Animal Companion and Natural Bond/Beastmaster [Archive] - Wizards Community

Animal Companion and Natural Bond/Beastmaster [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
Landale
02-21-07, 04:59 PM Ok, so I'm having some trouble understanding the rules that Natural Bond and Beastmaster follow. I would like this confusion to cease =).

So, I am going to be a ranger 12 soon. I am thinking about taking the Natural Bond feat, or getting Skill Focus to go into Beastmaster.

According to the LGCS, I can get a new Animal Companion before the start of the next adventure. Since I am level 12, my EDL is 6 when determining stuff for my animal companion. If I take Natural Bond or a level of Beastmaster, since my EDL now becomes 9, am I now able to take a Dire Wolf as my animal companion?

The assumption is that I would be EDL 9 with either those two cases, so I could therefore take an animal companion from the second alternative animal companion table in the PHB (the 6HD animals). As a result, the new dire wolf animal companion would also have 2 more HD, 2 Nat AC, 1 str/dex, Evasion.

Am I correct here? Or are those abilities strictly and only for the abilities, and not which animal I can choose?

Thanks for the help! =)
~Landale
Britt
02-21-07, 05:50 PM You would be able to take a dire wolf and your dire wolf would be advanced as if you were a 3rd level druid (9th level - 6).

And yes I know the arguments trying to say that you would be treated as a 6th level druid with a dire wolf, and they are incorrect. The benefit from Natural Bond does not apply twice and does not counteract the reduced effectiveness of more powerful animal companions.
RedKnightofKet
02-21-07, 06:29 PM Hey Britt,

Further on this issue, in what order do you apply Natural Bond and Beastmaster? For example, would a Druid 3/Fighter 3/ Beastmaster 1 apply the Natural Bond ability first (to cover the fighter levels) and then apply Beastmaster?

In essense, do you apply Natural Bond as the FAQ describes the application of Practised Spellcaster? If the answer is ETV, at least then I would feel more secure about my decision when judging.
Britt
02-21-07, 06:30 PM I believe the answer is ETV, but Practiced Spellcaster is a good indicator.
Landale
02-22-07, 10:09 AM Thank you for responding to my post =). That makes me so much happier to know. Plus, I looked through my ARs and found access to it! =D

Dawg and I will be ruining my poor DM's day next level =).

Thanks!

P.S. Yes...he is named Dawg. I kept referring to my wolf as "my dog," and someone just started calling him that.
Alpha_Nerd
02-22-07, 10:13 AM Could you take Natural Bond at 12th and retrain Skill:Focus Handle Animal into one of your previous feats so at 13th you get a 13th level Companion, or are all of your other feats 100% necessary?

12 Ranger = 6
Natural Bond = 3
1 Beastmaster = 4
bitznarf
02-22-07, 11:10 AM Could you take Natural Bond at 12th and retrain Skill:Focus Handle Animal into one of your previous feats so at 13th you get a 13th level Companion, or are all of your other feats 100% necessary?

12 Ranger = 6
Natural Bond = 3
1 Beastmaster = 4

You cannot retrain out of a prerequisite in LG. In a home game, that would be up to your GM.

EDIT: By the way, if you were, say, a 6th level druid, 3 levels something else, 1 level Beastmaster and natural bond, you would end up with a effective druid level of 13 as well.

6 Druid = 6
3 Somemething else + Natural Bond = 3
1 Beastmaster = 4

Per the FAQ about ordering of this sort of thing, you apply your feats and SQ in the way most favorable to the character that has them.
Alpha_Nerd
02-22-07, 12:37 PM You cannot retrain out of a prerequisite in LG. In a home game, that would be up to your GM.

I worded that poorly. I meant if he had one of his 4-9 feats that he didn't necessarily need, like Improved Initiative or something, he could retrain that into Natural Bond and take Beast Master at 12th or 13th.
Landale
02-22-07, 03:12 PM Ok, I have another question about this.

As noted before, I will be level 12 soon and I have access to Natural Bond, but it is gotten as a favor and I spend 1 TU to train it and then I cross off the favor (I spend the TU and favor on the AR that I level to 12 on).

If I die at level 12, and have to be resurrected back to 11th level, when I reach 12th again, can I still take Natural Bond?

I would assume yes, because I already received the training for it and know how to do it, I would just need to gain the level again.
Britt
02-22-07, 03:24 PM Ask again if it becomes an issue :)
Landale
02-22-07, 03:27 PM Oki doke. Was just a concern I had when I looked at the AR I got it on.

Thanks again for the answers yesterday! =)
Necrochaos
05-09-07, 09:36 PM Has anyone seen access to Natural Bond? I've only seen it in one metaorg, never on a cert. Maybe special mission for it?
clannagh
05-09-07, 11:08 PM Has anyone seen access to Natural Bond? I've only seen it in one metaorg, never on a cert. Maybe special mission for it?

Two perrenland meta's have it. I have never seen it on a cert.
Landale
05-10-07, 12:43 AM It's out there. I got that crazy access to it that costs a TU on the AR that I level up and take the feat.

BTW, the ruling from my triad on that crazy favor I mentioned earlier in the thread is that if I spent the TU, I have permanent access to it. So, should I die and go back to 11, when I get back to 12, I'll be able to take it again =).
boolean
05-10-07, 10:16 AM You would be able to take a dire wolf and your dire wolf would be advanced as if you were a 3rd level druid (9th level - 6).

I disagree. The text of Natural Bond says it give a bonus to EDL for determining the bonuses the animal companion gets. It doesn't say anything about increasing EDL for purposes of choosing alternate animal companions.
_metz_
05-10-07, 10:38 AM I disagree. The text of Natural Bond says it give a bonus to EDL for determining the bonuses the animal companion gets. It doesn't say anything about increasing EDL for purposes of choosing alternate animal companions.

When the circle member/writer of the dispel confusion says so, its going to be a reasonably common DM call... so even with table variation you'll be pushing against it...
TWG_Prometheus
05-10-07, 11:08 AM This is also the sort of thing that makes me want to smack my players over the head with a rulebook for even considering it, not just ordinary everyday table variation.
boolean
05-14-07, 12:20 AM When the circle member/writer of the dispel confusion says so, its going to be a reasonably common DM call... so even with table variation you'll be pushing against it...

Which is why Circle members usually don't make rulings on general D&D rules. If this question had been asked in the "LG Questions/Answers" thread, Britt would have refused to answer it.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Landale 02-21-07, 04:59 PM	Ok, so I'm having some trouble understanding the rules that Natural Bond and Beastmaster follow. I would like this confusion to cease =). So, I am going to be a ranger 12 soon. I am thinking about taking the Natural Bond feat, or getting Skill Focus to go into Beastmaster. According to the LGCS, I can get a new Animal Companion before the start of the next adventure. Since I am level 12, my EDL is 6 when determining stuff for my animal companion. If I take Natural Bond or a level of Beastmaster, since my EDL now becomes 9, am I now able to take a Dire Wolf as my animal companion? The assumption is that I would be EDL 9 with either those two cases, so I could therefore take an animal companion from the second alternative animal companion table in the PHB (the 6HD animals). As a result, the new dire wolf animal companion would also have 2 more HD, 2 Nat AC, 1 str/dex, Evasion. Am I correct here? Or are those abilities strictly and only for the abilities, and not which animal I can choose? Thanks for the help! =) ~Landale
Britt 02-21-07, 05:50 PM	You would be able to take a dire wolf and your dire wolf would be advanced as if you were a 3rd level druid (9th level - 6). And yes I know the arguments trying to say that you would be treated as a 6th level druid with a dire wolf, and they are incorrect. The benefit from Natural Bond does not apply twice and does not counteract the reduced effectiveness of more powerful animal companions.
RedKnightofKet 02-21-07, 06:29 PM	Hey Britt, Further on this issue, in what order do you apply Natural Bond and Beastmaster? For example, would a Druid 3/Fighter 3/ Beastmaster 1 apply the Natural Bond ability first (to cover the fighter levels) and then apply Beastmaster? In essense, do you apply Natural Bond as the FAQ describes the application of Practised Spellcaster? If the answer is ETV, at least then I would feel more secure about my decision when judging.
Britt 02-21-07, 06:30 PM	I believe the answer is ETV, but Practiced Spellcaster is a good indicator.
Landale 02-22-07, 10:09 AM	Thank you for responding to my post =). That makes me so much happier to know. Plus, I looked through my ARs and found access to it! =D Dawg and I will be ruining my poor DM's day next level =). Thanks! P.S. Yes...he is named Dawg. I kept referring to my wolf as "my dog," and someone just started calling him that.
Alpha_Nerd 02-22-07, 10:13 AM	Could you take Natural Bond at 12th and retrain Skill:Focus Handle Animal into one of your previous feats so at 13th you get a 13th level Companion, or are all of your other feats 100% necessary? 12 Ranger = 6 Natural Bond = 3 1 Beastmaster = 4
bitznarf 02-22-07, 11:10 AM	Could you take Natural Bond at 12th and retrain Skill:Focus Handle Animal into one of your previous feats so at 13th you get a 13th level Companion, or are all of your other feats 100% necessary? 12 Ranger = 6 Natural Bond = 3 1 Beastmaster = 4 You cannot retrain out of a prerequisite in LG. In a home game, that would be up to your GM. EDIT: By the way, if you were, say, a 6th level druid, 3 levels something else, 1 level Beastmaster and natural bond, you would end up with a effective druid level of 13 as well. 6 Druid = 6 3 Somemething else + Natural Bond = 3 1 Beastmaster = 4 Per the FAQ about ordering of this sort of thing, you apply your feats and SQ in the way most favorable to the character that has them.
Alpha_Nerd 02-22-07, 12:37 PM	You cannot retrain out of a prerequisite in LG. In a home game, that would be up to your GM. I worded that poorly. I meant if he had one of his 4-9 feats that he didn't necessarily need, like Improved Initiative or something, he could retrain that into Natural Bond and take Beast Master at 12th or 13th.
Landale 02-22-07, 03:12 PM	Ok, I have another question about this. As noted before, I will be level 12 soon and I have access to Natural Bond, but it is gotten as a favor and I spend 1 TU to train it and then I cross off the favor (I spend the TU and favor on the AR that I level to 12 on). If I die at level 12, and have to be resurrected back to 11th level, when I reach 12th again, can I still take Natural Bond? I would assume yes, because I already received the training for it and know how to do it, I would just need to gain the level again.
Britt 02-22-07, 03:24 PM	Ask again if it becomes an issue :)
Landale 02-22-07, 03:27 PM	Oki doke. Was just a concern I had when I looked at the AR I got it on. Thanks again for the answers yesterday! =)
Necrochaos 05-09-07, 09:36 PM	Has anyone seen access to Natural Bond? I've only seen it in one metaorg, never on a cert. Maybe special mission for it?
clannagh 05-09-07, 11:08 PM	Has anyone seen access to Natural Bond? I've only seen it in one metaorg, never on a cert. Maybe special mission for it? Two perrenland meta's have it. I have never seen it on a cert.
Landale 05-10-07, 12:43 AM	It's out there. I got that crazy access to it that costs a TU on the AR that I level up and take the feat. BTW, the ruling from my triad on that crazy favor I mentioned earlier in the thread is that if I spent the TU, I have permanent access to it. So, should I die and go back to 11, when I get back to 12, I'll be able to take it again =).
boolean 05-10-07, 10:16 AM	You would be able to take a dire wolf and your dire wolf would be advanced as if you were a 3rd level druid (9th level - 6). I disagree. The text of Natural Bond says it give a bonus to EDL for determining the bonuses the animal companion gets. It doesn't say anything about increasing EDL for purposes of choosing alternate animal companions.
_metz_ 05-10-07, 10:38 AM	I disagree. The text of Natural Bond says it give a bonus to EDL for determining the bonuses the animal companion gets. It doesn't say anything about increasing EDL for purposes of choosing alternate animal companions. When the circle member/writer of the dispel confusion says so, its going to be a reasonably common DM call... so even with table variation you'll be pushing against it...
TWG_Prometheus 05-10-07, 11:08 AM	This is also the sort of thing that makes me want to smack my players over the head with a rulebook for even considering it, not just ordinary everyday table variation.
boolean 05-14-07, 12:20 AM	When the circle member/writer of the dispel confusion says so, its going to be a reasonably common DM call... so even with table variation you'll be pushing against it... Which is why Circle members usually don't make rulings on general D&D rules. If this question had been asked in the "LG Questions/Answers" thread, Britt would have refused to answer it.