Greatest Seafaring Nations? [Archive] - Wizards Community

Greatest Seafaring Nations? [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
Fokinther
03-14-07, 11:33 AM Greeting fellow Realms fans. This is my first time on a Message Board, so I'm a little nervous. Anyway, here goes.

I would like to know which nations of Faerun are the greatest seafarers and explorers. The reason I wish to know is that I am working on a project involving Maztica in my spare time. I am completely retconning that "Amnish Conquistador" stuff and replacing it with something that makes more sense. So which Faerunian nation has the greatest seafarers and so who would be most likely to discover the New World first?
Naturally, said seafaring nation should be one on either the west or southern coast of Faerun.

Also, what about Zakhara, Evermeet, Nimbral or that unnamed African-style continent (the Chultan homeland)? Would any of those nations have met/traded with or set up a trading colony in the New World?

Thanks for your time,
Richard Fokinther
Khaelieth
03-14-07, 11:53 AM Well, Evermeet is undoubtedly (sp?) the greatest seafaring nation by far. I don't see Evermeet colonizing Maztica, as they've got their hands full recivilising Faerūn already, teaching the humans pottery and such.

Though amongst the humans, I might be tempted to say Ruathym.
Panurg
03-14-07, 11:54 AM The Nelanther-Pirates have to be great Seafarers.
Also the Elves of Evermeet qualify for a nation with great skill in that sector.

The other human kingdoms at the sword coast don't really qualify in my opinion they are more coast bound and not used to navigate the open ocean.

But perhaps some of the more adventurous barbarian "dragonship" owners of the north. They remind me a bit of other sailsmen who did a great job once in earth history. :D
MarkusTay63
03-14-07, 12:02 PM The continent to North of Maztica is known as Anchorome, and it appears to be filled with Elves and humans resembling American-Indians. The continent below Maztica is called Katashaka, and is roughly African in culture. It has been reccomended that the Nyambe rules be used for this region.

The following is just opinion -

As far as sea-faring peoples, the Rauthym and the Northmen of the Moonshaes are a hardy lot, and may have colonies in Anchorome. Luskan may as well, but they are more concentrated on their own local power-base. Waterdeep would definately be intersted in this area, and I believe they do have a colony just North of Maztica now, which they share with Baldur's Gate (not entirely sure about that, I'm just doing this from memory). Both Amn and Tethyr have colonies in Maztica, although they are not really known for their navies overmuch. Calimshan supposedly has a powerful navy, but they have mostly been interested in trading to the south, in Chult and even further afield in Zakhara.

Out of all of those Waterdeep perhaps has the best navy. The pirates of the Nelanther Isles would be a VERY strong navy if they were unified, and might make an interesting group to harry ships along the cost of Maztica (a'la pirates of the caribbean).

The other strongest navies are all located in the Sea of Fallen Stars (like Cormyr). You don't neccessarily have to count them out because there are several large portals that ships can sail through to travel from one sea to the other, the most notable located in Undermountain and lead to Skullport. Getting BACK may be a bit of a problem, however. There is another portal that will take ships from the Lake of Steam to an area between Thay and Mulhorand, but that may be inactive now do to some volcanic activity.

Hope that helps. :)
Tergiver
03-14-07, 12:04 PM I would like to know which nations of Faerun are the greatest seafarers and explorers.

I would say "Follow the money" to find the nations with the motivations and capabilities. If Amn doesn't work for you, Calimshan, Tashalar, and Lapaliiya could all work. The Rundeen could fund this, and could get "hints" from certain undead masters that this is a good idea.

I would argue against Evermeet as discoverer - the elves there are very isolationist, and I think it's probably psychologically important to the ones who come from the Realms proper to consider themselves far to the west of everything. They would know of the locations of the continents (from Spelljamming, if nothing else), but wouldn't have any motivation to travel there. That is, until someone starts oppressing aboriginal elves.

Another possibility, either for initial discoverer or competing great power, is Halruaa.

There's also the "J. Random Adventurers discovered this new continent and triggered a nation-state gold rush" possibility...
Fokinther
03-14-07, 12:21 PM Thanks for the input everybody!

I'm with Khaelieth and Tergiver on the question of Evermeet- those elves are far too isolationist for this kind of thing.

I'm quite pleasantly surprised by the wealth of candidates for New World colonies. The Ruathym Islanders and their kin, the Northmen of the Moonshaes are certainly an interesting possibility, but I think I should be careful about copying the history of their real-world counterparts. It's still a very good idea, though.

The Pirate connection is also a good idea- all those exotic New World goods coming back from Maztica are sure to attract seagoing raiders of all stripes. For some more Pirates of the Caribbean-type adventures, perhaps there are some small islands near the Maztican coast to be colonised (pirate bases maybe?)

The people of Amn would probably have a few trading sites (no Conquistadors though), and then we've got the folks up at New Waterdeep and Fort Flame, who aren't Conquistador clones at all.

Tashalar, Lapaliiya, the Rundeen and Calimshan are all good ideas. Thanks, everybody!
GothicDan
03-14-07, 04:34 PM I thought the 'Northmen' were the Rauthymar, and the southern 'Celtic' types were the Ffolk?
Fokinther
03-14-07, 06:04 PM Oops, sorry. Wrong button.
boards
03-14-07, 09:08 PM The various cities of Chessanta all had fairly good navies, and now that Tchazza rules all except Luthcheq (sp) they should combine to form a very strong navy.
Khaelieth
03-14-07, 09:15 PM Well, the elves of Evermeet are rarely beaten at sea, even if they are pretty isolated. Then again, I'd say The Empire of Shade's got a pretty good navy, as it's never been beaten ^^
Lord Karsus
03-16-07, 12:30 AM Well, the elves of Evermeet are rarely beaten at sea, even if they are pretty isolated. Then again, I'd say The Empire of Shade's got a pretty good navy, as it's never been beaten ^^

::Ears perk up::

:lightbulb

-Was that Shade versus Evermeet I heard? :)

-Anyway, in seriousness, Shade might have a better navy that it has now if it weren't, you know, a land-locked city-state in the middle of the desert...
Stigger
03-16-07, 01:54 AM Baldur's Gate... they have a tiny bit of a sea-faring history to them. And even an inspiration in Balduran to go off looking in that direction... so skill, motive, and money. My own personal favorites really.
Karsus the Mad
03-16-07, 02:04 AM Lantan would be a nice option. Colonizing Maztica for resources like they did in some areas of the Chultan peninsula.
Khaelieth
03-16-07, 04:26 AM ::Ears perk up::

:lightbulb

-Was that Shade versus Evermeet I heard? :)

-Anyway, in seriousness, Shade might have a better navy that it has now if it weren't, you know, a land-locked city-state in the middle of the desert...

We both know elves aren't afraid of their own shades, or someone else's shade! The Sun Elves would create a huge catapult, load it with Shade and make the poor Netherese folk believe they've joined a Spelljammer campaign.

EDIT: And you've got the legend of the Four Sons of Vyshaan, they headed west, so they might have a colony somewhere! They could have done what rabbits do when attacked by a fox; leg it down a hole, multiply until there's enough rabbits to win, hop out and kill it!
Fokinther
03-16-07, 07:26 AM Thanks for the replies everybody. I've started work on my Maztica project and I will be using some of your good ideas.
Lord Karsus
03-16-07, 09:57 AM We both know elves aren't afraid of their own shades, or someone else's shade! The Sun Elves would create a huge catapult, load it with Shade and make the poor Netherese folk believe they've joined a Spelljammer campaign.

Evermeet vs. Shade Thread (http://boards1.wizards.com/showthread.php?t=605219)
Alediran
03-16-07, 11:06 AM Evermeet vs. Shade Thread (http://boards1.wizards.com/showthread.php?t=605219)

Not again :(

*Casts Dead Thread Stays Dead*

It's a powerful white necromancy that avoids threads from being resurrected or made undead.
Lord Karsus
03-16-07, 01:56 PM Not again :(

*Casts Dead Thread Stays Dead*

It's a powerful white necromancy that avoids threads from being resurrected or made undead.

-Alediran...Come now. You cannot counter my dweomers...;)

-I wonder what ever happened to Zsych...
Stigger
03-16-07, 03:49 PM Probably undead somewhere washing socks... which is to be my default answer for questions about anyone.
Lord Karsus
03-16-07, 05:24 PM Probably undead somewhere washing socks... which is to be my default answer for questions about anyone.

:rofl:
Alediran
03-16-07, 08:43 PM -Alediran...Come now. You cannot counter my dweomers...;)

-I wonder what ever happened to Zsych...

True. Then I'll call all the spirits of House Tir'ent's Selu'Taar. You know they are many
Lord Karsus
03-16-07, 11:09 PM -I like you. You're a good kid. Let's not...muck up the relation, eh? Suffice to say...I am not in the least bit perturbed. :cool:
ericlboyd
03-17-07, 12:21 AM This post to the Realms list (new Realmslore from Ed) might be of interest. See the write-up of Eskember.

http://oracle.wizards.com/scripts/wa.exe?A2=ind0304D&L=REALMS-L&P=R5617&I=-3

--Eric
Old Sage
03-17-07, 12:35 AM Ah, Eskember... I still love that write-up. 'Tis a shame it never made it into the Old Grey Box.

Great call Eric! ;)
Eladrinstar
03-18-07, 10:59 PM The continent below Maztica is called Katashaka

I have heard this continent is African-like, but where did you get the name?
Lord Karsus
03-18-07, 11:58 PM Probably undead somewhere washing socks... which is to be my default answer for questions about anyone.

-Actually, ZSych is back now, oddly enough. I think he might be an unconscious manifestation of the inverse of most of my ideas and beliefs. That, or I'm just so powerful that I gated him in from who knows where, and I didn't even realize it...
Stigger
03-19-07, 12:34 AM So you're sure he's not just typing responses to things between loads of washing then?
Lord Karsus
03-19-07, 12:39 AM So you're sure he's not just typing responses to things between loads of washing then?

-Do Undead have the capcity to read, think, and formulate a (mostly) coherent response? I mean, most Undead don't even have (complete) fingers...And, let's not even talk about what Undead have going for them concerning optics and brain power.
Stigger
03-19-07, 12:41 AM Sure, some of them do... he could have been turned into a mummy or something... wight could probably even pull it off sorta...
Fokinther
03-19-07, 04:30 AM Thanks, Eric- Eskember looks an intersting place. I'm certainly going to insert that into my campaign.
Just a silly question about pirates in the realms, though (somewhat off topic)- Do Faerunian pirates use the (in)famous "skull and crossbones" flag (the jolly roger)? Or is that too "real world"?
I know historical pirate flags actually varied quite a lot- I was just wondering is Realms pirates have any particularly common pirate flags/insignia.
Stigger
03-19-07, 04:47 AM Might look at Pirates of the Sea of Fallen Stars for some insight on that. Never did manage to pick it up myself, gonna have to PDF that soon come to think of it.
Old Sage
03-19-07, 08:05 AM Re: Pirate flags and the like...

The flag-type 'Skull and Crossbones/Jolly Roger' has indeed been noted in the Realmslore -- as referenced in Sea of Fallen Stars, pg. 142.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Fokinther 03-14-07, 11:33 AM	Greeting fellow Realms fans. This is my first time on a Message Board, so I'm a little nervous. Anyway, here goes. I would like to know which nations of Faerun are the greatest seafarers and explorers. The reason I wish to know is that I am working on a project involving Maztica in my spare time. I am completely retconning that "Amnish Conquistador" stuff and replacing it with something that makes more sense. So which Faerunian nation has the greatest seafarers and so who would be most likely to discover the New World first? Naturally, said seafaring nation should be one on either the west or southern coast of Faerun. Also, what about Zakhara, Evermeet, Nimbral or that unnamed African-style continent (the Chultan homeland)? Would any of those nations have met/traded with or set up a trading colony in the New World? Thanks for your time, Richard Fokinther
Khaelieth 03-14-07, 11:53 AM	Well, Evermeet is undoubtedly (sp?) the greatest seafaring nation by far. I don't see Evermeet colonizing Maztica, as they've got their hands full recivilising Faerūn already, teaching the humans pottery and such. Though amongst the humans, I might be tempted to say Ruathym.
Panurg 03-14-07, 11:54 AM	The Nelanther-Pirates have to be great Seafarers. Also the Elves of Evermeet qualify for a nation with great skill in that sector. The other human kingdoms at the sword coast don't really qualify in my opinion they are more coast bound and not used to navigate the open ocean. But perhaps some of the more adventurous barbarian "dragonship" owners of the north. They remind me a bit of other sailsmen who did a great job once in earth history. :D
MarkusTay63 03-14-07, 12:02 PM	The continent to North of Maztica is known as Anchorome, and it appears to be filled with Elves and humans resembling American-Indians. The continent below Maztica is called Katashaka, and is roughly African in culture. It has been reccomended that the Nyambe rules be used for this region. The following is just opinion - As far as sea-faring peoples, the Rauthym and the Northmen of the Moonshaes are a hardy lot, and may have colonies in Anchorome. Luskan may as well, but they are more concentrated on their own local power-base. Waterdeep would definately be intersted in this area, and I believe they do have a colony just North of Maztica now, which they share with Baldur's Gate (not entirely sure about that, I'm just doing this from memory). Both Amn and Tethyr have colonies in Maztica, although they are not really known for their navies overmuch. Calimshan supposedly has a powerful navy, but they have mostly been interested in trading to the south, in Chult and even further afield in Zakhara. Out of all of those Waterdeep perhaps has the best navy. The pirates of the Nelanther Isles would be a VERY strong navy if they were unified, and might make an interesting group to harry ships along the cost of Maztica (a'la pirates of the caribbean). The other strongest navies are all located in the Sea of Fallen Stars (like Cormyr). You don't neccessarily have to count them out because there are several large portals that ships can sail through to travel from one sea to the other, the most notable located in Undermountain and lead to Skullport. Getting BACK may be a bit of a problem, however. There is another portal that will take ships from the Lake of Steam to an area between Thay and Mulhorand, but that may be inactive now do to some volcanic activity. Hope that helps. :)
Tergiver 03-14-07, 12:04 PM	I would like to know which nations of Faerun are the greatest seafarers and explorers. I would say "Follow the money" to find the nations with the motivations and capabilities. If Amn doesn't work for you, Calimshan, Tashalar, and Lapaliiya could all work. The Rundeen could fund this, and could get "hints" from certain undead masters that this is a good idea. I would argue against Evermeet as discoverer - the elves there are very isolationist, and I think it's probably psychologically important to the ones who come from the Realms proper to consider themselves far to the west of everything. They would know of the locations of the continents (from Spelljamming, if nothing else), but wouldn't have any motivation to travel there. That is, until someone starts oppressing aboriginal elves. Another possibility, either for initial discoverer or competing great power, is Halruaa. There's also the "J. Random Adventurers discovered this new continent and triggered a nation-state gold rush" possibility...
Fokinther 03-14-07, 12:21 PM	Thanks for the input everybody! I'm with Khaelieth and Tergiver on the question of Evermeet- those elves are far too isolationist for this kind of thing. I'm quite pleasantly surprised by the wealth of candidates for New World colonies. The Ruathym Islanders and their kin, the Northmen of the Moonshaes are certainly an interesting possibility, but I think I should be careful about copying the history of their real-world counterparts. It's still a very good idea, though. The Pirate connection is also a good idea- all those exotic New World goods coming back from Maztica are sure to attract seagoing raiders of all stripes. For some more Pirates of the Caribbean-type adventures, perhaps there are some small islands near the Maztican coast to be colonised (pirate bases maybe?) The people of Amn would probably have a few trading sites (no Conquistadors though), and then we've got the folks up at New Waterdeep and Fort Flame, who aren't Conquistador clones at all. Tashalar, Lapaliiya, the Rundeen and Calimshan are all good ideas. Thanks, everybody!
GothicDan 03-14-07, 04:34 PM	I thought the 'Northmen' were the Rauthymar, and the southern 'Celtic' types were the Ffolk?
Fokinther 03-14-07, 06:04 PM	Oops, sorry. Wrong button.
boards 03-14-07, 09:08 PM	The various cities of Chessanta all had fairly good navies, and now that Tchazza rules all except Luthcheq (sp) they should combine to form a very strong navy.
Khaelieth 03-14-07, 09:15 PM	Well, the elves of Evermeet are rarely beaten at sea, even if they are pretty isolated. Then again, I'd say The Empire of Shade's got a pretty good navy, as it's never been beaten ^^
Lord Karsus 03-16-07, 12:30 AM	Well, the elves of Evermeet are rarely beaten at sea, even if they are pretty isolated. Then again, I'd say The Empire of Shade's got a pretty good navy, as it's never been beaten ^^ ::Ears perk up:: :lightbulb -Was that Shade versus Evermeet I heard? :) -Anyway, in seriousness, Shade might have a better navy that it has now if it weren't, you know, a land-locked city-state in the middle of the desert...
Stigger 03-16-07, 01:54 AM	Baldur's Gate... they have a tiny bit of a sea-faring history to them. And even an inspiration in Balduran to go off looking in that direction... so skill, motive, and money. My own personal favorites really.
Karsus the Mad 03-16-07, 02:04 AM	Lantan would be a nice option. Colonizing Maztica for resources like they did in some areas of the Chultan peninsula.
Khaelieth 03-16-07, 04:26 AM	::Ears perk up:: :lightbulb -Was that Shade versus Evermeet I heard? :) -Anyway, in seriousness, Shade might have a better navy that it has now if it weren't, you know, a land-locked city-state in the middle of the desert... We both know elves aren't afraid of their own shades, or someone else's shade! The Sun Elves would create a huge catapult, load it with Shade and make the poor Netherese folk believe they've joined a Spelljammer campaign. EDIT: And you've got the legend of the Four Sons of Vyshaan, they headed west, so they might have a colony somewhere! They could have done what rabbits do when attacked by a fox; leg it down a hole, multiply until there's enough rabbits to win, hop out and kill it!
Fokinther 03-16-07, 07:26 AM	Thanks for the replies everybody. I've started work on my Maztica project and I will be using some of your good ideas.
Lord Karsus 03-16-07, 09:57 AM	We both know elves aren't afraid of their own shades, or someone else's shade! The Sun Elves would create a huge catapult, load it with Shade and make the poor Netherese folk believe they've joined a Spelljammer campaign. Evermeet vs. Shade Thread (http://boards1.wizards.com/showthread.php?t=605219)
Alediran 03-16-07, 11:06 AM	Evermeet vs. Shade Thread (http://boards1.wizards.com/showthread.php?t=605219) Not again :( Casts Dead Thread Stays Dead It's a powerful white necromancy that avoids threads from being resurrected or made undead.
Lord Karsus 03-16-07, 01:56 PM	Not again :( Casts Dead Thread Stays Dead It's a powerful white necromancy that avoids threads from being resurrected or made undead. -Alediran...Come now. You cannot counter my dweomers...;) -I wonder what ever happened to Zsych...
Stigger 03-16-07, 03:49 PM	Probably undead somewhere washing socks... which is to be my default answer for questions about anyone.
Lord Karsus 03-16-07, 05:24 PM	Probably undead somewhere washing socks... which is to be my default answer for questions about anyone. :rofl:
Alediran 03-16-07, 08:43 PM	-Alediran...Come now. You cannot counter my dweomers...;) -I wonder what ever happened to Zsych... True. Then I'll call all the spirits of House Tir'ent's Selu'Taar. You know they are many
Lord Karsus 03-16-07, 11:09 PM	-I like you. You're a good kid. Let's not...muck up the relation, eh? Suffice to say...I am not in the least bit perturbed. :cool:
ericlboyd 03-17-07, 12:21 AM	This post to the Realms list (new Realmslore from Ed) might be of interest. See the write-up of Eskember. http://oracle.wizards.com/scripts/wa.exe?A2=ind0304D&L=REALMS-L&P=R5617&I=-3 --Eric
Old Sage 03-17-07, 12:35 AM	Ah, Eskember... I still love that write-up. 'Tis a shame it never made it into the Old Grey Box. Great call Eric! ;)
Eladrinstar 03-18-07, 10:59 PM	The continent below Maztica is called Katashaka I have heard this continent is African-like, but where did you get the name?
Lord Karsus 03-18-07, 11:58 PM	Probably undead somewhere washing socks... which is to be my default answer for questions about anyone. -Actually, ZSych is back now, oddly enough. I think he might be an unconscious manifestation of the inverse of most of my ideas and beliefs. That, or I'm just so powerful that I gated him in from who knows where, and I didn't even realize it...
Stigger 03-19-07, 12:34 AM	So you're sure he's not just typing responses to things between loads of washing then?
Lord Karsus 03-19-07, 12:39 AM	So you're sure he's not just typing responses to things between loads of washing then? -Do Undead have the capcity to read, think, and formulate a (mostly) coherent response? I mean, most Undead don't even have (complete) fingers...And, let's not even talk about what Undead have going for them concerning optics and brain power.
Stigger 03-19-07, 12:41 AM	Sure, some of them do... he could have been turned into a mummy or something... wight could probably even pull it off sorta...
Fokinther 03-19-07, 04:30 AM	Thanks, Eric- Eskember looks an intersting place. I'm certainly going to insert that into my campaign. Just a silly question about pirates in the realms, though (somewhat off topic)- Do Faerunian pirates use the (in)famous "skull and crossbones" flag (the jolly roger)? Or is that too "real world"? I know historical pirate flags actually varied quite a lot- I was just wondering is Realms pirates have any particularly common pirate flags/insignia.
Stigger 03-19-07, 04:47 AM	Might look at Pirates of the Sea of Fallen Stars for some insight on that. Never did manage to pick it up myself, gonna have to PDF that soon come to think of it.
Old Sage 03-19-07, 08:05 AM	Re: Pirate flags and the like... The flag-type 'Skull and Crossbones/Jolly Roger' has indeed been noted in the Realmslore -- as referenced in Sea of Fallen Stars, pg. 142.