Need help with my fighter [Archive] - Wizards Community

Need help with my fighter [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
ThaiGQ
05-04-07, 11:49 AM I've been reading these forums for a while now, but I've only been recently able to post so I'd just like to start off by saying, "Hello!" to everyone. :D

On to the topic of the post... I've only been playing LG for less than a year and am fairly new to the 3.5 rules. That being said, the first character I made for LG is Lan, a Human Fighter 4/Marshall 2, who evolved from being a damage dealer to a cork/tank due to having Gwumph, a mounted halfling (despite his delusions otherwise), in the party that just blows the opposition to pieces with his lance (when he connects with his Spirited Charge). We play together pretty often, so there's usually less need for Lan to deal damage than to anchor the opposition in place so Gwumph can find his charge lane and skewer the enemy. However, I didn't really put that much thought into the initial build (which hasn't turned out TOO badly so far) and was wondering if anyone had any suggestions for improving it and in which direction (classes, feats, etc...) to take it.

Here's the build so far:

Lan Human Male LG Fighter 4/Marshall 2 (follower of Heironeous)
Str: 16, Dex: 10, Con: 14, Int: 10, Wis: 10, Cha: 14

Lvl. 1: Ftr 1 (WF: Longsword, Power Attack, Cleave)
Lvl. 2: Ftr 2 (Improved Initiative)
Lvl. 3: Ftr 3 (Endurance)
Lvl. 4: Ftr 4 (WS: Longsword, Stat. Bump: Str)
Lvl. 5: Mar 1 (SF: Diplomacy, Minor Aura: Force of Will)
Lvl. 6: Mar 2 (Die Hard, Major Aura: Motivate Attack)

Currently, he wears +1 Full Plate, carries a +1 Wooden Tower Shield (he didn't have access to a metal one yet, but I'm probably going to sell this one and purchase a metal one now that it's Open Access) and +1 Longsword, and has a +1 RoP for a total AC of 25 and he can duck behind the shield for total cover. He's also just recently purchased a Helm of Glorious Recovery which makes Die Hard a bit more useful.

So far, it's proved a rather effective tactic for me to stand out front and have the enemies try and hit me while Gwumph gets in position for a charge, but from what I've read on the forums, AC 25 is not going to be enough past APL 6.

I was thinking of re-training out Cleave and replacing it with Iron Will and maybe pick up Indomitable Soul at level 9 (or re-training out Die Hard so I can get it sooner).

I want to get Lan to Marshall 4 so that he can pick up Motivate Dexterity and also grant a free move action to his allies 1/day (especially to Gwumph who needs to spend precious rounds maneuvering to get in line for a charge).

I've also been toying with the idea of adding 4 Paladin levels (I can accept taking an xp hit for 1 level) as it fits with his personality and the bonuses to his saves certainly won't hurt either! But more importantly I want the turn undead attempts to power Divine Shield and Divine Vigor which will allow him to stay in combat longer.

As for PrC's I'm thinking about either Occult Slayer or Pious Templar (or maybe both!), but if I go Ftr 4/Mar 4/ Pal 4, that only leaves 3 more levels open.

Thoughts? I'd appreciate any advice you can give!
Fronch
05-04-07, 03:32 PM However, I didn't really put that much thought into the initial build (which hasn't turned out TOO badly so far) and was wondering if anyone had any suggestions for improving it and in which direction (classes, feats, etc...) to take it.It seems like you're not very focused here. In my opinion, focusing on AC instead of damage isn't very useful. If the monster is intelligent, and has a choice between attacking you, the high-AC low-damage PC, versus the spirited charger, it's going to ignore you and go after the PC who can actually kill it. You should train into some more effective feats; Endurance and Die Hard are awful. You might also consider a more effective weapon like spiked chain or elven thinblade, but it sounds like you want to focus more on character concept than maximum effectiveness.
TWG_Prometheus
05-04-07, 05:11 PM Getting Grant Move Action is a good idea if you're working with a charger...it's a good idea generally actually. I don't see the build as being terribly unfocused, but I'm not sure what you have Endurance/Die Hard for. It'd take a REALLY good item to justify two feat choices. Make sure you don't lose another Base Attack Bonus before level 9 and you can pick up Melee Weapon Mastery which will keep your damage in the moderate range. (If you're carrying a shield and NOT using the shield as your weapon, I can't come up with a way to get your damage above moderate.)

For Armor Class, it depends on your typical group setup, but I might shy away from Rings of Protection. With a helpful party, you can usually get at least Protection from Evil and Shield of Faith if you're lucky, so any Ring of Protection will be wasted once the fighting gets heavy. Rather, keep focusing on the enhancement bonuses of your armor.

If it was my character, and heading for a tank route, I'd probably drop Endurance, Die Hard and Cleave for Shield Specialization, Shield Ward and Close-Quarters Combat. This would mean dumping the Tower Shield but that might be a good decision anyway. The -2 to attacks hurts. Those feats will prevent most miscellaneous melee badness that can happen to you and allow you to concentrate on your hp and armor class. I probably wouldn't devote any more feats to defense than that, however. Look for offensive stuff, even (or especially) feats that help your attacks of opportunity. Make the bad guys pay for leaving your threat range to go bash on other people.

It's late in the build, but Paladin 4 wouldn't be a bad way to go. Smite Evil and the save bonuses would pay off early enough that you won't suffer a lot in getting to Paladin 4. Getting there will involve taking an experience penalty temporarily, however, and since you're keying your build off another character that might be undesirable.

You might want to consider going into Mounted Combat yourself. It's not something that you would always use, but increasing your mobility to match that of your partner may pay off. Having one charger in a party is good, but having two is really interesting.
ThaiGQ
05-05-07, 04:16 AM Getting Grant Move Action is a good idea if you're working with a charger...it's a good idea generally actually. I don't see the build as being terribly unfocused, but I'm not sure what you have Endurance/Die Hard for. It'd take a REALLY good item to justify two feat choices. Make sure you don't lose another Base Attack Bonus before level 9 and you can pick up Melee Weapon Mastery which will keep your damage in the moderate range. (If you're carrying a shield and NOT using the shield as your weapon, I can't come up with a way to get your damage above moderate.)

For Armor Class, it depends on your typical group setup, but I might shy away from Rings of Protection. With a helpful party, you can usually get at least Protection from Evil and Shield of Faith if you're lucky, so any Ring of Protection will be wasted once the fighting gets heavy. Rather, keep focusing on the enhancement bonuses of your armor.

If it was my character, and heading for a tank route, I'd probably drop Endurance, Die Hard and Cleave for Shield Specialization, Shield Ward and Close-Quarters Combat. This would mean dumping the Tower Shield but that might be a good decision anyway. The -2 to attacks hurts. Those feats will prevent most miscellaneous melee badness that can happen to you and allow you to concentrate on your hp and armor class. I probably wouldn't devote any more feats to defense than that, however. Look for offensive stuff, even (or especially) feats that help your attacks of opportunity. Make the bad guys pay for leaving your threat range to go bash on other people.

It's late in the build, but Paladin 4 wouldn't be a bad way to go. Smite Evil and the save bonuses would pay off early enough that you won't suffer a lot in getting to Paladin 4. Getting there will involve taking an experience penalty temporarily, however, and since you're keying your build off another character that might be undesirable.

You might want to consider going into Mounted Combat yourself. It's not something that you would always use, but increasing your mobility to match that of your partner may pay off. Having one charger in a party is good, but having two is really interesting.

First off, my apologies for not being able to separate and reply to each point...I just don't know how to do it yet. :P

As to the feats Endurance/Die Hard, I will need Endurance for Indomitable Soul as I think failing a Will Save is the fastest way of taking a character out of a battle. Die Hard, I can live without (like I said, I may retrain it into Indomitable Soul to save myself a feat), but it's kind of nice when used in conjunction with the Helm of Glorious Recovery that I just bought.

As for Melee Weapon Mastery, I agree, I think that it's a good idea and I've been thinking about taking it.

On using the shield as a weapon, I've been seriously toying with the idea, but it seems feat intensive and that would require me to re-train most of my feats (probably WF and WS) to make it work. I think it's a really cool idea...I'm just not sure how effective it is. Can anyone shed any light on this? In particular, I like the feats that stun or sicken the opponent but I'm not sure how often it would actually work.

I would LOVE to add more to my offensive capabilities...but like I said, I'm not quite sure how to do that with my current character. Originally, I was going to build a mounted knight (similar to Mandorallen from the Belgariad series if anyone's read it) but after playing a few adventures where having a large-sized mount was impractical (and since we already had a mounted charger in our group), I just sort of ended up in this role. Going back to the original concept is certainly appealing, but I'm not sure if I still can this late in his career. I suppose it's still possible with re-training but again, it's feat intensive and I'd certainly be less effective without a mount as they tend to be targeted as opposed to the rider. Also, I'm in the Perrenland region and from the modules I've played so far, using a large-sized mount seems to be very impractical. Although admittedly, the increase in speed would certainly be welcome! Moving at 20 ft. per round is just so limiting...hence my desire for Divine Vigor (as well as the +2 hp/level).
_metz_
05-05-07, 04:45 AM With stats like that, screaming for some paladin levels, unfortunately already 6 levels in...

Retrain improved initiative ASAP.
ThaiGQ
05-05-07, 09:44 AM With stats like that, screaming for some paladin levels, unfortunately already 6 levels in...

Retrain improved initiative ASAP.

Retrain into what? Any suggestions?
_metz_
05-05-07, 10:24 AM I would retrain into true beleiver - suits the fluff of the character, and means you can take pious templar levels. Then at the beginning of pious templar 2 retrain weapon specialisation into something else... hmmm lets have a look at the build then:

1: Ftr 1 (WF: Longsword, Power Attack, Cleave)
2: Ftr 2 (Improved Initiative)
3: Ftr 3 (Endurance)
4: Ftr 4 (WS: Longsword, Stat. Bump: Str)
5: Mar 1 (SF: Diplomacy, Minor Aura: Force of Will)
6: Mar 2 (Die Hard, Major Aura: Motivate Attack)
7: Mar 3 Retraining: Cleave - True Believer (Minor Aura: Motivate Dex)
8: Pious Templar1: Retraining: Die Hard - Close Quarters Fighting
9: Pious Templar2: Retraining: Endurance - Shield Ward(level 9 feat - Melee Weapon Mastery) Weapon Spec from Pious Templar
10: Pious Templar3: Retraining: Weapon Spec - Shield Specialization
11: Pious Templar4: Bonus Feat: Improved Critical: Longsword
12: Occult Slayer1: (not sure what feat to take)
13: Occult Slayer2:
14: Occult Slayer3:
15: Occult Slayer4:

If you already have the 4 ranks in knowledge religion then:

1: Ftr 1 (WF: Longsword, Power Attack, Cleave)
2: Ftr 2 (Improved Initiative)
3: Ftr 3 (Endurance)
4: Ftr 4 (WS: Longsword, Stat. Bump: Str)
5: Mar 1 (SF: Diplomacy, Minor Aura: Force of Will)
6: Mar 2 (Die Hard, Major Aura: Motivate Attack)
7: Retraining: Cleave - True Believer Pious Templar1:
8: Pious Templar2: Retraining: Die Hard - Close Quarters Fighting
9: Pious Templar3: Retraining: Weapon Spec - Shield Specialization (level 9 feat - Melee Weapon Mastery) Weapon Spec from Pious Templar
10: Pious Templar4: Retraining: Endurance - Shield Ward Bonus Feat: Improved Critical: Longsword
11: Occult Slayer1:
12: Occult Slayer2: (Heavy Armour Optimization?)
13: Occult Slayer3:
14: Occult Slayer4:
15: Occult Slayer5: (Greater Heavy Armour Optimization?)

Looks a bit messy, but its definitely viable, lots of retraining. I just wish you had Int 13 for Combat Expertise.

This will allow you to get a good AC, like you were after, and get your Pious Occult slaying in the name of heironious on.
ThaiGQ
05-06-07, 06:53 AM Looks a bit messy, but its definitely viable, lots of retraining. I just wish you had Int 13 for Combat Expertise.

This will allow you to get a good AC, like you were after, and get your Pious Occult slaying in the name of heironious on.

I wish I had Int 13 for Combat Expertise too...or maybe even better yet, Dex 13 for Elusive Target, but not much I can do about that now... :weep:

Thanks for the ideas! They'll definitely give me something to think about. I'm a bit curious though...is it worth it to take Occult Slayer 4 if I can't take Occult Slayer 5?
_metz_
05-06-07, 07:20 AM Its nowhere near as good no. Do you have 4 ranks in knowledge religion to take pious templar a level earlier?
DeimosGandymede
05-06-07, 02:35 PM I have been out of the LG system for a few months now...what is this "retrain" you are talking about? We are allowed to redo chars for more ability to be a haxxors?

-MW-
GorTeX
05-06-07, 03:08 PM 7: Retraining: Cleave - True Believer Pious Templar1:

Don't you need True Believer to take Pious Templar? If so, you can't do the retrain AND take the class at the same time (you have to pick the class you are leveling to before retraining--and you must meet all pre-requesites before picking the class)
_metz_
05-06-07, 11:52 PM Ah ok, no worries, go with the first build then if I were you ThaiGQ.

Though the 4 levels of Occult slayer may not be as suitable anymore.

Maybe Divine Crusader?

Then you can paladin it up a little without actually being one. Your Charisma score is more useful as well. 4 levels in it will give you (with a high charisma score from a +4 cloak) 4th level spells in the domain you choose.
bitznarf
05-07-07, 12:04 AM I have been out of the LG system for a few months now...what is this "retrain" you are talking about? We are allowed to redo chars for more ability to be a haxxors?

-MW-
The rules governing it are in the PHB2. Basically when you level up you can change one thing from a past level. Feat choices, class ability choices, skill choices, etc. You do need to own the PHB2 to use them.
ThaiGQ
05-07-07, 07:01 AM Thanks for all the great ideas guys (especially Metz for taking me through a couple of potential builds level-by-level :D )! The ideas for feats, PrCs, and rules clarifications have gone a long way to help me plan him out! Of course, I'm always open to any more ideas if you have them...just wanted to let you guys know I appreciate the help. :D

Since Lan is my first LG character, I've got a bit of a soft spot for him and want him to do well (while still keeping in line with his personality, of course)!

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
ThaiGQ 05-04-07, 11:49 AM	I've been reading these forums for a while now, but I've only been recently able to post so I'd just like to start off by saying, "Hello!" to everyone. :D On to the topic of the post... I've only been playing LG for less than a year and am fairly new to the 3.5 rules. That being said, the first character I made for LG is Lan, a Human Fighter 4/Marshall 2, who evolved from being a damage dealer to a cork/tank due to having Gwumph, a mounted halfling (despite his delusions otherwise), in the party that just blows the opposition to pieces with his lance (when he connects with his Spirited Charge). We play together pretty often, so there's usually less need for Lan to deal damage than to anchor the opposition in place so Gwumph can find his charge lane and skewer the enemy. However, I didn't really put that much thought into the initial build (which hasn't turned out TOO badly so far) and was wondering if anyone had any suggestions for improving it and in which direction (classes, feats, etc...) to take it. Here's the build so far: Lan Human Male LG Fighter 4/Marshall 2 (follower of Heironeous) Str: 16, Dex: 10, Con: 14, Int: 10, Wis: 10, Cha: 14 Lvl. 1: Ftr 1 (WF: Longsword, Power Attack, Cleave) Lvl. 2: Ftr 2 (Improved Initiative) Lvl. 3: Ftr 3 (Endurance) Lvl. 4: Ftr 4 (WS: Longsword, Stat. Bump: Str) Lvl. 5: Mar 1 (SF: Diplomacy, Minor Aura: Force of Will) Lvl. 6: Mar 2 (Die Hard, Major Aura: Motivate Attack) Currently, he wears +1 Full Plate, carries a +1 Wooden Tower Shield (he didn't have access to a metal one yet, but I'm probably going to sell this one and purchase a metal one now that it's Open Access) and +1 Longsword, and has a +1 RoP for a total AC of 25 and he can duck behind the shield for total cover. He's also just recently purchased a Helm of Glorious Recovery which makes Die Hard a bit more useful. So far, it's proved a rather effective tactic for me to stand out front and have the enemies try and hit me while Gwumph gets in position for a charge, but from what I've read on the forums, AC 25 is not going to be enough past APL 6. I was thinking of re-training out Cleave and replacing it with Iron Will and maybe pick up Indomitable Soul at level 9 (or re-training out Die Hard so I can get it sooner). I want to get Lan to Marshall 4 so that he can pick up Motivate Dexterity and also grant a free move action to his allies 1/day (especially to Gwumph who needs to spend precious rounds maneuvering to get in line for a charge). I've also been toying with the idea of adding 4 Paladin levels (I can accept taking an xp hit for 1 level) as it fits with his personality and the bonuses to his saves certainly won't hurt either! But more importantly I want the turn undead attempts to power Divine Shield and Divine Vigor which will allow him to stay in combat longer. As for PrC's I'm thinking about either Occult Slayer or Pious Templar (or maybe both!), but if I go Ftr 4/Mar 4/ Pal 4, that only leaves 3 more levels open. Thoughts? I'd appreciate any advice you can give!
Fronch 05-04-07, 03:32 PM	However, I didn't really put that much thought into the initial build (which hasn't turned out TOO badly so far) and was wondering if anyone had any suggestions for improving it and in which direction (classes, feats, etc...) to take it.It seems like you're not very focused here. In my opinion, focusing on AC instead of damage isn't very useful. If the monster is intelligent, and has a choice between attacking you, the high-AC low-damage PC, versus the spirited charger, it's going to ignore you and go after the PC who can actually kill it. You should train into some more effective feats; Endurance and Die Hard are awful. You might also consider a more effective weapon like spiked chain or elven thinblade, but it sounds like you want to focus more on character concept than maximum effectiveness.
TWG_Prometheus 05-04-07, 05:11 PM	Getting Grant Move Action is a good idea if you're working with a charger...it's a good idea generally actually. I don't see the build as being terribly unfocused, but I'm not sure what you have Endurance/Die Hard for. It'd take a REALLY good item to justify two feat choices. Make sure you don't lose another Base Attack Bonus before level 9 and you can pick up Melee Weapon Mastery which will keep your damage in the moderate range. (If you're carrying a shield and NOT using the shield as your weapon, I can't come up with a way to get your damage above moderate.) For Armor Class, it depends on your typical group setup, but I might shy away from Rings of Protection. With a helpful party, you can usually get at least Protection from Evil and Shield of Faith if you're lucky, so any Ring of Protection will be wasted once the fighting gets heavy. Rather, keep focusing on the enhancement bonuses of your armor. If it was my character, and heading for a tank route, I'd probably drop Endurance, Die Hard and Cleave for Shield Specialization, Shield Ward and Close-Quarters Combat. This would mean dumping the Tower Shield but that might be a good decision anyway. The -2 to attacks hurts. Those feats will prevent most miscellaneous melee badness that can happen to you and allow you to concentrate on your hp and armor class. I probably wouldn't devote any more feats to defense than that, however. Look for offensive stuff, even (or especially) feats that help your attacks of opportunity. Make the bad guys pay for leaving your threat range to go bash on other people. It's late in the build, but Paladin 4 wouldn't be a bad way to go. Smite Evil and the save bonuses would pay off early enough that you won't suffer a lot in getting to Paladin 4. Getting there will involve taking an experience penalty temporarily, however, and since you're keying your build off another character that might be undesirable. You might want to consider going into Mounted Combat yourself. It's not something that you would always use, but increasing your mobility to match that of your partner may pay off. Having one charger in a party is good, but having two is really interesting.
ThaiGQ 05-05-07, 04:16 AM	Getting Grant Move Action is a good idea if you're working with a charger...it's a good idea generally actually. I don't see the build as being terribly unfocused, but I'm not sure what you have Endurance/Die Hard for. It'd take a REALLY good item to justify two feat choices. Make sure you don't lose another Base Attack Bonus before level 9 and you can pick up Melee Weapon Mastery which will keep your damage in the moderate range. (If you're carrying a shield and NOT using the shield as your weapon, I can't come up with a way to get your damage above moderate.) For Armor Class, it depends on your typical group setup, but I might shy away from Rings of Protection. With a helpful party, you can usually get at least Protection from Evil and Shield of Faith if you're lucky, so any Ring of Protection will be wasted once the fighting gets heavy. Rather, keep focusing on the enhancement bonuses of your armor. If it was my character, and heading for a tank route, I'd probably drop Endurance, Die Hard and Cleave for Shield Specialization, Shield Ward and Close-Quarters Combat. This would mean dumping the Tower Shield but that might be a good decision anyway. The -2 to attacks hurts. Those feats will prevent most miscellaneous melee badness that can happen to you and allow you to concentrate on your hp and armor class. I probably wouldn't devote any more feats to defense than that, however. Look for offensive stuff, even (or especially) feats that help your attacks of opportunity. Make the bad guys pay for leaving your threat range to go bash on other people. It's late in the build, but Paladin 4 wouldn't be a bad way to go. Smite Evil and the save bonuses would pay off early enough that you won't suffer a lot in getting to Paladin 4. Getting there will involve taking an experience penalty temporarily, however, and since you're keying your build off another character that might be undesirable. You might want to consider going into Mounted Combat yourself. It's not something that you would always use, but increasing your mobility to match that of your partner may pay off. Having one charger in a party is good, but having two is really interesting. First off, my apologies for not being able to separate and reply to each point...I just don't know how to do it yet. :P As to the feats Endurance/Die Hard, I will need Endurance for Indomitable Soul as I think failing a Will Save is the fastest way of taking a character out of a battle. Die Hard, I can live without (like I said, I may retrain it into Indomitable Soul to save myself a feat), but it's kind of nice when used in conjunction with the Helm of Glorious Recovery that I just bought. As for Melee Weapon Mastery, I agree, I think that it's a good idea and I've been thinking about taking it. On using the shield as a weapon, I've been seriously toying with the idea, but it seems feat intensive and that would require me to re-train most of my feats (probably WF and WS) to make it work. I think it's a really cool idea...I'm just not sure how effective it is. Can anyone shed any light on this? In particular, I like the feats that stun or sicken the opponent but I'm not sure how often it would actually work. I would LOVE to add more to my offensive capabilities...but like I said, I'm not quite sure how to do that with my current character. Originally, I was going to build a mounted knight (similar to Mandorallen from the Belgariad series if anyone's read it) but after playing a few adventures where having a large-sized mount was impractical (and since we already had a mounted charger in our group), I just sort of ended up in this role. Going back to the original concept is certainly appealing, but I'm not sure if I still can this late in his career. I suppose it's still possible with re-training but again, it's feat intensive and I'd certainly be less effective without a mount as they tend to be targeted as opposed to the rider. Also, I'm in the Perrenland region and from the modules I've played so far, using a large-sized mount seems to be very impractical. Although admittedly, the increase in speed would certainly be welcome! Moving at 20 ft. per round is just so limiting...hence my desire for Divine Vigor (as well as the +2 hp/level).
_metz_ 05-05-07, 04:45 AM	With stats like that, screaming for some paladin levels, unfortunately already 6 levels in... Retrain improved initiative ASAP.
ThaiGQ 05-05-07, 09:44 AM	With stats like that, screaming for some paladin levels, unfortunately already 6 levels in... Retrain improved initiative ASAP. Retrain into what? Any suggestions?
_metz_ 05-05-07, 10:24 AM	I would retrain into true beleiver - suits the fluff of the character, and means you can take pious templar levels. Then at the beginning of pious templar 2 retrain weapon specialisation into something else... hmmm lets have a look at the build then: 1: Ftr 1 (WF: Longsword, Power Attack, Cleave) 2: Ftr 2 (Improved Initiative) 3: Ftr 3 (Endurance) 4: Ftr 4 (WS: Longsword, Stat. Bump: Str) 5: Mar 1 (SF: Diplomacy, Minor Aura: Force of Will) 6: Mar 2 (Die Hard, Major Aura: Motivate Attack) 7: Mar 3 Retraining: Cleave - True Believer (Minor Aura: Motivate Dex) 8: Pious Templar1: Retraining: Die Hard - Close Quarters Fighting 9: Pious Templar2: Retraining: Endurance - Shield Ward(level 9 feat - Melee Weapon Mastery) Weapon Spec from Pious Templar 10: Pious Templar3: Retraining: Weapon Spec - Shield Specialization 11: Pious Templar4: Bonus Feat: Improved Critical: Longsword 12: Occult Slayer1: (not sure what feat to take) 13: Occult Slayer2: 14: Occult Slayer3: 15: Occult Slayer4: If you already have the 4 ranks in knowledge religion then: 1: Ftr 1 (WF: Longsword, Power Attack, Cleave) 2: Ftr 2 (Improved Initiative) 3: Ftr 3 (Endurance) 4: Ftr 4 (WS: Longsword, Stat. Bump: Str) 5: Mar 1 (SF: Diplomacy, Minor Aura: Force of Will) 6: Mar 2 (Die Hard, Major Aura: Motivate Attack) 7: Retraining: Cleave - True Believer Pious Templar1: 8: Pious Templar2: Retraining: Die Hard - Close Quarters Fighting 9: Pious Templar3: Retraining: Weapon Spec - Shield Specialization (level 9 feat - Melee Weapon Mastery) Weapon Spec from Pious Templar 10: Pious Templar4: Retraining: Endurance - Shield Ward Bonus Feat: Improved Critical: Longsword 11: Occult Slayer1: 12: Occult Slayer2: (Heavy Armour Optimization?) 13: Occult Slayer3: 14: Occult Slayer4: 15: Occult Slayer5: (Greater Heavy Armour Optimization?) Looks a bit messy, but its definitely viable, lots of retraining. I just wish you had Int 13 for Combat Expertise. This will allow you to get a good AC, like you were after, and get your Pious Occult slaying in the name of heironious on.
ThaiGQ 05-06-07, 06:53 AM	Looks a bit messy, but its definitely viable, lots of retraining. I just wish you had Int 13 for Combat Expertise. This will allow you to get a good AC, like you were after, and get your Pious Occult slaying in the name of heironious on. I wish I had Int 13 for Combat Expertise too...or maybe even better yet, Dex 13 for Elusive Target, but not much I can do about that now... :weep: Thanks for the ideas! They'll definitely give me something to think about. I'm a bit curious though...is it worth it to take Occult Slayer 4 if I can't take Occult Slayer 5?
_metz_ 05-06-07, 07:20 AM	Its nowhere near as good no. Do you have 4 ranks in knowledge religion to take pious templar a level earlier?
DeimosGandymede 05-06-07, 02:35 PM	I have been out of the LG system for a few months now...what is this "retrain" you are talking about? We are allowed to redo chars for more ability to be a haxxors? -MW-
GorTeX 05-06-07, 03:08 PM	7: Retraining: Cleave - True Believer Pious Templar1: Don't you need True Believer to take Pious Templar? If so, you can't do the retrain AND take the class at the same time (you have to pick the class you are leveling to before retraining--and you must meet all pre-requesites before picking the class)
_metz_ 05-06-07, 11:52 PM	Ah ok, no worries, go with the first build then if I were you ThaiGQ. Though the 4 levels of Occult slayer may not be as suitable anymore. Maybe Divine Crusader? Then you can paladin it up a little without actually being one. Your Charisma score is more useful as well. 4 levels in it will give you (with a high charisma score from a +4 cloak) 4th level spells in the domain you choose.
bitznarf 05-07-07, 12:04 AM	I have been out of the LG system for a few months now...what is this "retrain" you are talking about? We are allowed to redo chars for more ability to be a haxxors? -MW- The rules governing it are in the PHB2. Basically when you level up you can change one thing from a past level. Feat choices, class ability choices, skill choices, etc. You do need to own the PHB2 to use them.
ThaiGQ 05-07-07, 07:01 AM	Thanks for all the great ideas guys (especially Metz for taking me through a couple of potential builds level-by-level :D )! The ideas for feats, PrCs, and rules clarifications have gone a long way to help me plan him out! Of course, I'm always open to any more ideas if you have them...just wanted to let you guys know I appreciate the help. :D Since Lan is my first LG character, I've got a bit of a soft spot for him and want him to do well (while still keeping in line with his personality, of course)!