Halfling Tripper [Archive] - Wizards Community

Halfling Tripper [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
Japangirl
04-11-07, 07:19 PM Spiked Chain Halfling

Str: 10 (4)
Dex: 18 (10)
Con: 15 (8)
Int: 14 (6)
Wis: 8 (0)
Cha: 8 (0)

Bump Dex 2, Con 1

1 Fighter: Exotic Weapon Proficiency (Spiked Chain), Weapon Finesse
2 Fighter: Weapon Focus (Spiked Chain)
3 Fighter: Combat Reflexes
4 Fighter: Combat Expertise
5 Rogue: +1d6 sneak attack, trap sense +1, trapfinding
6 Rogue: Evasion, Improved Trip
7 Rogue: +2d6 sneak attack
8 Exotic Weapon Master: Flurry of Strikes
9 Exotic Weapon Master: AoO through cover, Underfoot Combat (RoW)
10 Exotic Weapon Master: Improved Trip
11 Rogue: Uncanny Dodge
12 ??: Confound the Bigger Folk (RoW)
13 ??:
14 ??:
15 ??: Weapon Spec (Spiked Chain) or Deadly Defense (CS)

This is obviously incomplete, it's just something I was playing around with. It doesn't really hit peak power until level 12, but it's a decent damage dealer/tank before that. At 12, you run under something that is large or bigger and can standard action trip it. You use your Dex or Str, whichever is higher (Dex, obviously), and the creature loses all size bonuses to the Trip attempt. You also gain all the other bonuses of Underfoot Combat and Confound the Bigger Folk.
clannagh
04-11-07, 07:22 PM Spiked Chain Halfling

Str: 10 (4)
Dex: 18 (10)
Con: 15 (8)
Int: 14 (6)
Wis: 8 (0)
Cha: 8 (0)

Bump Dex 2, Con 1

1 Fighter: Exotic Weapon Proficiency (Spiked Chain), Weapon Finesse
2 Fighter: Weapon Focus (Spiked Chain)
3 Fighter: Combat Reflexes
4 Fighter: Combat Expertise
5 Rogue: +1d6 sneak attack, trap sense +1, trapfinding
6 Rogue: Evasion, Improved Trip
7 Rogue: +2d6 sneak attack
8 Exotic Weapon Master: Flurry of Strikes
9 Exotic Weapon Master: AoO through cover, Underfoot Combat (RoW)
10 Rogue: Uncanny Dodge
11 ??:
12 ??: Confound the Bigger Folk (RoW)
13 ??:
14 ??:
15 ??: Weapon Spec (Spiked Chain) or Deadly Defense (CS)

This is obviously incomplete, it's just something I was playing around with. It doesn't really hit peak power until level 12, but it's a decent damage dealer/tank before that. At 12, you run under something that is large or bigger and can standard action trip it. You use your Dex or Str, whichever is higher (Dex, obviously), and the creature loses all size bonuses to the Trip attempt. You also gain all the other bonuses of Underfoot Combat and Confound the Bigger Folk.

how about
11 Exotic Weapon Master: Trip .. spiked chain

for another +2 to the trips
Japangirl
04-11-07, 07:25 PM Uh, right. I thought I had all three levels in there. Oops! Added to the build up top.
clannagh
04-11-07, 07:52 PM coupla other thoughts

- this feat order might make you more effective below 6 ...

1 Fighter: Exotic Weapon Proficiency (Spiked Chain), Weapon Finesse
2 Fighter: Combat Expertise
3 Fighter: Improved Trip
4 Fighter: Combat Reflexes
5 Rogue: +1d6 sneak attack, trap sense +1, trapfinding
6 Rogue: Evasion, Weapon Focus (Spiked Chain)

- adding 3 levels of swashie would get you finesse for free and INT to damage but delay your build (probably too much)

- other feats that work well with chain builds are deft opportunist, hold the line and power attack.
cycloptic_squirrel
04-12-07, 01:06 AM coupla other thoughts
- adding 3 levels of swashie would get you finesse for free and INT to damage but delay your build (probably too much)

Why not just throw it in instead of a few levels of fighter? If you set up like so you can trade Combat Reflexes for an extra die of sneak attack damage and a dodge bonus, with the option of taking the third level of swashbuckler at any point after level seven to add intellegence to damage.

1 Swashbuckler: Exotic Weapon Proficiency (Spiked Chain), Weapon Finesse
2 Rogue: +1d6 sneak attack, trapfinding
3 Fighter: Combat Expertise, Improved Trip
4 Rogue: Evasion
5 Swashbuckler: Grace +1
6 Rogue: trap sense +1, Daring Outlaw, +3d6 sneak attack
7 Fighter:Weapon Focus (Spiked Chain)
thorinXXX
04-12-07, 11:34 AM With a halfling's -4 due to size you will either be tripped or have to drop your weapon most of the time. I would suggest finding a way to include either the Prone Fighting feat or a level in Thief Acrobat to reduce these effects.

Damage output is negligable, no strength bonus, no Power Attack, insignificant sneak dice.
Tripping is pitiful. -4 at 1st level, 0 at 6th level, +2 at 8th level with maybe a +1 from Gauntlets at 6th, and maybe a +2 from a belt at 10th.
When tripping you use St. When resisting a trip you may use St or Dx. You may only trip something one size larger than you. PHB pg 158
Jay_Ibero_911
04-12-07, 04:13 PM With a halfling's -4 due to size you will either be tripped or have to drop your weapon most of the time. I would suggest finding a way to include either the Prone Fighting feat or a level in Thief Acrobat to reduce these effects.

Damage output is negligable, no strength bonus, no Power Attack, insignificant sneak dice.
Tripping is pitiful. -4 at 1st level, 0 at 6th level, +2 at 8th level with maybe a +1 from Gauntlets at 6th, and maybe a +2 from a belt at 10th.
When tripping you use St. When resisting a trip you may use St or Dx. You may only trip something one size larger than you. PHB pg 158

Confound the Big Fold specifically allows you to use Dex to trip and allows you to trip things 2 or more sizes bigger than you and denies them their size bonuses on resist, and even if you fail they can't try to trip you back...and that's just one of the abilities granted by the tactical feat...
Alpha_Nerd
04-12-07, 04:49 PM Once you get CtBF you're going to be amazing at tripping, unfortunately until then you're pretty sub-par :(
Mommy was an Orc
04-12-07, 05:45 PM Confound the Big Fold specifically allows you to use Dex to trip and allows you to trip things 2 or more sizes bigger than you and denies them their size bonuses on resist, and even if you fail they can't try to trip you back...and that's just one of the abilities granted by the tactical feat...

Well, somewhat. The problem with this use of CtBF is that you need to:
Enter their square.
Wait until the next round, hoping they don't decide to 5' step away from you or worse, take a full attack against you(say via grappling you...)
Make a standard action trying to trip someone when they would be considered flatfooted against your full attack.
Lomiat
04-12-07, 06:24 PM While Confound the Big Folk removes any bonuses opposing creatures gain to their trip checks based on size, it doesn't remove your penalties to trip checks, does it?

Furthermore, I don't believe it removes any bonuses opposing creatures gain to their trip checks based on multiple legs.

As far as I'm concerned, that makes it a "quirky" idea, rather than a solid one.
Japangirl
04-13-07, 03:43 PM This isn't a terribly solid build and I'm fully aware of it. It just looked like something fun to play with. Add more rogue levels for more sneak dice at high levels, maybe. Or add fighter levels to pick up feats like Power Attack.

This build is actually an awesome tripper. It's better at tripping huge things than medium creatures, just as good at tripping large things, and won't bother trying to trip medium things since I can't stand in their square anyways. The four-legged bonus doesn't go away, that is true, but a medium tripper has to deal with that too.

And the attack routine isn't nearly that bad. You want to hit touch AC for trip attacks anyways, so tumble into their square (one move action) and then trip attack (standard action). Now improved trip means you get an attack (but they're not flat footed so no sneak attack on this one). Now they're prone and you're in their squares after only one round of actions.
Zanzibax
04-13-07, 03:48 PM With a halfling's -4 due to size you will either be tripped or have to drop your weapon most of the time. I would suggest finding a way to include either the Prone Fighting feat or a level in Thief Acrobat to reduce these effects.

Damage output is negligable, no strength bonus, no Power Attack, insignificant sneak dice.
Tripping is pitiful. -4 at 1st level, 0 at 6th level, +2 at 8th level with maybe a +1 from Gauntlets at 6th, and maybe a +2 from a belt at 10th.
When tripping you use St. When resisting a trip you may use St or Dx. You may only trip something one size larger than you. PHB pg 158

The damn thing *would* be underfoot though.
Mommy was an Orc
04-13-07, 04:15 PM And the attack routine isn't nearly that bad. You want to hit touch AC for trip attacks anyways, so tumble into their square (one move action) and then trip attack (standard action). Now improved trip means you get an attack (but they're not flat footed so no sneak attack on this one). Now they're prone and you're in their squares after only one round of actions.

The feat doesn't actually work that way. You move in on the first round and then 'On the next round, you can use a standard action to attempt to trip...' - at which point, if they're still on top of you, you could instead treat them as flatfooted against all your attacks.
Mithrus
04-13-07, 10:47 PM If instead of halfling, have you considered using gnome and taking Titan Fighting as well? Also, instead of rogue, use scout and skirmish for damage and bonus to move? Take the Improved Skirmish feat from CS if you can get your move to 40+ reliably. I'm thinking something like Scout7/Fighter8. Sorry I haven't spent much time on a specific build, but I think this might be a similarly effective build.

1) Scout: 1st [Weapon Finesse],Skirmish (+1d6), trapfinding
2) Scout: 2nd Battle fortitude +1, uncanny dodge
3) Fighter: 1st [Combat Expertise][Improved Trip]
4) Fighter: 2nd [Dodge]
5) Scout: 3rd Fast movement +10 ft., skirmish (+1d6, +1 AC), trackless step
6) Fighter: 3rd [Titan Fighting]
7) Scout: 4th Bonus feat[Underfoot Combat] (retrain Tumble)
8) Fighter: 4th [Confound the Big Folk]
9) Scout: 5th [Mobility], Evasion, skirmish (+2d6, +1 AC)
10) EWM: 1st
11) Fighter: 5th
12) EWM: 2nd [Elusive Target]
13) Scout: 6th Flawless stride
14) EWM: 3rd
15) Fighter: 6th [][]

The last few feats I'm open to ideas.
Japangirl
04-14-07, 04:04 AM If instead of halfling, have you considered using gnome and taking Titan Fighting as well? Also, instead of rogue, use scout and skirmish for damage and bonus to move? Take the Improved Skirmish feat from CS if you can get your move to 40+ reliably. I'm thinking something like Scout7/Fighter8. Sorry I haven't spent much time on a specific build, but I think this might be a similarly effective build.

1) Scout: 1st [Weapon Finesse],Skirmish (+1d6), trapfinding
2) Scout: 2nd Battle fortitude +1, uncanny dodge
3) Fighter: 1st [Combat Expertise][Improved Trip]
4) Fighter: 2nd [Dodge]
5) Scout: 3rd Fast movement +10 ft., skirmish (+1d6, +1 AC), trackless step
6) Fighter: 3rd [Titan Fighting]
7) Scout: 4th Bonus feat[Underfoot Combat] (retrain Tumble)
8) Fighter: 4th [Confound the Big Folk]
9) Scout: 5th [Mobility], Evasion, skirmish (+2d6, +1 AC)
10) EWM: 1st
11) Fighter: 5th
12) EWM: 2nd [Elusive Target]
13) Scout: 6th Flawless stride
14) EWM: 3rd
15) Fighter: 6th [][]

The last few feats I'm open to ideas.

Needs Exotic Weapon Proficiency in there somewhere :).

I had considered gnome, but Titan Fighting didn't strike me as good enough to be better than +2 dex and +1 to all saves from being a halfling. I like the order of classes, and scout could be good for more movement, some precision damage, and extra feats. I still like rogue better though, sneak attack will be more useful than skirmish overall. Using more fighter levels to pick up the Elusive Target chain is a good idea, I'll see if I can make it fit.
Mithrus
04-14-07, 09:05 AM Needs Exotic Weapon Proficiency in there somewhere :).
As for exotic weapon proficiency, gnome hooked hammer will work, although spiked chain would be far better if I could figure out which feat to swap out for it. Even with as many feats as this class has, it could still use more ;)
I still like rogue better though, sneak attack will be more useful than skirmish overall.I had forgotten that CtBF makes the target flat footed, so sneak attack every attack would be better, since you would get quite a few bonuses to attack for the iteratives. Too bad that totally messes up the feat progression...:( Also, IMO, Elusive Target in these builds is a must. The bonus move from scout also helps a ton. Move 20' just plain stinks for things like jumping etc.
magebeast
04-14-07, 01:32 PM I had forgotten that CtBF makes the target flat footed, so sneak attack every attack would be better, since you would get quite a few bonuses to attack for the iteratives. Too bad that totally messes up the feat progression...:( Also, IMO, Elusive Target in these builds is a must. The bonus move from scout also helps a ton. Move 20' just plain stinks for things like jumping etc.

Not quite a must. Japangirl survives as a frontliner rogue at the moment without it!

Although she does complain a lot after the fact.
zstinger
04-16-07, 12:14 AM I am also building up a halfling along similar lines and find it rather sub-optimal. CtBF does help with removing the heftly size bonuses of big folk. However, +4 to str check from improved trip will not help a dex build since by RAW, it only applies to "strength checks made to trip opponent".

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Japangirl 04-11-07, 07:19 PM	Spiked Chain Halfling Str: 10 (4) Dex: 18 (10) Con: 15 (8) Int: 14 (6) Wis: 8 (0) Cha: 8 (0) Bump Dex 2, Con 1 1 Fighter: Exotic Weapon Proficiency (Spiked Chain), Weapon Finesse 2 Fighter: Weapon Focus (Spiked Chain) 3 Fighter: Combat Reflexes 4 Fighter: Combat Expertise 5 Rogue: +1d6 sneak attack, trap sense +1, trapfinding 6 Rogue: Evasion, Improved Trip 7 Rogue: +2d6 sneak attack 8 Exotic Weapon Master: Flurry of Strikes 9 Exotic Weapon Master: AoO through cover, Underfoot Combat (RoW) 10 Exotic Weapon Master: Improved Trip 11 Rogue: Uncanny Dodge 12 ??: Confound the Bigger Folk (RoW) 13 ??: 14 ??: 15 ??: Weapon Spec (Spiked Chain) or Deadly Defense (CS) This is obviously incomplete, it's just something I was playing around with. It doesn't really hit peak power until level 12, but it's a decent damage dealer/tank before that. At 12, you run under something that is large or bigger and can standard action trip it. You use your Dex or Str, whichever is higher (Dex, obviously), and the creature loses all size bonuses to the Trip attempt. You also gain all the other bonuses of Underfoot Combat and Confound the Bigger Folk.
clannagh 04-11-07, 07:22 PM	Spiked Chain Halfling Str: 10 (4) Dex: 18 (10) Con: 15 (8) Int: 14 (6) Wis: 8 (0) Cha: 8 (0) Bump Dex 2, Con 1 1 Fighter: Exotic Weapon Proficiency (Spiked Chain), Weapon Finesse 2 Fighter: Weapon Focus (Spiked Chain) 3 Fighter: Combat Reflexes 4 Fighter: Combat Expertise 5 Rogue: +1d6 sneak attack, trap sense +1, trapfinding 6 Rogue: Evasion, Improved Trip 7 Rogue: +2d6 sneak attack 8 Exotic Weapon Master: Flurry of Strikes 9 Exotic Weapon Master: AoO through cover, Underfoot Combat (RoW) 10 Rogue: Uncanny Dodge 11 ??: 12 ??: Confound the Bigger Folk (RoW) 13 ??: 14 ??: 15 ??: Weapon Spec (Spiked Chain) or Deadly Defense (CS) This is obviously incomplete, it's just something I was playing around with. It doesn't really hit peak power until level 12, but it's a decent damage dealer/tank before that. At 12, you run under something that is large or bigger and can standard action trip it. You use your Dex or Str, whichever is higher (Dex, obviously), and the creature loses all size bonuses to the Trip attempt. You also gain all the other bonuses of Underfoot Combat and Confound the Bigger Folk. how about 11 Exotic Weapon Master: Trip .. spiked chain for another +2 to the trips
Japangirl 04-11-07, 07:25 PM	Uh, right. I thought I had all three levels in there. Oops! Added to the build up top.
clannagh 04-11-07, 07:52 PM	coupla other thoughts - this feat order might make you more effective below 6 ... 1 Fighter: Exotic Weapon Proficiency (Spiked Chain), Weapon Finesse 2 Fighter: Combat Expertise 3 Fighter: Improved Trip 4 Fighter: Combat Reflexes 5 Rogue: +1d6 sneak attack, trap sense +1, trapfinding 6 Rogue: Evasion, Weapon Focus (Spiked Chain) - adding 3 levels of swashie would get you finesse for free and INT to damage but delay your build (probably too much) - other feats that work well with chain builds are deft opportunist, hold the line and power attack.
cycloptic_squirrel 04-12-07, 01:06 AM	coupla other thoughts - adding 3 levels of swashie would get you finesse for free and INT to damage but delay your build (probably too much) Why not just throw it in instead of a few levels of fighter? If you set up like so you can trade Combat Reflexes for an extra die of sneak attack damage and a dodge bonus, with the option of taking the third level of swashbuckler at any point after level seven to add intellegence to damage. 1 Swashbuckler: Exotic Weapon Proficiency (Spiked Chain), Weapon Finesse 2 Rogue: +1d6 sneak attack, trapfinding 3 Fighter: Combat Expertise, Improved Trip 4 Rogue: Evasion 5 Swashbuckler: Grace +1 6 Rogue: trap sense +1, Daring Outlaw, +3d6 sneak attack 7 Fighter:Weapon Focus (Spiked Chain)
thorinXXX 04-12-07, 11:34 AM	With a halfling's -4 due to size you will either be tripped or have to drop your weapon most of the time. I would suggest finding a way to include either the Prone Fighting feat or a level in Thief Acrobat to reduce these effects. Damage output is negligable, no strength bonus, no Power Attack, insignificant sneak dice. Tripping is pitiful. -4 at 1st level, 0 at 6th level, +2 at 8th level with maybe a +1 from Gauntlets at 6th, and maybe a +2 from a belt at 10th. When tripping you use St. When resisting a trip you may use St or Dx. You may only trip something one size larger than you. PHB pg 158
Jay_Ibero_911 04-12-07, 04:13 PM	With a halfling's -4 due to size you will either be tripped or have to drop your weapon most of the time. I would suggest finding a way to include either the Prone Fighting feat or a level in Thief Acrobat to reduce these effects. Damage output is negligable, no strength bonus, no Power Attack, insignificant sneak dice. Tripping is pitiful. -4 at 1st level, 0 at 6th level, +2 at 8th level with maybe a +1 from Gauntlets at 6th, and maybe a +2 from a belt at 10th. When tripping you use St. When resisting a trip you may use St or Dx. You may only trip something one size larger than you. PHB pg 158 Confound the Big Fold specifically allows you to use Dex to trip and allows you to trip things 2 or more sizes bigger than you and denies them their size bonuses on resist, and even if you fail they can't try to trip you back...and that's just one of the abilities granted by the tactical feat...
Alpha_Nerd 04-12-07, 04:49 PM	Once you get CtBF you're going to be amazing at tripping, unfortunately until then you're pretty sub-par :(
Mommy was an Orc 04-12-07, 05:45 PM	Confound the Big Fold specifically allows you to use Dex to trip and allows you to trip things 2 or more sizes bigger than you and denies them their size bonuses on resist, and even if you fail they can't try to trip you back...and that's just one of the abilities granted by the tactical feat... Well, somewhat. The problem with this use of CtBF is that you need to: Enter their square. Wait until the next round, hoping they don't decide to 5' step away from you or worse, take a full attack against you(say via grappling you...) Make a standard action trying to trip someone when they would be considered flatfooted against your full attack.
Lomiat 04-12-07, 06:24 PM	While Confound the Big Folk removes any bonuses opposing creatures gain to their trip checks based on size, it doesn't remove your penalties to trip checks, does it? Furthermore, I don't believe it removes any bonuses opposing creatures gain to their trip checks based on multiple legs. As far as I'm concerned, that makes it a "quirky" idea, rather than a solid one.
Japangirl 04-13-07, 03:43 PM	This isn't a terribly solid build and I'm fully aware of it. It just looked like something fun to play with. Add more rogue levels for more sneak dice at high levels, maybe. Or add fighter levels to pick up feats like Power Attack. This build is actually an awesome tripper. It's better at tripping huge things than medium creatures, just as good at tripping large things, and won't bother trying to trip medium things since I can't stand in their square anyways. The four-legged bonus doesn't go away, that is true, but a medium tripper has to deal with that too. And the attack routine isn't nearly that bad. You want to hit touch AC for trip attacks anyways, so tumble into their square (one move action) and then trip attack (standard action). Now improved trip means you get an attack (but they're not flat footed so no sneak attack on this one). Now they're prone and you're in their squares after only one round of actions.
Zanzibax 04-13-07, 03:48 PM	With a halfling's -4 due to size you will either be tripped or have to drop your weapon most of the time. I would suggest finding a way to include either the Prone Fighting feat or a level in Thief Acrobat to reduce these effects. Damage output is negligable, no strength bonus, no Power Attack, insignificant sneak dice. Tripping is pitiful. -4 at 1st level, 0 at 6th level, +2 at 8th level with maybe a +1 from Gauntlets at 6th, and maybe a +2 from a belt at 10th. When tripping you use St. When resisting a trip you may use St or Dx. You may only trip something one size larger than you. PHB pg 158 The damn thing would be underfoot though.
Mommy was an Orc 04-13-07, 04:15 PM	And the attack routine isn't nearly that bad. You want to hit touch AC for trip attacks anyways, so tumble into their square (one move action) and then trip attack (standard action). Now improved trip means you get an attack (but they're not flat footed so no sneak attack on this one). Now they're prone and you're in their squares after only one round of actions. The feat doesn't actually work that way. You move in on the first round and then 'On the next round, you can use a standard action to attempt to trip...' - at which point, if they're still on top of you, you could instead treat them as flatfooted against all your attacks.
Mithrus 04-13-07, 10:47 PM	If instead of halfling, have you considered using gnome and taking Titan Fighting as well? Also, instead of rogue, use scout and skirmish for damage and bonus to move? Take the Improved Skirmish feat from CS if you can get your move to 40+ reliably. I'm thinking something like Scout7/Fighter8. Sorry I haven't spent much time on a specific build, but I think this might be a similarly effective build. 1) Scout: 1st [Weapon Finesse],Skirmish (+1d6), trapfinding 2) Scout: 2nd Battle fortitude +1, uncanny dodge 3) Fighter: 1st [Combat Expertise][Improved Trip] 4) Fighter: 2nd [Dodge] 5) Scout: 3rd Fast movement +10 ft., skirmish (+1d6, +1 AC), trackless step 6) Fighter: 3rd [Titan Fighting] 7) Scout: 4th Bonus feat[Underfoot Combat] (retrain Tumble) 8) Fighter: 4th [Confound the Big Folk] 9) Scout: 5th [Mobility], Evasion, skirmish (+2d6, +1 AC) 10) EWM: 1st 11) Fighter: 5th 12) EWM: 2nd [Elusive Target] 13) Scout: 6th Flawless stride 14) EWM: 3rd 15) Fighter: 6th [][] The last few feats I'm open to ideas.
Japangirl 04-14-07, 04:04 AM	If instead of halfling, have you considered using gnome and taking Titan Fighting as well? Also, instead of rogue, use scout and skirmish for damage and bonus to move? Take the Improved Skirmish feat from CS if you can get your move to 40+ reliably. I'm thinking something like Scout7/Fighter8. Sorry I haven't spent much time on a specific build, but I think this might be a similarly effective build. 1) Scout: 1st [Weapon Finesse],Skirmish (+1d6), trapfinding 2) Scout: 2nd Battle fortitude +1, uncanny dodge 3) Fighter: 1st [Combat Expertise][Improved Trip] 4) Fighter: 2nd [Dodge] 5) Scout: 3rd Fast movement +10 ft., skirmish (+1d6, +1 AC), trackless step 6) Fighter: 3rd [Titan Fighting] 7) Scout: 4th Bonus feat[Underfoot Combat] (retrain Tumble) 8) Fighter: 4th [Confound the Big Folk] 9) Scout: 5th [Mobility], Evasion, skirmish (+2d6, +1 AC) 10) EWM: 1st 11) Fighter: 5th 12) EWM: 2nd [Elusive Target] 13) Scout: 6th Flawless stride 14) EWM: 3rd 15) Fighter: 6th [][] The last few feats I'm open to ideas. Needs Exotic Weapon Proficiency in there somewhere :). I had considered gnome, but Titan Fighting didn't strike me as good enough to be better than +2 dex and +1 to all saves from being a halfling. I like the order of classes, and scout could be good for more movement, some precision damage, and extra feats. I still like rogue better though, sneak attack will be more useful than skirmish overall. Using more fighter levels to pick up the Elusive Target chain is a good idea, I'll see if I can make it fit.
Mithrus 04-14-07, 09:05 AM	Needs Exotic Weapon Proficiency in there somewhere :). As for exotic weapon proficiency, gnome hooked hammer will work, although spiked chain would be far better if I could figure out which feat to swap out for it. Even with as many feats as this class has, it could still use more ;) I still like rogue better though, sneak attack will be more useful than skirmish overall.I had forgotten that CtBF makes the target flat footed, so sneak attack every attack would be better, since you would get quite a few bonuses to attack for the iteratives. Too bad that totally messes up the feat progression...:( Also, IMO, Elusive Target in these builds is a must. The bonus move from scout also helps a ton. Move 20' just plain stinks for things like jumping etc.
magebeast 04-14-07, 01:32 PM	I had forgotten that CtBF makes the target flat footed, so sneak attack every attack would be better, since you would get quite a few bonuses to attack for the iteratives. Too bad that totally messes up the feat progression...:( Also, IMO, Elusive Target in these builds is a must. The bonus move from scout also helps a ton. Move 20' just plain stinks for things like jumping etc. Not quite a must. Japangirl survives as a frontliner rogue at the moment without it! Although she does complain a lot after the fact.
zstinger 04-16-07, 12:14 AM	I am also building up a halfling along similar lines and find it rather sub-optimal. CtBF does help with removing the heftly size bonuses of big folk. However, +4 to str check from improved trip will not help a dex build since by RAW, it only applies to "strength checks made to trip opponent".