Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Maesto 10-30-07, 07:43 PM	Hi, I've got a friend who I built a character for a long time ago, but always left the 15th level feat spot free, as she was unlikely to get there anytime soon. However, she's now about to hit level 15, and is asking for a feat =) She's human, 8 levels of cleric, 6 levels of sacred exorcist (likely to take the 7th, unless somebody points out something cooler). Feats are currently: Quicken Spell Extra Turning Augment Healing Craft Wondrous Item Disciple of the Sun Power Attack Retraining is an option, probably for extra turning (hey - was a great choice before Divine Metamagic went away). Domains are luck and destiny. Stats, including boosters, currently sit at 16, 12, 16, 12, 22, 14. (SDCIWC) Items of interest are: +1 Adamantium Fullplate with Lesser Fortification +1 Adamantium Animated Heavy Shield +1 Sacred morningstar Bead of Karma (and the rest of the strand of prayer beads) +2 Belt of Magnificence +4 Periapt of Wisdom Phylactery of Undead Turning Boots of Speed Rods of Extend (Normal and Lesser) Typical MO is to cast divine power and wade into combat with DR3/- and a high AC, along with respectable attack and damage bonuses. Spells like quickened Divine Favour, Heroes Feast, and GMW help here. I'm currently thinking either Spell Focus + Metamagic School Focus (Evocation) using retraining, for cheaper quickened Divine Powers and Divine Favours (and flamestrikes, if so inclined), or Chain Spell, for delay death and GMW (is it useful for any other cleric spells?), although I haven't waded through the onslaught of new books thrown our way over the past year or so. Suggestions, anybody?
Lomiat 10-30-07, 08:04 PM	A lot of turning clerics exchanged their defunct DMMs and Divine Spellpowers for Divine Ward. Heal spells cast at Close range are pretty handy, though it's not necessarily the player's style. Retraining for Spell Focus + Metamagic Spell Focus could be pretty cool. Casting Quickened Divine Powers as 7th level spells lets her do it every battle without wasting valuable in-combat time. Otherwise, Craft Magic Arms and Armor lets her revisit all her old weapon and armor access and look for creative ways to spend her 52 Year 7 TUs.
copperwyrmling 10-30-07, 08:14 PM	If you keep Extra Turning, there's Divine Ward or Domain Spontaneity (from memory some divine feats from PHB2 let you get DR or save boosts, but they're probably not so useful to her since she already has adamantine armor and fairly good saves). I see she retrained Improved Turning: good choice :) (although I remember being very grateful for it when she was L11 and trying to turn that 24HD dread wraith...) If she's had any particularly good item access, the appropriate crafting feat might be useful. Chain is useful for Dispel Magic, GMW, Delay Death, and not much else on the cleric list unfortunately, as far as I can see. EDIT: If she regularly plays in less-than-full tables (which seems to happen often at APL 14-16, at least for me), then Leadership and an appropriately chosen cohort might be worthwhile.
Maesto 10-30-07, 10:25 PM	I'm going to steer clear of cohorts; the simpler things are, the better. My friend mostly plays in Canberra, where high level tables always seem to be filled, for some reason. There are two other high level characters running around there with cohorts, which may contribute (funnily enough). I don't know that she's picked up much funky armour/shield access. Most of it has been in the favour box rather than in the items found list. Although I guess, if you upgrade the weapon to holy and flaming, that would be pretty cool for only 21K. Upgrading armour to heavy fort would be nifty, although I don't think I've ever seen access to that in the items found box; she might have. Hmm, she may have also found access to a deathward item, which could go on the shield ;-) Perhaps there is some funky stuff to be crafted for her yet. Divine Ward I don't think she'd use much - her concentration skill is +25 or something stupid (tunic of steady spellcasting), so casting in melee isn't a problem. Insignia of Healing, Close Wounds, and Delay Death are all ranged, and if she wants to buff somebody, chances are it will be herself. Divine Spontaneity luck or destiny? Could be amusing - spontaneously cast delay death with the destiny domain ;-) I'm not sure that the other domain spells get much mileage, although there are certainly some cool options available from those domains. Mostly just the "High level spell slot!" argument. Righto, I think I'll suggest Metamagic School Focus or Craft+Domain Spontaneity or two Domain Spontaneities. hehehe =) Thanks, Jolyon
zoinks69 11-02-07, 09:52 AM	Divine Ward is spectacular. However, if she's a melee type, it might not be very useful if she's trying to take full attacks and instead using actions on spells (though quicken still helps here). Chain Spell is fantastic for buffing/debuffing, though maybe her Wis is a little low if she's more melee? Chain Delay Death still makes this worthwhile (my opinion). Domain Spontaneity is good if her domains are good. I'm not sure how well Spontaneous Delay Deaths would work...spontaneous spells are cast on the caster's turn, and Delay Death is an immediate. Wouldn't this mean the spell could only be converted and cast, as an immediate, on her own turn (thus negating the big benefit of Delay Death -- casting when you see someone about to croak). Another to consider -- Retributive Spell (from Complete Mage). Essentially it lets you charge yourself up with a spell that you can, as an immediate, cast on a creature that does melee damage to you. Limitations are that it has to be a targettable spell (so, for instance, no Flame Strike). Cost is +1 spell level, but you can pre-cast and it lasts 24 hours/until discharged/replaced. Personally (although my cleric isn't much into melee anymore) I walk around with Plane Shift (Will save or get off the board) or Disintegrate (from Destruction domain, Fort save or take a bunch of damage), depending on what I expect to face. I'd have to check the books again, but I think you could charge up a Dispel/Greater Dispel. Wade into combat and debuff the enemy of your choosing when he makes the mistake of daring to hit a girl ;D
bitznarf 11-02-07, 10:09 AM	Domain Spontaneity is good if her domains are good. I'm not sure how well Spontaneous Delay Deaths would work...spontaneous spells are cast on the caster's turn, and Delay Death is an immediate. Wouldn't this mean the spell could only be converted and cast, as an immediate, on her own turn (thus negating the big benefit of Delay Death -- casting when you see someone about to croak). Where are you getting the idea that you can only spontaneously convert spells on your turn?
solbergb 11-02-07, 01:13 PM	Where are you getting the idea that you can only spontaneously convert spells on your turn? Yeah. There is no such restriction on spont casting.
Mattastrophic 11-02-07, 01:54 PM	Divine Ward is huge. I was so happy I took it with my healing-focused cohort the moment she cast her first Freedom of Movement through the Divine Ward. Mobile Spellcasting might also be a good one. Gives you a lot more freedom to buff and get your 40'-moving self where you need to be. -Matt
zoinks69 11-02-07, 03:50 PM	Yeah. There is no such restriction on spont casting. Someone please correct me if I'm wrong, I don't have CD handy, so I'm only assuming this is a quote: "Domain Spontaneity: Each time you take this feat, choose a domain that you have access to. You may now convert prepared divine spells into any spell from that domain. You expend a spell of equal or higher level, as well as expending one of your daily turn undead attempts. This works just as good clerics spontaneously cast prepared spells as cure spells." I guess there is room for interpretation (and never mind that 'immediate' actions weren't yet in the rules, or were just coming in around the same time), but "works just as" says to me "rule it just as you would a normal spontaneous casting". Normal spontaneous casts occur on the cleric's turn, unless I've missed something. Honestly though, I'm not a rules hardass unless it's very cut and dry. In this case I don't think the rules were written to take this situation into account. As such, in the absence of a FAQ or errata, I'd have to give it to the PCs.
bitznarf 11-02-07, 04:11 PM	Normal spontaneous casts occur on the cleric's turn, unless I've missed something. Spontaneous casting has nothing to do with whose turn it is. For a while it only occurred on your turn simply because there was no way to cast spells out of turn order. With the addition of immediate action spells, this changes. It is no different than a sorceror casting a spell he knows. You absolutely can't add metamagic to your casting (baring something like Rapid Metamagic), but you can spontaneously cast an immediate action spell.