Post/Author/DateTime	Post
arcanist supreme 09-02-07, 09:37 AM	Did anyone read about Demogorgon supplanted by PCs in this issue? Wow. Never thought the day could come. :)
Red_Wizard 09-04-07, 09:00 AM	He's not gone though. He lives on in Canon by the very words of that issue, and with the off chance of the PC's killing him, only pushing his rule back a tad. It says specifically, that he'll most likely return even if killed, so in truth the final part to that adventure was more than disappointing. I wish they has said one way or the other, however as it stands, saying what they did, it can only mean he has survived.
Shemeska the Marauder 09-08-07, 02:16 PM	Ultimately the final conclusion of the Dungeon APs has been to not set a "true" assumed conclusion for the path itself. I rather like the stance since it allows the fluff within the modules to be assumed for planar canon purposes, but not necessarily the events themselves, giving later writers a massive amount of material to work with, and considerable room to work within. For instance, the "Lich Queen's Beloved" in Dungeon could have had Vlaakith killed off by PCs. We got tons of detail on the githyanki (to augment the 2e material), and tons of material on Tunar'ath as well, but noticably Vlaakith is still alive in subsequent material mentioning the githyanki. Presumably Demogorgon is still alive, but the exact circumstances won't be hammered out till later authors touch upon the topic (I'm of the opinion that you can't truly kill off a brilliant villain...).
arcanist supreme 09-09-07, 12:51 PM	Well, guess it is fair. Grazzt got summoned and imprisoned. Orcus got slain and resurrected AND resurrected (again). Demogorgon got defeated and essence trapped by Iggwilv. I guess they are trying to balance it all out. :) Demogorgon: CR 33 Malcanthet: CR 28 I am quite impressed by Ahazu The Seizer and I am thoroughly surprised how the Abyssal Layer Dreaming Gulf came about (and the demonic subtype Loumaras).
Red_Wizard 09-09-07, 02:41 PM	But he wasn't defeated. It say's "IF" the party manages to defeat him, Iggwilv will capture his essence, though why is left up to the DM, or future modules that decide to canonize this freak happenstance. Basically it means that In the unlikely event the PC's managae to beat him on his own plane and survive, you are given future plot hooks so you don't have to end the campaign. However, as it reads, he is not dead in canon.
lavekkia 09-10-07, 01:07 PM	They did the same in Dun100 for the Lich Queen as Shemeska pointed out. In that issue they presented options for the eventual failure by PCs (namely Vlaakith becoming a true Goddess). I suppose they did the same in this issue