Cost of Enlarge Person Potions [Archive] - Wizards Community

Cost of Enlarge Person Potions [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
Suvarov454
05-06-07, 02:05 PM Can anyone explain why the cost of a potion of Enlarge Person is 250 GP (instead of 25 GP, like every other potion of a 1st level spell without costly material components)?
Mommy was an Orc
05-06-07, 02:16 PM Can anyone explain why the cost of a potion of Enlarge Person is 250 GP (instead of 25 GP, like every other potion of a 1st level spell without costly material components)?

Presumably because the 3.0 Potion was a 5th caster level potion and they kept the same value.

5*50 = 250.
Lomiat
05-06-07, 02:20 PM It's still worth the 250 gp, though, since it takes effect immediately, not one round later. My tripper's bought potions of Enlarge Person since he was second level. It's also particularly good for grapplers.
Howie23
05-06-07, 02:36 PM Can anyone explain why the cost of a potion of Enlarge Person is 250 GP (instead of 25 GP, like every other potion of a 1st level spell without costly material components)?

1st level potions are 50gp, not 25gp.

There are lots of opinions. Mine is that it is an error that has never been corrected.

David
zigspatty
05-06-07, 03:44 PM In 3.0, Enlarge Person only enlarged 20% per level to a maximum of 100% at CL 5. So, making the potion at CL 5 was very cost effective - and making it at any other CL was a bit tricky to adjudicate the results with regard to increased size/strength/etc. So, the 3.0 DMG listed the CL 5 potion as the standard one found in treasure hoardes.

In 3.5, Enlarge Person always enlarges your size to the next higher category: medium< large, small<medium, etc. The only change related to CL is its duration. This makes the results of enjargement much simpler, and gives far less reason to make the potions at CL5, but the DMG entry wasn't changed to reflect to spell's change. At least, that's my theory of why it's priced so high.

The 250 gp price tag make the enlarge person potion less cost effective, but *most* judges will allow it to last 5 minutes (instead of just one), which sometimes enables a character to enjoy its benefits in more than 1 fight. So, it's not all bad. I've also seen potions of Enlarge Person - CL1, (50 gp) offered on an AR, and seen players happily buy 10 of them.

Patty
Ancillary
05-06-07, 05:59 PM I believe it is intentional to compensate for the fact you get the effect immediately and do not need to wait for a whole round for it to take effect. Having it cost 50 would seriously undercost it, especially with the delay potion feat (already a good choice for fighter types) open access.
pedr
05-06-07, 06:43 PM Note that CL 1 wands of Enlarge Person are now Open to all characters. So for the cost of three potions you can get 50 charges. Of course you need a friendly caster to use the wand on you, and it takes them a full-round action (I think), but very very much cheaper!
JamesMaissen
05-06-07, 09:34 PM I believe it is intentional to compensate for the fact you get the effect immediately and do not need to wait for a whole round for it to take effect. Having it cost 50 would seriously undercost it, especially with the delay potion feat (already a good choice for fighter types) open access.

It's not intentional, but rather a hold over on the tables much the same way the Wand of Heightened (to 4th) Ray of Enfeeblement is one.

If you were correct then the PhB would need to make those explainations under brew potion. Also the price for a potion of lesser restoration would need to be increased as it's normally a 3 round casting time.

-James
Eric Anondson
05-07-07, 12:30 AM FWIW, the Magic Item Compendium (p. 256) lists potions of enlarge person with a market price of 50 gp in the consolidated magic item tables.
thunderspirit
05-07-07, 12:41 PM Can anyone explain why the cost of a potion of Enlarge Person is 250 GP (instead of 25 GP, like every other potion of a 1st level spell without costly material components)?
Gnomes.
Mithreinmaethor
05-07-07, 03:10 PM FWIW, the Magic Item Compendium (p. 256) lists potions of enlarge person with a market price of 50 gp in the consolidated magic item tables.

So would this not mean that since it is the newest printing of said rule/material that until the LGCS 598 comes out that this is the option we use ?
Mommy was an Orc
05-07-07, 03:47 PM So would this not mean that since it is the newest printing of said rule/material that until the LGCS 598 comes out that this is the option we use ?

No. Two problems:
Magic Item Compendium is not an LG legal book.
Even if it were, we're given access to the potion chart in DMG, not the one in Magic Item Compendium.
Suvarov454
05-08-07, 09:03 PM 1st level potions are 50gp, not 25gp.

There are lots of opinions. Mine is that it is an error that has never been corrected.

David

Yes. 50 GP. I knew that. Pardon my addlebrained mistake.

Baring AR access, I'm going to avoid table variation by buying scrolls (which are 25 GP) until I can afford a wand.

Of course, what I really want is a 9th level Cleric cohort with the Strength domain. Hooray! Righteous Might (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/righteousMight.htm)!:D At 1125 GP each, scrolls of it cost a bit too much.
Southernskies
05-08-07, 09:28 PM Of course, what I really want is a 9th level Cleric cohort with the Strength domain. Hooray! Righteous Might (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/righteousMight.htm)!:D At 1125 GP each, scrolls of it cost a bit too much.

Since Righteous Might is Personal, I don't see the point if you're not a cleric yourself (especially with all the errata for it).
gomeztoo
05-08-07, 09:54 PM FWIW, the Magic Item Compendium (p. 256) lists potions of enlarge person with a market price of 50 gp in the consolidated magic item tables.

So, do these take a full round to drink?
kjenks
05-08-07, 10:28 PM So, do these take a full round to drink?

Sort of. It takes a move action to get it out and a standard action to drink it. The spell takes effect immediately -- because a potion has an exception to the usual rule that items that store spells take as long to cast as the normal spell.
gomeztoo
05-08-07, 10:54 PM Should be more expensive then, imo.
Casting time is part of the power balance.
King Kashue
05-09-07, 02:55 AM Should be more expensive then, imo.
Casting time is part of the power balance.

Except that's not how any other potions work...Lesser Resto takes three rounds to cast, but it's 300gp just like every other 2nd level potion...
gomeztoo
05-09-07, 03:28 AM So, logically, that should be more expensive too.
Scrolls and wands have adjusted casting times. It makes sense that potions somehow compensate too. Though potions have a few other restrictions, and are slightly more expensive, too.
MatteBlack
05-09-07, 02:38 PM The pricing may be an anomally but, I don't see it as a problem. The potion is still well worth the gold you pay for them. As overused as Enlarge is, I am fine with it being listed at a premium.

I understand why it is so popular. It's such a good answer to a number of combat problems but, I feel yawning when I see it cast at mid to high level adventures.

Lee
JamesMaissen
05-09-07, 03:17 PM So, logically, that should be more expensive too.
Scrolls and wands have adjusted casting times. It makes sense that potions somehow compensate too. Though potions have a few other restrictions, and are slightly more expensive, too.

And 2nd level potions of cure light wounds shouldn't cost twice the price as 1st level potions simply for curing 1hp more.. let alone the price on higher level ones.

The formulas are in the PhB and they don't take usefulness into account.

-James
bitznarf
05-09-07, 03:20 PM ..
King Kashue
05-10-07, 12:42 AM So, logically, that should be more expensive too.

Well, by your logic...Which nothing else in the system reflects :D
gomeztoo
05-10-07, 01:28 AM Well, by your logic...Which nothing else in the system reflects :D

Apparently.
Suvarov454
05-10-07, 08:48 PM I decided to go for the price/performance of a Wand of Enlarge Person. It's only 750, even if I do need a Sorc/Wiz in the party to use it. I may be mistaken, but I'm not unsure! :D

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Suvarov454 05-06-07, 02:05 PM	Can anyone explain why the cost of a potion of Enlarge Person is 250 GP (instead of 25 GP, like every other potion of a 1st level spell without costly material components)?
Mommy was an Orc 05-06-07, 02:16 PM	Can anyone explain why the cost of a potion of Enlarge Person is 250 GP (instead of 25 GP, like every other potion of a 1st level spell without costly material components)? Presumably because the 3.0 Potion was a 5th caster level potion and they kept the same value. 5*50 = 250.
Lomiat 05-06-07, 02:20 PM	It's still worth the 250 gp, though, since it takes effect immediately, not one round later. My tripper's bought potions of Enlarge Person since he was second level. It's also particularly good for grapplers.
Howie23 05-06-07, 02:36 PM	Can anyone explain why the cost of a potion of Enlarge Person is 250 GP (instead of 25 GP, like every other potion of a 1st level spell without costly material components)? 1st level potions are 50gp, not 25gp. There are lots of opinions. Mine is that it is an error that has never been corrected. David
zigspatty 05-06-07, 03:44 PM	In 3.0, Enlarge Person only enlarged 20% per level to a maximum of 100% at CL 5. So, making the potion at CL 5 was very cost effective - and making it at any other CL was a bit tricky to adjudicate the results with regard to increased size/strength/etc. So, the 3.0 DMG listed the CL 5 potion as the standard one found in treasure hoardes. In 3.5, Enlarge Person always enlarges your size to the next higher category: medium< large, small<medium, etc. The only change related to CL is its duration. This makes the results of enjargement much simpler, and gives far less reason to make the potions at CL5, but the DMG entry wasn't changed to reflect to spell's change. At least, that's my theory of why it's priced so high. The 250 gp price tag make the enlarge person potion less cost effective, but most judges will allow it to last 5 minutes (instead of just one), which sometimes enables a character to enjoy its benefits in more than 1 fight. So, it's not all bad. I've also seen potions of Enlarge Person - CL1, (50 gp) offered on an AR, and seen players happily buy 10 of them. Patty
Ancillary 05-06-07, 05:59 PM	I believe it is intentional to compensate for the fact you get the effect immediately and do not need to wait for a whole round for it to take effect. Having it cost 50 would seriously undercost it, especially with the delay potion feat (already a good choice for fighter types) open access.
pedr 05-06-07, 06:43 PM	Note that CL 1 wands of Enlarge Person are now Open to all characters. So for the cost of three potions you can get 50 charges. Of course you need a friendly caster to use the wand on you, and it takes them a full-round action (I think), but very very much cheaper!
JamesMaissen 05-06-07, 09:34 PM	I believe it is intentional to compensate for the fact you get the effect immediately and do not need to wait for a whole round for it to take effect. Having it cost 50 would seriously undercost it, especially with the delay potion feat (already a good choice for fighter types) open access. It's not intentional, but rather a hold over on the tables much the same way the Wand of Heightened (to 4th) Ray of Enfeeblement is one. If you were correct then the PhB would need to make those explainations under brew potion. Also the price for a potion of lesser restoration would need to be increased as it's normally a 3 round casting time. -James
Eric Anondson 05-07-07, 12:30 AM	FWIW, the Magic Item Compendium (p. 256) lists potions of enlarge person with a market price of 50 gp in the consolidated magic item tables.
thunderspirit 05-07-07, 12:41 PM	Can anyone explain why the cost of a potion of Enlarge Person is 250 GP (instead of 25 GP, like every other potion of a 1st level spell without costly material components)? Gnomes.
Mithreinmaethor 05-07-07, 03:10 PM	FWIW, the Magic Item Compendium (p. 256) lists potions of enlarge person with a market price of 50 gp in the consolidated magic item tables. So would this not mean that since it is the newest printing of said rule/material that until the LGCS 598 comes out that this is the option we use ?
Mommy was an Orc 05-07-07, 03:47 PM	So would this not mean that since it is the newest printing of said rule/material that until the LGCS 598 comes out that this is the option we use ? No. Two problems: Magic Item Compendium is not an LG legal book. Even if it were, we're given access to the potion chart in DMG, not the one in Magic Item Compendium.
Suvarov454 05-08-07, 09:03 PM	1st level potions are 50gp, not 25gp. There are lots of opinions. Mine is that it is an error that has never been corrected. David Yes. 50 GP. I knew that. Pardon my addlebrained mistake. Baring AR access, I'm going to avoid table variation by buying scrolls (which are 25 GP) until I can afford a wand. Of course, what I really want is a 9th level Cleric cohort with the Strength domain. Hooray! Righteous Might (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/righteousMight.htm)!:D At 1125 GP each, scrolls of it cost a bit too much.
Southernskies 05-08-07, 09:28 PM	Of course, what I really want is a 9th level Cleric cohort with the Strength domain. Hooray! Righteous Might (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/righteousMight.htm)!:D At 1125 GP each, scrolls of it cost a bit too much. Since Righteous Might is Personal, I don't see the point if you're not a cleric yourself (especially with all the errata for it).
gomeztoo 05-08-07, 09:54 PM	FWIW, the Magic Item Compendium (p. 256) lists potions of enlarge person with a market price of 50 gp in the consolidated magic item tables. So, do these take a full round to drink?
kjenks 05-08-07, 10:28 PM	So, do these take a full round to drink? Sort of. It takes a move action to get it out and a standard action to drink it. The spell takes effect immediately -- because a potion has an exception to the usual rule that items that store spells take as long to cast as the normal spell.
gomeztoo 05-08-07, 10:54 PM	Should be more expensive then, imo. Casting time is part of the power balance.
King Kashue 05-09-07, 02:55 AM	Should be more expensive then, imo. Casting time is part of the power balance. Except that's not how any other potions work...Lesser Resto takes three rounds to cast, but it's 300gp just like every other 2nd level potion...
gomeztoo 05-09-07, 03:28 AM	So, logically, that should be more expensive too. Scrolls and wands have adjusted casting times. It makes sense that potions somehow compensate too. Though potions have a few other restrictions, and are slightly more expensive, too.
MatteBlack 05-09-07, 02:38 PM	The pricing may be an anomally but, I don't see it as a problem. The potion is still well worth the gold you pay for them. As overused as Enlarge is, I am fine with it being listed at a premium. I understand why it is so popular. It's such a good answer to a number of combat problems but, I feel yawning when I see it cast at mid to high level adventures. Lee
JamesMaissen 05-09-07, 03:17 PM	So, logically, that should be more expensive too. Scrolls and wands have adjusted casting times. It makes sense that potions somehow compensate too. Though potions have a few other restrictions, and are slightly more expensive, too. And 2nd level potions of cure light wounds shouldn't cost twice the price as 1st level potions simply for curing 1hp more.. let alone the price on higher level ones. The formulas are in the PhB and they don't take usefulness into account. -James
bitznarf 05-09-07, 03:20 PM	..
King Kashue 05-10-07, 12:42 AM	So, logically, that should be more expensive too. Well, by your logic...Which nothing else in the system reflects :D
gomeztoo 05-10-07, 01:28 AM	Well, by your logic...Which nothing else in the system reflects :D Apparently.
Suvarov454 05-10-07, 08:48 PM	I decided to go for the price/performance of a Wand of Enlarge Person. It's only 750, even if I do need a Sorc/Wiz in the party to use it. I may be mistaken, but I'm not unsure! :D