Post/Author/DateTime	Post
hento 03-13-07, 08:39 AM	I'm runninga a campaign in wich the adventurers have started warmongering against Neverwinter and have Luskan, Fireshar (killed Nw regent) and about 200 orcs to back them up, and are recruiting Frost Giants and the people from The Ten Towns. They have been going at it for 2 months by now and Nw found out what they are planing. I'm wondering if any of you have any ideas what would the region look like afterwards wheter they win or lose? p.s. should be a great battle of about 12.000 people in it. I am still considering dragons. :mage: :invasion: :duel: :invasion: :mage:
Aldareth 03-13-07, 08:45 AM	If Neverwinter allready nows about their plans , than say goodbye to them :) i dont think the Lords Alliance will wait until they got enough troops to start their War
hento 03-13-07, 09:10 AM	If Neverwinter allready nows about their plans , than say goodbye to them :) i dont think the Lords Alliance will wait until they got enough troops to start their War They actually already have 4200 troops so the war is going to be, and if successfull in recruiting Frost Giants and people from 10 Towns the ods should be about equal considering that Neverwinter has 6000 troops. But I'm actually interested in the state of the region AFTER THE WAR not whether the war shoul happen or not. :D
Panurg 03-13-07, 10:00 AM	Sorry, but last reply on your players plans before you discuss the after-war situation: 1. How by the Nine Hells should they be able to recruit people from Ten-Towns to lay siege on Neverwinter? 2. Do they know what the Lords Alliance is? 3. Can you imagine the difficulties of supplying/nourishing an army of 4600 folks in the north? Outside a great city with a trading-port? (I'm not convinced, that Luskan is in the position to supply such a number of warriors without losing severe portions of it's own ressources. Not to mention that they won't let your players army rest within city limits or even near the city.) I think it shuouldn't be too easy to start big wars for players, but I wish them good luck. Concerning your question: considering, the history of the north and the nature of war, in my opinion there will be more chaos in the region. Up to destabilisation of Ten-Towns and of course a cultural backlash for humankind in the region. With far reaching effects under the right circumstances. Perhaps even to the worst for the Silvermarches Region. Or the best of the Orcs in the region, depending on which side you whanna watch it from.
hento 03-13-07, 10:46 AM	Sorry, but last reply on your players plans before you discuss the after-war situation: 1. How by the Nine Hells should they be able to recruit people from Ten-Towns to lay siege on Neverwinter? 2. Do they know what the Lords Alliance is? 3. Can you imagine the difficulties of supplying/nourishing an army of 4600 folks in the north? Outside a great city with a trading-port? (I'm not convinced, that Luskan is in the position to supply such a number of warriors without losing severe portions of it's own ressources. Not to mention that they won't let your players army rest within city limits or even near the city.) I think it shuouldn't be too easy to start big wars for players, but I wish them good luck. Concerning your question: considering, the history of the north and the nature of war, in my opinion there will be more chaos in the region. Up to destabilisation of Ten-Towns and of course a cultural backlash for humankind in the region. With far reaching effects under the right circumstances. Perhaps even to the worst for the Silvermarches Region. Or the best of the Orcs in the region, depending on which side you whanna watch it from. Regarding 1 Don't know and don't care, it's their problem and solving it is a part of the campaign. Regarding 2 "A loose league of like-minded rulers led by Waterdeep, allies the good cities and small settlements of the Dessarin valley in this region" Forgotten Realms Campaign Setting; They've managed to convince Waterdeep & others to get spoils of war from Neverwinter... Regarding 3 Luskan already has 4000 men at arms (city size 16000), also remember the Archane Brotherhood and the insidious Kraken Society situated in Luskan. the rest of what the adventurers recruit they themselves have to find a way to get ressources, also not my problem. They've been at it for about 2 months now, and we play 2 times a week; wed and sun. I agree with you about not being easy to start big wars. :rimshot:
Panurg 03-13-07, 12:00 PM	That's right it's not your problem at all if you don't interfere in the world that you DM in at all. But then - so it seems to me (perhaps it's entirely different) - the world would be kinda static. In some way perhaps as in the NES game from ancient times: North and South. Don't mean to critisize what you are doing (which I'm not supposed to), but to talk about the outcome of a situation as complex as this one, I think one could use more detailed information about the scenery. Concerning the kraken society and the brotherhood of the arcane: they can be valuable allies, but in the same moment their chaotic natures can break thrue and you have a total disaster. About the core statement concerning the lords alliance: indeed we have a loose organisation here, but considering the possible threat and the of course the possible loss of an important (not too important) port in the north it's very likely they send a strike force. With the Ten Towns statement I simply meant that: Luskan is always athreat for the small villages of Ten Towns, why would they work together with a neighbor, thats threatening them and sending out pirate ships to plunder the trade routes? But you are right, thats the business of your players. I simply thought YOU, as the one responsibel for lots of outcomes in the world YOU create and YOU are filling with life could be interested ventillating some possible events and the plausibility of them. Didn't mean to offend you though. ;)
MarkusTay63 03-13-07, 12:51 PM	Regarding 1 Don't know and don't care, it's their problem and solving it is a part of the campaign. "A loose league of like-minded rulers led by Waterdeep, allies the good cities and small settlements of the Dessarin valley in this region" Forgotten Realms Campaign Setting And that information has changed since that book was published. They are a much more cohesive force now with Silver Marches as an ally and the threat of Obould in the North. They've managed to convince Waterdeep & others to get spoils of war from Neverwinter...:eek: :confused: So Waterdeep is a warmongering land-grabbing profiteering power in YOUR Realms? Not that that isn't possible, I suppose. Sounds like the U.S. to me... :rimshot: Considering how much this differs from the existing Realms, it would be hard to say what would happen. My guess, with Waterdeep acting that way, that WD will become the NEW Super-power in the North, and probably have it's eyes on Luskan next (it's old rival). Once they get a taste of power, they won't want to stop. Luskan, for itself, will likely try the same thing. An alliance based on greed will rapidly fall apart as soon as it's time to devide up the spoils. Expect another war and even more chaos as soon as the first one is over. Troops from Ten Towns? :confused: The barbarians from the region would be more believable and appropriate. Ten Towns has barely enough folks to defend itself.....
ClobberinTime 03-13-07, 02:44 PM	So Waterdeep is a warmongering land-grabbing profiteering power in YOUR Realms? Not that that isn't possible, I suppose. Sounds like the U.S. to me... :rimshot: Dude you should keep your political beliefs to yourself, this isn't the forum for them.
MarkusTay63 03-13-07, 02:53 PM	I notice YOUR location... taking things personally, hmmmmm? ;) Notice the 'rimshot' smiley. If you weren't a politician you'd actually own a sense of humor.... :rolleyes:
Panurg 03-13-07, 03:01 PM	Mr. Tay, thanks for setting things right like this. It's always hard for me to find the precise statement I try to formulate. But you mentioned many things I tried to say. :D Beside that: I'm very interested to learn about the right forums for making fun of fantasy locations. ;)
hento 03-13-07, 03:05 PM	Concerning the kraken society and the brotherhood of the arcane: they can be valuable allies, but in the same moment their chaotic natures can break thrue and you have a total disaster. Didn't mean to offend you though. ;) Well actually I'm trying to get that kind of an effect across The North. It was in my plan that sometimes after the war they get contacted by the Nine Hells and get offered some jobs or something alike. The general thing is that this is a chaotic evil :devil: campaign and making advantures of a type save the king's daughter don't work here. It's the aftermath that interests me because I will need the state of the world if they ever return to it. None taken. :mage:
MarkusTay63 03-13-07, 03:11 PM	An interesting piece of lore from the Planescape setting was that when a place became too much like one of the Outerplanes, that place would begin to slip into THAT plane. This was actually written with the border towns in mind, but I suppose theoretically it could happen ANYWHERE in the multiverse, explaining why it is so important to maintain a balance of good and evil, law and chaos. When 'all Hell breaks loose' in the North, it could mean that literally. ;)
Panurg 03-13-07, 03:30 PM	Ok, now I the picture is getting clearer. You want to have a reason for a more complex plot. Nice idea. I also have a campaign running in the moment with evil PCs, and it's not so easy to keep them at bay while trying to let them feel the power of evilness. :schemes: With nice political plots and revenge and anger and pride and bloodrage and demonbargaining and devil worshipping and beeing beat up by Aurumach for inbalancing the cosmic forces ... :dancin: So I would suggest to let them run in a debacoulos war which they are (against all signs) losing. You could f.e. let the massed power of the Lords Alliance with some divine (which isn't unusual in the Realms) help march against them and in the same time make a blizzard destroy a big part of their allies. In desperation they will seek help, and call for it loudly. And in the nick of time help will show up and turn the tides. But for a wicked prize. They have to swear allegiance to a demon prince (preferably Demon if they are chaotic evil, best found in the Abyss not Nine Hells, but if you want to be extremely tricky you could also make devils manipulate them, which could give the whole story another turn) in order to escape punishment and to save their remaining troops. The results of this are manyfold in my opinion. At first it brings unrest to the whole region and may awake some slumbering orc-tribes or goblin-tribes (why not bring up a underdark kingdom of Orogs, they are used and described only on rare occasions in 3.0 and 3.5 times). Secondly it could leave some of the cities unprotected which leads to opportunities for other evil groups (as Zenths, or Iron throne, Underdark Nations, ...) And thirdly the bargain with the demon in such a prominent place like the north could lead to much more demon activity there (Ammarindar is only a teleport away). Which in response could lead to many other incidents including the appearance of shade-explorers or spies. Who knows.:plotting:
hento 03-13-07, 03:54 PM	Yes, that is exactly the thing i had in mind. I like the way you're thinking. :bravo: Keep 'em coming...
ClobberinTime 03-13-07, 05:08 PM	I notice YOUR location... taking things personally, hmmmmm? ;) Notice the 'rimshot' smiley. If you weren't a politician you'd actually own a sense of humor.... :rolleyes: I just sent a note to W. it read: 'There is a little wiener boy up on Long Island who needs to be deprived of his chance to see his first real pair of boobies by being sent down to Gitmo. The only problem is that he will enjoy it too much, rolling around with his other anti-american buddies, painting each other with flowers, and being the belle of the ball so to speak, its probably more attention than he gets now at home, since he is a very sad little boy, who spends all of his time in his parents basement posting Anti-American propoganda on gaming web sites. On second thought, just let him be, being a pre-pube is tough these days, and who knows, if he makes it past his disenfranchised 'woe is me I'm so misunderstood' teen years on Long Island, he might even contribute something to our country.' Now who says politicians don't have a sense of humor, yuck yuck...........
hento 03-13-07, 05:30 PM	Now who says politicians don't have a sense of humor, yuck yuck........... How about you let politics alone and start some creative writing about Outcome of war against Neverwinter. Ha?
Stigger 03-13-07, 05:35 PM	Considering the depopulation those army size figures are probably going to result in... I'd go with not much. Off the top of my head I think Neverwinter had maybe 23,000 people overall and a standing army of 400 or so... and if you're pulling massive conscriptions, those are probably going to be coming off the nearby farms over a bunch of squishy artisans in the city... which is going to make food scarce more than likely... which means win or lose, the regions going to be pretty screwed for a few years and not capable of supporting all that many people in the very near term. Given the whole issue of attrition on the way down from Luskan though... and food... 12,000 people is an awful lot considering you seem to have stripped a quarter of Luskans population for the armed forces and are at best going to end up with half-trained, poorly equipped illiterate starving and probably ill peasants... and no readily apparent way to maintain them logistically in the field. Even if that's not you're problem, it isn't something I could see the Hosttower allowing without some very pressing reasons... Presuming you have those reasons and ignoring established lore for a bit... it could present a lot of opportunity for betrayals on the battlefield, subtle undermining of efforts being made, backroom deals being made ala the partitioning of Poland between Germany and the Soviet Union... lots of stuff to have fun with really. Maybe have the elves and druids in the Neverwinter Wood show up at the final battle and kick everyone in the teeth, providing you with an enemy for them to come back to collect ears from... perhaps it could be the first step in an Elven attempt to rebuild Illefarn or something. Alternately, have an orcish warlord rise up and decide he's goint to be the next Obould and have him sweep in from the rear after everyone's tired and bleeding, making way for him to steal the PC's prize out from under them and for them to seek revenge. Or maybe you could just have Talona show up in microbe/bacteria form and wipe out both sides to the point where a single battle will decide everything, only to have the target for the future arc show up and spoil the plans of the PC's... maybe even make it one (or all) of their henchmen cohorts who were waiting in reserve and betray them at the last minute to sweep up victory for themselves. Dunno, hope it helps a bit though.
ClobberinTime 03-13-07, 06:51 PM	Ok I'll contribute, just so you know tho, he started it, :) Ok first off: The numbers don't seem that far off, in general for the FR you need to multiply the population by 10 to get the number of people living around the city/in its cultural sphere, in fact the population numbers for the regions in the FRCS are calculated by adding the populations of all of the cities listed and multiplying by 10. Given the Demographics in the DMs guide 5% of the population will have the warrior class right, so a city of 23600 people has a total population including outlying areas of 236000, and that divided by 20 is 11,800 right, so Neverwinter with full conscription should be able to field an army of around 6-9000 troops, so I think you are right on there. Have you thought about buying PoF, it has rules for lots of this stuff. The thing I always notice/and obsess over are things like this- a 10' (is it 20 ' or 10') radius fireball covers 600 square feet about or 24 squares so massed infantry is really reall vulnerable, if they don't figure out ways to protect their men and Neverwinter does, then the PCs will lose. They need things like 'Rods of Fire Extinguishing', their own counter spelling wizards, Epic Spells that aroint certain spells, Flags with magical powers etc... otherwise their army will be swiss cheese. If they just come in with no plan, and no preparation hammer them, if they spend a reasonable amount of time and thought figuring things out then give them a chance. Think of This, you can buy 10 javelins of fireball (same as lightning for 7500gps, those 10 javelins will kill between 120-240 troops all told, they mass their troops to charge a gate, get all bunched together and then plowy. I would probably hint something about what sorts of magical defenses the city has or some such.
hento 03-14-07, 04:11 AM	Thank you Stigger and Cobberin Time. :ayyyy!: :thumbsup: If there is someone else with this kind of ideas please don't be afraid to post. This thing bugs me a lot and i would appreciate any ideas that may come to mind. :lightbulb
Boda 03-14-07, 09:32 AM	Mercenaries from Druergar city beneath evermoors. Extraplanar allies. Griffon's nest barbarians. Dont think the lords alliance would keep itself out of it, but ok, if your guys can infiltrate the city and sabbotage the defenses, that will do just fine. Another rogue pseudo pirate harbor in the region( luskan version 2) or a independant state(griffon nest)? But still, the city lords can just dial 9-1-1 and sumon the chosen, to kick everybody to the fugue plane, and then one of then takeover the rulership of neverwinter( as part of mystra plan to takeover the realms).
ShadezofDis 03-14-07, 10:24 AM	First off, I think you're letting your players off to easy in terms of; Logistics, feeding and keeping 4200 people healthy and sheltered is REALLY expensive and it's also REALLY noticable. How far away from Neverwinter are these forces? How far away from a city? What does the local city think of a pretty large army chillin out near them? Recruitement, where did they find these forces? Why are these forces following the PC's? If it's for pay then were are the PC's storing the money? How are they giving it out? Repurcussions, no Northern power is just going to sit there watching this build up. Anyhow, we can brush that under the rug for now. When reading Stigger's post (specifically the part regarding the Neverwinter Wood) I thought "Well gosh, this would just be a great plot for Eldreth Veluuthra" AND it's a handy way for you to be able to gloss over the glaring lore errors ({Note: these may not be errors, you may have very good in game explinations for them that you haven't included in the post} the Lords Alliance not stepping into the situation, why the Luskan forces would give the PC's support, etc) It fits very well that EV would try and forment war between human powers (or any nonelven powers really) Anyhow, without knowing why the Lords Alliance won't step in, without knowing who is losing troops to this newly formed army, without knowing how the PC's go about making war and without knowing quite a few other things it's really impossible to give you any real answer on "What would happen after a war in Neverwinter." By MarkusTay63 An interesting piece of lore from the Planescape setting was that when a place became too much like one of the Outerplanes, that place would begin to slip into THAT plane. I love the idea of that, in fact that's the basis of a theory about why the gods exist and what their real job is along with what AO's job is. :D
Empirate 03-14-07, 12:24 PM	A few notes on warfare in magical worlds. 1. Soldiers know they're gonna face at least a few wizards/sorcerers. They don't wanna die for their country but make the other guy die for his. So they'll probably demand heavy anti-magical screening to fight at all. 2. Professional soldiers, as opposed to conscripts, know how to deal with enemy spellcasters. Especially, they know they should spread out so any given fireball doesn't kill hundreds of soldiers but only half a dozen or so. This makes use of lighter armor necessary, and good equipment including ranged weapons to cover the greater distances on the suddenly much larger battlefield. Mobility is a big issue, making cavalry important. 3. As long as there is no single point at which spellcasters can cause serious trouble via AoE spells, they're basically out of the game: They only have a few spell slots available, and they're not only massively outnumbered by the enemy infantry, they also have to contend with enemy spellslingers. 4. Spellcasters can thus be most valuable in the role of very flexible support. Scrying magic will be important in any war, as well as spells such as message or sending to relay orders quickly and efficiently. They can be useful as battlecasters in certain specific situations (bridges, gate defenses etc.) but have to take enemy spellslingers of unknown numbers and quality into account. Illusions, especially terrain-altering ones like mirage arcana, are good. Calling spells might provide very powerful muscle in the form of Demons, Celestials or Elementals. 5. Equally important as spellcasters are creatures that have innate powers making them dangerous. Flying creatures can be especially important to keep track of; everything causing fear effects is interesting; everything with massive hitpoints and/or a good AC makes for a very good spearhead. 6. Professional soldiers will probably have been trained in monster-combat, too, but here only higher-level characters can really make a difference. 7. If for no other reason than troop morale Clerics and Druids will most likely be relegated mostly to the role of medic. Having them use their spell slots for anything else is a sure way of having your army rebel on you. Even the life of a 1st level warrior counts where his friends and family are concerned... All in all, you might consider understanding everything magical or otherwise very powerful as the military technology of the realms. Today, in our world, we have tanks, cruise missiles, helicopters, artillery. In the FR, they have giants, demons, dragons, and fireballs. There are ways to stay alive as a frail little human even against such things, and as soldiers, people are taught how. They're also taught how to work together with these factors in order to maximize everybody's battlefield performance.
hento 03-14-07, 03:28 PM	First off, I think you're letting your players off to easy Further explanation as follows: the background story is quite large and it would take me quite an amount of time to write it all down. I'll try to narrow it down to avoid further discussions about this subject Regarding the armies: Luskan itself has 4000 active armed troops as a city of that size (mages, fighters, priests etc.) which they have decided to mobilize against Neverwinter when the time comes under the command of Luskan itself. Ogre tribes in Neverwinter wood are currently very active in pillage & plunder of local farms around the area of Neverwinter. This attacks have been Neverwinters problems in the past and now make even more problems. A quest has been made with the PCs, before all this started, from the side of Nw to destroy the tribes but they have decided to recruit it against Nw instead. PCs killed a young adult copper dragon in Fireshars mines and gained 200 land troops which will be sent to Luskan with a merchantile caravan as an escort when the time comes. PCs are currently killing of Frost Giants and animating them, progressing deeper into The North searching for their main base to kill the leader and overtaking command of them, probably afterwards letting them raid local caravans as before or killing of every last one and making an undead army. This yet stays unclear. Kraken society and the Arcane brotherhood are making unrest in the local areas as before. A pact with the PCs in Skullport has been made with local chieftains to pay of high ranking officials to look the other way and cut of support of from the Lords Alliance to Nw for the time being. Also messengers from Nw carrying info about current situation being killed of constantly by local thieves guild. PCs heard rumor of something killing of fire elementals below Nw and will probably themselves contribute to this situation making winter come to Neverwinter. Neverwinter sending bounty hunters to track and kill down PCs, attempts so far not giving any result. A few notes on warfare in magical worlds Fully aware. Hope I've made the situation clearer. :surrender
Mpinkard 03-14-07, 06:12 PM	(please excuse my spelling errors) I started a campaign in back November loosly based on the Neverwinter Nights game. Now to add a bit of creative freedom I thinned out the overall population of adventurers across Faerūn. The players found themselves in Neverwinter as heros during the initial outbreak of the plague called "The Wailing Death". The PCs had set out to recover the Waterdavian cratures that were stolen from the academy but somehow became sidetracked and ended up leaving Neverwinter via one-way portal(the portal, discovered below Neverwinter, was malfunctioning and popped them up in Chult). While knowing as a player how the adventure unfolded if you SOLVED the mystery of the Wailing Death. I decided to go witha "What if" campaign. About one month after the players left Neverwinter certian aggressors with extraplaner resources had assassinated Lord Nasher after reducing the population below 40%. These extraplaner attackers then made their way into the city driving the weakend city to their knees. Swearing Vengance and not totally driven evil as it happened in the NWN Game, Lady Aribeth fled Neverwinter with roughly 10,000 refugees and solders to Waterdeep. The remaining Helmite Priests were sacrificed by extraplaner intruders to infernal lords thus doubling thier strength. The Arcane Brotherhood fearing the same for them struck a bargin, in the name of Luskan, with the extraplaner general. This agreement would set defenses to the North and in the waters. Meanwhile the New Neverwinter Rulers set their defenses to cover the Southern routes and raised many thousands of undead to Neverwinter wood. By the time Lady Aribeth arrives in Waterdeep with the refugees and remaining Solders, it is early winter(You can only travel as fast as your slowest). Neverwinter has gained the assistance of two particular unnamed dragons, one is a Shadowdragon and the other has not yet shown itself. To make matters worse and seem like doom is about to fold up on the PCs and the North, an early blizzard and fallen on the reagon, Snowfall has blanketed everything from well north of the Spine to just south of the Western Heartlands. (This weather seems unnatural but has not been investigated by the PCs at this time) The snow is so bad in Cormyr they have encountered 2 and 3 foot drifts during their travels. (Other than what you have read above I have not revealed anything else to my Players since it is only rumors they are hearing.) I have a few campaign battle maps that I have been using for Axis troop movements. Including a short list of Axis "monsters" I have yet to rerveal any ofthe Alied plans from the Lords of Alliance. I do want to mention. Longsaddle, Stonebridge and Mirabar are in danger of being sacked by spring unless the allies can overcome this unnatural winter and still defeat the Axis lines.
421 03-14-07, 07:58 PM	It could be useful to know the class & level of your players. The year and month can be useful too.
hento 03-15-07, 04:24 AM	It could be useful to know the class & level of your players. The year and month can be useful too. Lukač: half-orc Barbarian/Berserker 6/1, CE (7) Neno: elf Wizard/Battle Magus 9/2 TN (11) Alen: half-elf Cleric/Dragon Cleric 7/5 CE (12) Moky: drow Wizard/War Wizard 7/4 CE (11) Year not specified, middle of autumn. :u::u::raincloud:u::u:
Tevin Kevlak 03-15-07, 04:27 AM	Shouldn't the CR (I assume that's what the numbers in brackets represent) of Moky actually be 13? Drow have a level adjustment of +2.
hento 03-15-07, 04:45 AM	Shouldn't the CR (I assume that's what the numbers in brackets represent) of Moky actually be 13? Drow have a level adjustment of +2. Correct. Thank you for noticing. :incog:
ShadezofDis 03-15-07, 02:04 PM	Lukač: half-orc Barbarian/Berserker 6/1, CE (7) Neno: elf Wizard/Battle Magus 9/2 TN (11) Alen: half-elf Cleric/Dragon Cleric 7/5 CE (12) Moky: drow Wizard/War Wizard 7/4 CE (11) Year not specified, middle of autumn. :u::u::raincloud:u::u: I suspected, and this confirms. We run VERY different games so I can't really help you with the results since my results would vary dramatically from your own. :) Good luck to you though!
hedgeknight 03-16-07, 07:16 PM	Kudos to your players for a great idea! I ran an extended campaign where Neverwinter was besieged by Luskan, specifically Eltuth Oyim of the Hosttower of the Arcane. He was backed by servants of Auril with whom he had made an allegiance. They took Neverwinter from the inside by having agents inside the Cloaktower. Once a battle was started inside the mages' tower, humanoid forces laid seige to the walls with Luskan's navy coming in the harbor. Then Eltuth and his personal guard, including an adult white dragon showed up and "picked up the pieces". This pitched the region into chaos under the rule of a tyrannical despot. Eltuth ruled with an iron fist, even though Lord Alagondar and a handful of loyalists survived and went "underground." With the assistance of Auril, the region was plunged into a frostfell, with winter lasting for several seasons. The PCs who barely survived the fall of Neverwinter, went on a mission to destroy Eltuth Oyim and restore Lord Alagondar to the ruling seat of Neverwinter. This campaign was an email campaign and lasted six years - w/o a doubt, the most fun I've had gaming. Don't forget this: just because WOTC "says" that Alustriel, Khelben Blackstaff, Elminster, and such are demi-gods, it doesn't mean they have to exist in YOUR campaign. ;) Peace! -g-
hento 03-16-07, 08:19 PM	Kudos to your players for a great idea! Don't forget this: just because WOTC "says" that Alustriel, Khelben Blackstaff, Elminster, and such are demi-gods, it doesn't mean they have to exist in YOUR campaign. ;) Peace! -g- Just give me a very interesting idea :lightbulb : why in not to round up all of those legendary characters, the good and the evil and cut down their levels and CR to those of the PCs and put them all on the battlefield. How big an impact could that bring to the region. Could make the whole thing more interesting... :plotting: BTW, has anyone seen those 2 falling wizards in the Fallen Tower at 23:11? Does anyone know who was that third guy that blew them up? Probably could use his to infiltrate PCs into Nw.
MerrikCale 03-18-07, 08:50 PM	I'd go with some previous thoughts, the Lord's Alliance would wipe the floor with them.
hento 03-19-07, 04:45 AM	I'd go with some previous thoughts, the Lord's Alliance would wipe the floor with them. :detect: I belive that you misunderstood the whole thing here. The freakin sisi Lords Alliance isn't going to help little old Neverwinterans in this matter. They are all on their own... bu hu hu :bigeyes: I was thinking more of putting Elm and Drizzt on Nw side and Halaster, Mirt and Elaith on Luskans. And cutting their CRs down to defeatable lvls.
Stigger 03-19-07, 04:49 AM	Doesn't make a lot of sense, but it's you're campaign I guess...
hento 03-19-07, 06:45 AM	Doesn't make a lot of sense, but it's you're campaign I guess... Most of those good aligned campaigns don't make a lot of sense to me with 4 PC being able to defeat whole armies in defence of a town or slaying half of the Nine Hells without a scratch. I also don't see why you all consider the Lords Alliance as gods; they are an organization of people and people can be manipulated with. If you have something in mind that would make sense to you please enlighten me.
Stigger 03-19-07, 07:04 AM	Was more in reference to Mirt siding with Luskan... he's got a few grudges against them last I checked. And they against him. As to Halaster, I don't see him getting involved either, as he tends to stay out of those sorts of conflicts as they're beneath him in a lot of respects. Same pretty much goes for Elaith and Elminster though. Drizzt I could sorta see getting involved, more to spite Luskan than to help Neverwinter though. Personally, I'd leave the lot of them out of the whole matter, as I can't see any of them getting involved over a relatively small city going by the changes you seem to have made to canon... not really worth their time. Maybe if you got those black dragons in the Mere involved it might make more sense to pull in heavy guns, but it's not like Neverwinter doesn't have its own resident steel dragon who could probably call on at least one other steel dragon for aid. Think it would be more interesting to stay 'organic', so to speak, rather than bringing in names just for the sake of bringing in names.
hento 03-19-07, 07:18 AM	Thanks for the background on those chars for I only have them in FRCS and was wondering a bit about their points of view in the world. Was mearly a thought though. I wonder could you look up that wis in the Fallen Tower (had lab there before the thing exploded). I only have those old 2e sourcebooks and those 3,5e don't quite give the info so i'm a bit confused if I could use the guy to get PCs inside Nw for an inside job. p.s. thanks for the black dragons tip
Stigger 03-19-07, 07:23 AM	Llomnauvel 'Firehands' Oloadhin was the fellow who blew them up, and was the owner of the tower in the first place. He died in the process however. Wasn't just two mages though, he took out over a dozen hosttower mages before he, the Overwizard Glagorn, and the rest of the surviving hosttower mages went out together in a blaze powered by every magical item in the tower...
hento 03-19-07, 07:27 AM	:censored: :raincloud Will have to think about something else...
Stigger 03-19-07, 07:33 AM	Shouldn't be that hard to get them into Neverwinter. Not like it's warded or anything. It's got a big river running right through the middle of it anyway, not like a waterbreathing spell couldn't get them into the city. Cloak of the Sea would make it even easier. Not like they have merfolk and sea elves guarding the harbor like Waterdeep does either. Fly spell in the middle of the night to take them up over the walls and slip in under the cover of fog or something. Hell, the eastern half of the city has a pretty big wooded hill that they could use... within the walls no less from what I understand. I'd suggest taking a look at the downloads section for WotC and seeing if Volo's guide to the North is available for free. It's the most complete description I've seen of the city, and covers Luskan and most of the surrounding towns and villages as well. Very much worth it.
Stigger 03-19-07, 07:35 AM	Yeah they have it there, along with The North and The Savage Frontier. All three might be handy for a quick glance at. Some of it's a bit dated, but it's very good for a basic overview.
hento 03-19-07, 07:48 AM	Got all 2e books, most of new 3.5e ones just haven't the time to read them though. Regarding your last, they managed to pissof Lord Nasher in the past so he's got a curse on two of them so if they ever get back to Nw they automatically get teleported to the jail. That is why I need to find some char, formerly Nw wiz with knowlegde of their wards to get the thing of. Otherwise getting in isn't a problem.
Stigger 03-19-07, 07:51 AM	Dimensional Anchor spell... or whatever the personal equivalent is of that spell if that's the area one. Should work for them, presuming you have it as an OnEnter sort of curse, rather than one that constantly looks for them being there that'll zap them after it wears off... have the hosttower offer something like that to them in exchange for certain considerations when the city is looted and it might work. Going off of memory though, there's only two mages specifically mentioned in the sources I'm aware of, those being Eltoora Sarptyl and Ophala Cheldarstone, both members of the Cloaktower, and with Ophala as being in consideration for elevation to the ranks of Mystra's Chosen. Eltoora's pretty much left a blank slate from what I recall. You've got a lot of room to play with for coming up with a disgruntled mage to use as your plot device there.
hento 03-19-07, 08:00 AM	It's the zapping kind, but i'll work something out. Sidequests and such ought to bring some Nw outcast mages up to the surface. Might even get some devils to propose deal, the PCs are CE anyway :evillaugh Cloaktower might work... :)
Stigger 03-19-07, 08:04 AM	Could get someone to cast some high level divinations or something to figure out a way to remove the curses... or better yet transfer them to some poor unsuspecting dupe. Sounds like something the Hosttower would do to its enemies. :D Thinking about it, if the spell is actively looking for them, an amulet of proof against detection and location could work to mask them from it, since it blocks divination spells on the wearer. Up the caster level maybe if you need to, but it's a relatively simple and straightforward solution to your problem maybe.
clevercommie 03-20-07, 04:32 PM	I just sent a note to W. it read: 'There is a little wiener boy up on Long Island who needs to be deprived of his chance to see his first real pair of boobies by being sent down to Gitmo. The only problem is that he will enjoy it too much, rolling around with his other anti-american buddies, painting each other with flowers, and being the belle of the ball so to speak, its probably more attention than he gets now at home, since he is a very sad little boy, who spends all of his time in his parents basement posting Anti-American propoganda on gaming web sites. On second thought, just let him be, being a pre-pube is tough these days, and who knows, if he makes it past his disenfranchised 'woe is me I'm so misunderstood' teen years on Long Island, he might even contribute something to our country.' Now who says politicians don't have a sense of humor, yuck yuck........... Unfortunatly the sad kind of kills the funny (you by the way, not him). Just stow the commentary will you, it belittles you more than anyone else.
hento 03-23-07, 08:39 AM	bump :bump: :whatsthis Newsflash: Just got 2 new players in the campaign :cheer: :dancin: :w00t:. The first one is a Johnny Neutron TN human Cleric, and another is Migi, a half-orc Barbarian. The crew just killed 8 Frost Giants, animated them and heading of to find more.