Post/Author/DateTime	Post
mparthas 09-01-07, 04:29 PM	He was one of the better, probably the best character, that ever came out of Forgotten Realms' novels and I was sorry to saw him go. Though I usually hate this kind of plot device, I am wondering if wotc is going to resurrect him. If they have george rr martin as a writer then I wouldnt worry about it since he can kill off an interesting character and create even more engaging character out of the blue. Sadly they do not. Has there been any novels or game materials mentioning Pharauns Fate after his demise in the Abyss ?
Zanan 09-01-07, 04:39 PM	Matter of factly, the longer I read the WotSQ series, the more I got annoyed with this chap. He more or less became the stereotypical bravado-style better-than-the rest wizard chap who was edging along the lines of the male drow forerunners who opposed the female, i.e. Drizzt, Zaknafein, and Jarlaxle. In that respect, I do not miss him. For me, Valas Hune, Danfiae and Quenthel (with a few exceptions) from this series, as well as Jezz, Cavatina, and Q'arlynd from Lady Penitent I give the readership a better view of typical drow characters. But that's just me. As for your question, no novel has taken him up so far, methinks. It could well be though that Aliisza (who claimed his finger) may use this to get her lover back in the The Gossamer Plain (The Empyrean Odyssey - Trilogy, Book I), though you need to ask Thomas Reid. NB: Q'arlynd Melarn of LP I will be to your liking as well, I guess.
mparthas 09-01-07, 04:49 PM	I absolutely agree that he started great in Book 1 and goes downhill from there. He was very funny in book 1, kinda funny in book 2 and then his talent for wittiness just petered out. I am pining for humor and inventiveness. Pharaun gave us that, for a time at least and my hope is through Pharaun's resurrection, these things will also be brought back. Valas was quite good except that he didnt have as much screen time so there is little to no character development. And regarding Danifae, if the Menzoberranzan were acting in role, they would have off-ed her long since. I smelled plot shield there which made me dislike her.
Zandilar 09-01-07, 07:29 PM	Heya, The track record of the use of resurrection in novels is quite bad. Authors really don't like it (or other healing spells, and they also seem to have an aversion to divine magic just in general - however, having not read WotSQ or been able to get my hands on first book of the Lady Penitent series, I can't really comment on the use of divine magic in those books... though with Lolth out of the picture, they had a very good excuse for not using it in WotSQ). So I honestly wouldn't expect any dead character come back from the dead, no matter how attached to them you are.
Zanan 09-02-07, 04:25 AM	When he passed away, those able to resurrect him had other things on their mind, something like meeting Lolth in "person". The only one about afterwards, Quenthel, did not bother to look what happened to him and even if, she'd rather have raised him as a zombie than resurrect him. As for LP I, quite a bit of resurrection takes place amongst the Eilistraeens (thumbs up, Mrs. Smedman), most likely because they are, relatively speaking, so few in number. I wonder whether that battlemistress makes an appearance in LP II though?
MarkusTay63 09-02-07, 10:49 AM	Pharaun was my favorite character in that series as well, and I'd have to agree that his personality took a dive in the last couple books. But then again, the whole series took a dive as well. Having different authors interpretations of the characters might have been a good idea at first, but they all came out looking incredibly schitzophrenic by the end of the story. Even for Drow, the behaviour was far too chaotic. Pharaun saves a total stranger, yet lets a friend die? WTF? WotC, please, PLEASE NEVER EVER let different authors interpret characters again! They were like a completely different group of people from one book to the next! And each author had his/her personal favorite, so each novel became centered around a different caracter. It was a very unpleasant reading experience. And I'm still not sure if the series served any purpose... did the group actually accomplish anything?! And why were only Drow from FR allowed to become Lolth's "Chosen One" (whatever that title was)? Hundreds, perhaps thousands, of worlds with Drow and only three from Abeir-Toril were eligible? The believability goes right out the window there... I hope they bring back Pharaun, but only have the author that portrayed Pharaun with a heart write him from now on. Also Valas Hune(sp?), I'd like to see him appear in his own book, or perhaps make a cameo in the Sellswords series. He is indebted to Pharaun for saving him from life as an Aboleth-slave, so it would be cool to have Valas be the one to bring him back (with the Succubus' help, of course). Maybe have him join the Bregan D'arthe as well, they could always use some more firepower, and he seems like the kind of guy that would get along perfectly with Jarlaxle.
Lord Karsus 09-04-07, 03:02 PM	...however, having not read...the Lady Penitent series, I can't really comment on the use of divine magic in those books... -Resurrection is used to much that it's sickening. Really. And I'm still not sure if the series served any purpose... did the group actually accomplish anything?! And why were only Drow from FR allowed to become Lolth's "Chosen One" (whatever that title was)? Hundreds, perhaps thousands, of worlds with Drow and only three from Abeir-Toril were eligible? The believability goes right out the window there... -No, no. The Realms are their own little microcosm now, remember. There is the FR Lolth, and the rest-of-the-multiverse Lolth...:rolleyes: Also Valas Hune(sp?), I'd like to see him appear in his own book, or perhaps make a cameo in the Sellswords series. He is indebted to Pharaun for saving him from life as an Aboleth-slave, so it would be cool to have Valas be the one to bring him back (with the Succubus' help, of course). Maybe have him join the Bregan D'arthe as well, they could always use some more firepower, and he seems like the kind of guy that would get along perfectly with Jarlaxle. -Firstly, Valas already is a member of Bregan D'aerthe. Anyway, Valas is actually mentioned by either Jarlaxle or Kimmuriel in Road of the Patriarch. It was nothing more than a passing mention, towards the end of the book, I believe.
Sosthenes 09-04-07, 05:38 PM	One thing about the characterisations was the constant pestering with "If a drow could have felt friendship, he would have" stuff that was thrown about. A rather low-brow method of conveying the "evil-ness" of the drow race... Was it just me or did this get worse after the first book?
SmartPaladin 09-05-07, 11:10 PM	I honestly couldn't read the last book of WotSQ. I loved Ryld Argith, and Valas Hune. I also liked Halisstra Melarn, but that took sometime. I didn't care for Danifae, and Quenthel Baenre should have stayed dead. Oh, and I want Jeggred to be resurrected, just to be killed again. A few thousand more times to be honest. So long as they were in the underdark, or on the surface I was fine (though I'm still kinda put out with Eilistraee faithful, but I guess that's not her fault) I could handle. But once we had all of these Drow women running off to the Demonwebs Pit, I just lost all interest.
Sir Aurik 09-06-07, 08:32 AM	I honestly couldn't read the last book of WotSQ. I loved Ryld Argith, and Valas Hune. I couldent agree more. The impression I got from Ryld in particular is that of someone who is not inherintly evil (I think he would have been neutral at worst had he growen up anywhere elce), who has to "act" evil in order to survive. Both he and Valas show a longing for freindship, which in drow society just doesnt happen.
mparthas 09-06-07, 11:16 AM	The impression I got from Ryld in particular is that of someone who is not inherintly evil (I think he would have been neutral at worst had he growen up anywhere elce), who has to "act" evil in order to survive. In other words, Ryld acted like humans and that is what made him interesting. A character that is overly one dimensional, e.g. through and through evil or chaotic or both would not stay interesting after the first ten pages. You already knew what he's thinking, knew what he's gonna do, what his reaction gonna be on any given situation.
Lord Karsus 09-06-07, 01:21 PM	I honestly couldn't read the last book of WotSQ. -Even though you read the rest of the series? I never would have simply stopped. Just read it to know exactly takes place at the end. Closure, you need closure!
SmartPaladin 09-06-07, 11:09 PM	-Even though you read the rest of the series? I never would have simply stopped. Just read it to know exactly takes place at the end. Closure, you need closure! Closure? What closure? I knew how it ended going into the series, it was just the fact that we have all of these Drow women wanting to become the next Lolth, and we're in Lolth's home plane. I had no interest into it at that point. I had a hard time finishing the box before that one. Quick note, Ryld always struck me as Lawful Evil, maybe Lawful Neutral.
MarkusTay63 09-07-07, 01:51 AM	-Firstly, Valas already is a member of Bregan D'aerthe. Anyway, Valas is actually mentioned by either Jarlaxle or Kimmuriel in Road of the Patriarch. It was nothing more than a passing mention, towards the end of the book, I believe.The way I wrote that made it come ou wrong, I guess. I switched subjects from Valas to Pharaun, so I was wishing Pharaun would come back and join Bregen D'aerthe. Jarlaxle, Pharaun, Ryld, and Valas as an adventuring party... it's the DROW SQUAD!!!! :D Was Kimmuriel that cleric of Vaerun? I didn't like him, but my dream team needs a healer.... :rolleyes:
Zanan 09-07-07, 04:28 AM	The way I wrote that made it come ou wrong, I guess. I switched subjects from Valas to Pharaun, so I was wishing Pharaun would come back and join Bregen D'aerthe. Jarlaxle, Pharaun, Ryld, and Valas as an adventuring party... it's the DROW SQUAD!!!! :D Was Kimmuriel that cleric of Vaerun? I didn't like him, but my dream team needs a healer.... :rolleyes: Can't see the obsession many on here have with the Bregan D'aerthe, a simply - if renowned - mercenary gang. Looks to me that those people just simply cannot stand to work for a decently created, organized, and lead drow house? Kimmuriel is a psionic character, most likely a psion. No healing in him. I doubt that he's a Vhaeraunian either.
Lord Karsus 09-07-07, 10:22 AM	Was Kimmuriel that cleric of Vaerun? I didn't like him, but my dream team needs a healer.... :rolleyes: -No, Kimmuriel is a Psion. Psions do have some manifestations that can heal, however. I think you might be thinking of Rai'Guy, who was a Cleric of Lolth.
MarkusTay63 09-07-07, 03:29 PM	God, I think I hated HIM even more... at least Kimmuriel had a decent name... :rolleyes: How about Liriel Baenre? Oh wait... she wasn't a cleric... that was the whole reason behind the story... How about that dude that was chasing her? The priest of Vhaerun? I think he died, though......and so did his god, I hear... Can't a guy get a decent Drow cleric without turning to Lolth around here? If that Drizzt was just slightly more intelligent, he would actually be able to cast spells... :rolleyes: But then again, I wouldn't want him in my Dream Team anyway - he's a 'show-boater'.
SmartPaladin 09-07-07, 04:39 PM	Liriel Baenre is a Cleric. She's now a Cleric of Mystra (as was revealed in The Best of the Realms Book 3: The Stories of Elaine Cunningham), which makes sense really. Nevermind that Mystra could backhand Lolth so hard, that Eilistraee would win the Sava game by default.
MarkHall 09-07-07, 04:42 PM	(as was reviled in The Best of the Realms Book 3: The Stories of Elaine Cunningham), LOL! Sorry, that's a funny typo... reviled instead of revealed...
SmartPaladin 09-07-07, 04:44 PM	Thanks for pointing it out Mark, somedays, spelling isn't my strong suit.
MarkHall 09-07-07, 05:03 PM	Normally, I let typos stand; if the message is largely intelligible, it's not worth the effort, and there's no point. I make exceptions when someone uses a completely wrong word (saying descendants instead of ancestors), or the typo is so unintentionally hilarious that I have to laugh out loud (as in, where other people can share in my merriment).
MarkusTay63 09-07-07, 05:28 PM	Okay, don't rub it in... I already said I was sorry for that one. :rolleyes: ;) :D Thanks for the info, SmartPaladin, now I'll have to pick up that book next (in the middle of Darkvision now).
runestar 09-07-07, 09:13 PM	Has there been any novels or game materials mentioning Pharauns Fate after his demise in the Abyss ? None that I am aware of, though he is briefly mentioned in gossamer plains...or is that gossamer chains?:P
Forest_Wanderer_Aerandir 09-07-07, 09:49 PM	Closure, you need closure! If I am ever in a relationship with an elf of any sort, Closure is not something I need. I don't want to know I'm breaking up with good characters! Hand me a bottle of vodka and ring of wishing, and ignorance becomes bliss.
Rufus_StoneHammer 09-07-07, 10:18 PM	Has anyone read the book "The Gossamer Plain" It tells something I thought was really cool. It has more to do with Aliisza. Also has to do with Pharaun. I just got through reading it, very good book I think.
MarkusTay63 09-07-07, 10:39 PM	So MANY books, so little time... :(
Forest_Wanderer_Aerandir 09-07-07, 11:41 PM	That's why D&D canon is good. Speeds up your page to minute rate. That's right, Highschool. My D&D playing and reading behind textbooks is, in fact, HELPING me, moreso than learning how to do chin ups on a flat surface. The Gossamer Plain sounds good, though. -chapters-
MerrikCale 09-07-07, 11:44 PM	I rather enjoyed Pharaun, but I do get the fact that he was a tad stereotypical. The problem is in a long series like that you need some comic relief
Forest_Wanderer_Aerandir 09-07-07, 11:47 PM	WHich I got from the first and second book, and then it stopped. The plot was decent enough, but I wish Salvatore had written it. He is the Lolth male incarnate. And yes, I realize Lolth wouldn't have a male incarnate, but still. :P
MarkusTay63 09-07-07, 11:50 PM	RAS = Lolth? :plotting: Sounds like a match to me. ;)
Forest_Wanderer_Aerandir 09-07-07, 11:52 PM	Ha. I KNEW there was a Lolth incarnate somewhere. Explains all the spiders that continually appear in my room. *squish* EDIT: Wait a second. If I squish a spider, and a spider is a piece of Lolth, am I squishing Salvatore? :mymy:
MarkusTay63 09-08-07, 12:01 AM	We can only hope... :cool:
Forest_Wanderer_Aerandir 09-08-07, 08:48 AM	Oh no you didn't. We don't want Salvatore dead. Who's gonna write the Drizzt!? :duel:
Rufus_StoneHammer 09-08-07, 12:49 PM	Just got through reading gossamer plain and it was cool. Pharaun and Aliisza have a baby togather. It's a really good read.
MarkusTay63 09-08-07, 03:37 PM	Get out of here! I guess we got our first NPC for 4e, then... Oh no you didn't. We don't want Salvatore dead. Who's gonna write the Drizzt!? :duel:What, you don't think someone else could do just as good a job as RAS? You need to get out more... :rolleyes: I'll start by saying that I own EVERY single FR novel by RAS, so obviously I like his stories. However, I grow tired of of the constant combat scenes, so I have started reading some of the other FR authors we have. And guess what? Other folks have talent too.... :cool: I'm currently reading Darkvision and am thoroughly enjoying it. Imagine... a non-stereotypical Dwarf that doesn't come off plain silly. ;)
Zanan 09-08-07, 06:21 PM	Just got through reading gossamer plain and it was cool. Pharaun and Aliisza have a baby togather. It's a really good read. What? A half-fiend / half-drow? Or was it drow half-fiend? :D
Forest_Wanderer_Aerandir 09-08-07, 07:58 PM	Get out of here! I guess we got our first NPC for 4e, then... What, you don't think someone else could do just as good a job as RAS? You need to get out more... :rolleyes: I'll start by saying that I own EVERY single FR novel by RAS, so obviously I like his stories. However, I grow tired of of the constant combat scenes, so I have started reading some of the other FR authors we have. And guess what? Other folks have talent too.... :cool: I'm currently reading Darkvision and am thoroughly enjoying it. Imagine... a non-stereotypical Dwarf that doesn't come off plain silly. ;) Oh, pish tosh, I've been reading other authors too. I just have fun defending things in pointless ditties. And making use of the :duel: smiley. I have to say, I did rather enjoy the Avatar Series. But that's way old. Like, Time of Troubles old. :P I'm currently delving in the Knights of Cormyr series.
GothicDan 09-08-07, 08:01 PM	Avatar Trilogy was TERRIBLE.
Forest_Wanderer_Aerandir 09-08-07, 08:36 PM	-shame- I liked Cyric. And I keep in mind, it was the first realms books I ...um..."borrowed" from the school library. In retrospect, not so good I suppose, but there's some nostalgia. And for those wondering, I don't include these two petty books coming after the original trilogy.
MarkusTay63 09-08-07, 08:59 PM	LOL, I liked those, but hated the trilogy. Go figure. To each his own, and all of that. But you gotta admit that Pwent and Pikel are morons. :P Have you read The Crusade series about the Tuigan Horde? I really enjoyed that one... lot's of Toril gets exposure there, and we see Azoun in all his glory. Azoun... :weep:
Forest_Wanderer_Aerandir 09-08-07, 09:20 PM	I'll remember that one next time I make a trip to the library. The only reason I read the final two is because they were very much about the pantheon. Although I think Crucible was the better of the two final books. Also, the whole Elminster-die-trial thing I found was ok, if a bit generic.
Zanan 09-09-07, 05:45 AM	Avatar Trilogy was TERRIBLE. If you've misplaced your ticket for the temple of Loviatar, try The Night Parade (written by the same author). ;)
Zandilar 09-09-07, 08:33 AM	Heya, If you've misplaced your ticket for the temple of Loviatar, try The Night Parade (written by the same author). ;) *shudder* The only good thing about it was that it included my favorite Cormyian NPC... The worst thing was that it included my favorite Cormyrian NPC. I'm not really surprised the "lore" from that book has been largely ignored by everyone to come after. Edit: Though I really didn't mind the adoption of Krystin part of the storyline. Krystin was kinda cool, so I'm a bit miffed no one has remembered her since.
Lord Karsus 09-09-07, 09:23 AM	Just got through reading gossamer plain and it was cool. Pharaun and Aliisza have a baby togather. It's a really good read. -Yeah...That's kind of spoiler worthy. I finished the book a while ago, so it's no surprise to me, but...
Caltob 09-09-07, 02:56 PM	What? A half-fiend / half-drow? Or was it drow half-fiend? :D Actually more of a drow half-celestial
Zanan 09-10-07, 09:54 AM	Actually more of a drow half-celestial Unless I am mistaken OR something strange happening to Aliisza, she's an alu-fiend, i.e. a variant half-fiend? Mating with somesuch produces no celestials, I assumed.
Zireael 09-10-07, 09:57 AM	Pharaun and Aliisza did have a child, that's all.
GothicDan 09-10-07, 10:14 AM	Come on, we all know that Alu-Fiends and Drow make Aasimar. *snicker.* I'm not going to no temple of Loviatar unless she turns into a guy. A tall, Scandinavian blond guy.. Oh, yeah. PS: I need to stop being so lewd on these boards. Where's my thermo book?
Zanan 09-10-07, 11:17 AM	Well, there are a few male priests of the Maiden, you know?! Need to get that book.
MarkusTay63 09-10-07, 12:10 PM	You kidding? Dambrath is my favorite country! Hiney-whipping Half-drow babes - thats even more fun then Spring Break and girls gone wild! :D Hey, has anybody else noticed Pharaun sounds an awful lot like Faerun? Maybe he is an incarnation of the continent itself? :eek: (that was a joke, BTW) ;)
Lord Karsus 09-10-07, 12:39 PM	-I once made a Planewalking character in a homebrew campaign named Phaerūn. A Sun Elf Sorcerer/Fighter. I was young and innocent then. Go figure...
Caltob 09-10-07, 01:09 PM	Come on, we all know that Alu-Fiends and Drow make Aasimar. *snicker.* I'm not going to no temple of Loviatar unless she turns into a guy. A tall, Scandinavian blond guy.. Oh, yeah. PS: I need to stop being so lewd on these boards. Where's my thermo book? Thet said they would turn Aliisza's fiend from into celestial if she didn't choose death, so I asumed they did the same for Keal.
SmartPaladin 09-11-07, 12:57 AM	You kidding? Dambrath is my favorite country! Hiney-whipping Half-drow babes - thats even more fun then Spring Break and girls gone wild! :D Nevermind the fact that I think most Half Drow have a better sense of humor then most Drow... A Drow is always keeping one eye over their shoulder, a Half Drow tends to as well, but they have no problem laughing about the absurdity of it all. Or am I the only one who thinks that way?
Cord de'Beron 09-11-07, 05:28 PM	As for Ryld Argith, he is one of the more interesting characters in the books, and is described pretty good. But I dont like the wahy R.A. Salvatore suddenly turns his actions and mind into a more evil view, like he is trying to justifies his coming death. That was one of the think that really made me rate the books pretty low.
MarkusTay63 09-11-07, 08:14 PM	None of the characters were consistent from one book to the next, that was my problem with the series. Each novel described a completely different set of personalities. :( Chaotic is one thing, schitzophrenic is a whole 'nother ball of wax.
Rinonalyrna Fathomlin 09-12-07, 01:21 PM	As I've said elsewhere, I thought Pharaun was a jerk and an evil slimeball from the beginning, and I'm not unhappy that he's gone. And by the way, I think the premise of "evil characters are the heroes you're going to be rooting for" is dubious to begin with.
Zanan 09-14-07, 04:25 AM	None of the characters were consistent from one book to the next, that was my problem with the series. Each novel described a completely different set of personalities. :( Chaotic is one thing, schitzophrenic is a whole 'nother ball of wax. Nono ... Danifae and Valas always stayed the same.
Forest_Wanderer_Aerandir 09-14-07, 10:06 PM	None of the characters were consistent from one book to the next, that was my problem with the series. Each novel described a completely different set of personalities. :( Chaotic is one thing, schitzophrenic is a whole 'nother ball of wax. 7 and 1/2 comments regarding schitzophrenic's and wax popped into my head after reading that. But the gerbil is learning "self control", so I didn't say them.