Best way to spend gold for low level wizard? [Archive] - Wizards Community

Best way to spend gold for low level wizard? [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
echoota
11-13-06, 12:17 PM To help me learn the game to a fuller extent for DM purposes I'm going to play a wizard strait through to 16. I'm quite content to mini-max this character to the limits as I go along and one of the first things I'm confronted with is how to spend my gold.

First my stats:

Grey Elf
Str 6 Dex 14 Con 12 Int 20 Wis 10 Cha 8

No speciality school (for learning purposes I want access to all spells)

Feat: Empower Spell (I'm investing in the future, so that when I can use the feat it will be available, plus it unlocks a lot of feats out of Complete Arcane right at 3rd level)

Starting spells:
Burning Hands
Color Spray
Enlarge Person
Grease
Mage Armor
Magic Missile
Magic Weapon
Sleep

I've played in a couple of mods already and right off I've gotten access to a pearl of power with an adventure frequency. Pretty cool, however I also notice that for the cost of that one pearl of power I could scribe 40 scrolls. The scrolls seem like the way to go, but might as well ask for those that know better.

How much should I be investing in buying scrolls to then write into my spellbook?

Are there other items at low level that I can afford which would be worthwhile to wizards to keep an eye out for?
Japangirl
11-13-06, 01:51 PM After you have a small (or large depending on the person) stockpile of useful scrolls, a few pearls of power are the way to go. Cloak or vest of resistance +1, headband of intellect +2 should probably your next purchases after that.

Oh, and 6 Str really hurts. The shadows are going to go after you anyways, and could kill you with one lucky hit. Are you sure you want to do that low of Str? You could easily shift 2 points from Dex or Wis to make up for that. An 8 Str is great for the whole shadow issue as well as carrying capacity.
KShaver
11-13-06, 02:59 PM I've played in a couple of mods already and right off I've gotten access to a pearl of power with an adventure frequency. Pretty cool, however I also notice that for the cost of that one pearl of power I could scribe 40 scrolls. The scrolls seem like the way to go, but might as well ask for those that know better.

Scrolls are a better investment if caster level isn't an issue or if its an unlikely utility spell you don't want to keep memorized. Spells like endure elements, magic weapon, and fairie fire often work best on scrolls.

The pearl of power is a better choice for those spells you need to cast over and over again, where caster level matters (most damage spells), or when the save DC matters. Spells that benefit greatly from a pearl of power are magic missile, burning hands, and color spray.

My opinion is dip into both categories. Make scrolls of situational spells that you just don't want to keep memorized, while also keeping a few pearls of power to boost your day to day nukage. Also note that scroll pricing for higher level spells jumps a little faster than pearl of power pricing, of course these price jumps include higher caster level and save DCs which is the scrolls biggest weakness.
Howie23
11-13-06, 03:23 PM Oh, and 6 Str really hurts. The shadows are going to go after you anyways, and could kill you with one lucky hit. Are you sure you want to do that low of Str? You could easily shift 2 points from Dex or Wis to make up for that. An 8 Str is great for the whole shadow issue as well as carrying capacity.

He already did go with Str6. His option isn't to shift points; his option is to start a different character.

David
solbergb
11-13-06, 03:36 PM Scrolls.

Spend your first 1000gp on L1 scrolls.

Add a smattering of L2 scrolls once you start playing APL4 games

When you have enough spell slots+consumables to cast a spell every round of 3 combats in a day, you can then start buying permanent items.
Lupo
11-13-06, 04:02 PM To help me learn the game to a fuller extent for DM purposes I'm going to play a wizard strait through to 16. I'm quite content to mini-max this character to the limits as I go along and one of the first things I'm confronted with is how to spend my gold.

First my stats:

Grey Elf
Str 6 Dex 14 Con 12 Int 20 Wis 10 Cha 8

No speciality school (for learning purposes I want access to all spells)

Feat: Empower Spell (I'm investing in the future, so that when I can use the feat it will be available, plus it unlocks a lot of feats out of Complete Arcane right at 3rd level)

Starting spells:
Burning Hands
Color Spray
Enlarge Person
Grease
Mage Armor
Magic Missile
Magic Weapon
Sleep

I've played in a couple of mods already and right off I've gotten access to a pearl of power with an adventure frequency. Pretty cool, however I also notice that for the cost of that one pearl of power I could scribe 40 scrolls. The scrolls seem like the way to go, but might as well ask for those that know better.

How much should I be investing in buying scrolls to then write into my spellbook?

Are there other items at low level that I can afford which would be worthwhile to wizards to keep an eye out for?

buy one scroll of every 1st level spell, scribe some scrolls of "magic missile", "magic weapon", "enlarge person", "grease" (i recommend around 3 of each), buy scrolls of any 2nd level spell you can imagine useful once and you can afford.

scribe scrolls at caster level 3 when usefull, like magic missile and metamagic feat enhanced spells, like a sculpted "burning hands" or "grease".

lately my level 3 wiz was unfortunate to be part of a four player table at APL 4. he went through a heap of scrolls, but we made it :).

ciao

martin m.

ps: with your low strength, buy a riding dog for getting your stuff along. later on make sure to have a floating disk :). and yes, go for "ectoplasmic armor" otherwise the shadows will start drooling at your name.
UMiskatonic
11-13-06, 04:32 PM Buy the first haversack you see, it's going to last longer than that dog will.

Grab scrolls or scribe a few SR=no spells as well, or the first creature with good SR is going to eat you for lunch.

Mithril buckler is a must-have as well. +1 AC, no ASF. Enchant it for fun and profit.

And you have the scribe scroll feat. Use it. You shouldn't have to buy too many scrolls, make them instead, especially at 1st level. Once you hit the 10th one, you're making money.

Buy 1, scribe it, make 10 more = 250 gold
Buy 10, cast them = 250
Sieylianna
11-13-06, 04:56 PM I've played in a couple of mods already and right off I've gotten access to a pearl of power with an adventure frequency. Pretty cool, however I also notice that for the cost of that one pearl of power I could scribe 40 scrolls. The scrolls seem like the way to go, but might as well ask for those that know better.

You don't need 40 scrolls. I wouldn't keep more than 2 of any individual scroll at a time. Scrolls are good for utility spells which don't have a saving throw. That pearl allows you to cast 1st level spells at your caster level, without paying extra. It can also be loaned to other party members.

You're not going to want to buy the pearl until at least 3rd, but it's a long term purchase. You're going to make some scrolls that you never use.

Ed
Lomiat
11-13-06, 06:22 PM Scribe (and buy) scrolls after each adventure until you reach 3rd level. You've had this advice repeated to you from each person posting to this board for a reason: it's sound advice. Scrolls allow a wizard who normally casts 3 spells a day (we're ignoring cantrips, here) to cast up to 3 spells per combat, possibly more.

The spells will never stop being useful, either, so long as you do one of the following things:
1) Get the rewards card: Right Scroll for the Job
or
2) Focus on buying the types of scrolls that don't require caster level or save DC (as was already mentioned): Endure Elements, Magic Weapon, Obscuring Mist, Enlarge Person, etc. (Some level and save-dependent spells still have good effects even when cast from a scroll: Grease can make someone flat-footed, Magic Missile can provide crunch-time damage, etc.)

By 3rd level, if you're truly concerned about what you should purchase, you'll pick up the Craft Wondrous Item feat. If you do, you'll never buy anything again; you'll craft everything. The only exceptions will be spells you scribe into your spellbook (until you can craft a Boccob's Blessed Book) and any Metamagic Rods you might pick up.
solbergb
11-13-06, 09:30 PM You don't need 40 scrolls. I wouldn't keep more than 2 of any individual scroll at a time.
Ed

At APL2, scrolls are damn near as good as anything in your head. Only once you reach level 3 and above do you realy start pulling away. Then the caster level dependent things really start to matter, even on otherwise no-save things like ray of enfeeble, magic missile and tenser disk, and duration starts to become significantly better on the hour/level stuff.

You need enough to contribute in 3 fights a day vs random opponents, combined with your "head slots".

How many scrolls it takes an individual depends on his style and mix. My sorceress (who had nothing but utility spells in her head till level 3) preferred a mix of one each of about 20 first level spells, plus four magic missile scrolls (and a tanglefoot bag, some alch fire and oil). At APL2, hitting for 2-5 damage on demand is worth a few scrolls. But not a "head slot" that can be used for a spell that has a saving throw and thus is much better in your brain than on a scroll.

When she hit level 3, she added about 3 level 2 spells (glitterdust always on the list, the others varied, but web, pyrotechnics) command undead and see invis have made it on at various times)
UMiskatonic
11-16-06, 12:19 PM The one thing I would add is that a wand of magic missiles is worth having.

Not for raw power, mind you, but because it's good against so many different things. Huge range, beats partial cover, shoots into grapples, affects incorporeal creatures, beats partial concealment, and is rarely defended against.

On the occasions that the bad guy has good SR or a shield spell, use SR=no spells, or hit that evil wizard with dispel magic, a reflex save, or fortitude save.

It's one of the only 1st level spells that you WILL cast 50 times, and is therefore worth it as a wand.

Also, wands don't provoke to use, so it's nice to have one in some circumstances, like the assassin vine in the 30' room.
solbergb
11-16-06, 01:57 PM My experiences with wands of magic missileL1 are that folks buy them and outgrow them before they use them up.

Or to put it another way. You play 7 modules from level 1 to level 3. After level 3, you won't use the wand.

7 modules = 21 battles maximum, and you won't have the wand till you've played two adventures. So 15 battles.

If you get the wand after your 2nd AR and do nothing but fire magic missile in every battle you *might* use up the wand before it's very suboptimal compared to other things you could be doing.

Which is why I like scrolls. I used magic missile about 15 times between my second AR and level 3. That translates to 375gp, or half the cost of a wand. Indeed, you have to actually use the spell > 30 times to make the wand "cheaper" than using scrolls.

If you do buy the wand, do it for the other reasons (doesn't provoke, can be drawn like a weapon once you have BAB+1, can be used in a grapple). If those reasons aren't worth a few hundred low level gp then just get enough scrolls to meet the needs of an adventure, buy extras at the beginning of two-rounders and when you hit level 3, you'll have more cash and fewer "leftover magic missile 1s" to sell off or use up.
_m_
11-16-06, 05:16 PM honestly, ur all wrong.

i spent my first 10k gold on a...

BOAT!!!

but seriously, early games really are fairly easy. if you dont want to spend much money... just dont. its pretty easy to get through without much gear if ur not seeing physical combat much.

one thing i WOULD recommend is a clw wand. everyone in our local area carries one, even though most of us cant use them.

ur much more likely to get healed if the cleric / druid / ranger / paladin gets to use YOUR wand charges instead of hers.
Mommy was an Orc
11-17-06, 10:52 AM My experiences with wands of magic missileL1 are that folks buy them and outgrow them before they use them up.

Which is why I like scrolls. I used magic missile about 15 times between my second AR and level 3. That translates to 375gp, or half the cost of a wand. Indeed, you have to actually use the spell > 30 times to make the wand "cheaper" than using scrolls.

That's not quite true. The point in time where a Wand of Magic Missles is cheaper than buying scrolls is when you've used up 22 charges. At that point, assuming you sell the Wand back, the cost per magic missle is less than 25. If you use 30 charges, the cost is actually only 20 per magic missle.

20 charge Wand is still worth 150 gold if you sell it, so you paid 600 gold to fire off 30 missles...
Alpha_Nerd
11-17-06, 11:21 AM What I'm doing for my wizard is levels 1-5 all of my gold has been either scribing scrolls or putting spells into my spellbook. I pretty much scribed 5 scrolls after every adventure, including level 1 magic missle scrolls. All of the scrolls I "outgrew" I just sold for half (what I paid) and just used up a minor amount of exp as my opportunity cost. At 5th, I picked up CWI and the first thing I made was 5 1st level pearls of power. Cost me 2500 gold and 200 exp, but I think they will be a good investment for a long time.
_m_
11-20-06, 04:51 PM What I'm doing for my wizard is levels 1-5 all of my gold has been either scribing scrolls or putting spells into my spellbook. I pretty much scribed 5 scrolls after every adventure, including level 1 magic missle scrolls. All of the scrolls I "outgrew" I just sold for half (what I paid) and just used up a minor amount of exp as my opportunity cost. At 5th, I picked up CWI and the first thing I made was 5 1st level pearls of power. Cost me 2500 gold and 200 exp, but I think they will be a good investment for a long time.

i spent my first 4k on a periapt of health. deffinately a worth while investment imo.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
echoota 11-13-06, 12:17 PM	To help me learn the game to a fuller extent for DM purposes I'm going to play a wizard strait through to 16. I'm quite content to mini-max this character to the limits as I go along and one of the first things I'm confronted with is how to spend my gold. First my stats: Grey Elf Str 6 Dex 14 Con 12 Int 20 Wis 10 Cha 8 No speciality school (for learning purposes I want access to all spells) Feat: Empower Spell (I'm investing in the future, so that when I can use the feat it will be available, plus it unlocks a lot of feats out of Complete Arcane right at 3rd level) Starting spells: Burning Hands Color Spray Enlarge Person Grease Mage Armor Magic Missile Magic Weapon Sleep I've played in a couple of mods already and right off I've gotten access to a pearl of power with an adventure frequency. Pretty cool, however I also notice that for the cost of that one pearl of power I could scribe 40 scrolls. The scrolls seem like the way to go, but might as well ask for those that know better. How much should I be investing in buying scrolls to then write into my spellbook? Are there other items at low level that I can afford which would be worthwhile to wizards to keep an eye out for?
Japangirl 11-13-06, 01:51 PM	After you have a small (or large depending on the person) stockpile of useful scrolls, a few pearls of power are the way to go. Cloak or vest of resistance +1, headband of intellect +2 should probably your next purchases after that. Oh, and 6 Str really hurts. The shadows are going to go after you anyways, and could kill you with one lucky hit. Are you sure you want to do that low of Str? You could easily shift 2 points from Dex or Wis to make up for that. An 8 Str is great for the whole shadow issue as well as carrying capacity.
KShaver 11-13-06, 02:59 PM	I've played in a couple of mods already and right off I've gotten access to a pearl of power with an adventure frequency. Pretty cool, however I also notice that for the cost of that one pearl of power I could scribe 40 scrolls. The scrolls seem like the way to go, but might as well ask for those that know better. Scrolls are a better investment if caster level isn't an issue or if its an unlikely utility spell you don't want to keep memorized. Spells like endure elements, magic weapon, and fairie fire often work best on scrolls. The pearl of power is a better choice for those spells you need to cast over and over again, where caster level matters (most damage spells), or when the save DC matters. Spells that benefit greatly from a pearl of power are magic missile, burning hands, and color spray. My opinion is dip into both categories. Make scrolls of situational spells that you just don't want to keep memorized, while also keeping a few pearls of power to boost your day to day nukage. Also note that scroll pricing for higher level spells jumps a little faster than pearl of power pricing, of course these price jumps include higher caster level and save DCs which is the scrolls biggest weakness.
Howie23 11-13-06, 03:23 PM	Oh, and 6 Str really hurts. The shadows are going to go after you anyways, and could kill you with one lucky hit. Are you sure you want to do that low of Str? You could easily shift 2 points from Dex or Wis to make up for that. An 8 Str is great for the whole shadow issue as well as carrying capacity. He already did go with Str6. His option isn't to shift points; his option is to start a different character. David
solbergb 11-13-06, 03:36 PM	Scrolls. Spend your first 1000gp on L1 scrolls. Add a smattering of L2 scrolls once you start playing APL4 games When you have enough spell slots+consumables to cast a spell every round of 3 combats in a day, you can then start buying permanent items.
Lupo 11-13-06, 04:02 PM	To help me learn the game to a fuller extent for DM purposes I'm going to play a wizard strait through to 16. I'm quite content to mini-max this character to the limits as I go along and one of the first things I'm confronted with is how to spend my gold. First my stats: Grey Elf Str 6 Dex 14 Con 12 Int 20 Wis 10 Cha 8 No speciality school (for learning purposes I want access to all spells) Feat: Empower Spell (I'm investing in the future, so that when I can use the feat it will be available, plus it unlocks a lot of feats out of Complete Arcane right at 3rd level) Starting spells: Burning Hands Color Spray Enlarge Person Grease Mage Armor Magic Missile Magic Weapon Sleep I've played in a couple of mods already and right off I've gotten access to a pearl of power with an adventure frequency. Pretty cool, however I also notice that for the cost of that one pearl of power I could scribe 40 scrolls. The scrolls seem like the way to go, but might as well ask for those that know better. How much should I be investing in buying scrolls to then write into my spellbook? Are there other items at low level that I can afford which would be worthwhile to wizards to keep an eye out for? buy one scroll of every 1st level spell, scribe some scrolls of "magic missile", "magic weapon", "enlarge person", "grease" (i recommend around 3 of each), buy scrolls of any 2nd level spell you can imagine useful once and you can afford. scribe scrolls at caster level 3 when usefull, like magic missile and metamagic feat enhanced spells, like a sculpted "burning hands" or "grease". lately my level 3 wiz was unfortunate to be part of a four player table at APL 4. he went through a heap of scrolls, but we made it :). ciao martin m. ps: with your low strength, buy a riding dog for getting your stuff along. later on make sure to have a floating disk :). and yes, go for "ectoplasmic armor" otherwise the shadows will start drooling at your name.
UMiskatonic 11-13-06, 04:32 PM	Buy the first haversack you see, it's going to last longer than that dog will. Grab scrolls or scribe a few SR=no spells as well, or the first creature with good SR is going to eat you for lunch. Mithril buckler is a must-have as well. +1 AC, no ASF. Enchant it for fun and profit. And you have the scribe scroll feat. Use it. You shouldn't have to buy too many scrolls, make them instead, especially at 1st level. Once you hit the 10th one, you're making money. Buy 1, scribe it, make 10 more = 250 gold Buy 10, cast them = 250
Sieylianna 11-13-06, 04:56 PM	I've played in a couple of mods already and right off I've gotten access to a pearl of power with an adventure frequency. Pretty cool, however I also notice that for the cost of that one pearl of power I could scribe 40 scrolls. The scrolls seem like the way to go, but might as well ask for those that know better. You don't need 40 scrolls. I wouldn't keep more than 2 of any individual scroll at a time. Scrolls are good for utility spells which don't have a saving throw. That pearl allows you to cast 1st level spells at your caster level, without paying extra. It can also be loaned to other party members. You're not going to want to buy the pearl until at least 3rd, but it's a long term purchase. You're going to make some scrolls that you never use. Ed
Lomiat 11-13-06, 06:22 PM	Scribe (and buy) scrolls after each adventure until you reach 3rd level. You've had this advice repeated to you from each person posting to this board for a reason: it's sound advice. Scrolls allow a wizard who normally casts 3 spells a day (we're ignoring cantrips, here) to cast up to 3 spells per combat, possibly more. The spells will never stop being useful, either, so long as you do one of the following things: 1) Get the rewards card: Right Scroll for the Job or 2) Focus on buying the types of scrolls that don't require caster level or save DC (as was already mentioned): Endure Elements, Magic Weapon, Obscuring Mist, Enlarge Person, etc. (Some level and save-dependent spells still have good effects even when cast from a scroll: Grease can make someone flat-footed, Magic Missile can provide crunch-time damage, etc.) By 3rd level, if you're truly concerned about what you should purchase, you'll pick up the Craft Wondrous Item feat. If you do, you'll never buy anything again; you'll craft everything. The only exceptions will be spells you scribe into your spellbook (until you can craft a Boccob's Blessed Book) and any Metamagic Rods you might pick up.
solbergb 11-13-06, 09:30 PM	You don't need 40 scrolls. I wouldn't keep more than 2 of any individual scroll at a time. Ed At APL2, scrolls are damn near as good as anything in your head. Only once you reach level 3 and above do you realy start pulling away. Then the caster level dependent things really start to matter, even on otherwise no-save things like ray of enfeeble, magic missile and tenser disk, and duration starts to become significantly better on the hour/level stuff. You need enough to contribute in 3 fights a day vs random opponents, combined with your "head slots". How many scrolls it takes an individual depends on his style and mix. My sorceress (who had nothing but utility spells in her head till level 3) preferred a mix of one each of about 20 first level spells, plus four magic missile scrolls (and a tanglefoot bag, some alch fire and oil). At APL2, hitting for 2-5 damage on demand is worth a few scrolls. But not a "head slot" that can be used for a spell that has a saving throw and thus is much better in your brain than on a scroll. When she hit level 3, she added about 3 level 2 spells (glitterdust always on the list, the others varied, but web, pyrotechnics) command undead and see invis have made it on at various times)
UMiskatonic 11-16-06, 12:19 PM	The one thing I would add is that a wand of magic missiles is worth having. Not for raw power, mind you, but because it's good against so many different things. Huge range, beats partial cover, shoots into grapples, affects incorporeal creatures, beats partial concealment, and is rarely defended against. On the occasions that the bad guy has good SR or a shield spell, use SR=no spells, or hit that evil wizard with dispel magic, a reflex save, or fortitude save. It's one of the only 1st level spells that you WILL cast 50 times, and is therefore worth it as a wand. Also, wands don't provoke to use, so it's nice to have one in some circumstances, like the assassin vine in the 30' room.
solbergb 11-16-06, 01:57 PM	My experiences with wands of magic missileL1 are that folks buy them and outgrow them before they use them up. Or to put it another way. You play 7 modules from level 1 to level 3. After level 3, you won't use the wand. 7 modules = 21 battles maximum, and you won't have the wand till you've played two adventures. So 15 battles. If you get the wand after your 2nd AR and do nothing but fire magic missile in every battle you might use up the wand before it's very suboptimal compared to other things you could be doing. Which is why I like scrolls. I used magic missile about 15 times between my second AR and level 3. That translates to 375gp, or half the cost of a wand. Indeed, you have to actually use the spell > 30 times to make the wand "cheaper" than using scrolls. If you do buy the wand, do it for the other reasons (doesn't provoke, can be drawn like a weapon once you have BAB+1, can be used in a grapple). If those reasons aren't worth a few hundred low level gp then just get enough scrolls to meet the needs of an adventure, buy extras at the beginning of two-rounders and when you hit level 3, you'll have more cash and fewer "leftover magic missile 1s" to sell off or use up.
_m_ 11-16-06, 05:16 PM	honestly, ur all wrong. i spent my first 10k gold on a... BOAT!!! but seriously, early games really are fairly easy. if you dont want to spend much money... just dont. its pretty easy to get through without much gear if ur not seeing physical combat much. one thing i WOULD recommend is a clw wand. everyone in our local area carries one, even though most of us cant use them. ur much more likely to get healed if the cleric / druid / ranger / paladin gets to use YOUR wand charges instead of hers.
Mommy was an Orc 11-17-06, 10:52 AM	My experiences with wands of magic missileL1 are that folks buy them and outgrow them before they use them up. Which is why I like scrolls. I used magic missile about 15 times between my second AR and level 3. That translates to 375gp, or half the cost of a wand. Indeed, you have to actually use the spell > 30 times to make the wand "cheaper" than using scrolls. That's not quite true. The point in time where a Wand of Magic Missles is cheaper than buying scrolls is when you've used up 22 charges. At that point, assuming you sell the Wand back, the cost per magic missle is less than 25. If you use 30 charges, the cost is actually only 20 per magic missle. 20 charge Wand is still worth 150 gold if you sell it, so you paid 600 gold to fire off 30 missles...
Alpha_Nerd 11-17-06, 11:21 AM	What I'm doing for my wizard is levels 1-5 all of my gold has been either scribing scrolls or putting spells into my spellbook. I pretty much scribed 5 scrolls after every adventure, including level 1 magic missle scrolls. All of the scrolls I "outgrew" I just sold for half (what I paid) and just used up a minor amount of exp as my opportunity cost. At 5th, I picked up CWI and the first thing I made was 5 1st level pearls of power. Cost me 2500 gold and 200 exp, but I think they will be a good investment for a long time.
_m_ 11-20-06, 04:51 PM	What I'm doing for my wizard is levels 1-5 all of my gold has been either scribing scrolls or putting spells into my spellbook. I pretty much scribed 5 scrolls after every adventure, including level 1 magic missle scrolls. All of the scrolls I "outgrew" I just sold for half (what I paid) and just used up a minor amount of exp as my opportunity cost. At 5th, I picked up CWI and the first thing I made was 5 1st level pearls of power. Cost me 2500 gold and 200 exp, but I think they will be a good investment for a long time. i spent my first 4k on a periapt of health. deffinately a worth while investment imo.