantasy as a whole than any other thing TSR, Wiz, Hasbro has put out. I know that the face of gamming is changing and that something may need to be done to preserve table top gaming as a whole but why take what has always outperformed every other setting/product you have and destroy that about it which made it special. IT doesnt make any buissnes sence. For all the players out there who as a kid like I was had your eyes opened to what it truly means to dream and to look beyond what is on the surface. Thanks Ed.
ikki 09-23-07, 06:16 PM	I doubt they will screw up everything... but hopefully it will be less safe.. not some paladins in shining armor at every corner.. Like a dark mulhorand, undead thay, cutthroat sembia, greedy and arrogant aristocratic cormyr etc.. paladins being almost as hunted as a demon would be now walking in waterdeep.. Away with the wishywashy niceness where good always wins and reigns supreme with a rare few exceptions where just goods indecisiveness is really all that keeps evil alive at all..
dragonheart 09-23-07, 07:22 PM	Darker indeed - go out and get the grand history and read the last 2 pages - the "future History" then cry - the mourning for the realms we all knew starts now. I for one have already written in my changes for my campaign. WHile I'm willing to give 4.0 a chance as a rules set what they have done to the realms is at best dispicable.
Rinonalyrna Fathomlin 09-24-07, 01:18 PM	I doubt they will screw up everything... but hopefully it will be less safe.. not some paladins in shining armor at every corner.. ... Away with the wishywashy niceness where good always wins and reigns supreme with a rare few exceptions where just goods indecisiveness is really all that keeps evil alive at all.. Ummm, no, the Realms is not how you are describing it at all. At least, it's not supposed to be. Cutthroat Sembia? HA! That's nothing new, it's always been that kind of place. Rick--welcome to the club. Take a seat and have some punch.
The Ubbergeek 09-24-07, 11:23 PM	The realms is not dead. The aliens who rp in our world don't ask that question. Just a new era.
creyzi4zb12 09-25-07, 06:26 AM	I love Legends Trilogy beyond all other dragonlance books. But the others weren't to be ignored as well. I especially loved the War of Souls more like the Legends Trilogy. Only frustration I had in the Second Generation was that there weren't any Raistlin& Crysania continuations that much.
capnvan 09-25-07, 07:23 AM	Like a dark mulhorand, undead thay, cutthroat sembia, greedy and arrogant aristocratic cormyr etc.. paladins being almost as hunted as a demon would be now walking in waterdeep.. Away with the wishywashy niceness where good always wins and reigns supreme with a rare few exceptions where just goods indecisiveness is really all that keeps evil alive at all.. Have you ever played a Ravenloft campaign? It sounds like you'd enjoy it. If you're looking for a setting where evil is firmly in the ascendant, and good is on the run, where paladins are hunted, that's the place to be. But it's not the Realms. And it's not Eberron, or Greyhawk (well, much of it, anyway), or Mystara, etc. They're all different. Which is good, because it offers a different tone to every campaign. These complaints that the Realms need to be "darker" are similar to going to watch Schindler's List and complaining because you really prefer comedies.
Suin Bahhar 09-25-07, 07:47 AM	A lighthearted comedy campaign set in 4e FR would need a very bright point of light indeed. Those campaigns can be really fun if done with the right players. Personally I like a good mixing of light hearted moments with a brutal headsevering melee combat thrown in after and followed by some deep cerebral roleplaying. A darker realms could make the status quo situations more tense, which I like. Being a funny oddball character in a serious and dangerous environment enhances the comedy. It sometimes lessens immersion though. I think the new realms will feel ok after Ed has said his 50 000 words and has painted the canvas of the new craterfilled realms into something of masterwork quality. I keep on being amazed at his attention to minute detail, sense of character personality and his weaving of intrigue he manages to put down in his replies over at candlekeep. If he gets to write so many words he is bound to drop all those new little pieces of lore we love to hear about right there in the middle of the darkness of the new realms. We would only require to bring our own points of light along to find them...
Rinonalyrna Fathomlin 09-25-07, 01:13 PM	The Realms has always had darkness in it. Where did people ever get the idea that the Realms was all rainbows and sunshine? Haven't they ever actually read any Realms history?
The Ubbergeek 09-25-07, 01:43 PM	The Realms has always had darkness in it. Where did people ever get the idea that the Realms was all rainbows and sunshine? Haven't they ever actually read any Realms history? Bad missconceptions, but also hard, cold facts that good is very strong. Why do you think 3ed toned darker the thing a bit? TSR had a policy that evil must NOT win.
MarkusTay63 09-25-07, 02:01 PM	Thayans, the Zhents, The cult of the Dragon, the Rundeen, The Twisted Rune, Westgate, Larloch and Iouluam, Just about every race underground, Goblinoids and other monstrous races, Sythilis Empire, Tan Chin/Ambuchar Devyam, Host tower of the Arcane, Cormanthor Drow, Veldorn, etc, etc.... Not Dark enough for you? How about Calimshan and Mulhorand, two of the oldest and most powerful empires of the past and both still existing to some degree, use slavery? The destruction of Maztican culture by the church of Helm? Should we look further afield? How about underwater? The Sahuagin nation of Alexatis? Remember the Threat from the Sea (now the Deepwater War)? How about Undermountain and Skullport? Yeah... the Realms were just waaaay too bright and shiney... not nearly enough darkness there. :rolleyes: Redesign the Realms? The Realms were 'points of Light' 30 years before the designers ever came up with that buzzword. :ahem:
Rinonalyrna Fathomlin 09-25-07, 02:06 PM	Excellent post, Markus. Why do you think 3ed toned darker the thing a bit? TSR had a policy that evil must NOT win. If the Realms was already "darkened" with 3E (not that I think there was ever a huge problem to begin with), then why does it need to be darkened yet again for 4E? Did 3E do a poor job of eradicating all the bright shininess, or something?
Rick Day 09-25-07, 06:19 PM	The realms are the darkest setting outside ravenloft period. No one can stop the reoccuring orc hordes that wipe out entire generations of defenders, there are more blatantly evil nations than anywhere else in any fantasy setting. there are only three big nations that qualify as "good" (maybe missing one) Silver marches, Cormyr and Impiltur. Thats it as far as thoes who can actually muster enough power or compassion to be qualified as a force for good. THere are smaller groups who would maybe try but they cant stand up to the powers of.... thay, zhent, mulmaster, Shadovar, Calimsham(though they have tamed a bit) any of the 5 or 6 breeding zones for the Orc hordes, the yuan-ti who control a half dozen citys at the least, the churces of talos, cyric, bane and Shar (just the most active of the evil ones)Not to mention the HUNDREDS of hidden lurking evils such as Larlock and other Liches of unimaginable evil. The realms as your dm must have presented them were a pale and flimsy thing. I grew up in a realms where not only did evil happen wehre good men took no action but good men had to fight just to keep there weak neibors from being tortured killed and raised to come after him. The great powers of waterdeep and halrua dont become involed in things unless they are affected and waterdeep is just as evil as it is good. Even places like cormy have theri dark seedy cut throat areas even inside the court of Azoun!
Muddman 09-25-07, 06:48 PM	Things have to change or else whats the point? In my opinion, not enough of Faerun changed from 2nd ed to 3rd. They introduced 1 new villian group (worth mentioning), got rid of none of the others and not one country changed hands or got conquered. Cormyr was in some trouble and lost a king, but other than that the status quo was upheld. I will admit that things advanced nicely over the course of the 3rd edition, but that was thanks to novels and not adventures, which I will also admit they have corrected with the new super adventure path. I was just confused what people object to in the upcoming events. Are thingas changing? Yes. But I won't assume that they're "going to screw things up". In fact, I've liked what they've done lately and am just now feeling like they're finally getting things perfect.
Rinonalyrna Fathomlin 09-25-07, 07:49 PM	Things have to change or else whats the point? It's not self-evident that all the changes that are happening must happen. I was just confused what people object to in the upcoming events. Are thingas changing? Yes. But I won't assume that they're "going to screw things up". In fact, I've liked what they've done lately and am just now feeling like they're finally getting things perfect. I've mentioned elsewhere many times that I just plain dislike a lot of the changes. I dislike one of the stated reasons behind some changes (ie. "we'd like a smaller pantheon"). What's so confusing about that? You like the changes (they're "perfect"), I hate them. It's really quite simple to understand.
capnvan 09-26-07, 04:44 AM	Things have to change or else whats the point? What does that even mean? When I parse that sentence, the result is utterly meaningless. No one has stated that they need the Realms to remain completely static; so presumably you're not talking about that. What's amusing is what you really mean - you like the changes that have been rumored and bandied about here on the forums. If change has to happen, what about making the nations of the Realms more stable, where many of the evils have been driven back? Would that suit your fancy? I tend to doubt it. In my opinion, not enough of Faerun changed from 2nd ed to 3rd. They introduced 1 new villian group (worth mentioning), got rid of none of the others and not one country changed hands or got conquered. Cormyr was in some trouble and lost a king, but other than that the status quo was upheld. See, this is where you tip your hand. What about the creation of the Silver Marches, and the (limited) pacification of the North? Of course, to you, and quite a few others, that's not the kind of change that you want. You want powers like Cormyr and Waterdeep in ruins. That's the kind of game setting you want. So, let's be honest, here. You don't think that the Realms are "stale," per se. Rather, you think that the Realms doesn't fit your concept of the ideal campaign setting. Those aren't the same thing, and so much of the rhetoric on these boards has been disingenuous as a result. I was just confused what people object to in the upcoming events. Are thingas changing? Yes. But I won't assume that they're "going to screw things up". In fact, I've liked what they've done lately and am just now feeling like they're finally getting things perfect. And here you continue to show your hand. Perfection indicates completeness. In your first paragraph you extol the virtues of change. And yet, your last words indicate that once the Realms reaches the point where you like it, the Realms should stay that way, because then it will be "perfect." I don't have a problem with what you like. I have a problem with you demanding changes in a product because you want those changes. You want to play dark? Play an elf in Hillsfar. Play a paladin in Thay. Try to stop the yuan-ti in the Vilhon Reach. Become a Knight of the Raven and take on the Zhentarim in the Ride. Just don't try to claim that your dreams are the inevitable course of Realmsian evolution.
MarkusTay63 09-26-07, 11:27 AM	But a DM could of made it as dark or as light as he wanted! It was always 'points of Light', NOTHING needed to make it that way. I have run Ravenloft adventures in the Realms (usually around Halloween), and I have run Castle Greyhawk (which is basically just a crazy fun-house style dungeon). You wanted WoD? Run a campaign IN Thay. You want Eberron? Run a campaign IN Halrua If you want Warforged, say the Halruans have been experimenting with some of their Netherese heritage magics and were trying to create 'better' Thaluds! Now Halrua looks just like Eberron (Five Kingdoms region)! You want a primitive jungle-style campaign, go to Malatra. You want a 'frontier feel', hop on an Amnish Ship heading for Maztica! You want Samurai and Ninjas, head over to Kara-Tur. Flying Carpets and genies? Just shoot south to Zakhara, or spend a few weeks in Calimshan. You want GH-style zaniness, run a campaign based around doing quests for the Harpels... FR has it ALL, and always has. You don't need to darken places like Cormyr - there are hundreds of areas nearby for you to run that sort of campaign. Just run a Moonsea Campaign if you wanted darkness and misery. What didn't Forgotten Realms already have that they thought it needs an overhaul? There is a place for everything - and everything had it's place!
GothicDan 09-26-07, 12:07 PM	FR's versatility (within certain thematic guidelines and cultural notes) is always what made me like it so much. I guess that's why I like Planescape just a LITTLE more, and partially why I'm not a fan of Eberron as much as I'd otherwise be. It's been marketed so much in the pulp-noir regard that it presents as 1D.
Rinonalyrna Fathomlin 09-26-07, 01:50 PM	Perfection indicates completeness. In your first paragraph you extol the virtues of change. And yet, your last words indicate that once the Realms reaches the point where you like it, the Realms should stay that way, because then it will be "perfect." Excellent point, and probably applicable to numerous other people here.
MarkusTay63 09-26-07, 02:11 PM	I guess that's why I like Planescape just a LITTLE more, and partially why I'm not a fan of Eberron as much as I'd otherwise be. It's been marketed so much in the pulp-noir regard that it presents as 1D.Have you taken a close look at Eberron, Dan? I would agree that the Dragonmarks, techno-magic, and the train are all way too steam-punk for some people's taste, but the world has a very rich and concise history. One of the things that always bothered me about FR's history is that humanoid kingdoms are constantly referenced in the past, yet are never placed in any timelines. Eberron HAS a period when humanoids were dominate, so in that one respect their history is somewhat more believable then FR's. Perhaps because it was built from the ground up, rather then pasting disparate lore together from dozens of designers in 1e and 2e. Either way, their history isn't as rich as ours, but it does 'flow' better. The Orcs with an ancient druidic society is a nice change of pace (although stolen from WoW), and Sarlona and Xendrik are excellent add-ins, unlike our own copy-and-paste 'alternate settings'. Not putting Eberron up on a pedestal or anything, I HATE the flavor, but you can tell that the world was designed as a cohesive whole, rather then from a central point out.
capnvan 09-26-07, 04:19 PM	Excellent point, and probably applicable to numerous other people here. I confess, my reply is purely a response to Sune's power. Any one think Tymora would really feel the same way? :rolleyes:
Muddman 09-30-07, 12:43 AM	I've mentioned elsewhere many times that I just plain dislike a lot of the changes. I dislike one of the stated reasons behind some changes (ie. "we'd like a smaller pantheon"). What's so confusing about that? You like the changes (they're "perfect"), I hate them. It's really quite simple to understand. I actully misspoke here and I didn't realize that until I re-read, allow me to clarify. "Perfect" was the wrong word, plain and simple. Also I would like to clarify that I like everything up to Shadowdale, my original post seems like I love everything they're planning on in the future, which I don't. I don't think killing off half a pantheon is a good idea, very little use to narrow it down. The 3 part mega adventure set is a great idea, and I hope they do more with that idea in 4th ed. They aren't the best adventures I've ever seen, but the scale and breadth of them makes them very cool. I would like more realms changing events written into adventures rather than just the novels. That was my original post's main point which wasn't made clear at all. And as many others have said, especially the ever calm and insightful Rinonalyrna Fathomlin, if you like nothing of whats happening, then just ignore it and play forgotten realms from the 1370s like I always have. From what I'm reading so far, I doubt I'll be jumping my campaign 100 years any time soon. PS - Rinonalyma, that wasn't being sarcastic, I really like how people rant and rave and then you answer them with even tempered grace. :)
The Ubbergeek 10-01-07, 12:37 AM	Have you taken a close look at Eberron, Dan? I would agree that the Dragonmarks, techno-magic, and the train are all way too steam-punk for some people's taste, but the world has a very rich and concise history. One of the things that always bothered me about FR's history is that humanoid kingdoms are constantly referenced in the past, yet are never placed in any timelines. Eberron HAS a period when humanoids were dominate, so in that one respect their history is somewhat more believable then FR's. Perhaps because it was built from the ground up, rather then pasting disparate lore together from dozens of designers in 1e and 2e. Either way, their history isn't as rich as ours, but it does 'flow' better. The Orcs with an ancient druidic society is a nice change of pace (although stolen from WoW), and Sarlona and Xendrik are excellent add-ins, unlike our own copy-and-paste 'alternate sttings'. Not putting Eberron up on a pedestal or anything, I HATE the flavor, but you can tell that the world was designed as a cohesive whole, rather then from a central point out. The fact is.... It's a litterary world, which was adapted to D&D. Where Eberron was made for D&D.
creyzi4zb12 10-01-07, 08:42 AM	Old age could mean death to something...Sadly dnd's not as how it was anymore. Take this video from 1994 when it was still 2.e http://youtube.com/watch?v=RwUQEK4JEVU Nooooooooooo!!!........AKIKO!! I admit it!! I'm a guy!! I'm very sorry for lying to u guys!!
ravennight 10-01-07, 11:31 AM	If I can just put my two cents in, I haven't followed the changes that closely, nor have I purchased my copy of the History yet, but I think that thematically, the general feel of the Realms was maybe did not reflect the kinds of horror that were already there. There are some great and storied evils there but maybe some people were having trouble (perhaps from lack of creativity) exhibiting that general mood into the campaigns so the powers that be decided to make it easier to extend that mood for everyone, i.e. less work for DM's. I always felt the epic-ness of the setting and the evils there mostly in the novels, until 3rd addition came out with the newer history, and felt the literary 'color' was richer. I always liked the ancient history too because it seemed grander and richer in color...I don't know if anyone agrees, but that's where I'm at right now.
18DELTA 10-01-07, 11:43 AM	Now the realms should be called the apocoplyse realms.:rolleyes: Creyz, so let me get this straight. You are a male, not female?:eek: :P ;)
Rinonalyrna Fathomlin 10-01-07, 01:58 PM	I actully misspoke here and I didn't realize that until I re-read, allow me to clarify. "Perfect" was the wrong word, plain and simple. Also I would like to clarify that I like everything up to Shadowdale, my original post seems like I love everything they're planning on in the future, which I don't. I don't think killing off half a pantheon is a good idea, very little use to narrow it down. Even if you did think all the changes are perfect, that wouldn't bother me.:) But thank you for clarifying. The 3 part mega adventure set is a great idea, and I hope they do more with that idea in 4th ed. They aren't the best adventures I've ever seen, but the scale and breadth of them makes them very cool. I would like more realms changing events written into adventures rather than just the novels. That was my original post's main point which wasn't made clear at all. Understood. I would agree with you, except for the fact that they have a "canon" outcome for adventures, apparently. I understand if they have to, but it's still kind of annoying. No matter what happens in a home game running the Shadowdale adventure, there is an official outcome for it. Also, some controversial changes are designed as "cut scenes" that the player cannot control, such as the deaths of Halaster and Sylune. Annoying. And as many others have said, especially the ever calm and insightful Rinonalyrna Fathomlin, if you like nothing of whats happening, then just ignore it and play forgotten realms from the 1370s like I always have. Agreed. Still, as some people have pointed out elsewhere, the people who DO love the changes are always free to change what they dislike as well, without waiting for the changes to be vetted by WotC. For example, the people who hate Mystra could have killed her off (or whatever) without WotC imposing that change on the official version. PS - Rinonalyma, that wasn't being sarcastic, I really like how people rant and rave and then you answer them with even tempered grace. :) Thank you for the kind words.:)
MarkusTay63 10-01-07, 03:33 PM	Old age could mean death to something...Sadly dnd's not as how it was anymore. Take this video from 1994 when it was still 2.e http://youtube.com/watch?v=RwUQEK4JEVU Nooooooooooo!!!........AKIKO!! I admit it!! I'm a guy!! I'm very sorry for lying to u guys!!What the HELL did that have to do with D&D?! :uh-huh:
creyzi4zb12 10-01-07, 11:37 PM	What the HELL did that have to do with D&D?! :uh-huh: Changes my friend....proceed with the transformation!! http://youtube.com/watch?v=STDhWfDBhPg
Dark Wizard 10-01-07, 11:43 PM	So you're implying that the New Realms would do better if it had more people lounging around in swimsuits?
18DELTA 10-02-07, 12:38 AM	So you're implying that the New Realms would do better if it had more people lounging around in swimsuits? :rofl: :heehee Ok, some of you I would prefer to see in swim suits. People like MarkusTay63 no way.;) :P
Keahi19 10-11-07, 01:05 AM	I think it might work if we get to see divisions. I never liked good or evil sides. I love neutral nations. Neutral was always best because it seems the most normal. How often in our world can we say we ever meet true evil and true good. Sure we run into it occasionally, but most of the world is neutral. And I like that. I also think that if they handle this correctly it could be good. Like how do people who are used to magic and ready on the go healing deal with a rudimentary health system whose major points are gone. It'd be like removing antibiotics from our world. So how do people go for this? Do they turn to technology and go the way of Lantan, replacing magic with technology? Do they try to figure out ways of returning magic? Do they go by tradition with strong governments? How do they cope? To see those developing and the debates and thought patterns would be interesting. I could see a bunch of old Romanesque style soldiers fighting against soldiers who look like British regulars from the American Revolution. If they develop it like that with deep thought that will be acceptable. I also hope it's a 10 or 20 year timejump. 100 years would kill alot of development.
Stigger 10-11-07, 02:17 AM	Creyzi, you can be, or make yourself out to be whatever you want. Doesn't matter much to me if you want to be a girl, boy, or an ambisexual walnut... so long as you're happy. ;) Other than that, what Markus said way up there seems to sum it up well enough for me.
Keahi19 10-11-07, 02:20 AM	Is the walnut edible if that's what they want to be?
selunatic2397 10-11-07, 06:09 PM	Is it an english walnut...or a black walnut? I have a black walnut tree in my back yard...an early frost killed the buds off so I have no walnuts for all the squirrels.
Jhalad 10-12-07, 12:49 PM	Old age could mean death to something...Sadly dnd's not as how it was anymore. Take this video from 1994 when it was still 2.e http://youtube.com/watch?v=RwUQEK4JEVU Nooooooooooo!!!........AKIKO!! I admit it!! I'm a guy!! I'm very sorry for lying to u guys!! Your video link is no good. Says it requires an invitation. As to the various statements saying how "light and fluffy" the Realms are in regards to lethality.. the streets of Waterdeep or Arabel are just as deadly as Thay, Mulmaster, Calimshan, or Menzoberanzan... okay, maybe not Menzo, but still, if you guys have a view that the Realms is all happy thoughts and fluffy kitties... then your DM's need to kick the game up to a more realistic level, or else you guys need to stick your nose in where it might not belong (as my group does on a regular basis). The Realms is deadly. Luskan's prison circus, Thayan press gangs, Zhent slavers, Calimshan assassins, Suzail merchants, the Night Parade, the shadowvar, the feyri, dark druids, clerics of Shar or Cyric, the phaerimm, the Unseen Network, the Elves of Evermeet (talk about a chip on the shoulder)... The Realms is already a "Points of Light" world. Yeah, some places might be safer than others. Cormyr, most sections of Waterdeep, the large open streets of Baldur's Gate, Halruaa (assuming you aren't a cleric of someone other than Mystra). I love the Realms. What is happening and will hapeen is terrible. To see the Realms get "fixed and updated" by destroying it is a sad, sad thing. I was planning on buying the 4th ed stuff simply for my collection, but if the rumors are true that they might be moving forward 100 years, or that they might be "merging" it with some other Realm, then I probably won't buy anything for 4th ed. I bought the Realms stuff because of the continual growing, evolving storyline. The Realms is versatile, adaptive, varied, unique, and wonderful. What is might become, I think, is a sad shadow of it's former self.
Nolwelen 10-12-07, 10:59 PM	You know, nothing lasts forever. The increasingly reptitive events in the FR time line hint toward the conclusion that the life cycle of the setting perhaps has reached its final destination.
creyzi4zb12 10-15-07, 10:47 AM	Your video link is no good. Says it requires an invitation. As to the various statements saying how "light and fluffy" the Realms are in regards to lethality.. the streets of Waterdeep or Arabel are just as deadly as Thay, Mulmaster, Calimshan, or Menzoberanzan... okay, maybe not Menzo, but still, if you guys have a view that the Realms is all happy thoughts and fluffy kitties... then your DM's need to kick the game up to a more realistic level, or else you guys need to stick your nose in where it might not belong (as my group does on a regular basis). The Realms is deadly. Luskan's prison circus, Thayan press gangs, Zhent slavers, Calimshan assassins, Suzail merchants, the Night Parade, the shadowvar, the feyri, dark druids, clerics of Shar or Cyric, the phaerimm, the Unseen Network, the Elves of Evermeet (talk about a chip on the shoulder)... The Realms is already a "Points of Light" world. Yeah, some places might be safer than others. Cormyr, most sections of Waterdeep, the large open streets of Baldur's Gate, Halruaa (assuming you aren't a cleric of someone other than Mystra). I love the Realms. What is happening and will hapeen is terrible. To see the Realms get "fixed and updated" by destroying it is a sad, sad thing. I was planning on buying the 4th ed stuff simply for my collection, but if the rumors are true that they might be moving forward 100 years, or that they might be "merging" it with some other Realm, then I probably won't buy anything for 4th ed. I bought the Realms stuff because of the continual growing, evolving storyline. The Realms is versatile, adaptive, varied, unique, and wonderful. What is might become, I think, is a sad shadow of it's former self. Dam!! Why'd they remove it....NVM here's a remake...But I still like the original...Akiko was great there/ http://youtube.com/watch?v=GRHhBsIPBjY
johnkretzer 10-17-07, 02:11 AM	I doubt they will screw up everything... but hopefully it will be less safe.. not some paladins in shining armor at every corner.... Um which campaign world do you play in???? It isn't the FR Like a dark mulhorand, undead thay, cutthroat sembia, greedy and arrogant aristocratic cormyr etc.. paladins being almost as hunted as a demon would be now walking in waterdeep.... Why should paladins be hunted? Also if you want a dark game play a slaves game in Thay(pre stupid civil war). Then again I might just suggest that you start by playing in a FR with a competent DM.... Away with the wishywashy niceness where good always wins and reigns supreme with a rare few exceptions where just goods indecisiveness is really all that keeps evil alive at all.. You de realize the old saying about the only thing neccessary for evil to win right?