Does Baleful Polymorph work for Minor Shapeshift? [Archive] - Wizards Community

Does Baleful Polymorph work for Minor Shapeshift? [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
Jay_Ibero_911
03-29-07, 01:48 PM Baleful Polymorph, as well as Animal Shapes are two PHB spells that seem like they should be in the polymorph subschool, but being in the PHB, they were around before the subschool came out. Unfortunately PHB2 makes no mention of these other spells directly. I realize this is a core rules issue, and can't expect an "official" LG ruling, but I'd like some opinions on whether or not you consider them to be polymorph spells for the purpose of Minor Shapeshift...
Arvagor
03-29-07, 02:10 PM As if the name of the spell weren't enough to put it in the subschool, if you read the errattaed baleful polymorph, you'll see that it has the exact same bullet points as are listed in describing the polymorph subschool: The target retains its own alignment (and personality, within the limits of the new form’s ability scores). The target retains its own hit points. The target is treated has having its normal Hit Dice for purpose of adjudicating effects based on HD, such as the sleep spell, though it uses the new form’s base attack bonus, base save bonuses, and all other statistics derived from Hit Dice. The target also retains the ability to understand (but not to speak) the languages it understood in its original form. It can write in the languages it understands, but only the form is capable of writing in some manner (such as drawing in the dirt with a paw).
As far as animal shapes is concerned, since there is a significant physical change in the creature's form, that is enough IMO to put it in the polymorph subschool as well...
Jay_Ibero_911
03-29-07, 08:05 PM Anyone else? Or is this the generally accepted interpretation?
Japangirl
03-30-07, 02:19 AM I think it works. Didn't the errata say something about if the spell had "polymorph" in the name or description, it counted as part of the polymorph school? It's late and I don't feel like looking that up, but as far as I'm concerned Baleful Polymorph counts for the purpose of Minor Shapeshift.
Lomiat
03-31-07, 11:11 AM Egad! What is that gnome up to now? Druids and their tricks, man....

I'd go with the consensus. If I had to rule it at my table, I wouldn't think twice about counting Baleful Polymorph as a polymorph school spell.
Timlagor
04-02-07, 01:48 PM There is indeed something in PHB2 about putting old spells into the polymorph subschoool but i can't remember the specifics. I don't think there's much doubt that BP qualifies though.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Jay_Ibero_911 03-29-07, 01:48 PM	Baleful Polymorph, as well as Animal Shapes are two PHB spells that seem like they should be in the polymorph subschool, but being in the PHB, they were around before the subschool came out. Unfortunately PHB2 makes no mention of these other spells directly. I realize this is a core rules issue, and can't expect an "official" LG ruling, but I'd like some opinions on whether or not you consider them to be polymorph spells for the purpose of Minor Shapeshift...
Arvagor 03-29-07, 02:10 PM	As if the name of the spell weren't enough to put it in the subschool, if you read the errattaed baleful polymorph, you'll see that it has the exact same bullet points as are listed in describing the polymorph subschool: The target retains its own alignment (and personality, within the limits of the new form’s ability scores). The target retains its own hit points. The target is treated has having its normal Hit Dice for purpose of adjudicating effects based on HD, such as the sleep spell, though it uses the new form’s base attack bonus, base save bonuses, and all other statistics derived from Hit Dice. The target also retains the ability to understand (but not to speak) the languages it understood in its original form. It can write in the languages it understands, but only the form is capable of writing in some manner (such as drawing in the dirt with a paw). As far as animal shapes is concerned, since there is a significant physical change in the creature's form, that is enough IMO to put it in the polymorph subschool as well...
Jay_Ibero_911 03-29-07, 08:05 PM	Anyone else? Or is this the generally accepted interpretation?
Japangirl 03-30-07, 02:19 AM	I think it works. Didn't the errata say something about if the spell had "polymorph" in the name or description, it counted as part of the polymorph school? It's late and I don't feel like looking that up, but as far as I'm concerned Baleful Polymorph counts for the purpose of Minor Shapeshift.
Lomiat 03-31-07, 11:11 AM	Egad! What is that gnome up to now? Druids and their tricks, man.... I'd go with the consensus. If I had to rule it at my table, I wouldn't think twice about counting Baleful Polymorph as a polymorph school spell.
Timlagor 04-02-07, 01:48 PM	There is indeed something in PHB2 about putting old spells into the polymorph subschoool but i can't remember the specifics. I don't think there's much doubt that BP qualifies though.