Manshoon Vampire? [Archive] - Wizards Community

Manshoon Vampire? [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
Beaver
08-03-07, 09:00 PM Is it correct what I read, that there is a vampire clone of Manshoon as well?? What is the story behind this?
Old Sage
08-03-07, 09:21 PM Yes. He's calling himself the Night King. See the "Westgate" entry in Cloak & Dagger, and the section on the Night Masks in 3e Lords of Darkness.
Green Elven Vampire
08-04-07, 12:15 AM I believe he's a level 18 wizard, Vampire Lord. Pretty powerful stuff. Not as powerful as the real Manshoon, but pretty close.
Lord Dracul
08-04-07, 06:50 PM Why is there 2 topics with the same question posted by the same person??
The_Shaman
08-07-07, 11:23 AM Wait, not as powerful? I admit I did not read the Manshoon entry (IIRC it was in FRCS in detail, but a vampire lord with 18 or so wizard levels is nothing to trifle with)
Duagloth
08-08-07, 09:30 PM Original Manshoon = Wizard/Archmage 25

Vampire Manshoon = Wizard 18 + Vampir

So well, the originial IS the stronger. (lvl 10+11 spells + Epic.)
Beaver
08-08-07, 11:25 PM What are level 10 and 11 spells?
Dhagon
08-09-07, 02:54 AM Level 10 and 11 spells are the spells you place in spell slots that you gained from the epic feat Increased Spell Capacity or have the Divine Spellcasting Salient Ability. Hopefully and spells you place in slots higher then level 9 will have metamagic feats applied to them as it would be a terrible waste otherwise.

And in the Epic Level handbook Manshoon is a Wizard 23/Archmage 2 and he has taken Increased Spell Capacity once (for a 10th level slot).

If you are using epic characters, use the Epic Level Handbook, the epic rules in the FRCS were just a stop-gap measure. (And how else can you become strong enough to fight gods?)
Dhagon
08-09-07, 03:01 AM In Lords of Darkness, Orbakh, as the vampire Manshoon calls himself, is listed as Wizard 16/Archmage 1.

And isn't there something about one of the clones living with Halaster?
Old Sage
08-09-07, 08:34 AM Indeed, one of the Manshoon clones was hanging with Halaster in Undermountain [prior to the Mad Mage's demise].
Old Sage
08-09-07, 08:36 AM Ed has said that there are actually more than the "official three" Manshoon clones running around. Officially, all we know is that there's one clone with the Zhents. One is a vampire crimelord in Westgate -- the Night King. And one is hanging with Halaster in Undermountain. We're assuming Ed will reveal more, in time.

Consider, also, this tidbit from both THO and Ed -

"Remember the clever words of Richard Lee Byers, at last year's GenCon Indy FR seminar: "In my father's house, there are many Manshoons."
In other words, there are MORE Manshoons than 3e lore currently admits (as Ed will reveal in the fullness of time). And I'd say he's far more powerful than Fzoul, because he has fall-back plans and caches and plans set in motion far beyond Fzoul's capacity to anticipate. He may have suffered a personal setback within the Zhentarim, temporarily, but (to quote Ed of the Greenwood, hereafter):

"He's MUCH more cunning and better prepared than Fzoul has ever been. Fzoul always plays the "Hi, God of the Moment, I'm Yours!" card, and that's like juggling a flaming sword: no matter how good you are, sooner or later you're going to get badly cut and burned. My money is always on Manshoon - - and remember, I created Fzoul, Manshoon, and the Zhentarim, but haven't really had the chance to properly tell any of their stories, yet. Just fragments."

To this I can add: don't miss the Best of Eddie book, for a few glimpses more . . .

love,
THO"
Dhagon
08-09-07, 03:10 PM What happened to the Manshoon clone in Undermountain? And how did he defeat his compulsion?
ShadezofDis
08-09-07, 04:30 PM What happened to the Manshoon clone in Undermountain? And how did he defeat his compulsion?

I'd assume it has something to do with him being an Archmage.

As far as what happened to him (I know quite why, but I see red everytime I hear about Halaster's death), I'm not really sure we know. It could be that he's attempting to control undermountain.
DollNamedSanity
08-10-07, 12:41 PM Okay, when people say "real" manshoon, they just mean the dominant clone right? Wasn't the first Manshoon (the one to make all the clones) killed in the clone frenzy?
ShadezofDis
08-10-07, 12:45 PM Okay, when people say "real" manshoon, they just mean the dominant clone right? Wasn't the first Manshoon (the one to make all the clones) killed in the clone frenzy?

AFAIK, the "real" Manshoon died quite a while ago. I know he dies at least once in the spellfire novels and El stated in that book that he's "killed" Manshoon multiple times and if Manshoon kept it up he'd hunt down all of his clones and destroy them too.

So, given that, I don't think Manshoon has had his original body for quite some time.
DollNamedSanity
08-10-07, 01:18 PM K, now that I got that cleared up. Anybody else waiting expectantly to see the eventual showdown between the Night Masks and the Shadow Thieves? Andybody placing any bets? I say that the Night Masks win round one, but that the Shadow Thieves win overall. And what about the Shadow Lords of Phlan(?) or was it Yhaunn? I can't remember, the one city with a decent Shou population, that mask gives them some essence of shadow... am I making any sense?
Green Elven Vampire
11-18-07, 03:16 PM The Night Masks would win hands down, if they could get over their Mask-Shar conflict in the ranks. They have "The Night Court" which is a whole hierarchy of powerful Clerics, Wizards, Rogues and fighters who are all Vampires of impressive abilities. Though I feel bad for the poor Golf elf infiltrator in their midsts.
The_Shaman
11-18-07, 09:31 PM The Night Masks would win hands down, if they could get over their Mask-Shar conflict in the ranks. They have "The Night Court" which is a whole hierarchy of powerful Clerics, Wizards, Rogues and fighters who are all Vampires of impressive abilities. Though I feel bad for the poor Golf elf infiltrator in their midsts.

The EV agent, you mean? I'd say it's a manner of who sniffs the other ones first. If the infiltrator does realize what he's up against, chance are he'll high-tail it the heck out of there. If they find out about him first, he's in deep trouble.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Beaver 08-03-07, 09:00 PM	Is it correct what I read, that there is a vampire clone of Manshoon as well?? What is the story behind this?
Old Sage 08-03-07, 09:21 PM	Yes. He's calling himself the Night King. See the "Westgate" entry in Cloak & Dagger, and the section on the Night Masks in 3e Lords of Darkness.
Green Elven Vampire 08-04-07, 12:15 AM	I believe he's a level 18 wizard, Vampire Lord. Pretty powerful stuff. Not as powerful as the real Manshoon, but pretty close.
Lord Dracul 08-04-07, 06:50 PM	Why is there 2 topics with the same question posted by the same person??
The_Shaman 08-07-07, 11:23 AM	Wait, not as powerful? I admit I did not read the Manshoon entry (IIRC it was in FRCS in detail, but a vampire lord with 18 or so wizard levels is nothing to trifle with)
Duagloth 08-08-07, 09:30 PM	Original Manshoon = Wizard/Archmage 25 Vampire Manshoon = Wizard 18 + Vampir So well, the originial IS the stronger. (lvl 10+11 spells + Epic.)
Beaver 08-08-07, 11:25 PM	What are level 10 and 11 spells?
Dhagon 08-09-07, 02:54 AM	Level 10 and 11 spells are the spells you place in spell slots that you gained from the epic feat Increased Spell Capacity or have the Divine Spellcasting Salient Ability. Hopefully and spells you place in slots higher then level 9 will have metamagic feats applied to them as it would be a terrible waste otherwise. And in the Epic Level handbook Manshoon is a Wizard 23/Archmage 2 and he has taken Increased Spell Capacity once (for a 10th level slot). If you are using epic characters, use the Epic Level Handbook, the epic rules in the FRCS were just a stop-gap measure. (And how else can you become strong enough to fight gods?)
Dhagon 08-09-07, 03:01 AM	In Lords of Darkness, Orbakh, as the vampire Manshoon calls himself, is listed as Wizard 16/Archmage 1. And isn't there something about one of the clones living with Halaster?
Old Sage 08-09-07, 08:34 AM	Indeed, one of the Manshoon clones was hanging with Halaster in Undermountain [prior to the Mad Mage's demise].
Old Sage 08-09-07, 08:36 AM	Ed has said that there are actually more than the "official three" Manshoon clones running around. Officially, all we know is that there's one clone with the Zhents. One is a vampire crimelord in Westgate -- the Night King. And one is hanging with Halaster in Undermountain. We're assuming Ed will reveal more, in time. Consider, also, this tidbit from both THO and Ed - "Remember the clever words of Richard Lee Byers, at last year's GenCon Indy FR seminar: "In my father's house, there are many Manshoons." In other words, there are MORE Manshoons than 3e lore currently admits (as Ed will reveal in the fullness of time). And I'd say he's far more powerful than Fzoul, because he has fall-back plans and caches and plans set in motion far beyond Fzoul's capacity to anticipate. He may have suffered a personal setback within the Zhentarim, temporarily, but (to quote Ed of the Greenwood, hereafter): "He's MUCH more cunning and better prepared than Fzoul has ever been. Fzoul always plays the "Hi, God of the Moment, I'm Yours!" card, and that's like juggling a flaming sword: no matter how good you are, sooner or later you're going to get badly cut and burned. My money is always on Manshoon - - and remember, I created Fzoul, Manshoon, and the Zhentarim, but haven't really had the chance to properly tell any of their stories, yet. Just fragments." To this I can add: don't miss the Best of Eddie book, for a few glimpses more . . . love, THO"
Dhagon 08-09-07, 03:10 PM	What happened to the Manshoon clone in Undermountain? And how did he defeat his compulsion?
ShadezofDis 08-09-07, 04:30 PM	What happened to the Manshoon clone in Undermountain? And how did he defeat his compulsion? I'd assume it has something to do with him being an Archmage. As far as what happened to him (I know quite why, but I see red everytime I hear about Halaster's death), I'm not really sure we know. It could be that he's attempting to control undermountain.
DollNamedSanity 08-10-07, 12:41 PM	Okay, when people say "real" manshoon, they just mean the dominant clone right? Wasn't the first Manshoon (the one to make all the clones) killed in the clone frenzy?
ShadezofDis 08-10-07, 12:45 PM	Okay, when people say "real" manshoon, they just mean the dominant clone right? Wasn't the first Manshoon (the one to make all the clones) killed in the clone frenzy? AFAIK, the "real" Manshoon died quite a while ago. I know he dies at least once in the spellfire novels and El stated in that book that he's "killed" Manshoon multiple times and if Manshoon kept it up he'd hunt down all of his clones and destroy them too. So, given that, I don't think Manshoon has had his original body for quite some time.
DollNamedSanity 08-10-07, 01:18 PM	K, now that I got that cleared up. Anybody else waiting expectantly to see the eventual showdown between the Night Masks and the Shadow Thieves? Andybody placing any bets? I say that the Night Masks win round one, but that the Shadow Thieves win overall. And what about the Shadow Lords of Phlan(?) or was it Yhaunn? I can't remember, the one city with a decent Shou population, that mask gives them some essence of shadow... am I making any sense?
Green Elven Vampire 11-18-07, 03:16 PM	The Night Masks would win hands down, if they could get over their Mask-Shar conflict in the ranks. They have "The Night Court" which is a whole hierarchy of powerful Clerics, Wizards, Rogues and fighters who are all Vampires of impressive abilities. Though I feel bad for the poor Golf elf infiltrator in their midsts.
The_Shaman 11-18-07, 09:31 PM	The Night Masks would win hands down, if they could get over their Mask-Shar conflict in the ranks. They have "The Night Court" which is a whole hierarchy of powerful Clerics, Wizards, Rogues and fighters who are all Vampires of impressive abilities. Though I feel bad for the poor Golf elf infiltrator in their midsts. The EV agent, you mean? I'd say it's a manner of who sniffs the other ones first. If the infiltrator does realize what he's up against, chance are he'll high-tail it the heck out of there. If they find out about him first, he's in deep trouble.