Healer/ Tank [Archive] - Wizards Community

Healer/ Tank [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
The_Jester
10-17-06, 03:52 PM My area seems to be short in both and I'm debating making a new character that does a little of both.

Any advice on designing a cleric or favoured soul that can also take a hit.
What are the pros and cons for the two different classes?
kenobi65
10-17-06, 04:15 PM While favored soul has some nice features (and can be a good class if you don't want to deal with maintaining a daily spell list), it isn't generally as flexible as a cleric.

Clerics know every spell on their spell list, and most clerics are going to be able to spontaneously cast their cure spells. If a favored soul wants to cast cure spells, those eat up slots on their (fairly small) list of spells known.

Clerics can turn undead...or use those turn attempts to power feats. Favored souls don't get to turn undead at all.

Clerics get 2 domains, with both the bonus spells (some of which aren't normally available to clerics at all) and the domain abilities.
Japangirl
10-17-06, 04:53 PM Favored souls get all the buff spells available to clerics, and weapon focus and spec for free. If you want to be a tank and cleric, favored souls have a lot of potential. Of course, buffing rounds do hurt but at least at later levels they often give you 2-3 rounds to buff simply because you saw them coming or knew what was coming.

The reason I'd go with cleric over favored soul, though, is pearls of power. Clerics can use them, favored souls can't. Enough said.
Iswald
10-17-06, 10:41 PM Favored souls also lack knowledge [religion] as a class skill which cuts into their PrC and possibly meta-org options. Also, they need two stats for spell casting unless they focus on buffing and healing (which is likely to be the case here) and wouldn't be able to put as many points into physical abilities. One more downside of favored souls as tanks is the lack of heavy armor proficiency (your dex will be low).
The_Jester
10-18-06, 01:02 AM Thanks.
What are some good race options? Dwarf might be good despite the hit to Cha, simply because I can ignore dexterity for AC and just buy heavy armour.

Any prestige classes that I simply have to look at?
Cynric
10-18-06, 02:00 AM I hate to derail the line of thought, but I have another suggestion.

In my local are, there was a noticible lack of the same types. My druid generally ended up doing both. I fixed the problem in the last rebuiuld by taking a level of Beastmaster. The animal companion does the damage and with spontaneous healer and a few prepared spells I am good for the healing requirements. Plus if you go human you can play around with augment summoning by level 12 and then things become ridiculous.
Lupo
10-18-06, 03:13 AM I hate to derail the line of thought, but I have another suggestion.

In my local are, there was a noticible lack of the same types. My druid generally ended up doing both. I fixed the problem in the last rebuiuld by taking a level of Beastmaster. The animal companion does the damage and with spontaneous healer and a few prepared spells I am good for the healing requirements. Plus if you go human you can play around with augment summoning by level 12 and then things become ridiculous.

from druid leel 7 onwards you always can summon one or more unicorns, they make excellent large speed bumps, have a circle of protection from evil always active, can do some healing and poison removal and are good chargers on undead, just need a touch attack to deliver some positive energy.

ciao

martin m.
WCrawford
10-18-06, 04:43 AM A cleric with the war domain can make a very good tank at early levels and have spells for healing. Taking Craft Magic Arms and Armor will allow the cleric to remain a capable tank throughout the entire career.

Throw in power attack and craft wonderous items and the cleric is capable of filling just about any role that may be needed in a party that may be deficient by adjusting prepared spells and magic items.

I generally suggest humans for clerics due to the additional feat at 1st level.
Iswald
10-18-06, 10:35 AM What are some good race options? Dwarf might be good despite the hit to Cha, simply because I can ignore dexterity for AC and just buy heavy armour.

As long as you don't intend to turn anything, ever, then dwarves are pretty good and you can dump charisma. But, if you want to use DMM or DSP or any other turning based feat, then you probably want to be human or perhaps wild elf (though you'd have to watch your hps).

If you want just a straight cleric, which is powerful enough in itself, without skills or turning, then half-orc should work well.

Radient Servant of Pelor (or other brand), is intended mainly for healing and turning. But, it also gives martial weapon proficiencies if you take just a single level for that. Combat medic (HB) can shore up your reflex save and has some very nice features, but costs two sub-optimal feats and is limited (it has wizard BAB which is easily overcome with the appropriate spell). Some players like warpriest (full BAB), but it only has 1/2 spell progression. Three other good PrCs for clerics are contemplative, sacred exorcist and divine inquisitor, though their benefits are less obvious while tanking.
Donald_Cannith
10-22-06, 11:23 AM I personally like gnomes in this build.. granted they have low strength but if your tankingyou arent aiming to deal a ton of damage jsut take it.a gnome can then easily get 10 str.16 con and 15 wis and dump all other stats. Eventually you can go warpriest in this buildandt hen things get really fun.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
The_Jester 10-17-06, 03:52 PM	My area seems to be short in both and I'm debating making a new character that does a little of both. Any advice on designing a cleric or favoured soul that can also take a hit. What are the pros and cons for the two different classes?
kenobi65 10-17-06, 04:15 PM	While favored soul has some nice features (and can be a good class if you don't want to deal with maintaining a daily spell list), it isn't generally as flexible as a cleric. Clerics know every spell on their spell list, and most clerics are going to be able to spontaneously cast their cure spells. If a favored soul wants to cast cure spells, those eat up slots on their (fairly small) list of spells known. Clerics can turn undead...or use those turn attempts to power feats. Favored souls don't get to turn undead at all. Clerics get 2 domains, with both the bonus spells (some of which aren't normally available to clerics at all) and the domain abilities.
Japangirl 10-17-06, 04:53 PM	Favored souls get all the buff spells available to clerics, and weapon focus and spec for free. If you want to be a tank and cleric, favored souls have a lot of potential. Of course, buffing rounds do hurt but at least at later levels they often give you 2-3 rounds to buff simply because you saw them coming or knew what was coming. The reason I'd go with cleric over favored soul, though, is pearls of power. Clerics can use them, favored souls can't. Enough said.
Iswald 10-17-06, 10:41 PM	Favored souls also lack knowledge [religion] as a class skill which cuts into their PrC and possibly meta-org options. Also, they need two stats for spell casting unless they focus on buffing and healing (which is likely to be the case here) and wouldn't be able to put as many points into physical abilities. One more downside of favored souls as tanks is the lack of heavy armor proficiency (your dex will be low).
The_Jester 10-18-06, 01:02 AM	Thanks. What are some good race options? Dwarf might be good despite the hit to Cha, simply because I can ignore dexterity for AC and just buy heavy armour. Any prestige classes that I simply have to look at?
Cynric 10-18-06, 02:00 AM	I hate to derail the line of thought, but I have another suggestion. In my local are, there was a noticible lack of the same types. My druid generally ended up doing both. I fixed the problem in the last rebuiuld by taking a level of Beastmaster. The animal companion does the damage and with spontaneous healer and a few prepared spells I am good for the healing requirements. Plus if you go human you can play around with augment summoning by level 12 and then things become ridiculous.
Lupo 10-18-06, 03:13 AM	I hate to derail the line of thought, but I have another suggestion. In my local are, there was a noticible lack of the same types. My druid generally ended up doing both. I fixed the problem in the last rebuiuld by taking a level of Beastmaster. The animal companion does the damage and with spontaneous healer and a few prepared spells I am good for the healing requirements. Plus if you go human you can play around with augment summoning by level 12 and then things become ridiculous. from druid leel 7 onwards you always can summon one or more unicorns, they make excellent large speed bumps, have a circle of protection from evil always active, can do some healing and poison removal and are good chargers on undead, just need a touch attack to deliver some positive energy. ciao martin m.
WCrawford 10-18-06, 04:43 AM	A cleric with the war domain can make a very good tank at early levels and have spells for healing. Taking Craft Magic Arms and Armor will allow the cleric to remain a capable tank throughout the entire career. Throw in power attack and craft wonderous items and the cleric is capable of filling just about any role that may be needed in a party that may be deficient by adjusting prepared spells and magic items. I generally suggest humans for clerics due to the additional feat at 1st level.
Iswald 10-18-06, 10:35 AM	What are some good race options? Dwarf might be good despite the hit to Cha, simply because I can ignore dexterity for AC and just buy heavy armour. As long as you don't intend to turn anything, ever, then dwarves are pretty good and you can dump charisma. But, if you want to use DMM or DSP or any other turning based feat, then you probably want to be human or perhaps wild elf (though you'd have to watch your hps). If you want just a straight cleric, which is powerful enough in itself, without skills or turning, then half-orc should work well. Radient Servant of Pelor (or other brand), is intended mainly for healing and turning. But, it also gives martial weapon proficiencies if you take just a single level for that. Combat medic (HB) can shore up your reflex save and has some very nice features, but costs two sub-optimal feats and is limited (it has wizard BAB which is easily overcome with the appropriate spell). Some players like warpriest (full BAB), but it only has 1/2 spell progression. Three other good PrCs for clerics are contemplative, sacred exorcist and divine inquisitor, though their benefits are less obvious while tanking.
Donald_Cannith 10-22-06, 11:23 AM	I personally like gnomes in this build.. granted they have low strength but if your tankingyou arent aiming to deal a ton of damage jsut take it.a gnome can then easily get 10 str.16 con and 15 wis and dump all other stats. Eventually you can go warpriest in this buildandt hen things get really fun.