Barbarian Question [Archive] - Wizards Community

Barbarian Question [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
lavyan
09-26-06, 07:40 PM I want to multiclass my barbarian as a cleric and I'm looking at Kelanen. What are the acceptable alignments for a cleric of Kelanen? I think:
LN
CN
NG
NE

I'm choosing Kelanen because his favored weapon 'any martial sword' and my Barbarian uses a falchion. Is there a better diety? Is thier any LG restrictions for using a herogod as a diety?

Any and all suggestions and comments will be greatly appreciated.

Thanks
kenobi65
09-26-06, 10:29 PM I want to multiclass my barbarian as a cleric and I'm looking at Kelanen. What are the acceptable alignments for a cleric of Kelanen? I think:
LN
CN
NG
NE

Or true Neutral, as well. NE, of course, isn't allowed for a PC, and LN isn't an option for you (unless you want to lose that Rage).

I'm choosing Kelanen because his favored weapon 'any martial sword' and my Barbarian uses a falchion. Is there a better diety? Is thier any LG restrictions for using a herogod as a diety?

Well, falchion is indeed listed as one of the weapons that Kelanen approves of. The only drawback to having him as a deity may be that he doesn't have an organized church in your region (i.e., other deities may have stronger metaorg representation). There's no particular downside to having a hero-god as your deity. (In fact, Kelanen is probably way over-represented by PC worshippers / clerics in LG.)
clik_ml
09-27-06, 12:35 AM Only thing to look out for really is that as a divine caster of kelanen, you can't use bows. You'll be restricted to swords and crossbows. Sometimes it's nice for the barbarian to be able to pull out a bow and plink away at baddies and that's an option you'll miss out on.

If the out of whack ratio of players worshipping kelanen keeps up, some regions might crack down more on the kelanites (I'm thinking veluna for one). I'm pretty sure the only reason why kelanen wasn't one of the religions banned in veluna was because it's a smaller following. So give them time :-)
Japangirl
09-29-06, 02:57 AM Kelanen is better than Pelor or St. Cuthbert in the BK. Of course, better is a relative term . . . instead of a HUGE price on your head, you have a small one. And the pictures on wanted posters aren't terribly accurate yet.
Lupo
09-29-06, 03:11 AM I want to multiclass my barbarian as a cleric and I'm looking at Kelanen. What are the acceptable alignments for a cleric of Kelanen? I think:
LN
CN
NG
NE

I'm choosing Kelanen because his favored weapon 'any martial sword' and my Barbarian uses a falchion. Is there a better diety? Is thier any LG restrictions for using a herogod as a diety?

Any and all suggestions and comments will be greatly appreciated.

Thanks

the only downside of kelanen is his limited choice of domains and the restriction to swords and crossbows. so followers of kelanen will never get an extra domain and you will face some critters, where your limit to slashing/piercing weapons will suck up some of your damage output in damage reduction.

on the other hand you can get a build (barbarian, cleric, fighter, pious-templar) that is only one BAB behind a straight fighter but has some very usefull additional powers. one of the few cases where a combination of two similar (in this case divine casters) spellcasting classes makes sense.

definitely worth it :)

ciao

martin m.
zoinks69
09-29-06, 03:49 AM the only downside of kelanen is his limited choice of domains and the restriction to swords and crossbows. so followers of kelanen will never get an extra domain and you will face some critters, where your limit to slashing/piercing weapons will suck up some of your damage output in damage reduction.

on the other hand you can get a build (barbarian, cleric, fighter, pious-templar) that is only one BAB behind a straight fighter but has some very usefull additional powers. one of the few cases where a combination of two similar (in this case divine casters) spellcasting classes makes sense.

definitely worth it :)

ciao

martin m.

Only having two domains is bad IF those domains are bad. War domain is fine. Travel domain is great. Have sword, will travel (what else can you ask for? If you are really desperate for domains, there are PrC's that grant specific domains or choices -- Warpriest, Seeker of the Misty Isle, etc)

Not being able to use longbows stinks...IF you can't fly. And we got that covered if you take enough cleric levels :)

I'll agree that DR/not slashing will hurt a little, but that's so few and far between.

I'd also agree that a fightery type with a cleric level and some templar is pretty nice, though personally I'd stick out the full cleric progression. Maybe start with one barbarian and the rest cleric if you are feeling adventurous.
lavyan
09-30-06, 08:10 PM Well I already have a fell fledged cleric (Fharlanghn), and being a wood elf makes it a little hard to multi class. The original plan was to go cleric3/barbarian4 and go with the Pious Templar. The problem there is the PT offers a few abilities with the dieties favored weapon, hence thinking about Kelanen? I have changed my mind now and the prestige class I may pursue is Bear Warrior, this 'opens' up my diety selection. I think I'm going to go with Rillifane Rallathil? I know I would take the Celerity Domain, the +10 movement should stack with a barbarians fast movement.

On a side note, could someone tell me when mods became available? I would like to judge a mod I played in at Gencon (Return to Storm Tower).

Thanks!
Dr.Cornelius
12-16-06, 05:49 AM Kord is also an excellent choice for Barbarian/Cleric:

Strength Domain (Feat of Strength 1/day)
Domain Spells:
1st: Enlarge Person (Natural Reach and extra damage)
2nd: Bull's Strength

Luck Domain (Re-roll 1/day)
Domain Spells:
2nd: Aid
3rd: Protection from Energy
4th: Freedom of Movement

The primary question is how many levels of cleric to take.
Suggested build:

Race: Human
Str: 16
Dex: 14
Con: 14
Int: 8
Wis: 14
Cha: 8

Race: Half Orc
Str: 18
Dex: 14
Con: 12
Int: 8
Wis: 14
Cha: 6

Lvl 1: Barbarian (Power Attack, Improved Initiative)
Lvl 2: Cleric
LvL 3: Cleric (Extra Rage)

You can go for more cleric levels by adding stat points at level 4 and 8 and buying a +2 or +4 Wisdom item to get the bonus spells.

Or you can settle for three levels of Cleric and continue with Fighter or move on to Pious Templar or Occult Slayer.
Mommy was an Orc
12-16-06, 08:51 AM Well I already have a fell fledged cleric (Fharlanghn), and being a wood elf makes it a little hard to multi class. The original plan was to go cleric3/barbarian4 and go with the Pious Templar.

You might want to check out Warpriest. It has a lot of nice qualities for a fullBAB PrC, including the ability to eventually do a 9th level spell in LG if you do the prereqs properly.

Pious Templar is definitely a powerhouse PrC though. I'd strongly advise splitting the Barbarian 4 into Barbarian 2/Fighter 2 - those extra two feats will really come in handy.
LGMoses
12-16-06, 06:06 PM [QUOTE=clik_ml;10198685]Only thing to look out for really is that as a divine caster of kelanen, you can't use bows. You'll be restricted to swords and crossbows. Sometimes it's nice for the barbarian to be able to pull out a bow and plink away at baddies and that's an option you'll miss out on.
[QUOTE]

NO. Barbarians shouldn't shoot bows! They should throw things. Get some spears and javelins and stuff. Nething you can throw would be nice.
Iswald
12-17-06, 01:45 AM NO. Barbarians shouldn't shoot bows! They should throw things. Get some spears and javelins and stuff. Nething you can throw would be nice.

As priests of Kelanen, they wouldn't be able to throw spears or javelins. They'd have to throw swords, daggers or, if they aren't going to shoot with them, crossbows.
clannagh
12-17-06, 05:25 PM As priests of Kelanen, they wouldn't be able to throw spears or javelins. They'd have to throw swords, daggers or, if they aren't going to shoot with them, crossbows.

With travel domain and barbarian strength .. just fly above the baddies whilst carrying large objects and drop them :)

BTW .. expect some table variation on what weapons count for kelanens war domain ability. Generally if a weapon has an exotic mode (like bastard swords) it may not be counted as having the weapon focus if used in that mode (single handed in the case of bastard swords). Furthermore I have seen some DM's rule that the focus counts for only a single weapon which the cleric has to choose when becoming a cleric rather than all weapons that qualify as kelanen.
clik_ml
12-17-06, 09:32 PM With travel domain and barbarian strength .. just fly above the baddies whilst carrying large objects and drop them.

BTW .. expect some table variation on what weapons count for kelanens war domain ability. Generally if a weapon has an exotic mode (like bastard swords) it may not be counted as having the weapon focus if used in that mode (single handed in the case of bastard swords).

Furthermore I have seen some DM's rule that the focus counts for only a single weapon which the cleric has to choose when becoming a cleric rather than all weapons that qualify as kelanen.

Those are rulings likely to be given often, I'd think- especially the second, since that is the only possible LG-legal ruling on favored weapons.

Bastard Swords are bizarre weapons which you become non-proficient with when wielded 1-handed (unless you have the exotic weapon proficiency, which the war domain cannot grant) and since weapon focus has a prerequisite of being proficient with the weapon, you lose that feat when wielding the weapon in an "exotic" fashion that you are not proficient with.

The only wiggle-room there is that those are bonus feats, which can disregard the rules for prerequisites (as weapon focus requires +1 BAB for example, but the cleric can get it anyway at level 1). So that's your source of table variation.

As for the other bit (multiple favored weapons), there should be absolutely no table variation since it is spelled out in the LG Deities document. The deities document for LG specifically says that if a deity has more than one favored weapon, you may choose only one to apply as a favored weapon for spells, feats or special prestige class bonuses. This means that you can't even do silly stuff like take the martial proficiency in one weapon and the weapon focus in another.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
lavyan 09-26-06, 07:40 PM	I want to multiclass my barbarian as a cleric and I'm looking at Kelanen. What are the acceptable alignments for a cleric of Kelanen? I think: LN CN NG NE I'm choosing Kelanen because his favored weapon 'any martial sword' and my Barbarian uses a falchion. Is there a better diety? Is thier any LG restrictions for using a herogod as a diety? Any and all suggestions and comments will be greatly appreciated. Thanks
kenobi65 09-26-06, 10:29 PM	I want to multiclass my barbarian as a cleric and I'm looking at Kelanen. What are the acceptable alignments for a cleric of Kelanen? I think: LN CN NG NE Or true Neutral, as well. NE, of course, isn't allowed for a PC, and LN isn't an option for you (unless you want to lose that Rage). I'm choosing Kelanen because his favored weapon 'any martial sword' and my Barbarian uses a falchion. Is there a better diety? Is thier any LG restrictions for using a herogod as a diety? Well, falchion is indeed listed as one of the weapons that Kelanen approves of. The only drawback to having him as a deity may be that he doesn't have an organized church in your region (i.e., other deities may have stronger metaorg representation). There's no particular downside to having a hero-god as your deity. (In fact, Kelanen is probably way over-represented by PC worshippers / clerics in LG.)
clik_ml 09-27-06, 12:35 AM	Only thing to look out for really is that as a divine caster of kelanen, you can't use bows. You'll be restricted to swords and crossbows. Sometimes it's nice for the barbarian to be able to pull out a bow and plink away at baddies and that's an option you'll miss out on. If the out of whack ratio of players worshipping kelanen keeps up, some regions might crack down more on the kelanites (I'm thinking veluna for one). I'm pretty sure the only reason why kelanen wasn't one of the religions banned in veluna was because it's a smaller following. So give them time :-)
Japangirl 09-29-06, 02:57 AM	Kelanen is better than Pelor or St. Cuthbert in the BK. Of course, better is a relative term . . . instead of a HUGE price on your head, you have a small one. And the pictures on wanted posters aren't terribly accurate yet.
Lupo 09-29-06, 03:11 AM	I want to multiclass my barbarian as a cleric and I'm looking at Kelanen. What are the acceptable alignments for a cleric of Kelanen? I think: LN CN NG NE I'm choosing Kelanen because his favored weapon 'any martial sword' and my Barbarian uses a falchion. Is there a better diety? Is thier any LG restrictions for using a herogod as a diety? Any and all suggestions and comments will be greatly appreciated. Thanks the only downside of kelanen is his limited choice of domains and the restriction to swords and crossbows. so followers of kelanen will never get an extra domain and you will face some critters, where your limit to slashing/piercing weapons will suck up some of your damage output in damage reduction. on the other hand you can get a build (barbarian, cleric, fighter, pious-templar) that is only one BAB behind a straight fighter but has some very usefull additional powers. one of the few cases where a combination of two similar (in this case divine casters) spellcasting classes makes sense. definitely worth it :) ciao martin m.
zoinks69 09-29-06, 03:49 AM	the only downside of kelanen is his limited choice of domains and the restriction to swords and crossbows. so followers of kelanen will never get an extra domain and you will face some critters, where your limit to slashing/piercing weapons will suck up some of your damage output in damage reduction. on the other hand you can get a build (barbarian, cleric, fighter, pious-templar) that is only one BAB behind a straight fighter but has some very usefull additional powers. one of the few cases where a combination of two similar (in this case divine casters) spellcasting classes makes sense. definitely worth it :) ciao martin m. Only having two domains is bad IF those domains are bad. War domain is fine. Travel domain is great. Have sword, will travel (what else can you ask for? If you are really desperate for domains, there are PrC's that grant specific domains or choices -- Warpriest, Seeker of the Misty Isle, etc) Not being able to use longbows stinks...IF you can't fly. And we got that covered if you take enough cleric levels :) I'll agree that DR/not slashing will hurt a little, but that's so few and far between. I'd also agree that a fightery type with a cleric level and some templar is pretty nice, though personally I'd stick out the full cleric progression. Maybe start with one barbarian and the rest cleric if you are feeling adventurous.
lavyan 09-30-06, 08:10 PM	Well I already have a fell fledged cleric (Fharlanghn), and being a wood elf makes it a little hard to multi class. The original plan was to go cleric3/barbarian4 and go with the Pious Templar. The problem there is the PT offers a few abilities with the dieties favored weapon, hence thinking about Kelanen? I have changed my mind now and the prestige class I may pursue is Bear Warrior, this 'opens' up my diety selection. I think I'm going to go with Rillifane Rallathil? I know I would take the Celerity Domain, the +10 movement should stack with a barbarians fast movement. On a side note, could someone tell me when mods became available? I would like to judge a mod I played in at Gencon (Return to Storm Tower). Thanks!
Dr.Cornelius 12-16-06, 05:49 AM	Kord is also an excellent choice for Barbarian/Cleric: Strength Domain (Feat of Strength 1/day) Domain Spells: 1st: Enlarge Person (Natural Reach and extra damage) 2nd: Bull's Strength Luck Domain (Re-roll 1/day) Domain Spells: 2nd: Aid 3rd: Protection from Energy 4th: Freedom of Movement The primary question is how many levels of cleric to take. Suggested build: Race: Human Str: 16 Dex: 14 Con: 14 Int: 8 Wis: 14 Cha: 8 Race: Half Orc Str: 18 Dex: 14 Con: 12 Int: 8 Wis: 14 Cha: 6 Lvl 1: Barbarian (Power Attack, Improved Initiative) Lvl 2: Cleric LvL 3: Cleric (Extra Rage) You can go for more cleric levels by adding stat points at level 4 and 8 and buying a +2 or +4 Wisdom item to get the bonus spells. Or you can settle for three levels of Cleric and continue with Fighter or move on to Pious Templar or Occult Slayer.
Mommy was an Orc 12-16-06, 08:51 AM	Well I already have a fell fledged cleric (Fharlanghn), and being a wood elf makes it a little hard to multi class. The original plan was to go cleric3/barbarian4 and go with the Pious Templar. You might want to check out Warpriest. It has a lot of nice qualities for a fullBAB PrC, including the ability to eventually do a 9th level spell in LG if you do the prereqs properly. Pious Templar is definitely a powerhouse PrC though. I'd strongly advise splitting the Barbarian 4 into Barbarian 2/Fighter 2 - those extra two feats will really come in handy.
LGMoses 12-16-06, 06:06 PM	[QUOTE=clik_ml;10198685]Only thing to look out for really is that as a divine caster of kelanen, you can't use bows. You'll be restricted to swords and crossbows. Sometimes it's nice for the barbarian to be able to pull out a bow and plink away at baddies and that's an option you'll miss out on. [QUOTE] NO. Barbarians shouldn't shoot bows! They should throw things. Get some spears and javelins and stuff. Nething you can throw would be nice.
Iswald 12-17-06, 01:45 AM	NO. Barbarians shouldn't shoot bows! They should throw things. Get some spears and javelins and stuff. Nething you can throw would be nice. As priests of Kelanen, they wouldn't be able to throw spears or javelins. They'd have to throw swords, daggers or, if they aren't going to shoot with them, crossbows.
clannagh 12-17-06, 05:25 PM	As priests of Kelanen, they wouldn't be able to throw spears or javelins. They'd have to throw swords, daggers or, if they aren't going to shoot with them, crossbows. With travel domain and barbarian strength .. just fly above the baddies whilst carrying large objects and drop them :) BTW .. expect some table variation on what weapons count for kelanens war domain ability. Generally if a weapon has an exotic mode (like bastard swords) it may not be counted as having the weapon focus if used in that mode (single handed in the case of bastard swords). Furthermore I have seen some DM's rule that the focus counts for only a single weapon which the cleric has to choose when becoming a cleric rather than all weapons that qualify as kelanen.
clik_ml 12-17-06, 09:32 PM	With travel domain and barbarian strength .. just fly above the baddies whilst carrying large objects and drop them. BTW .. expect some table variation on what weapons count for kelanens war domain ability. Generally if a weapon has an exotic mode (like bastard swords) it may not be counted as having the weapon focus if used in that mode (single handed in the case of bastard swords). Furthermore I have seen some DM's rule that the focus counts for only a single weapon which the cleric has to choose when becoming a cleric rather than all weapons that qualify as kelanen. Those are rulings likely to be given often, I'd think- especially the second, since that is the only possible LG-legal ruling on favored weapons. Bastard Swords are bizarre weapons which you become non-proficient with when wielded 1-handed (unless you have the exotic weapon proficiency, which the war domain cannot grant) and since weapon focus has a prerequisite of being proficient with the weapon, you lose that feat when wielding the weapon in an "exotic" fashion that you are not proficient with. The only wiggle-room there is that those are bonus feats, which can disregard the rules for prerequisites (as weapon focus requires +1 BAB for example, but the cleric can get it anyway at level 1). So that's your source of table variation. As for the other bit (multiple favored weapons), there should be absolutely no table variation since it is spelled out in the LG Deities document. The deities document for LG specifically says that if a deity has more than one favored weapon, you may choose only one to apply as a favored weapon for spells, feats or special prestige class bonuses. This means that you can't even do silly stuff like take the martial proficiency in one weapon and the weapon focus in another.