Druid Questions [Archive] - Wizards Community

Druid Questions [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
rockondon
07-15-07, 02:55 AM Some questions:

1) is it legal to hear the blurb of a module then decide what animal companion you'll have for that module? In other words - water adventure = water type companion, typical adventure = dire bat or something. Also, see question 2.

2) The PH states that "if the campaign takes place wholly or partly in an aquatic environment, the following creatures are also available: crocodile...etc." implying that a lvl 1 druid can have a croc in a water adventure, yet it also shows that a crocodile is a 'level - 3' companion, implying that it isn't available until at least 4th level. How does this work?

3) Can you and your companion share a spell then do your move actions simultaneously, thereby maintaining proximity so you can keep those spells (eg. barkskin)? (I'm 99% sure the answer is NO but just wanna make sure)

4) Is there any benefit for picking a deity for druid?

5) I have a lvl 5 elf druid that gained access to elf wizard substitution levels from RotW. I've never taken a prestige class before so I expect I did mistakes, but this is my plan:

Character level (in parentheses)
(5) druid 5
(6) druid 6 (wizard sub lvl 1)
(7) druid 6, wizard 2 (taking one true level in wizard)
(8) druid 7, wizard 3 (taking a second wiz sub lvl)
(9) druid 7, wizard 3, arcane heirophant 1 (feat: rapid spell)
(10) druid 7, wizard 3, arcane heirophant 2
(11) druid 7, wizard 3, arcane heirophant 3
(12) druid 7, wizard 3, arcane heirophant 3, Beastmaster 1 (feat: skill handle animal)
(13) druid 7, wizard 3, arcane heirophant 4, Beastmaster 1
(14) druid 7, wizard 3, arcane heirophant 5, Beastmaster 1
(15) druid 7, wizard 3, arcane heirophant 6, Beastmaster 1
so by my calculations, at lvl 15 the animal companion should be equivalent to that of a lvl 17 druid, I cast as a lvl 13 druid and a lvl 9 wizard.

So....does that work or no?
Also, is this a decent build? I want him as strong as possible.

thx for any help.
--Don
Lupo
07-15-07, 09:05 AM Some questions:

1) is it legal to hear the blurb of a module then decide what animal companion you'll have for that module? In other words - water adventure = water type companion, typical adventure = dire bat or something. Also, see question 2.

yes, totally legal, you can even read the blurb in advance and prepare your animal companion and your summon monster stats.

2) The PH states that "if the campaign takes place wholly or partly in an aquatic environment, the following creatures are also available: crocodile...etc." implying that a lvl 1 druid can have a croc in a water adventure, yet it also shows that a crocodile is a 'level - 3' companion, implying that it isn't available until at least 4th level. How does this work?

until you find a region or an AR that grants your druid the croc at first level you can only take it at fourth level and above - and anywhere else but in water crocs are sub par animal companions.

3) Can you and your companion share a spell then do your move actions simultaneously, thereby maintaining proximity so you can keep those spells (eg. barkskin)? (I'm 99% sure the answer is NO but just wanna make sure)

normally most DMs assume that a druid and the animal companion share the same initiative and can act simultaneously - otherwise the whole "stay within 5-ft" would be pathetic - but make sure to ask your DM in advance, same few allocate individual initiatives and split druid and animal companion. riding an animal companion solves this issue most of the time.

4) Is there any benefit for picking a deity for druid?

apart from the possibility to take levels in some divine prestige classes none, and none of the existing divine prestige classes offers anything that would make a sane druid switch classes.

a deity may also offer access to certain meta organizations - e.g. the church of ehlonna/ehlenestra in Innspa offers access to "ehlonna's way"

5) I have a lvl 5 elf druid that gained access to elf wizard substitution levels from RotW. I've never taken a prestige class before so I expect I did mistakes, but this is my plan:

Character level (in parentheses)
(5) druid 5
(6) druid 6 (wizard sub lvl 1)
(7) druid 6, wizard 2 (taking one true level in wizard)
(8) druid 7, wizard 3 (taking a second wiz sub lvl)
(9) druid 7, wizard 3, arcane heirophant 1 (feat: rapid spell)
(10) druid 7, wizard 3, arcane heirophant 2
(11) druid 7, wizard 3, arcane heirophant 3
(12) druid 7, wizard 3, arcane heirophant 3, Beastmaster 1 (feat: skill handle animal)
(13) druid 7, wizard 3, arcane heirophant 4, Beastmaster 1
(14) druid 7, wizard 3, arcane heirophant 5, Beastmaster 1
(15) druid 7, wizard 3, arcane heirophant 6, Beastmaster 1
so by my calculations, at lvl 15 the animal companion should be equivalent to that of a lvl 17 druid, I cast as a lvl 13 druid and a lvl 9 wizard.

So....does that work or no?
Also, is this a decent build? I want him as strong as possible.

thx for any help.
--Don

the build looks good and will get you a terrible effective animal companion and access to elven substitution level is a nice goody :)

but:

(12) druid 7, wizard 3, arcane heirophant 3, Beastmaster 1 (feat: skill handle animal)

will not work, you must have the prerequisites for a class BEFORE taking it. so you have to switch "rapid spell" and "skill focus (handle animal)" and your level calculation is a little bit off, the summed up levels yield 14 levels ;)

at level 12:

(12) druid 5 = 5 effective animal companion levels, wizard 3 = zero effective animal companion levels, arcane heirophant 3 = 3 effective animal companion levels, Beastmaster 1 (feat: rapid spell switched for skill handle animal) = 4 effective animal companion levels:

total 12 effective animal companion levels

(12) druid 5 = 5 effective druid spellcaster levels, wizard 3 = zero effective druid spellcaster levels, arcane heirophant 3 = 3 effective druid spellcaster levels, Beastmaster 1 (feat: rapid spell switched for skill handle animal) = zero effective druid spellcaster levels

total: 8 effective druid caster levels

(12) druid 5 = zero effective wizard spellcaster level, wizard 3 = 3 effective wizard spellcaster level, arcane heirophant 3 = 3 effective wizard spellcaster level, Beastmaster 1 (feat: rapid spell switched for skill handle animal) = zero effective wizard spellcaster level

total: 6 effective wizard caster levels

and at level 15:

(15) druid 5 = 5 effective animal companion levels, wizard 3 = zero effective animal companion levels, arcane heirophant 6 = 6 effective animal companion levels, Beastmaster 1 (feat: rapid spell switched for skill handle animal) = 4 effective animal companion levels:

total 15 effective animal companion levels

(15) druid 5 = 5 effective druid spellcaster levels, wizard 3 = zero effective druid spellcaster levels, arcane heirophant 6 = 6 effective druid spellcaster levels, Beastmaster 1 (feat: rapid spell switched for skill handle animal) = zero effective druid spellcaster levels

total: 11 effective druid caster levels

(15) druid 5 = zero effective wizard spellcaster level, wizard 3 = 3 effective wizard spellcaster level, arcane heirophant 6 = 6 effective wizard spellcaster level, Beastmaster 1 (feat: rapid spell switched for skill handle animal) = zero effective wizard spellcaster level

total: 9 effective wizard caster levels

not to bad at all, try to get your greedy fingers at "natural bond" NONC it works for animal companion like "practiced spellcaster" works for caster levels ;) this would give you an animal companion with an effective druid level 18!!!!!!!

try to get your animal and yourself sharkskin barding asap, animals can take fun feats like "power attack" :P

ciao

martin m.

edit: after checking, i don't see any reason to take the elven substitution level 3, you don't get any benefit from an animal companion familiar:confused:
rockondon
07-15-07, 02:39 PM will not work, you must have the prerequisites for a class BEFORE taking it
bummer, as you can see I'm a noob when it comes to multiclassing/prestige class. Thx for the info.

after checking, i don't see any reason to take the elven substitution level 3, you don't get any benefit from an animal companion familiar:confused:
prereq for arcane hierophant includes the ability to cast lvl 2 arcane spells. A pity it doesn't grant the companion the ability to deliver touch spells for me.

try to get your animal and yourself sharkskin barding asap, animals can take fun feats like "power attack" :P
will do :D
I presume you need access for it. *crosses fingers to find it some day*

and your level calculation is a little bit off
We appear to be interpreting Racial Substitution Levels differently. At higher levels I consider him a 7th lvl druid and you consider him 5th lvl.

Here's a couple screenies concerning racial substitution levels:
http://smg.photobucket.com/albums/v208/rockondon/Rotw1.jpg
http://smg.photobucket.com/albums/v208/rockondon/rotw2.jpg

So when my druid 5 gains a level and takes a wizard substitution level, he still casts as a lvl 6 druid (and a 1st lvl wiz) - what he loses is the ability to wild shape a 2nd time/day (as well as some hit points, skill points, etc).
RotW states: a character who takes racial substituion level gains spellcasting ability as if she had taken this level in the standard class.
So my 8th lvl character is a druid 7, wiz 1 multiclass and has 2 wizard substitution levels allowing him to cast as though he were a druid 7, wizard 3. He is not a druid 5, wizard 3 multiclass.

And I believe that the 8th lvl char animal companion is also treated as a druid 7. In RotW it states:
For instance, if you take the elf paladin substituion level for 3rd level, you forever lose the class features normally gained by a standard 3rd level paladin (such as aura of courage), gaining instead the racial sub class features for a 3rd level elf paladin.... When you gain another level in paladin, you gain the normal 4th level benefits of the standard paladin class.

It later goes on with the following somewhat confusing (to me) paragraph:
The description of each substitution level class feature explains what occurs to the standard class ability not gained , if that ability would normally increase at a specific rate (such as the paladin's smite evil ability).
I'm not positive but I think its saying that a 4th lvl paladin with one substitution lvl in something else still smites as an ordinary 4th lvl paladin, and thus a 6th lvl druid with one substitution lvl has the animal companion of a 6th lvl druid.

If I'm right, taking Natural Bond would pose little benefit (treat the companion as one level higher). I'm hoping to find access to the Easy Metamagic feat for better rapid summons.

What do you think?
Lupo
07-15-07, 02:54 PM bummer, as you can see I'm a noob when it comes to multiclassing/prestige class. Thx for the info.

prereq for arcane hierophant includes the ability to cast lvl 2 arcane spells. A pity it doesn't grant the companion the ability to deliver touch spells for me.

will do :D
I presume you need access for it. *crosses fingers to find it some day*

We appear to be interpreting Racial Substitution Levels differently. At higher levels I consider him a 7th lvl druid and you consider him 5th lvl.

Here's a couple screenies concerning racial substitution levels:
http://smg.photobucket.com/albums/v208/rockondon/Rotw1.jpg
http://smg.photobucket.com/albums/v208/rockondon/rotw2.jpg

So when my druid 5 gains a level and takes a wizard substitution level, he still casts as a lvl 6 druid (and a 1st lvl wiz) - what he loses is the ability to wild shape a 2nd time/day (as well as some hit points, skill points, etc).
RotW states: a character who takes racial substituion level gains spellcasting ability as if she had taken this level in the standard class.
So my 8th lvl character is a druid 7, wiz 1 multiclass and has 2 wizard substitution levels allowing him to cast as though he were a druid 7, wizard 3. He is not a druid 5, wizard 3 multiclass.

And I believe that the 8th lvl char animal companion is also treated as a druid 7. In RotW it states:
For instance, if you take the elf paladin substituion level for 3rd level, you forever lose the class features normally gained by a standard 3rd level paladin (such as aura of courage), gaining instead the racial sub class features for a 3rd level elf paladin.... When you gain another level in paladin, you gain the normal 4th level benefits of the standard paladin class.

It later goes on with the following somewhat confusing (to me) paragraph:
The description of each substitution level class feature explains what occurs to the standard class ability not gained , if that ability would normally increase at a specific rate (such as the paladin's smite evil ability).
I'm not positive but I think its saying that a 4th lvl paladin with one substitution lvl in something else still smites as an ordinary 4th lvl paladin, and thus a 6th lvl druid with one substitution lvl has the animal companion of a 6th lvl druid.

If I'm right, taking Natural Bond would pose little benefit (treat the companion as one level higher). I'm hoping to find access to the Easy Metamagic feat for better rapid summons.

What do you think?

nooooo, you don't get DOUBLE levels, if you take a racial substitution level for a class you do exactly that, you substitute ONE class level with a level with some other features.

so your wizard substitution level 1 replaces just the features of a normal wizard 1 and otherwise functions as a wizard 1 and you can advance normally with further standard wizard levels. you don't get benefits for any other class but wizard with it.

ciao

martin m.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
rockondon 07-15-07, 02:55 AM	Some questions: 1) is it legal to hear the blurb of a module then decide what animal companion you'll have for that module? In other words - water adventure = water type companion, typical adventure = dire bat or something. Also, see question 2. 2) The PH states that "if the campaign takes place wholly or partly in an aquatic environment, the following creatures are also available: crocodile...etc." implying that a lvl 1 druid can have a croc in a water adventure, yet it also shows that a crocodile is a 'level - 3' companion, implying that it isn't available until at least 4th level. How does this work? 3) Can you and your companion share a spell then do your move actions simultaneously, thereby maintaining proximity so you can keep those spells (eg. barkskin)? (I'm 99% sure the answer is NO but just wanna make sure) 4) Is there any benefit for picking a deity for druid? 5) I have a lvl 5 elf druid that gained access to elf wizard substitution levels from RotW. I've never taken a prestige class before so I expect I did mistakes, but this is my plan: Character level (in parentheses) (5) druid 5 (6) druid 6 (wizard sub lvl 1) (7) druid 6, wizard 2 (taking one true level in wizard) (8) druid 7, wizard 3 (taking a second wiz sub lvl) (9) druid 7, wizard 3, arcane heirophant 1 (feat: rapid spell) (10) druid 7, wizard 3, arcane heirophant 2 (11) druid 7, wizard 3, arcane heirophant 3 (12) druid 7, wizard 3, arcane heirophant 3, Beastmaster 1 (feat: skill handle animal) (13) druid 7, wizard 3, arcane heirophant 4, Beastmaster 1 (14) druid 7, wizard 3, arcane heirophant 5, Beastmaster 1 (15) druid 7, wizard 3, arcane heirophant 6, Beastmaster 1 so by my calculations, at lvl 15 the animal companion should be equivalent to that of a lvl 17 druid, I cast as a lvl 13 druid and a lvl 9 wizard. So....does that work or no? Also, is this a decent build? I want him as strong as possible. thx for any help. --Don
Lupo 07-15-07, 09:05 AM	Some questions: 1) is it legal to hear the blurb of a module then decide what animal companion you'll have for that module? In other words - water adventure = water type companion, typical adventure = dire bat or something. Also, see question 2. yes, totally legal, you can even read the blurb in advance and prepare your animal companion and your summon monster stats. 2) The PH states that "if the campaign takes place wholly or partly in an aquatic environment, the following creatures are also available: crocodile...etc." implying that a lvl 1 druid can have a croc in a water adventure, yet it also shows that a crocodile is a 'level - 3' companion, implying that it isn't available until at least 4th level. How does this work? until you find a region or an AR that grants your druid the croc at first level you can only take it at fourth level and above - and anywhere else but in water crocs are sub par animal companions. 3) Can you and your companion share a spell then do your move actions simultaneously, thereby maintaining proximity so you can keep those spells (eg. barkskin)? (I'm 99% sure the answer is NO but just wanna make sure) normally most DMs assume that a druid and the animal companion share the same initiative and can act simultaneously - otherwise the whole "stay within 5-ft" would be pathetic - but make sure to ask your DM in advance, same few allocate individual initiatives and split druid and animal companion. riding an animal companion solves this issue most of the time. 4) Is there any benefit for picking a deity for druid? apart from the possibility to take levels in some divine prestige classes none, and none of the existing divine prestige classes offers anything that would make a sane druid switch classes. a deity may also offer access to certain meta organizations - e.g. the church of ehlonna/ehlenestra in Innspa offers access to "ehlonna's way" 5) I have a lvl 5 elf druid that gained access to elf wizard substitution levels from RotW. I've never taken a prestige class before so I expect I did mistakes, but this is my plan: Character level (in parentheses) (5) druid 5 (6) druid 6 (wizard sub lvl 1) (7) druid 6, wizard 2 (taking one true level in wizard) (8) druid 7, wizard 3 (taking a second wiz sub lvl) (9) druid 7, wizard 3, arcane heirophant 1 (feat: rapid spell) (10) druid 7, wizard 3, arcane heirophant 2 (11) druid 7, wizard 3, arcane heirophant 3 (12) druid 7, wizard 3, arcane heirophant 3, Beastmaster 1 (feat: skill handle animal) (13) druid 7, wizard 3, arcane heirophant 4, Beastmaster 1 (14) druid 7, wizard 3, arcane heirophant 5, Beastmaster 1 (15) druid 7, wizard 3, arcane heirophant 6, Beastmaster 1 so by my calculations, at lvl 15 the animal companion should be equivalent to that of a lvl 17 druid, I cast as a lvl 13 druid and a lvl 9 wizard. So....does that work or no? Also, is this a decent build? I want him as strong as possible. thx for any help. --Don the build looks good and will get you a terrible effective animal companion and access to elven substitution level is a nice goody :) but: (12) druid 7, wizard 3, arcane heirophant 3, Beastmaster 1 (feat: skill handle animal) will not work, you must have the prerequisites for a class BEFORE taking it. so you have to switch "rapid spell" and "skill focus (handle animal)" and your level calculation is a little bit off, the summed up levels yield 14 levels ;) at level 12: (12) druid 5 = 5 effective animal companion levels, wizard 3 = zero effective animal companion levels, arcane heirophant 3 = 3 effective animal companion levels, Beastmaster 1 (feat: rapid spell switched for skill handle animal) = 4 effective animal companion levels: total 12 effective animal companion levels (12) druid 5 = 5 effective druid spellcaster levels, wizard 3 = zero effective druid spellcaster levels, arcane heirophant 3 = 3 effective druid spellcaster levels, Beastmaster 1 (feat: rapid spell switched for skill handle animal) = zero effective druid spellcaster levels total: 8 effective druid caster levels (12) druid 5 = zero effective wizard spellcaster level, wizard 3 = 3 effective wizard spellcaster level, arcane heirophant 3 = 3 effective wizard spellcaster level, Beastmaster 1 (feat: rapid spell switched for skill handle animal) = zero effective wizard spellcaster level total: 6 effective wizard caster levels and at level 15: (15) druid 5 = 5 effective animal companion levels, wizard 3 = zero effective animal companion levels, arcane heirophant 6 = 6 effective animal companion levels, Beastmaster 1 (feat: rapid spell switched for skill handle animal) = 4 effective animal companion levels: total 15 effective animal companion levels (15) druid 5 = 5 effective druid spellcaster levels, wizard 3 = zero effective druid spellcaster levels, arcane heirophant 6 = 6 effective druid spellcaster levels, Beastmaster 1 (feat: rapid spell switched for skill handle animal) = zero effective druid spellcaster levels total: 11 effective druid caster levels (15) druid 5 = zero effective wizard spellcaster level, wizard 3 = 3 effective wizard spellcaster level, arcane heirophant 6 = 6 effective wizard spellcaster level, Beastmaster 1 (feat: rapid spell switched for skill handle animal) = zero effective wizard spellcaster level total: 9 effective wizard caster levels not to bad at all, try to get your greedy fingers at "natural bond" NONC it works for animal companion like "practiced spellcaster" works for caster levels ;) this would give you an animal companion with an effective druid level 18!!!!!!! try to get your animal and yourself sharkskin barding asap, animals can take fun feats like "power attack" :P ciao martin m. edit: after checking, i don't see any reason to take the elven substitution level 3, you don't get any benefit from an animal companion familiar:confused:
rockondon 07-15-07, 02:39 PM	will not work, you must have the prerequisites for a class BEFORE taking it bummer, as you can see I'm a noob when it comes to multiclassing/prestige class. Thx for the info. after checking, i don't see any reason to take the elven substitution level 3, you don't get any benefit from an animal companion familiar:confused: prereq for arcane hierophant includes the ability to cast lvl 2 arcane spells. A pity it doesn't grant the companion the ability to deliver touch spells for me. try to get your animal and yourself sharkskin barding asap, animals can take fun feats like "power attack" :P will do :D I presume you need access for it. crosses fingers to find it some day and your level calculation is a little bit off We appear to be interpreting Racial Substitution Levels differently. At higher levels I consider him a 7th lvl druid and you consider him 5th lvl. Here's a couple screenies concerning racial substitution levels: http://smg.photobucket.com/albums/v208/rockondon/Rotw1.jpg http://smg.photobucket.com/albums/v208/rockondon/rotw2.jpg So when my druid 5 gains a level and takes a wizard substitution level, he still casts as a lvl 6 druid (and a 1st lvl wiz) - what he loses is the ability to wild shape a 2nd time/day (as well as some hit points, skill points, etc). RotW states: a character who takes racial substituion level gains spellcasting ability as if she had taken this level in the standard class. So my 8th lvl character is a druid 7, wiz 1 multiclass and has 2 wizard substitution levels allowing him to cast as though he were a druid 7, wizard 3. He is not a druid 5, wizard 3 multiclass. And I believe that the 8th lvl char animal companion is also treated as a druid 7. In RotW it states: For instance, if you take the elf paladin substituion level for 3rd level, you forever lose the class features normally gained by a standard 3rd level paladin (such as aura of courage), gaining instead the racial sub class features for a 3rd level elf paladin.... When you gain another level in paladin, you gain the normal 4th level benefits of the standard paladin class. It later goes on with the following somewhat confusing (to me) paragraph: The description of each substitution level class feature explains what occurs to the standard class ability not gained , if that ability would normally increase at a specific rate (such as the paladin's smite evil ability). I'm not positive but I think its saying that a 4th lvl paladin with one substitution lvl in something else still smites as an ordinary 4th lvl paladin, and thus a 6th lvl druid with one substitution lvl has the animal companion of a 6th lvl druid. If I'm right, taking Natural Bond would pose little benefit (treat the companion as one level higher). I'm hoping to find access to the Easy Metamagic feat for better rapid summons. What do you think?
Lupo 07-15-07, 02:54 PM	bummer, as you can see I'm a noob when it comes to multiclassing/prestige class. Thx for the info. prereq for arcane hierophant includes the ability to cast lvl 2 arcane spells. A pity it doesn't grant the companion the ability to deliver touch spells for me. will do :D I presume you need access for it. crosses fingers to find it some day We appear to be interpreting Racial Substitution Levels differently. At higher levels I consider him a 7th lvl druid and you consider him 5th lvl. Here's a couple screenies concerning racial substitution levels: http://smg.photobucket.com/albums/v208/rockondon/Rotw1.jpg http://smg.photobucket.com/albums/v208/rockondon/rotw2.jpg So when my druid 5 gains a level and takes a wizard substitution level, he still casts as a lvl 6 druid (and a 1st lvl wiz) - what he loses is the ability to wild shape a 2nd time/day (as well as some hit points, skill points, etc). RotW states: a character who takes racial substituion level gains spellcasting ability as if she had taken this level in the standard class. So my 8th lvl character is a druid 7, wiz 1 multiclass and has 2 wizard substitution levels allowing him to cast as though he were a druid 7, wizard 3. He is not a druid 5, wizard 3 multiclass. And I believe that the 8th lvl char animal companion is also treated as a druid 7. In RotW it states: For instance, if you take the elf paladin substituion level for 3rd level, you forever lose the class features normally gained by a standard 3rd level paladin (such as aura of courage), gaining instead the racial sub class features for a 3rd level elf paladin.... When you gain another level in paladin, you gain the normal 4th level benefits of the standard paladin class. It later goes on with the following somewhat confusing (to me) paragraph: The description of each substitution level class feature explains what occurs to the standard class ability not gained , if that ability would normally increase at a specific rate (such as the paladin's smite evil ability). I'm not positive but I think its saying that a 4th lvl paladin with one substitution lvl in something else still smites as an ordinary 4th lvl paladin, and thus a 6th lvl druid with one substitution lvl has the animal companion of a 6th lvl druid. If I'm right, taking Natural Bond would pose little benefit (treat the companion as one level higher). I'm hoping to find access to the Easy Metamagic feat for better rapid summons. What do you think? nooooo, you don't get DOUBLE levels, if you take a racial substitution level for a class you do exactly that, you substitute ONE class level with a level with some other features. so your wizard substitution level 1 replaces just the features of a normal wizard 1 and otherwise functions as a wizard 1 and you can advance normally with further standard wizard levels. you don't get benefits for any other class but wizard with it. ciao martin m.