Post/Author/DateTime	Post
tlotig 08-13-07, 08:51 AM	Ok so My warmage 7 got access to a healing belt. 3 charges a day, 1 charge 2d8 healing 2 charge 3d8 healing 3 charge 4d8 healing cost 750. can be used on others given that it costs the same as a wand of CLW but never runs out is this over powered. for the price i think i will buy 3-4.
Banor 08-13-07, 09:08 AM	Its not broken as you will probably wont dominate an encounter with it (or break a mod) but its for sure a damn great item
tlotig 08-13-07, 09:34 AM	true probably should have said is healing belt too good
jimmy_dowdall 08-13-07, 09:35 AM	damm right where can i get me one of those
Hariman 08-13-07, 09:50 AM	It's a good item, but the max you can get out of it is 6d8 healing. It's a nice item, and many of my characters would buy one if they didn't have another item for the belt slot.
Iswald 08-13-07, 09:50 AM	I recommend crafting as many as you can and giving them out to your companions to use! This frees druids from the pesky task of healing. Also, it lets people save the cleric if they go down.
Rerednaw 08-13-07, 10:33 AM	Also grants a +2 to your healing check. Nice item at low to mid-levels. Of course you have to be as lucky as the OP and gain access. (Considering my wizard 9 is STILL looking for POP1 access). :) I do not think it is broken so much as many many other items in the MIC. And as a wizard who has spent thousands on scrolls to see them go poof, I'd be MUCH happier if there were MORE x/day items versus throw gp at the monster items. In fact I think the question should be more of, in LG are x/day items broken compared to consumable items. I do not think so, considering how difficult it is to retain wealth in LG, I'd welcome the change. And if they were truly broken, then you had better starting banning other x/day things like POPs, rings, rods, many wondrous items, plus a bunch of stuff in the MIC.
zoinks69 08-13-07, 10:54 AM	Is there any "attunement" time (do you have to wear it for a day or week before you can use it)? If not, it's pretty nice. If there is a waiting period, I'd say it's iffy -- Melee types will have Str belts, casters will likely have dwarvenkind or endurance. Still, for the price, it'd be worth picking one up if you don't already have a belt.
_metz_ 08-13-07, 11:08 AM	Ok so My warmage 7 got access to a healing belt. 3 charges a day, 1 charge 2d8 healing 2 charge 3d8 healing 3 charge 4d8 healing cost 750. can be used on others given that it costs the same as a wand of CLW but never runs out is this over powered. for the price i think i will buy 3-4. Not broken. But stupidly good. Sarian will buy a few of the things, they are darn good. Yay for the access we got.
Reylance 08-13-07, 11:27 AM	There is no attunement necessary, which is what makes the item broken. Say you're a 12th level fighter with your belt of giant strength +6. You battle, you take damage. After the battle is over, and you're doing out-of-combat healing, you take off your belt of giant strength +6, don your healing belt, expend three charges, and heal 6d8 points of damage without taxing the cleric's spells or your wands. If you needed to wear the belt for 24 hours to use it, then it would be balanced. Since you don't, every PC should buy one (or ten) when they find access. In running my first 3rd edition home campaign, I found I didn't want to give out wands of cure light wounds. If you can freely heal yourself, there's rarely any tough decision to make. Do we pull back and rest? Can we survive another battle?
UMiskatonic 08-13-07, 12:23 PM	While resource management is fun and all, a healing belt won't help you decide whether to chase the villian, or rescue the princess. Plot and character decisions are still as valid as ever. That said, I think a healing belt is just fine. The guy with 6 healing belts is going to need them, cuz I spent my money on full plate and a +1 greatsword. Generally, a party can find a way to heal everyone when there's no danger. There isn't a lot of difference between a healing belt, and a wand of CLW, or a wand of lesser vigor, or 30 CLW scrolls. The important thing to realize is that there's a real limit on hit points per turn. If the fire giant is determined to crush your party, no healing belt will help. He can easily dish out more than you can take. And if I'm that fire giant, I would be thrilled to have you spend three rounds switching belts and using one to heal your self. I'm pretty sure I can kill your wizard in 12 seconds, which includes travel time.
Grantor 08-13-07, 12:42 PM	I agree with some of the recent sentiments. If you could heal others with the belt, it might be too good, but since it is limited to yourself and uses an action, it's not going to be useful except when it is taking your actions away from finishing the combat.
jstorrie 08-13-07, 12:52 PM	It's not broken. Wands of Lesser Vigor are already economical enough for out-of-combat healing that you won't see much savings from buying a belt of healing, and as UMiskatonic points out above, you'll need more healing if you invest your limited resources in this instead of items that make your character more effective.
Reylance 08-13-07, 01:01 PM	750 gp is chump change after 6th level or so, and it pays for itself in ten days of combat if you use 3 charges to replace 5 charges from a wand of cure light wounds, twenty days if you replace 2 or 3 charges from a wand of lesser vigor.
cycloptic_squirrel 08-13-07, 01:57 PM	I find it overpowered like so many other things in the MIC. I suppose once these items become more and more common it won't bother me as much, but until then, I'm still operating under the old mindset, which finds this too good for the price it's listed. I think I'd be happy with the MIC if there was a blanket rule that every wearable item required a time to attune itself; 24 hours would be nice, but I think 4 hours would work just as well. 24 hours could work if you could freely remove the item and stay attuned (using another item in that slot would break the attunement). As long as I'm wishing, I'd like a bagel.
Tanath 08-13-07, 01:59 PM	I agree with some of the recent sentiments. If you could heal others with the belt, it might be too good, but since it is limited to yourself and uses an action, it's not going to be useful except when it is taking your actions away from finishing the combat. You certainly can heal others with the belt. Its a lay-on-hands effect. My druid has purchased one, and plans to buy more.
cetiken 08-13-07, 03:42 PM	I think that its a fine out of combat healing item at mid levels and good in combat for low levels. I don't think its all that super good and probably priced about right. You might not have noticed, but before MIC 99% of all magic items were priced such that they were unusable - which I'm sure makes those DMs who hate magic items happy, but not many PCs. The short list of items that weren't overpriced included most of what is available in core access - Baccob's Book, Pearls of Power, Stat Items, and a few weapon and armor enchantments. And things that cost in excess of 20k gp which LG characters cannot reasonably expect to buy. What MIC did is create a lot of cheap items that are worthwhile without being consumable. It is in fact a different way of looking at things and personally I welcome the Healing Belt and what it represents.
Sieylianna 08-13-07, 04:56 PM	It's incredibly good. I've seen multiple people with access who have bought 4-6 of them, so everyone at a table with them can have some in-combat healing. Ed
cetiken 08-13-07, 06:52 PM	It's incredibly good. I've seen multiple people with access who have bought 4-6 of them, so everyone at a table with them can have some in-combat healing. That's their choice to do so. Personally, I think anyone who drops ~4k gp should have some significant benefit. And except in the most dire circumstances I consider it a waste of a standard action to heal 4-32 hp (average 18).
AOSOL 08-13-07, 08:27 PM	I would spend my next 5,000 on those belts. Now I just need to find access to some.
Sieylianna 08-13-07, 10:34 PM	And except in the most dire circumstances I consider it a waste of a standard action to heal 4-32 hp (average 18). What it means is that if you're in bad shape, you're not disrupting the rest of the party, by forcing someone to heal you. And that 4d8 is slightly less than a cure serious wounds at minimum caster level. Ed
Iswald 08-13-07, 11:12 PM	Don't forget that it is a wondrous item (meaning more people can craft it than wands). It not only takes a standard action to use but, it also provokes an AoO when you do use it. This is one factor in favor of using wands in combat.
boolean 08-14-07, 01:28 AM	I think most forms of access (especially Adventure access) should have a limit to how many of the item a player can purchase. If you defeat an enemy who has one Healing Belt, it doesn't really make sense that you could buy four or five. The item wouldn't need a "recharge period" if you were only allowed to buy one. Sure, this line of reasoning could be taken too far. Most items should realistically be limited to one per table, not one per player, but that leads to the same problems we had back in the days when the campaign used certificates for magic items. It also doesn't stop a character with Craft Wondrous from making a bunch of these items.
Hariman 08-14-07, 09:00 AM	They're a really good item. Especially for a rogue who wants a way to damage undead or heal the party when he's up against uncrittables. BUT, other have mentioned that they compete with belts of giant strength for the belt slot. And I'm pretty sure there's a "Belt of Dwarvenkind" which grants +2 CON, among other things. BUT, belts aren't that common, and at 750 GP, putting one on another character if you can't wear it is a no brainer. The great flaw is the healing is limited to a maximum of 4d8 at one time. As was mentioned before: Items like the Healing Belt exemplify the point of the MIC. Change the pricing of magic items so that players will USE them and purchase them before, or with, their "Must Have items". It's not broken, it's just the new standard of useful.
Mommy was an Orc 08-14-07, 10:02 AM	I think it is a little too efficient for what it does - an Eternal Wand of Lesser Vigor heals 22 hp a day and costs slightly more, this heals 27 hp on average and doesn't require the user to be a Cleric/Druid. Broken, no. But it shouldn't be so good, even by MIC standards.
Hariman 08-14-07, 10:40 AM	I think it is a little too efficient for what it does - an Eternal Wand of Lesser Vigor heals 22 hp a day and costs slightly more, this heals 27 hp on average and doesn't require the user to be a Cleric/Druid. Broken, no. But it shouldn't be so good, even by MIC standards. But as good as it is, it won't replace wands of CLW and Lesser Vigor. Even if it DOES heal 27 HP a day, average, that's nothing compared to what wands of CLW and Lesser Vigor can do. BUT, if they really are underpriced, then the price shouldn't go up more than a little bit. Otherwise, they'll be overpriced. So, now I've got a hypothetical question: If your character had only a few scrolls and potions of healing (and no other healing), and you had 750 GP to spend, would you buy a Wand of CLW or a Healing Belt?
cetiken 08-14-07, 11:56 AM	So, now I've got a hypothetical question: If your character had only a few scrolls and potions of healing (and no other healing), and you had 750 GP to spend, would you buy a Wand of CLW or a Healing Belt? Depends. At low levels (<5) I think the healing belt is really good. So is the wand of CLWs my level 2 bard carries around. If my character can't use the wand then defiantly the healing belt. Otherwise I think taking the wand would be my first priority (assuming access that will let me buy the belt later). If I could use a Wand of Lesser Vigor I'd take that as my preferred out of combat item every time after level 5. But then I'm one of those who thinks its fair. ;)
Mommy was an Orc 08-14-07, 07:20 PM	If your character had only a few scrolls and potions of healing (and no other healing), and you had 750 GP to spend, would you buy a Wand of CLW or a Healing Belt? Healing Belt. Not even a question. A Healing Belt essentially heals 27 hp of damage per day at no resource cost other than the day. That's the equivalent of 5 charges off of a Wand of CLW. Yes, there might be days where the Wand is better. But they're not going to be that common, and the savings will buy another belt...
Jay_Ibero_911 08-14-07, 08:14 PM	I'd love to get access to one of those with my druid. 1 tu and 1875gp crafting for 30d8 healing every day Never need a wand of CLW again. Maybe make 10 just to be safe.
Timlagor 08-14-07, 10:03 PM	Beats hell out of the PoP1-Lesser Vigor that is the previous most efficient form of out of combat healing and anyone can do it. There might still be a case for Happy Sticks for emergencies but this is definitely a very good item -and the ability to blow it in combat is still significant if the situation warrants it (especially for the 'squishies')
Arcane Guyver 08-14-07, 10:55 PM	Way too good. Just from the responses on this topic, it sounds like you'd have to be pretty dumb to pass up acquiring at least one if you have access.
Hariman 08-15-07, 04:54 AM	Way too good. Just from the responses on this topic, it sounds like you'd have to be pretty dumb to pass up acquiring at least one if you have access. But a maximum of 6d8 is no substitute for wands of CLW and Lesser Vigor when out of combat. Nor is it a substitute for having a cleric. It just provides a little healing for those who have none. Or extra healing for those that do. The only thing about it that might need to change is the price might need to go up just a little. It's like a Heward's Fortifying bedroll, it's useful, but not the be all end all of such an item. Even if a caster uses a Heward's Fortifying Bedroll, they still lose any spells they cast within the last 8 hours from the new allotment of spells.
Timlagor 08-15-07, 07:14 AM	Fortifying Bedroll is also only usable every other day and no Wizard would even contemplate passing it up. I seriously considered crafting two in case I adventure with another arcanist and its use came up. (I've had one for two adventures and used it twice in the second one ..and would have used it cosmetically in the first if my brain had been working properly) I agree that you should have a Wand for when you need a *lot* of healing on the same day. However this item sets a new benchmark in efficiency -smashing Pearls of Power for Lesser Vigor by a Cleric with Augment Healing ..even if you throw in the generous ruling of Healthful Rest! (32hp/day for 1,000gp v. ~27Hp/day for 750gp: over 10% cheaper on average ...and I don't allow that interpretation of Healthful Rest) All that and the in-combat application is far from insignificant. It certainly won't be putting Clerics out of business and PoPs have a lot more value than just healing but this item is amazingly good value.
Hariman 08-15-07, 09:50 AM	Fortifying Bedroll is also only usable every other day and no Wizard would even contemplate passing it up. I seriously considered crafting two in case I adventure with another arcanist and its use came up. (I've had one for two adventures and used it twice in the second one ..and would have used it cosmetically in the first if my brain had been working properly) I agree that you should have a Wand for when you need a *lot* of healing on the same day. However this item sets a new benchmark in efficiency -smashing Pearls of Power for Lesser Vigor by a Cleric with Augment Healing ..even if you throw in the generous ruling of Healthful Rest! (32hp/day for 1,000gp v. ~27Hp/day for 750gp: over 10% cheaper on average ...and I don't allow that interpretation of Healthful Rest) All that and the in-combat application is far from insignificant. It certainly won't be putting Clerics out of business and PoPs have a lot more value than just healing but this item is amazingly good value. No argument here. But my prior statements about the MIC setting new standards for pricing and usefulness stands.
Jay_Ibero_911 08-15-07, 02:18 PM	But a maximum of 6d8 is no substitute for wands of CLW and Lesser Vigor when out of combat. I'd say it's an awesome substitute when out of combat. Especially if you are able to craft them. Craft 10 belts at the cost of buying 5 wands, and have the equivalent of a full wand of CLW available every single day (60d8 vs. 5d8+50). Never buy another clw wand again, and most likely use the belt charges more frivolously than you would have used wand charges, making your life much easier.
Wraith235 08-15-07, 03:24 PM	No argument here. But my prior statements about the MIC setting new standards for pricing and usefulness stands. I so agree with this statement .... HoB - Rod of Arming - 15k MIC - Ring of Arming - 5k they do the same thing and I dont mind giving up a ring slot for this ....
Arassuil 08-15-07, 08:12 PM	I'd have to say that the Healing Belt isn't necessarily broken, but *very* useful. I have a 9th level cleric (who is running through Red Hand of Doom right now, very near the end) who would *love* to have this item. Through sheer luck, he picked up 5 Pearl of Power (1st), and 1 Pearl of Power (2nd). He still have some access to pick up more 2nd level ones, and will probably do so when he finishes Red Hand of Doom. Since it's about equivalent to a 1st PoP in terms of the amound of healing, but slightly cheaper, it is a must have for my cleric (if I ever get access). The real usefulness, I think, is handing it out to a non-cleric who isn't using a belt slot to serve as a backup healing if the cleric ever goes down. I nearly died once (thank goodness for casting Delay Death on myself), and then stabilizing at -35. The party sorcerer had a favor that let him use a Cure Moderate Wounds at min caster level once per mod, and used that on me, followed by several potions of Cure Light Wounds to bring me concious again. Although 6d8 healing probably wouldn't have brought me up, it would have come close and wouldn't have used up charges from a wand. Just my long-winded opinion (which also went off topic a bit) ;)
control freak 08-15-07, 08:14 PM	the "broken items" will slowly become the standard and then you will simply say "do ion stones stink?"
Gwumph 08-15-07, 10:53 PM	10 belts equal 10 pounds. I know alot of wizards that cannot afford an extra 10 pounds of weight.
Hariman 08-15-07, 11:17 PM	the "broken items" will slowly become the standard and then you will simply say "do ioun stones stink?" They're "Slotless" and the effects will always be useful. And if it gets that bad, they'll get repriced in the MIC2.
Ancillary 08-16-07, 01:11 AM	I think they are efficient but not broken. The best healing is killing things faster, the guy that said he would buy a magic greatsword with the money is right on the money. That said, the fact that anyone can use them and they would take only a standard action to use one to stabilize someone with vs a move and a full round with the potion is great. Actions are king, after all, and stabilizing a party member is something that will come up occasionally. I think buying more than one is a little much. It is true you would make your money back eventually, but I consider the opportunity cost of lost combat items not worth it.
Iswald 08-16-07, 10:01 AM	I think buying more than one is a little much. It is true you would make your money back eventually, but I consider the opportunity cost of lost combat items not worth it. I think this depends upon what function you have to perform in the party. If you end up healing all the time because you're a bard, ranger, druid, paladin, etc, then buying multiple healing belts to pass out will let you focus on whatever aspect you'd rather be doing than healing. My druid will do some healing. But, he's not a healer. He'll cast a lesser vigor, mass lesser vigor or hit you with a CLW wand. Don't expect him to cast a cure moderate from a slot he'd use to summon a dire wolf. If he had healing belts, he could pass them out so that others could heal in combat. Or, he could use them for healing after combat (changing belts when he runs out of charges). Either way, he gets to summon creatures which is his primary function. Even if he was doing healing in combat, if he wears a healing belt himself, he could use it on turns where his companion or summoned creature are handling combat and his actions can more easily be used for healing. This would still allow him to prepare his normal druid spells instead of healing spells.
TWG_Prometheus 08-16-07, 10:48 AM	I'd just note that I still consider Pearls of Power I to be far superior in terms of benefit/cost over a Healing Belt. While it's true that you can get more raw healing out of a Healing Belt, Pearls of Power I can provide additional functions beyond simple healing. Restoring a Paladin's Lesser Restoration, a Cleric's Shield of Faith, or even a Wizard's Magic Missile/Lesser Orb of Acid/Mage Armor are all important functions that a Healing Belt can't approximate. Hopefully all that Healing Belt access is that we'll see Healing Belts mixed in with Pearls of Power in people's backpacks...not just Pearls.
Hariman 08-16-07, 02:00 PM	I'd just note that I still consider Pearls of Power I to be far superior in terms of benefit/cost over a Healing Belt. While it's true that you can get more raw healing out of a Healing Belt, Pearls of Power I can provide additional functions beyond simple healing. Restoring a Paladin's Lesser Restoration, a Cleric's Shield of Faith, or even a Wizard's Magic Missile/Lesser Orb of Acid/Mage Armor are all important functions that a Healing Belt can't approximate. Hopefully all that Healing Belt access is that we'll see Healing Belts mixed in with Pearls of Power in people's backpacks...not just Pearls. I'd never buy more than one healing belt for my characters. (OK, maybe 2 for my rogue/wizard) But I'd buy more than one Pearl of Power (Or Memento Magicka) for my casters.
Timlagor 08-16-07, 08:15 PM	10 belts equal 10 pounds. I know alot of wizards that cannot afford an extra 10 pounds of weight. So get 8 and craft a Handy Haversack to keep them in.