AR granting Core access to sor/wiz spells [Archive] - Wizards Community

AR granting Core access to sor/wiz spells [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
shearin69
09-07-06, 11:09 PM My Warmage received an AR favor - access to a single core sor/wiz spell up to 6th level in the school of Abjuration; can he 1) get this type of spell at all? or 2) if so must he wait until his next Advance Learning at 11th or can he get it now?

There have been OTHER ARs that grant access to specific limited spells from StormWrack, and I figured that my Warmage can only get the Evocation spells. This AR access is worded differently hence question

Thanks
JosephKell
09-08-06, 12:01 AM I think the only way a Warmage can pick up a spell not on the class list is via Advanced Learning or the Extra Spell feat. Advanced Learning has to be an Evocation school.

So... Extra Spell feat to get an abjuration spell. But if you are taking Extra Spell, I recommend you take it at level 9 for Haste.

I am making a Gnome Warmage (gonna be a Magetank) and I think I want the Haste spell so I can have a move spell of 30 feet in Mithril Full-Plate (and the extra attack for party members is nice).
Mommy was an Orc
09-08-06, 12:06 AM My Warmage received an AR favor - access to a single core sor/wiz spell up to 6th level in the school of Abjuration; can he 1) get this type of spell at all? or 2) if so must he wait until his next Advance Learning at 11th or can he get it now?

Unless that AR favor is worded in such a way that it not only gives access, but lets you know it, I'd say you can't use it at all.
Madfox11
09-08-06, 03:43 AM Unless that AR favor is worded in such a way that it not only gives access, but lets you know it, I'd say you can't use it at all.

Correct. Although if you see an AR that actually allows you to break the rules of the game, you might want to check whether or not the Circle overlooked something or missed a typo.

Pieter Sleijpen
RPGA Living Greyhawk Circle Member
The Splintered Suns
JamesMaissen
09-08-06, 09:11 AM I think the only way a Warmage can pick up a spell not on the class list is via Advanced Learning or the Extra Spell feat. Advanced Learning has to be an Evocation school.

So... Extra Spell feat to get an abjuration spell. But if you are taking Extra Spell, I recommend you take it at level 9 for Haste.

Extra spell by Circle fiat does not work in this fashion. Chris Tulach made this ruling and I think you can find it on the Pale website (among other places),

-James
shearin69
09-08-06, 10:55 PM Extra spell by Circle fiat does not work in this fashion. Chris Tulach made this ruling and I think you can find it on the Pale website (among other places),

-James

I like to find more details on this ruling, because it's a LGCS core feat and if one selects a core spell, one should be able to use it. My Warmage has been operating with Extra Spell Feat since level 6 (now 10th)- and I will check with my triad on the use of both the Extraspell feat for the Warmage and this AR Favor which I suspect would be just getting access to a spell from someone's spell book. For those interested the actual favor is: Learn a single Core access sorcerer/wizard spell of up to 6th-level from the school of Abjuration. Thanks for the info
shearin69
09-08-06, 11:34 PM -- Ok, I read through the posting on PALE (great site - thanks!) and I will have to reselect a feat or take a level of wizard to get access to other spells. Personally I don’t see a problem with allowing it - but hey I'm only a 1.5 year LG user and do not have the experience that members of the circle have. I thought I had a decent way to get additional spell without over balancing the character - one spell at the cost of a FEAT, sounded like a good trade off.

So, I will have to wait until the someone can authorize more evocation spells from the Spell Compendium for the Warmage's Advance Learning (AdvL) - because REALLY - 1st and 2sd AdvL choices are flare, dancing lights and Tenser floating disk - PLEASSSEEE that is not choice- that's just wasted ink on my spell list, and making a hybrid character just to take advantage of spell, skills or feast access is just working the numbers in my opinion.

Thanks again for the suggestions and help.
Timlagor
09-10-06, 11:24 AM You never get to cast spells that aren't on your spell list. Extra Spell says nothing to overcome this rule.

(Unless it has other text,) The favour is only useful to people who cast from the Sorceror/Wizard list (and Sorcerors would need to use it as a Spell Known so it doesn't do anything for them either).
Samwise
09-10-06, 05:03 PM You never get to cast spells that aren't on your spell list. Extra Spell says nothing to overcome this rule.

Extra Spell actually says the opposite of that, as I confirmed with CustServ. The only access limit on Extra Spell is that it must be the same type of magic you cast, Arcane or Divine. You can select from any list that grants that type of spell, including other base class lists, prestige class lists, and for clerics, domain lists, even if you don't have that domain.

Obviously the Circle has chosen a more restrictive interpretation, or they may not be aware that WotC has a different view of the feat. (I wasn't aware of that ruling and asked CustServ about a year after that ruling.)
kenobi65
09-10-06, 11:48 PM Obviously the Circle has chosen a more restrictive interpretation, or they may not be aware that WotC has a different view of the feat. (I wasn't aware of that ruling and asked CustServ about a year after that ruling.)

Well, as I'm sure you know, Sam, CustServ isn't an official LG rules source (and, they've given some wacky answers to some questions). Unless / until it gets clarified in the FAQ, the Circle is free to rule however they want on it.
Samwise
09-10-06, 11:56 PM Yep. That's why I merely noted there was an alternate view from CustServ, and that the Circle wouldn't have had access to it.

I will also add that upon confirming that response from CustServ, I noted some very abusive possibilities it opened up to Creighton. (Like for example, using one of those now eliminated "any limited spell" favors to take "anyspell" off the domain list, even though the whole domain isn't available.)

Now I am sort of tweaked as I was seriously considering taking Extra Spell to gain Cure Light Wounds off the Bard list for my Wizard if I ever hit 6th level. But my post should be read as:
"Well, a year after the Circle made that ruling, CustServ said something different. So if they like, there's a reference to change it so I can have Cure Light Wounds."
:schemes:
Timlagor
09-11-06, 01:11 AM I'll be putting that one down to Cust Serv thoughtlessness. The Feat doesn't say anything of the sort and it certainly should do so unambiguously if it meant it.
Specifically it doesn't say that it adds spells to the spell list.

The Wizard reference is "clearly" (well I thought so but obviously it's not clear) referencing the fact that not every spell is immediately available to every wizard in a campaign and some DMs might put heavy limits on reasearching them.

Anyway you probably knew all that and I'm confident that the Circle aren't about to change their minds so I'm just waffling really :rolleyes:
Mommy was an Orc
09-11-06, 01:26 AM Now I am sort of tweaked as I was seriously considering taking Extra Spell to gain Cure Light Wounds off the Bard list for my Wizard if I ever hit 6th level. But my post should be read as:
"Well, a year after the Circle made that ruling, CustServ said something different. So if they like, there's a reference to change it so I can have Cure Light Wounds."
:schemes:

Arcane Disciple: Healing and a 12 Wisdom will get you that - doesn't your Wizard have that?
Samwise
09-11-06, 01:33 AM I'll be putting that one down to Cust Serv thoughtlessness. The Feat doesn't say anything of the sort and it certainly should do so unambiguously if it meant it.
Specifically it doesn't say that it adds spells to the spell list.

I disagree completely. The text reads:
Benefit: You learn one additional spell at any level up to one lower than the highest level of spell you can currently cast.

There is absolutely no limitation stated or implied in that sentence, aside from level. If anything, the CustServ reply adds a limitation not otherwise suggested by that sentence.
But to continue:
Thus, a 4th-level sorcerer (maximum sell level 2nd) gains a new 0-level or 1st-level spell known with which to expand her repertoire.

That clearly establishes the level limit.
And:
For classes such as wizard that have more options for learning spells, Extra Spell is generally used to learn a specific spell that the character lacks access to and would be unable to research.

That again states no limitation, but does directly suggest breaking several limitations, specifically prohibited schools for specialist wizards, and class spell list.
The feat says what it says. It doesn't need to add anything else, full permission is already given. While CustServ (and by extention R&D) sometimes seem a tad confused about what is written in the books versus what they wanted to say, in this case the text says what it says, nothing more and nothing less. If that means the feat is way too powerful, then I suppose it does. I'd consider it rather thoroughly useless if it wasn't that open-ended.

Again, I'm not expecting any reversal, LG could use more house rules limiting such things.
Samwise
09-11-06, 01:34 AM Arcane Disciple: Healing and a 12 Wisdom will get you that - doesn't your Wizard have that?

Sadly, he lacks a deity with Healing as a Domain. Perhaps a suitable opportunity to conver will arise, or perhaps I'll consider a random level of cleric or somesuch. :D
Madfox11
09-11-06, 03:38 AM I disagree completely. The text reads:
Benefit: You learn one additional spell at any level up to one lower than the highest level of spell you can currently cast.

There is absolutely no limitation stated or implied in that sentence, aside from level. If anything, the CustServ reply adds a limitation not otherwise suggested by that sentence.

Huh? Actually, it is a rather basic assumption in D&D that unless otherwise stated the basic rules are followed. To break the spell-list limitations the feat needs to specifically mention that it does so and not the other way around.
Samwise
09-11-06, 02:19 PM Huh? Actually, it is a rather basic assumption in D&D that unless otherwise stated the basic rules are followed. To break the spell-list limitations the feat needs to specifically mention that it does so and not the other way around.

No, it is a basic assumption that unless the text says something, don't assume that it does.
The text of Extra Spell doesn't say anything about spell list, therefore do not assume that it places such a limitation.
For gaining new spells, either automatically by level or by adding them to your spell book, it does limit you to spells on your spell list. As an example:
PHB page 54
Spells: A sorcerer casts arcane spells (the same type of spells available to bards and wizards), which are drawn primarily from the sorcerer/wizard spell list (page 192).
. . .
These new spells can be common spells chosen from the sorcerer/wizard spell list (page 192), or they can be unusual spells that the sorcerer has gained some understanding of by study.

Not much of a hard and fast limitation there to start with.
Add to that:
PHB page 57 sidebar
Spells of the prohibited school or schools are not available to the wizard, and she can't even cast such spells from scrolls or fire them from wands.

When combined with the additional text of Extra Spell, which does not explicitly state that is supersedes that limitation but merely suggests it, then no spell list restriction could be assumed.

And for reference, aside from the text of the feat, this is the "question" I submitted:

Aside from the noted limit on spell level, what limits are there, if any, as to what spells can be chosen?
Can you choose a spell from any spell list?
Such as:
Can a wizard choose a bard spell? (Or a cleric choose a druid or paladin spell?)
Can a specialist wizard choose a spell from his banned school?
Can an arcane caster choose a divine spell? (Or a divine caster choose an arcane spell?
Can a warmage (or dread necromancer) choose any spell? (Arcane or divine, from any list.)
Can you choose a spell from another list that has the spell at a lower level than it is on your standard spell list? (Such as a wizard taking animate dead from the cleric spell list.)
Can you choose spells from prestige class spell lists? (And can prestige class spellcasters use the feat for spells from regular spell lists?)

I know this is a rather open-ended question, but the wording of the feat, particularly that last sentence, seems to suggest there are no intended limits, other than the spell level, on selecting a spell.

I like my questions to CustServ to be very thorough so they can't "miss" any obvious implications. The reply was quite brief:

The Extra Spell Feat allows you to learn any Arcane spell that you may not have normal access to, such as a spell from a prohibited school, or an arcane spell that is not on your list. You cannot learn Divine spells with this feat. The same goes for a divine caster. They cannot learn Arcane spells, but could learn a divine spell, even from a domain list they do not have.

And again, this isn't a demand the Circle ruling be changed. Doesn't the ruling state "In the Living Greyhawk campaign . . ." rather directly making it just an LG rule anyway? That is enough for me to accept it. I am just noting the alternate reply as a general rules discussion. (Which means we should mosey to another forum or something. :) )
shearin69
09-11-06, 05:34 PM Wow, I didn't not expect such a discussion. I have to thanks for all the input and I agree the WoTC my interpret a rule differently than LG-Circle, but then again LG is different than open play and to establish a standard some rules may seems more restrictive than others - all in the name of game balance and fairness (don't quote me on this).

So, I'd figure that best bet with this feat (extra spell) is for the WARMAGE to select a sor/wiz spell of the evocation class. As far as the AR granting access - like I mentioned before I figured its the same as getting access to someone's or a collection of spell books of the Abjuration class - which would NOT do the Warmage any good - not on their spell list, and if it is - hey the WARMAGE will get it sooner or later. Thanks agin for the input. Good gaming ya'll
kenobi65
09-11-06, 11:15 PM Got the new Dragon (#348) in the mail today. In Sage Advice, Andy Collins says this:

Can the warmage (Complete Arcane) benefit from the Extra Spell feat?
No. Extra Spell lets you add one spell to your list of spells known, but the spell must be taken from your class spell list. Since the warmage already knows all the spells on his class spell list, this feat has no effect.

Note that the first part of his answer ("the spell must be taken from your class spell list") also appears to contradict the answer that CustServ gave Samwise.
Samwise
09-12-06, 12:03 AM That it does. (Contradict the answer from CustServ.)
It looks like dissension in the ranks again, like the recent confusion on reach weapons and soft cover. :P

I'm still waiting for my subscription copy. Hopefully in a day or two.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
shearin69 09-07-06, 11:09 PM	My Warmage received an AR favor - access to a single core sor/wiz spell up to 6th level in the school of Abjuration; can he 1) get this type of spell at all? or 2) if so must he wait until his next Advance Learning at 11th or can he get it now? There have been OTHER ARs that grant access to specific limited spells from StormWrack, and I figured that my Warmage can only get the Evocation spells. This AR access is worded differently hence question Thanks
JosephKell 09-08-06, 12:01 AM	I think the only way a Warmage can pick up a spell not on the class list is via Advanced Learning or the Extra Spell feat. Advanced Learning has to be an Evocation school. So... Extra Spell feat to get an abjuration spell. But if you are taking Extra Spell, I recommend you take it at level 9 for Haste. I am making a Gnome Warmage (gonna be a Magetank) and I think I want the Haste spell so I can have a move spell of 30 feet in Mithril Full-Plate (and the extra attack for party members is nice).
Mommy was an Orc 09-08-06, 12:06 AM	My Warmage received an AR favor - access to a single core sor/wiz spell up to 6th level in the school of Abjuration; can he 1) get this type of spell at all? or 2) if so must he wait until his next Advance Learning at 11th or can he get it now? Unless that AR favor is worded in such a way that it not only gives access, but lets you know it, I'd say you can't use it at all.
Madfox11 09-08-06, 03:43 AM	Unless that AR favor is worded in such a way that it not only gives access, but lets you know it, I'd say you can't use it at all. Correct. Although if you see an AR that actually allows you to break the rules of the game, you might want to check whether or not the Circle overlooked something or missed a typo. Pieter Sleijpen RPGA Living Greyhawk Circle Member The Splintered Suns
JamesMaissen 09-08-06, 09:11 AM	I think the only way a Warmage can pick up a spell not on the class list is via Advanced Learning or the Extra Spell feat. Advanced Learning has to be an Evocation school. So... Extra Spell feat to get an abjuration spell. But if you are taking Extra Spell, I recommend you take it at level 9 for Haste. Extra spell by Circle fiat does not work in this fashion. Chris Tulach made this ruling and I think you can find it on the Pale website (among other places), -James
shearin69 09-08-06, 10:55 PM	Extra spell by Circle fiat does not work in this fashion. Chris Tulach made this ruling and I think you can find it on the Pale website (among other places), -James I like to find more details on this ruling, because it's a LGCS core feat and if one selects a core spell, one should be able to use it. My Warmage has been operating with Extra Spell Feat since level 6 (now 10th)- and I will check with my triad on the use of both the Extraspell feat for the Warmage and this AR Favor which I suspect would be just getting access to a spell from someone's spell book. For those interested the actual favor is: Learn a single Core access sorcerer/wizard spell of up to 6th-level from the school of Abjuration. Thanks for the info
shearin69 09-08-06, 11:34 PM	-- Ok, I read through the posting on PALE (great site - thanks!) and I will have to reselect a feat or take a level of wizard to get access to other spells. Personally I don’t see a problem with allowing it - but hey I'm only a 1.5 year LG user and do not have the experience that members of the circle have. I thought I had a decent way to get additional spell without over balancing the character - one spell at the cost of a FEAT, sounded like a good trade off. So, I will have to wait until the someone can authorize more evocation spells from the Spell Compendium for the Warmage's Advance Learning (AdvL) - because REALLY - 1st and 2sd AdvL choices are flare, dancing lights and Tenser floating disk - PLEASSSEEE that is not choice- that's just wasted ink on my spell list, and making a hybrid character just to take advantage of spell, skills or feast access is just working the numbers in my opinion. Thanks again for the suggestions and help.
Timlagor 09-10-06, 11:24 AM	You never get to cast spells that aren't on your spell list. Extra Spell says nothing to overcome this rule. (Unless it has other text,) The favour is only useful to people who cast from the Sorceror/Wizard list (and Sorcerors would need to use it as a Spell Known so it doesn't do anything for them either).
Samwise 09-10-06, 05:03 PM	You never get to cast spells that aren't on your spell list. Extra Spell says nothing to overcome this rule. Extra Spell actually says the opposite of that, as I confirmed with CustServ. The only access limit on Extra Spell is that it must be the same type of magic you cast, Arcane or Divine. You can select from any list that grants that type of spell, including other base class lists, prestige class lists, and for clerics, domain lists, even if you don't have that domain. Obviously the Circle has chosen a more restrictive interpretation, or they may not be aware that WotC has a different view of the feat. (I wasn't aware of that ruling and asked CustServ about a year after that ruling.)
kenobi65 09-10-06, 11:48 PM	Obviously the Circle has chosen a more restrictive interpretation, or they may not be aware that WotC has a different view of the feat. (I wasn't aware of that ruling and asked CustServ about a year after that ruling.) Well, as I'm sure you know, Sam, CustServ isn't an official LG rules source (and, they've given some wacky answers to some questions). Unless / until it gets clarified in the FAQ, the Circle is free to rule however they want on it.
Samwise 09-10-06, 11:56 PM	Yep. That's why I merely noted there was an alternate view from CustServ, and that the Circle wouldn't have had access to it. I will also add that upon confirming that response from CustServ, I noted some very abusive possibilities it opened up to Creighton. (Like for example, using one of those now eliminated "any limited spell" favors to take "anyspell" off the domain list, even though the whole domain isn't available.) Now I am sort of tweaked as I was seriously considering taking Extra Spell to gain Cure Light Wounds off the Bard list for my Wizard if I ever hit 6th level. But my post should be read as: "Well, a year after the Circle made that ruling, CustServ said something different. So if they like, there's a reference to change it so I can have Cure Light Wounds." :schemes:
Timlagor 09-11-06, 01:11 AM	I'll be putting that one down to Cust Serv thoughtlessness. The Feat doesn't say anything of the sort and it certainly should do so unambiguously if it meant it. Specifically it doesn't say that it adds spells to the spell list. The Wizard reference is "clearly" (well I thought so but obviously it's not clear) referencing the fact that not every spell is immediately available to every wizard in a campaign and some DMs might put heavy limits on reasearching them. Anyway you probably knew all that and I'm confident that the Circle aren't about to change their minds so I'm just waffling really :rolleyes:
Mommy was an Orc 09-11-06, 01:26 AM	Now I am sort of tweaked as I was seriously considering taking Extra Spell to gain Cure Light Wounds off the Bard list for my Wizard if I ever hit 6th level. But my post should be read as: "Well, a year after the Circle made that ruling, CustServ said something different. So if they like, there's a reference to change it so I can have Cure Light Wounds." :schemes: Arcane Disciple: Healing and a 12 Wisdom will get you that - doesn't your Wizard have that?
Samwise 09-11-06, 01:33 AM	I'll be putting that one down to Cust Serv thoughtlessness. The Feat doesn't say anything of the sort and it certainly should do so unambiguously if it meant it. Specifically it doesn't say that it adds spells to the spell list. I disagree completely. The text reads: Benefit: You learn one additional spell at any level up to one lower than the highest level of spell you can currently cast. There is absolutely no limitation stated or implied in that sentence, aside from level. If anything, the CustServ reply adds a limitation not otherwise suggested by that sentence. But to continue: Thus, a 4th-level sorcerer (maximum sell level 2nd) gains a new 0-level or 1st-level spell known with which to expand her repertoire. That clearly establishes the level limit. And: For classes such as wizard that have more options for learning spells, Extra Spell is generally used to learn a specific spell that the character lacks access to and would be unable to research. That again states no limitation, but does directly suggest breaking several limitations, specifically prohibited schools for specialist wizards, and class spell list. The feat says what it says. It doesn't need to add anything else, full permission is already given. While CustServ (and by extention R&D) sometimes seem a tad confused about what is written in the books versus what they wanted to say, in this case the text says what it says, nothing more and nothing less. If that means the feat is way too powerful, then I suppose it does. I'd consider it rather thoroughly useless if it wasn't that open-ended. Again, I'm not expecting any reversal, LG could use more house rules limiting such things.
Samwise 09-11-06, 01:34 AM	Arcane Disciple: Healing and a 12 Wisdom will get you that - doesn't your Wizard have that? Sadly, he lacks a deity with Healing as a Domain. Perhaps a suitable opportunity to conver will arise, or perhaps I'll consider a random level of cleric or somesuch. :D
Madfox11 09-11-06, 03:38 AM	I disagree completely. The text reads: Benefit: You learn one additional spell at any level up to one lower than the highest level of spell you can currently cast. There is absolutely no limitation stated or implied in that sentence, aside from level. If anything, the CustServ reply adds a limitation not otherwise suggested by that sentence. Huh? Actually, it is a rather basic assumption in D&D that unless otherwise stated the basic rules are followed. To break the spell-list limitations the feat needs to specifically mention that it does so and not the other way around.
Samwise 09-11-06, 02:19 PM	Huh? Actually, it is a rather basic assumption in D&D that unless otherwise stated the basic rules are followed. To break the spell-list limitations the feat needs to specifically mention that it does so and not the other way around. No, it is a basic assumption that unless the text says something, don't assume that it does. The text of Extra Spell doesn't say anything about spell list, therefore do not assume that it places such a limitation. For gaining new spells, either automatically by level or by adding them to your spell book, it does limit you to spells on your spell list. As an example: PHB page 54 Spells: A sorcerer casts arcane spells (the same type of spells available to bards and wizards), which are drawn primarily from the sorcerer/wizard spell list (page 192). . . . These new spells can be common spells chosen from the sorcerer/wizard spell list (page 192), or they can be unusual spells that the sorcerer has gained some understanding of by study. Not much of a hard and fast limitation there to start with. Add to that: PHB page 57 sidebar Spells of the prohibited school or schools are not available to the wizard, and she can't even cast such spells from scrolls or fire them from wands. When combined with the additional text of Extra Spell, which does not explicitly state that is supersedes that limitation but merely suggests it, then no spell list restriction could be assumed. And for reference, aside from the text of the feat, this is the "question" I submitted: Aside from the noted limit on spell level, what limits are there, if any, as to what spells can be chosen? Can you choose a spell from any spell list? Such as: Can a wizard choose a bard spell? (Or a cleric choose a druid or paladin spell?) Can a specialist wizard choose a spell from his banned school? Can an arcane caster choose a divine spell? (Or a divine caster choose an arcane spell? Can a warmage (or dread necromancer) choose any spell? (Arcane or divine, from any list.) Can you choose a spell from another list that has the spell at a lower level than it is on your standard spell list? (Such as a wizard taking animate dead from the cleric spell list.) Can you choose spells from prestige class spell lists? (And can prestige class spellcasters use the feat for spells from regular spell lists?) I know this is a rather open-ended question, but the wording of the feat, particularly that last sentence, seems to suggest there are no intended limits, other than the spell level, on selecting a spell. I like my questions to CustServ to be very thorough so they can't "miss" any obvious implications. The reply was quite brief: The Extra Spell Feat allows you to learn any Arcane spell that you may not have normal access to, such as a spell from a prohibited school, or an arcane spell that is not on your list. You cannot learn Divine spells with this feat. The same goes for a divine caster. They cannot learn Arcane spells, but could learn a divine spell, even from a domain list they do not have. And again, this isn't a demand the Circle ruling be changed. Doesn't the ruling state "In the Living Greyhawk campaign . . ." rather directly making it just an LG rule anyway? That is enough for me to accept it. I am just noting the alternate reply as a general rules discussion. (Which means we should mosey to another forum or something. :) )
shearin69 09-11-06, 05:34 PM	Wow, I didn't not expect such a discussion. I have to thanks for all the input and I agree the WoTC my interpret a rule differently than LG-Circle, but then again LG is different than open play and to establish a standard some rules may seems more restrictive than others - all in the name of game balance and fairness (don't quote me on this). So, I'd figure that best bet with this feat (extra spell) is for the WARMAGE to select a sor/wiz spell of the evocation class. As far as the AR granting access - like I mentioned before I figured its the same as getting access to someone's or a collection of spell books of the Abjuration class - which would NOT do the Warmage any good - not on their spell list, and if it is - hey the WARMAGE will get it sooner or later. Thanks agin for the input. Good gaming ya'll
kenobi65 09-11-06, 11:15 PM	Got the new Dragon (#348) in the mail today. In Sage Advice, Andy Collins says this: Can the warmage (Complete Arcane) benefit from the Extra Spell feat? No. Extra Spell lets you add one spell to your list of spells known, but the spell must be taken from your class spell list. Since the warmage already knows all the spells on his class spell list, this feat has no effect. Note that the first part of his answer ("the spell must be taken from your class spell list") also appears to contradict the answer that CustServ gave Samwise.
Samwise 09-12-06, 12:03 AM	That it does. (Contradict the answer from CustServ.) It looks like dissension in the ranks again, like the recent confusion on reach weapons and soft cover. :P I'm still waiting for my subscription copy. Hopefully in a day or two.