Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Grantor 10-09-06, 01:04 PM	How do players deal with starting a character on one course and then, after unlocking some nice things on their ARs, change the plan for character development? In my case, I was headed toward an Enlightened Fist, but by the time I reached second level as monk, I realized I liked using Diplomacy (not a class skill for Sorcerers or Enlightened Fists). It's really intertesting to be an unarmed member of a noble house that walks through the streets in a stately manner, yet does not fear trouble on the street. That and the things I have unlocked with my first three adventures are suggesting that I move in a different direction. I wouldn't mind hitting more of the Charisma classes, but then I'm stuck with a Lawful alignment that limits my choices (no Bard) and few ways to get my Monk abilities to increase due to the limited Monk-based prestige classes (especially those with the class skill of Diplomacy). But, when you have started a class and feat/skill build that point in one direction, how do other players deal with changing their goals? What does a Monk do with Combat Casting at 1st if he changes his mind and chooses not to go for Sorcerer? This is my first RPGA character and I was not aware of how much the results of play could affect the future of your character's development. I suppose I could scrape him and start anew; it's only been four adventures, but then I could never unlock the items and favors I have access to through these same scenarios. What stories do you have about changing your character concept after several weeks/months of play?
Arvagor 10-09-06, 02:24 PM	What stories do you have about changing your character concept after several weeks/months of play? I have a roguish PC (my first LG PC, actually) who I originally envisioned as headed towards the ShadowDancer PrC. I can't say it ever quite fit in with the background I developed for him*, but it sounded cool. Once Complete Adventurer came out, I saw the Thief-Acrobat class and thought it was perfect for him (in that, to survive as a slave for 10 years, he had to have been quite nimble at escaping some punishments). He's been a worshipper of Olidammara and a member of what amounts to the local thieves' guild since almost the beginning of his adventuring career (2 years ago real time was when I started playing LG). But recent regional events (a crackdown on any person or group that doesn't uphold the ideals of the region's theocracy), combined with a very strong "disfavor" from the head of the thieves' guild, have led him to reconsider that position. Depending on how regional events turn out over the next few mods, he may either convert to Trithereon, and pick up a few cleric levels (to be a voice preaching against what he perceives as a building tyranny of the local Church), or even odder, go the other direction, and become a paladin of Azor'alq -- in brief, he recently gained the 'dark' template from Tome of Magic, ostensibly while fighting to prevent a terrible evil from entering Oerth. He has been befriended by a cleric of Azor'alq recently, and the Baklunish lands have always been kind to him, so the paladin direction would be kind of an attempt to counter his template ("the light of Azor'alq to counter the darkness of my soul", kind of thing :) ). (Interestingly enough, gaining the dark template actually almost brings him full circle, since the "benefits" of the template actually give him a lot of the capabilities of the first couple of ShadowDancer levels :) ) I am of the opinion that having a PC's levels planned out from 1st all the way through retirement is all well and good, but don't be so beholden to that path that you are not willing to let the events of Oerth and your PC's experiences change him as he progresses... * Was born in Onnwal; around age 4-5, family kidnapped by raiders, and they were sold into slavery in the Pomarj. After many years, was "rescued" by a questing paladin from Veluna, and his mother felt enough gratitude toward the action that she followed the paladin back to Veluna (my home region) and brought what was left of the family with her (himself and his brother). Although he was freed from slavery, he chafed at the overly restrictive (i.e., Lawful Good) nature of the country, and became somewhat of a troublemaker, which led into his adventuring life as a rogue.
Reylance 10-09-06, 04:25 PM	I'd say you don't need to change your character's focus to get good at Diplomacy. If you make your fourth and fifth levels Paladin, you can pump those skill points into Diplomacy as a class skill. Then again, if you're built like most Enlightened Fists, you have an Int of 8, making getting into the prestige class hard enough, and this suggestion won't help much. You could choose to go Ascetic Knight with most levels in Paladin. Eventually, you might actually need to cast in combat, and Combat Casting will eventually be useful.
Grantor 10-09-06, 05:35 PM	If you make your fourth and fifth levels Paladin... Hmm...perhaps I should have mentioned that this monk is Lawful Neutral...
Mommy was an Orc 10-09-06, 06:44 PM	Hmm...perhaps I should have mentioned that this monk is Lawful Neutral... Try Hexblade instead
Japangirl 10-09-06, 07:00 PM	Well, you could realize that the good aspects of the country you left were actually beneficial, and repent of your wicked ways (fluff reasons to alter your alignment :) ). I know my rogue has always sort of distrusted spell casters, except for the cool buffs they cast, but now I'm taking a level of sorceror. One of my ARs gave me no choice in the matter. You just kind of incorporate the AR unlocks and twists into a character about as well as most people incorporate their life experiences into their lives and careers. Some people go through things and stay very much the same, others drastically alter their lives and careers. Up to you what you want your monk to do.
beyowulf 10-09-06, 07:00 PM	Hmm...perhaps I should have mentioned that this monk is Lawful Neutral... Someone correct me if I am wrong, but there's nothing wrong with changing your alignment if you're so inclined.
copper_wyrmling 10-09-06, 07:40 PM	Well, you asked for our stories, although I don't think this one will help you much. My sorcerer's character concept has shifted quite noticeably over the years, but I was lucky enough to have the 595 conversion come along at an opportune moment. She started out as the descendant of a copper dragon who'd ended up being fostered by gnomes (long backstory). Both of those traits led to a liking for practical jokes and a silver tongue, so she started with max ranks in Bluff and a snake familiar. The gnomish background gave her illusion spells, the dragon heritage meant that I tried to focus on acid damage, and she liked being underground. Then at level two, she encountered a wild magic field. Being a Wisdom-8 and insatiably curious sorcerer, she decided to relinquish all her saving throws against the field. The GM proceeded to roll six or seven entirely beneficial results - she finished that combat enlarged and invisible, with the ability to walk on walls and a breath weapon, and when she was just about to leave the room, the field healed her of all the damage she'd taken. A few modules later, she played a game where she had a dream warning her of an evil spirit menacing her. In the next two or three modules after that, she picked up two more certed dream sequences (and she was the only PC who got them). Net result: her view of magic shifted towards, "Magic is a conscious force that pervades the universe, and it LIKES me, and it communicates with me through my dreams." Then Complete Arcane came out, containing both the Draconic Heritage feats and the Wild Mage prestige class. Before her encounter with wild magic, I would've gone straight for the Draconic Heritage feats, but Wild Mage was a higher priority, so at conversion, I rebuilt for that PrC and asked for a special mission for access. She lost all her Bluff ranks (and the Polymorph Any Object on her rat that was making it look like a snake got dispelled ;) ) and became much more interested in tinkering with magical items and alien realms (items imbued with magical force like her as well). Also, because I'd discovered that I liked playing a talkative high-Charisma character, I started looking for items and spells that would boost her Charisma skills: flavor-wise, the Universe as a whole likes her, there's no reason for that not to extend to its inhabitants ;) More recently, she's developed an affinity for necromancy and mental magic, because the dreams have been allowing her to communicate with other sorcerers and long-dead spirits. I would take a Mindbender level if not for prohibitive skill and alignment requirements - so I guess that's a point, sometimes a particular ability is just not realistically achievable without wrecking what you've got. Also, she's made friends with a couple of ancient dark artifacts (she has very little sense of self-preservation when it comes to magic items or strange magical effects, because hey, The Magic Likes Her), and as a result is currently sunlight-averse and can absorb power from necromantic spells. Oh yes - she's still rather obsessed with dragons, since she thinks that the reason the powers of magic recognise her is her innately magical draconic bloodlines. Thanks to certain events in modules, she's now pretty sure she's a cross between red, copper and silver dragonkin: there may be more in the pipeline ;) She's a bit of a magnet for weird AR items. This actually gives me a good reason not to take Draconic Heritage feats: each of them represent a dominant draconic heritage, and you can only take *one*. So, at the end of all that... I would actually contemplate trying to stick with your original build, and seeing if you can incorporate your new access. If you just want to be good at Diplomacy, it's quite possible to be a reasonable party face (good enough that you can negotiate past most LG situations that are meant to be negotiated, not good enough to stop combats) with just Charisma, items (circlet of persuasion / sceptre of obedience / choker of eloquence), and the Friendly Face spell (Races of Destiny, +5 circumstance bonus to Diplomacy and Gather Information). If you can afford five ranks in Bluff, the synergy bonus helps as well. The marshal class might also be useful, but it would mean another BAB hit. Also, if you've only played three adventures, the access will even out. If you're playing a fighter-type and you've found nothing but spellbooks, don't despair: the weapons and armour will follow before long. Usually, you'll get most of the items you really need, and some that are just cool.
clik_ml 10-09-06, 08:28 PM	Someone correct me if I am wrong, but there's nothing wrong with changing your alignment if you're so inclined. You're quite right. In fact it is required for the use of some feats. Example feat: Devoted Performer, which requires you be a bard/paladin before taking it (which requires an alignment shift one way or the other... tis easier to start as bard tho). That's especially pertinent to this topic since my half-elf bard was originally going to be a bard/barbarian/wildrunner who wanted to earn the respect of his elven family, but early on he became enamoured with lawful goodness and he's now a 4 bard/2 paladin. This means I have a totally wasted feat (endurance) and some other wastes which will probably haunt me forever since I don't expect to ever get a conversion to "fix" him, but hey, I enjoy playing him much more now. [edit: one more bit] That same character was going to be using a two-handed sword like his big sister (whom he adventures with), but I was motivated to change weapons when I found access to a neat unique weapon which could function as a longsword or whip dagger (like the villain's sword in the movie Brotherhood of the Wolf).... but that access got errata'd out of the mod to my dismay. That's another character change that could/would have happened. I don't know if that weapon was written/created by the mod author and then removed, or if it is from one of the books... I haven't seen it in any book :-(
timerino 10-10-06, 05:49 PM	I had a Bard/Druid (one gnome band with his dog) happily making way to Geomancer when Races of the Wild came along. Then, with conversion, he fell on the side of the road and forgot how that trumpet worked, but fireballs came out instead. Now, he's an arcane heirophant. Not quite your story ... but maybe this one's better. Asherati WarMage/Scout (they're very similar: artillery in arrows or magic) who came into some star metal: lots of star metal. So, this PC will go for star metal adept ... sure, the attributes won't be optimized, but I'm working on a story of how this would make sense. Maybe the Asherati thinks she's having 'star metal' arthritis. tim
trollbill 10-10-06, 11:06 PM	Well, I know you have Charisma and since you are a Monk, you mostly likely have some Wisdom, as well. So you could go Cleric/Favored Soul to Sacred Fist instead of Sorcerer to Enlightened fist. This would at least give you access to Diplomacy and Sense Motive (5 ranks gets you a +2 synergy bonus on Diplomacy) till you are 6th-level. And you won't waste the Combat Casting as it is a prereq for Sacred Fist also. One other option might be a level of Marshal somewhere in the build. I know what you mean about enjoying the Diplomacy, though. One party position they don't openly list in LG is "Party Face," but it is just as vital as any of the others. Bluff, Diplomacy, Sense Motive and even Disguise can get you out of some tight spots combat skills would never succeed at. In fact, I've seen more mods go south due to lack of Charisma skills than lack of combat skills. More than once I have seen lunkheaded players do something wrong or say something wrong at the worst possible time and the only way to avoid ending the mod right there is to have someone with Charisma skills to talk their way out of it.
Grantor 10-10-06, 11:56 PM	One other option might be a level of Marshal somewhere in the build. That seems to be the solution that keeps as close as possible to my character concept (and to the way I have started playing him once the ARs started accrueing). If I follow this new plan, I'll recover my diplomatic skills after a level of sorcerer, and the major aura of +1 melee will counter my -1 BAB hit while also bolstering the party. Plus, it's rather noble to be a Marshal. 1 Human Monk 1: Negotiator, Combat Casting (Improved Unarmed, Stunning Fist) 2 Monk 2: (Deflect Arrows) 3 Sorcerer 1: Practiced Spellcaster 4 Sorcerer 2: +1 cha (15 Cha) [needed for class skills to qualify] 5 Marshal 1: (Skill Focus-Diplomacy, Motivate Dexterity aura) [and return Diplomacy Sense Motive to max ranks] 6 Marshal 2: (Motivate Attack aura) any feat 7+ Enlightened Fist 1 through 9: more stuff This also feels better for the AR access and favors that I have received. (Especially the merchant ship...) I wonder if the real problem here was locking my build in at first level. Yes, it's very effcient, but it sure doesn't plan for boons, curses, opportunites and other changes along the way. I'd still like to hear more stories about experienced players jumping horse at mid-race. Thanks!
copper_wyrmling 10-11-06, 12:11 AM	That seems to be the solution that keeps as close as possible to my character concept (and to the way I have started playing him once the ARs started accrueing). I know I said this before, but if you can fit Friendly Face into your sorcerer spell selection, a +5 circumstance bonus to Diplomacy and Gather Information that stacks with everything does help you act as the party face with not very many ranks. I agree with trollbill about the importance of having someone with Charisma skills - although I would add Gather Information to the list. Usually spells supercede skills pretty quickly for casters, but the way a lot of LG mods work, Gather Info is superior to divinations - with divinations you have to have enough information to know where to look, with Gather Info you just wander around on the street asking all the questions you want, and if you roll high enough the GM tells you the answers ;) My sorcerer recently learned Friendly Face and bought a Circlet of Persuasion. If she pays for luxury lifestyle and the bonus applies, she has +18 Diplomacy and Gather Information, +20 if in Hardby, +22 in Greyhawk. Sure, those aren't amazing numbers - you can beat them at L1 if you've got the right build - but it doesn't really detract from her main abilities at all, and those are all *untrained* skills (with no synergy bonuses): she didn't need to pay any skill ranks or feats to get to that level. (It's just fun to be able to roll the dice, smile happily and say, "Gather Information check of 40. Untrained." Then your party members chime in with, "Did you count our five successful assists?" "Oh, all right. 50, untrained." ;) )
trollbill 10-11-06, 12:27 PM	If I follow this new plan, I'll recover my diplomatic skills after a level of sorcerer, and the major aura of +1 melee will counter my -1 BAB hit while also bolstering the party. Plus, it's rather noble to be a Marshal.This also feels better for the AR access and favors that I have received. (Especially the merchant ship...) Dodn't forget that Sorcerer has Bluff as a class skill. So while you can't add ranks to Diplomacy cheaply while a Sorcerer, you can add a +2 synergy bonus to Diplomacy (and Disguise, and Sleight of Hand, and Intimidate) by getting 5 ranks in Bluff. Also, the Marshal offers you the chance to get 5 ranks in Knowledge (Heraldry) for another +2 Synergy bonus. So at level 6 you would have a +20 Diplomacy (9 ranks, +3 skill focus, +2 from 5 ranks in sense motive, +2 from 5 ranks in bluff, +2 from 5 ranks in knowledge - heraldy and +2 from charisma) check before magic. I wonder if the real problem here was locking my build in at first level. Yes, it's very effcient, but it sure doesn't plan for boons, curses, opportunites and other changes along the way. I never expect a build to go exactly as I planned it from the outset. Your character isn't the only one to gain experience as you play mods with him. Sometimes things don't work quite like you thought they would, or a cool opportunity opens up you weren't expecting. And since my characters are seldom fully developed personality-wise before their first adventure, I may decide that a certain build path no longer suits the character. Even if I mostly follow the plan, I still expect some minor changes.
Prochytes 10-19-06, 08:58 AM	[Since stories were requested, this is "how my main PC got where she is". Apologies in advance for length and self-indulgence. The most relevant stuff to other people is in the first two paragraphs, so you can just skip the rest.] My sorcerer has undergone a couple of developments in concept since Year Two. I originally knew that I wanted to play a bookish sorcerer. I then refined this into the notion of a character who would have desperately liked to be a wizard – the intellectual, disciplined, and controlled way of doing arcane magic – but whose gifts stem rather from the careless power of her bloodline. To make things worse, her Gift does not originally stem from draconic ancestry, but from the fact that one of her ancestors was a man who was caught in the Rain of Colourless Fire and did not die. Her magic owes its very existence to an arcane weapon of mass destruction. Like copper_wyrmling, I was fortunate in that rebuilds came along at a couple of crucial moments. I was therefore able to reassign some important Feats and class levels. Also, the prestige classes I decided to add last needed skills, not Feats, and her INT is so high that this was not too much of a problem. What is interesting is how plot advancements in the game world have made the developments in her character psychologically plausible. She was in Tenh when the Ether Threat began – and had to stand and watch helplessly while the Ethers casually butchered its inhabitants as if the Prime was their playpen and thousands of years of civilization did not matter. That event drove her obsessively to study Outsiders, their strengths and their weaknesses, so as to defend her world against similar planar incursions in future. Moreover, the conclusion to the Ether Threat series strengthened her already powerful conviction that any problem can be solved if you throw a big enough book at it. It was thus all but inevitable that she ultimately became an arcane Sacred Exorcist of Delleb, the Librarian God, as this was a nice working equivalent to a Buffy-style Watcher. As far as her ambiguous relationship with the forces that empower her was concerned, she spent a long time haunted by the notion that she was a grotesque freak with nine pints of liquid genocide pumping through her veins whose search for power to do good would only end up turning her into a monster. Again, plot developments had a part to play. An NPC paladin asked her to carry a curse for him because he was afraid that it would be transmitted to his son and “well, someone like you wouldn’t want to take the risk of bearing a child anyway, would she?” She then discovered that she could in fact release the Colourless Fire in destructive blasts (acid-substituted fire spells, in terms of game mechanics) – and got to see her much carnage she could inflict if she became angry. Her lowest point came when she ventured into the Bright Desert and seemingly lost control of her mind to the forces that held sway there. She then discovered that Killdeer, the town of her birth, is within spitting distance of a focal point for similar phenomena. It seemed not unreasonable to assume that the reason her sorcerer’s Gift is so much stronger than it has been in her family for generations is that she grew up on Onnwal’s equivalent of the Hellmouth – and that the forces behind the Dreaming have been shaping her destiny ever since she was born [this is something of a retcon, of course, since I had no idea that Killdeer had any such significance when I decided that she came from there]. It looked as though her nightmare of becoming a slave to magic beyond her control was coming true. In the course of the last year, other plot developments have left her somewhat more serene and settled. Her relationship to the Dreaming has changed. She now has some measure of control over it, which I have also represented by giving her spells with the shadow descriptor, and she no longer believes it to be inherently evil. She has met other sorcerers, including copper_wyrmling’s wild mage, and is a little more content with what she is. “Proper wizards” back in Onnwal have given her the academic validation she craves by admitting her to the Academy of Delleb and the Onnwal spellpool, which she had previously helped to retrieve from Scant. Moreover, she has been to Tovag Baragu, where the magic that infuses her bloodline was born, and has understood that it does not have to be destructive. Indeed, Tovag’s link to seemingly infinite “else-Oerths” has granted her a limited control over probability (Fatespinner levels). She still angsts about what she is, but she recognizes her possibilities. If I take her into the high level campaign, I intend to represent the consequences of routinely mainlining vast amounts of arcane power by upping her CHA but slightly diminishing her DEX and WIS, to represent the physical and mental toll that harnessing so much power entails. Apart from that, she is likely to go into the high-level campaign pretty much as she is.
_m_ 10-19-06, 07:16 PM	Dont be surprised if your character levels out of your control. My character was going for fatespinner, but ended up like so. 5 wizzard 2 geometer 1 warshaper lost the warshaper 1 shadow template (+1 lvl adjustment) 2 shadow caster - 1 wizard so whist i was intending to have 6 wizzard 3 fatespinner at lvl 9 i ended up with 4 wizzard 2 geometer 2 shadowcaster 1 dark template the trick is, dont be upset if your character dosent go where you want it to. Its fine to have a plan and all, but... just enjoy where your games take you.
paigeoliver 10-19-06, 11:37 PM	The only AR unlock that ever really changed my character was getting access to a 1000 GP light adamantine weapon at 1st level. I looked over the light weapons, picked throwing axe because of its dual function, and then turned into an axe thrower after that. I did totally change the direction of my Calvalry Marshall after dying and getting reincarnated as a half-orc. Out went the entire build and in comes the full Outcast Champion prestige class.
Puggle Halfwine 10-21-06, 07:19 AM	Although it's not technically an AR unlock, due to a recent string of modules involving Pholtans in the Nyrond Metaregion Vashan Von Sanguine (my cleric of Dalt) met some emphatic Pholtans today and, after a lengthy debate, atoned to Pholtus. This *completely* changes my build since, right after I converted, someone pointed out I could become a Radient Cheeseweasel and I (coincidently) met the prerequisites since I have Extra Turning to power Divine Metamagic (Quicken) and I picked the Sun domain, although I'm going to have to dump ALL my skill points for the next two levels into Knowledge <Religion> to JUST barely meet that prerequisite. It's possible, however... just. To be honest, however, there were both in character and out of character reasons for doing that. The primary one is that Dalt has no flavour text associated with it, whereas Pholtus has a whole region dedicated to his worship. Lots of meaty roleplaying hooks.
Iswald 10-22-06, 01:52 AM	Dalt has no flavor text in the campaign? 'Cause there's a paragraph in the deities doc about how his followers lock or unlock stuff.
Puggle Halfwine 10-22-06, 02:58 AM	Dalt has no flavor text in the campaign? 'Cause there's a paragraph in the deities doc about how his followers lock or unlock stuff. True, I just ment that he never appears in the campaign at all. Ever. Plus he's one of the deities that, at every table I play at, I say; "I'm a cleric of Dalt." And players who havn't played with me before say, "Who?" At least Pholtus gets a reaction; even if it's a negative one. ;)
Japangirl 10-23-06, 04:22 PM	I can't wait to see how the clerics who converted to Molaho Khem get greeted . . .
Cynric 10-24-06, 12:14 AM	Although it's not technically an AR unlock, due to a recent string of modules involving Pholtans in the Nyrond Metaregion Vashan Von Sanguine (my cleric of Dalt) met some emphatic Pholtans today and, after a lengthy debate, atoned to Pholtus. Veshan worships PHOLTUS now? :eek: How is he going to explain this to Princess? :confused: And what about their nights of debauchery?:weep:
_m_ 10-24-06, 12:21 AM	cynric... i met someone called cynric... i have this itching feeling that srdu has introduced me to a few people i really shudnt party with (including a female half orc who... well, (s)he just wasnt very female...) ... for the sake of the sanity of the dm.
Cynric 10-24-06, 12:32 AM	Cynric the druid is mine. If you think Hanae is bad, wait till you get Hanae, Veshan and Princess on one table, Hanae is the most genteel and ladylike of the lot.
_m_ 10-24-06, 12:53 AM	d'ye nat remember a li'l leprachaun feller runnin' around getin' hit by yer axe darlin? i think hanae and alvin together were bad enough.
Cynric 10-24-06, 06:00 AM	All I will say is Come to Canberra for a con and play with our Bright Sands character, some real weird ones out there.
ezreal2001 10-24-06, 07:11 PM	Although it's not technically an AR unlock, due to a recent string of modules involving Pholtans in the Nyrond Metaregion Vashan Von Sanguine (my cleric of Dalt) met some emphatic Pholtans today and, after a lengthy debate, atoned to Pholtus. So tell me what does Pholtus think of those who snog Incubi?
Puggle Halfwine 10-25-06, 01:07 AM	So tell me what does Pholtus think of those who snog Incubi? Veshan worships PHOLTUS now? :eek: How is he going to explain this to Princess? :confused: And what about their nights of debauchery?:weep: All I can say is, Vashan burned his last stockpile of Krukelwurst in the holy fires of the church of The Blinding Light and is giving up all his sinful ways! ... or is he...? (I have a plan in place if people want to try and convert him back... ;D)
ezreal2001 10-25-06, 02:11 AM	All I can say is, Vashan burned his last stockpile of Krukelwurst in the holy fires of the church of The Blinding Light and is giving up all his sinful ways! ... or is he...? (I have a plan in place if people want to try and convert him back... ;D) Mmmm... Krukelwurst tastes just like chicken:)
Lupo 10-25-06, 03:22 AM	All I can say is, Vashan burned his last stockpile of Krukelwurst in the holy fires of the church of The Blinding Light and is giving up all his sinful ways! ... or is he...? (I have a plan in place if people want to try and convert him back... ;D) the plan should really be good, all the pholtians my characters have met hadn't even the term "converted AWAY from the one true path", it always came out as "on the pile with the heretic" :rolleyes:. ok, "on the pile" made up a good part of ANY pholtian part of ANY conversation with my characters :D. ciao martin m.
Cynric 10-25-06, 10:43 PM	All I can say is, Vashan burned his last stockpile of Krukelwurst in the holy fires of the church of The Blinding Light and is giving up all his sinful ways! ... or is he...? (I have a plan in place if people want to try and convert him back... ;D) How is drinking and spreading happiness sinful?
_m_ 10-25-06, 10:47 PM	depends... how much drinking... and exactly what manner is the happiness spreading occouring...
Puggle Halfwine 10-26-06, 12:48 AM	Vashan spreads the word of Pholtus... with the power of LOVE.
_m_ 10-26-06, 12:51 AM	Personally, i think you're crazy. Zaggy is deffinately the most lovingest god. (yes, i too see the irony).