Looking for a Prestige Class [Archive] - Wizards Community

Looking for a Prestige Class [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
Swiftbrook
11-03-07, 10:45 PM I have some of the expansion books for 3.5, but not all. I'm looking for a prestige class for my elf ranger archer. I've just hit 11th level and I'm looking for a prestige class for 13th level. I'm planning on 12 level Ranger for Will save, spells and the Animal Companion bump you get.

What I'm looking for (in order of priority)
Full BAB
Good Will save
easy to moderate requirement to get into PC
Bonus feat/good ability to go with an archer.

My feats so far:
Point Blank Shot [1st]
Track [Ranger 1]
Many Shot [Ranger 2]
Endurance [Ranger 3]
Percise Shot [3rd] (possible retrain selection)
Natural Bond [6th] (possible retrain selection)
Rapid Shot [Ranger 6]
Improved Rapid Shot [9th]
Improved Percise Shot [Ranger 11]
Open Feat Spot [12th]

Yes, I know. I haven't taken Weapon Focus (longbow). But other things have come up and I'm not just an archer.

I've combed the books that I have. Occult Slayer of cheese and Order of the Bow Initiative are high on my list, but I'd prefer something else.

Do you have any suggestions from the following books that I don't have? Some of these books may not be LG legal. Other PC may have AR access required. Please only suggest PC that are Open or NONC. Thanks.

Books I don't have:
Complete Mage
Complete Champion
Complete Scoundral
Races of Destiny
Races of the Dragon
Frostburn
Shipwrack
Tomb of Battle (I'm not sure this is LG legal)
Miniature Handbook
Book of Exalted Deeds
Book of Vile Darkness
Libris Mortis
Draconomicon
Cityscape
Dungeonscape

Wow, I guess ther e were more books that I didn't have then I knew. Thanks for your help.

-Swiftbrook
copperwyrmling
11-03-07, 11:37 PM Pious Templar? The smite is kind of useless, but you'd get Weapon Specialization at L15 and could pick up Ranged Weapon Mastery at the same time. You'd want to take True Believer at 12 and retrain something to Weapon Focus (Longbow), although I don't know if you'll have enough skill points for the required Knowledge (Religion) ranks. (Also, your alignment and / or deity may not be compatible with this path.)

Alternatively, a level of Beastmaster would boost your animal companion. Dire bats make great archery platforms, or if you already use the companion as a tank, Beastmaster would make them better at that.
Maesto
11-04-07, 01:19 AM I've got a 12th level archer at the moment, with a number of ranger levels. The problem I have isn't landing the blow (attack bonus), but doing meaningful damage. Why the requirement of full BAB?

Beastmaster shoehorns in nicely, pious templar if you can crossclass enough stuff, seeker of the misty isle is just cute if you have access. Order of the Bow Initiate doesn't do much, really. Manyshot is basically as good as the precision shot. Occult Slayer does fairly well, although it has flavour issues. If you want to be a bit more versatile, a couple of levels of monk also work well for an archer.
Lomiat
11-04-07, 10:40 AM If you're willing to give up the full BAB (as Maesto points out, it's not as important once you've gained all the iterative attacks), you might consider either wizard or sorcerer (depending on your stats) in order to pick up Arrowmind.

Or if you'll have already hit Ranger 12, you could just ride the class all the way to the bitter end -- because no one else does that sort of thing.
Sieylianna
11-04-07, 11:01 AM Your feat list is wrong, you swapped rapid shot and manyshot.

I can't see retraining precise shot in any PC that claims to be an archer and you probably can't with improved precise shot.

It is hard to tell what you are looking for when you say that you're more than an archer and everything screams archer. Pious Templar would be my suggestion. I have an archer ranger who was planning on pious templar then contemplative, but that isn't going to happen with the campaign ending.

Ed
lunarfish
11-04-07, 11:07 AM If you're willing to give up the full BAB (as Maesto points out, it's not as important once you've gained all the iterative attacks), you might consider either wizard or sorcerer (depending on your stats) in order to pick up Arrowmind.

Or if you'll have already hit Ranger 12, you could just ride the class all the way to the bitter end -- because no one else does that sort of thing.

Untrue. I played with a pair of straight-classed archery Rangers down in the Bandit Kingdoms. Also, Arrow Mind is a Ranger spell as well as a Wizard spell, so he already has that.

-----

OBI, if you took Weapon Focus, might not be a bad choice. It's high Will, full base attack bonus, and Close Combat Shot never hurt anyone, even though you already can cast Arrow Mind. Another alternative would be to take a level of Wizard at 12th, and then take Arcane Archer at 13th-15th. It'll give you three points to all three saves, and the Guided Shot spell. If you've got a good spot, you can significantly reduce the danger of encounters long before the enemy can respond. Finally, you could grab Skill Focus [Handle Animal] at 12th, and at 13th take a level in Beastmaster. If you're partial to animal companions that might not be a bad choice.

However, I think that Ranger 15 would not be a bad choice for you. If your current Will save is really bad, like single digits, take Iron Will at 12th. Otherwise, Ranger meets all the requirements you list - full BAB, synergy with archery, and you already qualify. Plus, full Ranger progression gives you several cool spells, especially at 4th spell level (14th ranger level).

Food for thought,
Lunarfish
cetiken
11-04-07, 12:31 PM I agree that continueing ranger isn't a bad idea at all, also consier going into fighter as a 'prestige' class to gain some more feets.
Swiftbrook
11-04-07, 12:34 PM I can't see retraining precise shot in any PC that claims to be an archer and you probably can't with improved precise shot.
I was debating this "just because I can". I get Improved Precise without the prereq as a Ranger.

It is hard to tell what you are looking for when you say that you're more than an archer and everything screams archer.
Ed
I didn't list all my skills, spells and equipment. I'm a Listen, Spot and Survial monkey (or at least I try to be). I've done the best I can with my animal companion (a riding dog or elven hound) but math is against me. High level play kills off critters rather fast. In my game Friday night, the bbg almost killed off our Druids buffed rino with like 100+ HP in a round. My buffed, enlarged, riding dog was dropped in one round. That's why I'm thinking about dropping Natural Bond and sticking with my Elven Hound for flavor. Its a grapple monkey and can charge the wizard in the back of the fight.

I was hoping for some insight from the books I don't own. So far, it sounds like I made a wise move in not purchasing them.

Ranger 15 doesn't sound good because, with the campaign ending, I don't think I'm going to make it past 13th level before Origins.

Thanks for your ideas all. Any more?

-Swiftbrook
Sieylianna
11-04-07, 08:10 PM High level play kills off critters rather fast. In my game Friday night, the bbg almost killed off our Druids buffed rino with like 100+ HP in a round. My buffed, enlarged, riding dog was dropped in one round. That's why I'm thinking about dropping Natural Bond and sticking with my Elven Hound for flavor. Its a grapple monkey and can charge the wizard in the back of the fight.

I haven't seen a large number of companion deaths in high level modules. My 12th druid hasn't lost a companion since about 7th level - when she switched to a tiger with +1 mithral chain shirt barding (knock on wood). I was in an APL 12 module not long ago where party's arcane hierophant's bear was eaten by an advanced chuul, but that has been it. On the other hand, my druid treats her companion like a PC, not a consumable.

Ed
Swiftbrook
11-05-07, 04:40 PM My 12th druid hasn't lost a companion since

{snip}

On the other hand, my druid treats her companion like a PC, not a consumable.

Ed
Exactly. I'm runing a Ranger which = Druid/2 for animal companion. The math is against me. Ranger 12 (EDL 6) + Natural Bond (+3 EDL) + Beastmaster (EDL +4) = EDL 13 for Character level 13. That's putting two feats, Natural Bond and Skill Focus(Handle Animal) into my character. And, I have access only to Druid 10 level companions. OK, so there's a lot of Druid 10 animal companion choices. I think I'm going to leave the fighting animal companions to the high level druids.

My animal companion is Not a meat shield. I treat it as a PC and everyone knows it when I play.

-Swiftbrook
Mattastrophic
11-05-07, 05:56 PM Pious Templar is the most solid choice so far. Weapon Spec + Ranged Weapon Mastery = Awesomeness. Until then, you can shrug off those Disintegrates and Fingers of Death with Mettle.

-Matt
bitznarf
11-05-07, 06:31 PM I'd agree with Pious Templar from the choices I've seen so far. You already have the wisdom to take advantage of the spells.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Swiftbrook 11-03-07, 10:45 PM	I have some of the expansion books for 3.5, but not all. I'm looking for a prestige class for my elf ranger archer. I've just hit 11th level and I'm looking for a prestige class for 13th level. I'm planning on 12 level Ranger for Will save, spells and the Animal Companion bump you get. What I'm looking for (in order of priority) Full BAB Good Will save easy to moderate requirement to get into PC Bonus feat/good ability to go with an archer. My feats so far: Point Blank Shot [1st] Track [Ranger 1] Many Shot [Ranger 2] Endurance [Ranger 3] Percise Shot [3rd] (possible retrain selection) Natural Bond [6th] (possible retrain selection) Rapid Shot [Ranger 6] Improved Rapid Shot [9th] Improved Percise Shot [Ranger 11] Open Feat Spot [12th] Yes, I know. I haven't taken Weapon Focus (longbow). But other things have come up and I'm not just an archer. I've combed the books that I have. Occult Slayer of cheese and Order of the Bow Initiative are high on my list, but I'd prefer something else. Do you have any suggestions from the following books that I don't have? Some of these books may not be LG legal. Other PC may have AR access required. Please only suggest PC that are Open or NONC. Thanks. Books I don't have: Complete Mage Complete Champion Complete Scoundral Races of Destiny Races of the Dragon Frostburn Shipwrack Tomb of Battle (I'm not sure this is LG legal) Miniature Handbook Book of Exalted Deeds Book of Vile Darkness Libris Mortis Draconomicon Cityscape Dungeonscape Wow, I guess ther e were more books that I didn't have then I knew. Thanks for your help. -Swiftbrook
copperwyrmling 11-03-07, 11:37 PM	Pious Templar? The smite is kind of useless, but you'd get Weapon Specialization at L15 and could pick up Ranged Weapon Mastery at the same time. You'd want to take True Believer at 12 and retrain something to Weapon Focus (Longbow), although I don't know if you'll have enough skill points for the required Knowledge (Religion) ranks. (Also, your alignment and / or deity may not be compatible with this path.) Alternatively, a level of Beastmaster would boost your animal companion. Dire bats make great archery platforms, or if you already use the companion as a tank, Beastmaster would make them better at that.
Maesto 11-04-07, 01:19 AM	I've got a 12th level archer at the moment, with a number of ranger levels. The problem I have isn't landing the blow (attack bonus), but doing meaningful damage. Why the requirement of full BAB? Beastmaster shoehorns in nicely, pious templar if you can crossclass enough stuff, seeker of the misty isle is just cute if you have access. Order of the Bow Initiate doesn't do much, really. Manyshot is basically as good as the precision shot. Occult Slayer does fairly well, although it has flavour issues. If you want to be a bit more versatile, a couple of levels of monk also work well for an archer.
Lomiat 11-04-07, 10:40 AM	If you're willing to give up the full BAB (as Maesto points out, it's not as important once you've gained all the iterative attacks), you might consider either wizard or sorcerer (depending on your stats) in order to pick up Arrowmind. Or if you'll have already hit Ranger 12, you could just ride the class all the way to the bitter end -- because no one else does that sort of thing.
Sieylianna 11-04-07, 11:01 AM	Your feat list is wrong, you swapped rapid shot and manyshot. I can't see retraining precise shot in any PC that claims to be an archer and you probably can't with improved precise shot. It is hard to tell what you are looking for when you say that you're more than an archer and everything screams archer. Pious Templar would be my suggestion. I have an archer ranger who was planning on pious templar then contemplative, but that isn't going to happen with the campaign ending. Ed
lunarfish 11-04-07, 11:07 AM	If you're willing to give up the full BAB (as Maesto points out, it's not as important once you've gained all the iterative attacks), you might consider either wizard or sorcerer (depending on your stats) in order to pick up Arrowmind. Or if you'll have already hit Ranger 12, you could just ride the class all the way to the bitter end -- because no one else does that sort of thing. Untrue. I played with a pair of straight-classed archery Rangers down in the Bandit Kingdoms. Also, Arrow Mind is a Ranger spell as well as a Wizard spell, so he already has that. ----- OBI, if you took Weapon Focus, might not be a bad choice. It's high Will, full base attack bonus, and Close Combat Shot never hurt anyone, even though you already can cast Arrow Mind. Another alternative would be to take a level of Wizard at 12th, and then take Arcane Archer at 13th-15th. It'll give you three points to all three saves, and the Guided Shot spell. If you've got a good spot, you can significantly reduce the danger of encounters long before the enemy can respond. Finally, you could grab Skill Focus [Handle Animal] at 12th, and at 13th take a level in Beastmaster. If you're partial to animal companions that might not be a bad choice. However, I think that Ranger 15 would not be a bad choice for you. If your current Will save is really bad, like single digits, take Iron Will at 12th. Otherwise, Ranger meets all the requirements you list - full BAB, synergy with archery, and you already qualify. Plus, full Ranger progression gives you several cool spells, especially at 4th spell level (14th ranger level). Food for thought, Lunarfish
cetiken 11-04-07, 12:31 PM	I agree that continueing ranger isn't a bad idea at all, also consier going into fighter as a 'prestige' class to gain some more feets.
Swiftbrook 11-04-07, 12:34 PM	I can't see retraining precise shot in any PC that claims to be an archer and you probably can't with improved precise shot. I was debating this "just because I can". I get Improved Precise without the prereq as a Ranger. It is hard to tell what you are looking for when you say that you're more than an archer and everything screams archer. Ed I didn't list all my skills, spells and equipment. I'm a Listen, Spot and Survial monkey (or at least I try to be). I've done the best I can with my animal companion (a riding dog or elven hound) but math is against me. High level play kills off critters rather fast. In my game Friday night, the bbg almost killed off our Druids buffed rino with like 100+ HP in a round. My buffed, enlarged, riding dog was dropped in one round. That's why I'm thinking about dropping Natural Bond and sticking with my Elven Hound for flavor. Its a grapple monkey and can charge the wizard in the back of the fight. I was hoping for some insight from the books I don't own. So far, it sounds like I made a wise move in not purchasing them. Ranger 15 doesn't sound good because, with the campaign ending, I don't think I'm going to make it past 13th level before Origins. Thanks for your ideas all. Any more? -Swiftbrook
Sieylianna 11-04-07, 08:10 PM	High level play kills off critters rather fast. In my game Friday night, the bbg almost killed off our Druids buffed rino with like 100+ HP in a round. My buffed, enlarged, riding dog was dropped in one round. That's why I'm thinking about dropping Natural Bond and sticking with my Elven Hound for flavor. Its a grapple monkey and can charge the wizard in the back of the fight. I haven't seen a large number of companion deaths in high level modules. My 12th druid hasn't lost a companion since about 7th level - when she switched to a tiger with +1 mithral chain shirt barding (knock on wood). I was in an APL 12 module not long ago where party's arcane hierophant's bear was eaten by an advanced chuul, but that has been it. On the other hand, my druid treats her companion like a PC, not a consumable. Ed
Swiftbrook 11-05-07, 04:40 PM	My 12th druid hasn't lost a companion since {snip} On the other hand, my druid treats her companion like a PC, not a consumable. Ed Exactly. I'm runing a Ranger which = Druid/2 for animal companion. The math is against me. Ranger 12 (EDL 6) + Natural Bond (+3 EDL) + Beastmaster (EDL +4) = EDL 13 for Character level 13. That's putting two feats, Natural Bond and Skill Focus(Handle Animal) into my character. And, I have access only to Druid 10 level companions. OK, so there's a lot of Druid 10 animal companion choices. I think I'm going to leave the fighting animal companions to the high level druids. My animal companion is Not a meat shield. I treat it as a PC and everyone knows it when I play. -Swiftbrook
Mattastrophic 11-05-07, 05:56 PM	Pious Templar is the most solid choice so far. Weapon Spec + Ranged Weapon Mastery = Awesomeness. Until then, you can shrug off those Disintegrates and Fingers of Death with Mettle. -Matt
bitznarf 11-05-07, 06:31 PM	I'd agree with Pious Templar from the choices I've seen so far. You already have the wisdom to take advantage of the spells.