Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Banor 06-17-07, 07:57 PM	Basically this is the gnomish tank. Against anything that is larger than me, my AC is really high. The damage isnt too bad either especially at the higher levels where my sneak attack got some decent bumps. At lower level (1-5 ish) I'll be more like a secondary melee, helping for flanking and such. STR: 10 DEX 15 CON 16 INT 14 WIS 8 CHA 11 1.Swashbuckler 1 Weapon Finesse, Weapon Focus (rapier) 2.Swashbuckler 2 3.Swashbuckler 3 Combat Expertise 4.Swashbuckler 4 Stat Boost Dex 5.Swashbuckler 5 6.Blade Bravo 1 Dodge 7.Blade Bravo 2 8.Blade Bravo 3 Stat Boost INT Improved Critical (Rapier) 9.Blade Bravo 4 Titan Fighting 1d6 Melee sneak attack 10.Blade Bravo 5 11.Rogue 1 2d6 sneak 12.Blade Bravo 6 Stat Boost INT Daring Outlaw Improved Feint 4d6 sneak attack 13.Blade Bravo 7 14.Blade Bravo 8 5d6 sneak attack 15.Swashbuckler 6 Underfoot combat 6d6 sneak attack
Lupo 06-17-07, 09:02 PM	Basically this is the gnomish tank. Against anything that is larger than me, my AC is really high. The damage isnt too bad either especially at the higher levels where my sneak attack got some decent bumps. At lower level (1-5 ish) I'll be more like a secondary melee, helping for flanking and such. STR: 10 DEX 15 CON 16 INT 14 WIS 8 CHA 11 1.Swashbuckler 1 Weapon Finesse, Weapon Focus (rapier) 2.Swashbuckler 2 3.Swashbuckler 3 Combat Expertise 4.Swashbuckler 4 Stat Boost Dex 5.Swashbuckler 5 6.Blade Bravo 1 Dodge 7.Blade Bravo 2 8.Blade Bravo 3 Stat Boost INT Improved Critical (Rapier) 9.Blade Bravo 4 Titan Fighting 1d6 Melee sneak attack 10.Blade Bravo 5 11.Rogue 1 2d6 sneak 12.Blade Bravo 6 Stat Boost INT Daring Outlaw Improved Feint 4d6 sneak attack 13.Blade Bravo 7 14.Blade Bravo 8 5d6 sneak attack 15.Swashbuckler 6 Underfoot combat 6d6 sneak attack just out of curiosity :) and i am just to lazy to put all the pieces together ;) how IS the damage output of this build actually during his career? as i see some sneak damage (working approximately 50% of the time) in combination with a weapon with a high crit range - that does not get anything from the sneak dice :rolleyes: i am just curious, as i had a module yesterday where the frontlinerish types (our planned-to-take-a-seat frontliner hadn't shown up :weep: ) did around 14 hp damage against foes and there were some DR monsters. that made the module much harder than it should or could have been . . . . ciao martin m.
jstorrie 06-17-07, 09:07 PM	Your damage is awful, awful low. You're set up to use a rapier, which you can't two-hand, and you don't have shield proficiency, so your off-hand is basically doing nothing. The main problem is just that you're feat starved; if you had Fighter levels, you could get two-weapon fighting and proficiency with one of the elven weapons that is equivalent to the rapier. Consider: Gnome Str 14 Dex 14 Con 16 Int 14 Wis 8 Cha 8 1 Swashbuckler: Weapon Finesse, Two-Weapon Fighting 2 Fighter: 3 Fighter: Exotic Weapon Proficiency: Elven Lightblade, Weapon Focus: Rapier 4 Swashbuckler 5 Swashbuckler 6 Fighter: Combat Expertise 7 Fighter: Weapon Specialization (Rapier) 8 Blade Bravo 9 Blade Bravo: Melee Weapon Mastery 10 Blade Bravo: Dodge 11 Blade Bravo 12 Blade Bravo: Titan Fighting 13 Blade Bravo: Improved Two-Weapon Fighting 14 Blade Bravo 15 Blade Bravo: Daring Outlaw That's +6 damage per attack already (Strength, Weapon Spec, Weapon Mastery) plus the additional off-hand attacks. Boosting your Int is not wise–boost your Dex or Str. The +damage from Int doesn't apply to many foes.
Banor 06-17-07, 09:21 PM	DR might be my biggest problem you are right, will have to make sure that i can get hand on a special material to help on that. Telling blow might be an idea but right now i dont see where i could fit it. I found that sneak attack can be pretty reliable as long as the other melee with you know what he's doing (my regular gaming group play together for years, that should not be a problem). I'm much more of a tank than damage tho, with Goad (free from Blade Bravo 1, just need a +2 charisma cloak), If you are large (or larger) i can get to around 50 AC with Combat expertise on. Couple that with a flanker with me (you said rogue ?) and i can even dish some acceptable dammage while giving a very good protection to squishies. I also have a almost full baseattack (losing only 1 at 11) with no power attack, it should make my attack hit quite a bit, with my INT (fairly good esp after some items :) to my damage ill be around of 1d4+10 per swing, not too bad considering high crit chance (and power critical given for free on larger target than me) with flaming burst (or any other elemental equivalent) i can add some elemental damage to that.
Banor 06-17-07, 09:27 PM	Your damage is awful, awful low. You're set up to use a rapier, which you can't two-hand, and you don't have shield proficiency, so your off-hand is basically doing nothing. The main problem is just that you're feat starved; if you had Fighter levels, you could get two-weapon fighting and proficiency with one of the elven weapons that is equivalent to the rapier. Consider: Gnome Str 14 Dex 14 Con 16 Int 14 Wis 8 Cha 8 1 Swashbuckler: Weapon Finesse, Two-Weapon Fighting 2 Fighter: 3 Fighter: Exotic Weapon Proficiency: Elven Lightblade, Weapon Focus: Rapier 4 Swashbuckler 5 Swashbuckler 6 Fighter: Combat Expertise 7 Fighter: Weapon Specialization (Rapier) 8 Blade Bravo 9 Blade Bravo: Melee Weapon Mastery 10 Blade Bravo: Dodge 11 Blade Bravo 12 Blade Bravo: Titan Fighting 13 Blade Bravo: Improved Two-Weapon Fighting 14 Blade Bravo 15 Blade Bravo: Daring Outlaw That's +6 damage per attack already (Strength, Weapon Spec, Weapon Mastery) plus the additional off-hand attacks. Boosting your Int is not wise–boost your Dex or Str. The +damage from Int doesn't apply to many foes. Hum, havent seen it like this, that is a pretty good idea ill be looking for that. Biggest problem here is that ill be too low on Charisma to use goad (it doesnt state that you can use it without meeting the prerequisite), which help a lot to maximize Blade Bravo defensive skill.
dkay807 06-17-07, 11:01 PM	Hum, havent seen it like this, that is a pretty good idea ill be looking for that. Biggest problem here is that ill be too low on Charisma to use goad (it doesnt state that you can use it without meeting the prerequisite), which help a lot to maximize Blade Bravo defensive skill. I came up with a Blade Bravo build that's based off of Swashbuckler 3/Fighter 4 as well, however, he two-hands an Elven Thinblade, uses Power Attack and deals considerable damage with Melee Mastery and a high attack bonus.
jstorrie 06-17-07, 11:28 PM	Goad is pretty much crap. Look at the mechanics. When will you ever want to use a move action to attempt to distract a foe who threatens you? If you're close enough to be threatened, it'll likely already be attacking you and more importantly you'll likely be in position to full attack it. Whacking something for a significant full attack will almost always be much better for 'keeping aggro.' That being said, if a class gives you a specific bonus feat, you generally can ignore the feat's prerequisites. It's not written in anywhere, but if you remove that ability Rangers and Clerics break right off of the bat–and quite a few prestige classes (Pious Templars with Weapon Specialization but less than 4 Fighter levels, etc.) You don't need to have 13 Charisma to use Goad if you've picked it up through Blade Bravo. You also, really, don't need to use Goad. Just keep yourself positioned well on the battlefield. There's a Knight class feature and a Luck feat that both do what Goad does, but better. When you're supposed to be maintaining the front line, you can't afford to be wasting move actions on Will saves that your enemy would have a good chance of making even if you had 18 base Charisma and Ability Focus. Two-handing a thinblade, with Power Attack, is also a viable option as mentioned above. They both run out to about the same practical damage, since Weapon Spec/Mastery, Sneak Attack and Insightful Strike slightly favour two-weapon fighting. But really, your main focus here needs to be keeping your damage up. You're small, dextrous, with a high Constitution have Titan Fighting and a class ability that improves your AC; your defenses don't need work. As long as you keep dealing damage, you won't need to 'taunt'–and you won't be SOL when you run into mindless critters with DR that you can neither taunt nor hurt with low-damage attacks.
dkay807 06-18-07, 04:32 PM	You're small, dextrous, with a high Constitution have Titan Fighting and a class ability that improves your AC; your defenses don't need work. As long as you keep dealing damage, you won't need to 'taunt'–and you won't be SOL when you run into mindless critters with DR that you can neither taunt nor hurt with low-damage attacks Such a GREAT point. I see far too many people wasting character build resources on overdoing something that's already great and leaving other vital areas lacking. Then they wonder where they went wrong. I agree whole-heartedly with the above statement and will piggy-back by saying the following: Blade Bravos will never do incredible damage. It is very possible to deal formidable amounts of damage with the right build, the right items, etc. You are playing a Blade Bravo because it seems like fun, and you see the opportunity to have a GREAT armor class (as well as do some really cool stuff). Does your AC need to be unhittable? Absolutely not... you'll have very high HP as it is, and a hit every now and then won't hurt you much - as long as you are missed 80% of the time, you're fine - the rest is gravy. Also, from my experience as a player of a number of insane AC PCs, when the DM recognizes that he needs natural 20's to hit you, he will begin to ignore you, and you DON'T want that. You want to be able to deal enough damage to hold the monster's attention, and you want to give the monster at least a chance to hit you, or you'll lose the DM's attention.