Post/Author/DateTime	Post
gimble01 01-20-08, 03:14 AM	I'm currently running a halfling level 5 rogue 1 fighter....current feats: weapon focus (short sword), weapon finesse, two-weapon fighting, two-weapon defense, improved initiative. The problem is...that it seems if the enemy is immune to sneak attacks...i might as well not even be in the battle...if you have any feat suggestions, or builds that would help me past this problem it would be greatly appreciated (multiclassing does not seem to be an option at this point, with the 20% xp detriment).
magebeast 01-20-08, 03:31 AM	I'm currently running a halfling level 5 rogue 1 fighter....current feats: weapon focus (short sword), weapon finesse, two-weapon fighting, two-weapon defense, improved initiative. The problem is...that it seems if the enemy is immune to sneak attacks...i might as well not even be in the battle...if you have any feat suggestions, or builds that would help me past this problem it would be greatly appreciated (multiclassing does not seem to be an option at this point, with the 20% xp detriment). If you ever find access to golemstrike, a level of sorcerer might be a solution. Rogue is your favored class, so as long as you keep everything other than rogue close, you're fine. There are also some magic items that allow you to sneak attack non-sneakable things. Alchemical items can be helpful too. Everyone has things they are bad at hurting.
jstorrie 01-20-08, 04:29 AM	If you go up to Fighter 4, you can get Weapon Focus, Weapon Specialization and Melee Weapon Mastery (PHBII), adding a nice +3 to hit / +4 to damage to your rolls. Combat Expertise and Deadly Defense (Complete Scoundrel) would add another untyped +1d6 damage. Once you get up in levels and get some spare cash, keeping some spare bane or sacred weapons in the bag will help, as well.
Sieylianna 01-20-08, 10:48 AM	Two-weapon rend can be useful. You should also think about close-quarter fighting because small characters in melee are just asking to be grappled. Ed
UMiskatonic 01-20-08, 11:39 AM	I feel your pain. My fighter rogue has the same issue. There are a couple of ways around it. a) You can get there with magic. One level of sorceror or cleric would allow you access to golem strike or grave strike. Favored Soul is an option too. b) You can get there with UMD. Being able to use wands and scrolls reliably can do the job also, a wand of magic missiles or scorching ray can often get the job done. UMD/magic also allows you to shift gears, and become a party resource. Ex: "Zombies, eek! I'll get out a scroll of hide from undead, and a scroll of bless" For either of these, don't underestimate the ranged touch attack. As a halfling rogue, you probably don't miss a lot. c) That same ranged touch applies to alchemical items, which are a great idea for all characters, but especially for those with good aim, and who might need fire damage to overcome dr/piercing. Tanglefoot bags are also great. d) You can get there with magic weapons. My 14th level rogue/ranger NOW has a +1 silver undead-bane light mace. So much easier. This does take a while to afford, but it is more affordable to have four +1 weapons than a +5 weapon. e) There's the unheroic, but incredibly effective "I tumble around, flank, and aid the fighter's attack". Sometimes it's literally the best move you can make.
Lomiat 01-20-08, 12:30 PM	Does LG allow the halfling subrace that gains the bonus feat? I haven't played a halfling in LG so don't know for sure; otherwise, it looks like one too many feats. Two-weapon Defense? I'd retrain it. It's an entire feat dedicated to a mere +1 AC bump. If you took Quick Draw instead, you could throw multiple objects in a round (two-weapon fighting) and then start stocking up (as has been mentioned) on things like Tanglefoot Bags and alchemical weapons. UMD is also a very good idea if you have any CHA whatsoever. Scrolls are fine and dandy, but UMD also lets you run around using wands (DC 20) to heal, enlarge, grease, etc. Now that the 1st-level DMG wands are open, UMD is a better investment than it was previously. Umiskatonic, I believe, managed to hit most of the main points, but one he overlooked is metaorg access: Can you join a metaorg that grants your halfling access to one of the rogue alternate class features? Give up Trapsense to give anything you hit a -5 to AC? Sure, why not. Finally, one other option is to focus on the role your PC plays *leading up* to combat. A halfling rogue ought to be able to hide, sneak and scout like nobody's business. If you do this - even if you never land a blow in combat - you may make every combat ridiculously easy for a party that's prepared to encounter: foes it has already identified, aware of their positions, with buffs in place, with a plan. In that case, anything you can do to increase your party's advance knowledge is an effective EL penalty or two or three to the encounter. If you don't mind that role, I'd recommend retraining Two-weapon Defense to speed you toward Shadowdancer (Dodge, Mobility, Combat Reflexes), picking up another level of fighter for the other feat (and perhaps retraining, again - likely Weapon Focus) to hit Shadowdancer by 9th level. And then if you find access to Darkstalker, snatch it up! (In fact, Darkstalker's not a bad feat, even if you're not a Shadowdancer; it's just scary good if you are.) P.S.: Darkstalker is from Lords of Madness. Creatures with blindsense, scent, tremorsense, etc. must still beat your Hide or Move Silently in order to locate you.
boolean 01-20-08, 07:20 PM	If you ever find access to golemstrike, a level of sorcerer might be a solution. Golem Strike is Open, so he doesn't need access.
gimble01 01-20-08, 07:20 PM	i've decided to go to level 4 as fighter and then possibly cross to sorc or wizard (i'm thinking wizard) for some spells, expecially rays and i'm liking the blades of blood spell, so how about suggestions on the next 4 feats
Timlagor 01-20-08, 07:39 PM	Staggering Strike aat 9th is a shoe-in. Weapon Master and Improved TWF are similarly obvious to my mind. Dropping TWD I'd do immediately as well. Going Fighter rather than Rogue does have the major drawback that you're not picking up Sneak Attack dice to increase your damage and at the same time you won't be using Power Attack. Spending your Feats on Specialisation and Mastery seem essential to keep up. IMO If you intend to take casting then you should be heading straight for Unseen Seer by the shortest possible route and picking up Practiced Spellcaster.
MwaO 01-20-08, 10:49 PM	I'm currently running a halfling level 5 rogue 1 fighter....current feats: weapon focus (short sword), weapon finesse, two-weapon fighting, two-weapon defense, improved initiative. The problem is...that it seems if the enemy is immune to sneak attacks...i might as well not even be in the battle...if you have any feat suggestions, or builds that would help me past this problem it would be greatly appreciated (multiclassing does not seem to be an option at this point, with the 20% xp detriment). I think you've got a couple substandard feats: weapon focus and two-weapon defense. Quickdraw+TWF+acid flasks is an amazing opening 1st round attack for a Rogue. Something to also consider is Unseen Seer. It depends on how much further you think this character is going to go, but a Rogue 7/Fighter 1/Wizard 1/Unseen Seer 4 gets you 3rd level spells and an extra 3d6 of sneak in 7 levels. Plus Golem/Grave Strike.
Churcher 01-21-08, 12:09 AM	If I'm not mistaken, there's a clerical spell that allows you to sneak attack undead. Find access to it and see if you can get a potion/wand/scroll made of it. That should help you out without having to go to other classes...but if I'm horribly mistaken on it...Yeah, the Fighter route sounds good too.
bitznarf 01-21-08, 01:18 AM	If I'm not mistaken, there's a clerical spell that allows you to sneak attack undead. Find access to it and see if you can get a potion/wand/scroll made of it. That should help you out without having to go to other classes...but if I'm horribly mistaken on it...Yeah, the Fighter route sounds good too. No access is needed, its called grave strike, which others have mentioned in this thread.
UMiskatonic 01-21-08, 07:45 AM	Ditto on the feats. I'm not at all in love with Two weapon defense. Consider that imp. buckler defense does the same thing, and you can enchant the buckler way beyond the original +1. I'm not even sure I'd take that.... Feats are the thing that a rogue needs to think about the hardest. While all rogues are the same, more or less, for skill points, it's the 3-4 feats you have that will define what you do in battle. The feats and the fighting style HAVE to align, and you can't recover from a weak feat the way a fighter can.
Sieylianna 01-21-08, 06:40 PM	If I'm not mistaken, there's a clerical spell that allows you to sneak attack undead. Find access to it and see if you can get a potion/wand/scroll made of it. That should help you out without having to go to other classes...but if I'm horribly mistaken on it...Yeah, the Fighter route sounds good too. Grave Strike is a swift spell, so potions/wands/scrolls don't work with it. Unseen Seer is a very good prestige class, I was surprised that it wasn't restricted. That is probably your best route to fix the PC. Ed
JamesMaissen 01-22-08, 12:42 AM	Grave Strike is a swift spell, so potions/wands/scrolls don't work with it. Ed Small note, Grave Strike is personal so a potion is illegal. However a wand of grave strike can be very valid with the right build. While a scroll could work with AOOs or other ways of gaining an attack before their next round. The wand works wonders with dual wand wielder. -James
boolean 01-22-08, 01:03 AM	Small note, Grave Strike is personal so a potion is illegal. However a wand of grave strike can be very valid with the right build.Even if the spell contained in the wand is a swift action to cast, it's still a standard action to activate the wand. There are a couple of ways to make it useful, (dual wand wielder, metamagic spell trigger with extend spell) but it takes extra effort.
UMiskatonic 01-24-08, 06:13 PM	However, there's a undead-killing prestige class in the miniatures handbook that's rogue-centric. Undead slayer, or something like that. Find access to that, and you can ignore the need for grave strike.
Jay_Ibero_911 01-24-08, 07:14 PM	However, there's a undead-killing prestige class in the miniatures handbook that's rogue-centric. Undead slayer, or something like that. Find access to that, and you can ignore the need for grave strike. Skullclan Hunter...however you need the ability to turn undead to qualify for it...which means you likely can cast gravestrike anyway...