Post/Author/DateTime	Post
clannagh 01-11-07, 07:05 PM	OK .. here is the story I have this funky level 3 gnome Paladin of Velnius with mounted comabt and ride by ... by level 6 with items she will be .. S13/D14/Co14/I10/W14/Ch14 now the obvious vanilla build is ... Pali7/Hospitaler1/cavalier6 taking spirited charge and WF lance at 6 and hosp feats. Then power attack at level 9. Feat du jour at 12. This build works and does silly cavallier damage at higher levels but its a bit conventional for me. NOW .. an alternate build i looked at used devoted tracker to improve the mount but the pre-requisites of the feat imply you need to take one ranger and one paladin level BEFORE the feat level (a side effect of the order you level up in the PHB) hence paladin paladin paladin ranger (XP penalty) ranger ranger (devoted tracker) ranger (animal companian at EDL 1) paladin paladin (animal companian special mount at EDL 1) (spirited charge) beastmaster OR two more ranger to improve animal companian to EDL 3 the beast master of course ends the paladin track and this build still lacks power attack OK .. basically .. interesting as devoted tracker looks I cannot see a way to effectively use it ??? The ranger animal progression is so slow it renders the feat useless Any thoughts ....
ShinAkuma2 01-11-07, 07:10 PM	now the obvious vanilla build is ... Pali7/Hospitaler1/cavalier6 taking spirited charge and WF lance at 6 and hosp feats. Then power attack at level 9. Feat du jour at 12. This build works and does silly cavallier damage at higher levels but its a bit conventional for me. That's the build my Paladin was going for, except it was Pally6/Fighter1 so he could get Trample and Cavalry Charger. It makes me sad that he will be "vanilla"..:raincloud I thought I was being clever by doing Hospitaler1 instead of Fighter2...
clannagh 01-11-07, 07:33 PM	That's the build my Paladin was going for, except it was Pally6/Fighter1 so he could get Trample and Cavalry Charger. It makes me sad that he will be "vanilla"..:raincloud I thought I was being clever by doing Hospitaler1 instead of Fighter2... vanilla is relative .. how many paldin hospitalers do you come across btw it might be safer for you to do pally6/hospitaler1/fighter1 otherwise the fighter stops the pali track which may muck up the hospitaler paladin cross bonuses
RedKnightofKet 01-11-07, 11:59 PM	....snip.....the beast master of course ends the paladin track and this build still lacks power attack OK .. basically .. interesting as devoted tracker looks I cannot see a way to effectively use it ??? The ranger animal progression is so slow it renders the feat useless Any thoughts .... Well, how about this build? 1 - Paladin 1 (Track, Power Attack(for Human build)) 2 - Paladin 2 3 - Paladin 3 (SF: Handle Animal) 4 - Paladin 4 5 - Paladin 5 (mount time! woo hoo!) 6 - Beastmaster 1 (Devoted Tracker) 7 - Fighter 1 (Mounted Combat) 8 - Wild Plains Outrider 1 9 - Wild Plains Outrider 2 (Ride-By Attack) 10 - Wild Plains Outrider 3 11 - Fighter 2 (Spirited Charge) 12 - Beastmaster 2? (WF: Lance) 13 - Cavalier 1 14 - Cavalier 2 15 - Cavalier 3 Now, this build is designed with PA in mind; if you want to take it out, you can switch the BM 2 and qualify for Cav one level earlier. By the end, you have a mount with either EPL 8/EDL 8 or EPL 11/EDL 5. If you want to forego Cav at the end of the build, you could just go for BM 4, then WPO 3, then BM again, up to BM 7. That gives you EPL 5/EDL 13, or EPL 8/EDL 10.
Gwumph 01-12-07, 01:36 AM	Well since you have alreay done a number of things with your build, its hard to take from the top (i.e. taking fighter levels first) But a mounted chracter needs power attack and spirited charge asap. waiting until 9th is tooo long. 5th level nno power or spirit. (I assume you will be wielding lance 2-handed and have a some str bonus =15) Damage= 6+2D6 5th level with power and spirit (My halfing mounted fighter/Paladin is 5th with that) doing full power attack, Damage= 39+3D6 thats how much a difference those 2 feats make. if you must choose, and it is possible go power attack first, then take spirited charge later.
LGMoses 01-12-07, 03:54 PM	OK .. here is the story I have this funky level 3 gnome Paladin of Velnius with mounted comabt and ride by ... by level 6 with items she will be .. S13/D14/Co14/I10/W14/Ch14 now the obvious vanilla build is ... Pali7/Hospitaler1/cavalier6 taking spirited charge and WF lance at 6 and hosp feats. Then power attack at level 9. Feat du jour at 12. This build works and does silly cavallier damage at higher levels but its a bit conventional for me. NOW .. an alternate build i looked at used devoted tracker to improve the mount but the pre-requisites of the feat imply you need to take one ranger and one paladin level BEFORE the feat level (a side effect of the order you level up in the PHB) hence paladin paladin paladin ranger (XP penalty) ranger ranger (devoted tracker) ranger (animal companian at EDL 1) paladin paladin (animal companian special mount at EDL 1) (spirited charge) beastmaster OR two more ranger to improve animal companian to EDL 3 the beast master of course ends the paladin track and this build still lacks power attack OK .. basically .. interesting as devoted tracker looks I cannot see a way to effectively use it ??? The ranger animal progression is so slow it renders the feat useless Any thoughts .... How did u continue to progress as a paladin? If you take a level of another class you can't continue to progress as a paladin. Just curious is all...
jstorrie 01-12-07, 04:22 PM	Devoted Tracker allows you to multiclass between Ranger and Paladin. clannagh, have you considered doing Pal5/Beastmaster 1 and taking Devoted Tracker at CL6?
clannagh 01-15-07, 12:46 PM	Devoted Tracker allows you to multiclass between Ranger and Paladin. clannagh, have you considered doing Pal5/Beastmaster 1 and taking Devoted Tracker at CL6? the trouble is the devoted tracker pretty much requires you have a level of ranger to meet the pre-requisites for the feat
clannagh 01-15-07, 12:47 PM	How did u continue to progress as a paladin? If you take a level of another class you can't continue to progress as a paladin. Just curious is all... classes like hospitaler and cavalier specifically allow it feats like devoted tracker enable multiclassing paladins as well
jstorrie 01-15-07, 04:21 PM	the trouble is the devoted tracker pretty much requires you have a level of ranger to meet the pre-requisites for the feat Track is a feat, Smite Evil comes from Paladin, Wild Empathy comes from Beastmaster. No ranger necessary.
clannagh 01-15-07, 06:22 PM	Track is a feat, Smite Evil comes from Paladin, Wild Empathy comes from Beastmaster. No ranger necessary. you make a good point though beastmaster does stop you progressing as a paladin but later levels of cavallier etc should still stack with paladin mount levels i will need to look at the implications of that ...
clannagh 01-16-07, 02:13 AM	Devoted Tracker allows you to multiclass between Ranger and Paladin. clannagh, have you considered doing Pal5/Beastmaster 1 and taking Devoted Tracker at CL6? Ok .. doesnt fit my build as i have already taken ride by at three but in addition .. class features come after feats in level up progresion so wouldnt that rule out taking tracker at 6 using beastmaster as a prerequisite ?
RedKnightofKet 01-16-07, 06:55 PM	The chart in the PH has Class Features before feats. Although, I don't think the order is set in stone. Otherwise, a Wiz 1 does not qualify for Scribe Scroll, because Spells is the final step listed in the class and level features section. Ok .. doesnt fit my build as i have already taken ride by at three but in addition .. class features come after feats in level up progresion so wouldnt that rule out taking tracker at 6 using beastmaster as a prerequisite ?
jstorrie 01-16-07, 06:59 PM	There isn't really a 'level up progression.' It all happens at once.
clannagh 01-16-07, 10:58 PM	There isn't really a 'level up progression.' It all happens at once. I was pretty certian the numbered order in PHB is the order things must happen in. But if that turns out to be wrong i will be really pleased as it will fix hiccups in more than one of my builds.
jstorrie 01-17-07, 03:03 PM	The numbered order in the PHB is a checklist to make sure you don't forget anything, basically. Many classes actually break themselves if you apply it strictly.
kenobi65 01-17-07, 03:09 PM	The numbered order in the PHB is a checklist to make sure you don't forget anything, basically. Many classes actually break themselves if you apply it strictly. I dunno...it gets pointed to quite a bit as the reason why you can't take a Prestige Class at the same time that you get a prequisite for that class.
jstorrie 01-17-07, 03:27 PM	It's more that you don't get your level benefits until you get a level in something. The benefits of a given class level can't qualify you for itself.