Post/Author/DateTime	Post
LGMoses 11-12-06, 09:10 PM	a buddy and I are both members of the Yeomanry duelist club. He has insulted my wife's honor on countless times. Can I challenge him to the customary honor duel to the death?
_m_ 11-12-06, 09:46 PM	actually i think dueling between characters is kind of a cool idea (only if you've finished the adventure with time to spare, and no1 objects to you mucking around) though clearly NOT to the death, as there really is no way around the 'kill a pc, get yours ripped up'. but yeah, until one concedes would be fun.
clik_ml 11-13-06, 02:45 AM	Duels to the death could possibly be a triad special mission, but otherwise are a no-no that would get one character dead and the other one pulled, I imagine. Page 94 of the Bissel Meta-Activities Handbook v1.1.pdf has some interesting stuff on dueling. Dueling A duel is a structured combat between two opponents over an issue of honor. The issue contested by the duel is considered settled when the duel is over. It is considered extremely dishonorable to discuss the issue once the duel is over. Any parties wishing to duel must present their case to a magistrate (or to a noble who is lord to both parties) who will judge whether a duel is necessary and allowed. The magistrate will attempt to resolve the issue between the parties before approving the duel. It is considered extremely dishonorable to challenge the judgment of the magistrate in this matter. The magistrate will not approve a duel if either party does not wish to duel; there is some dishonor in refusing a duel, but it is not a severe dishonor. The party declared the aggrieved (by the magistrate) with respect to this issue is the Challenger. There are no rules against challenging someone above or below your station, but it is considered bad form to do either. The challenged individual has the right to choose the method of combat. All participants in a duel are forbidden to wear armor. The methods are: • By hand: no weapons, always non-lethal damage, combat until one opponent is unconscious or submits, mostly selected by the common folk • By blow: padded maces, always non-lethal damage, combat until one opponent is unconscious or submits, common among the commoners, the nobles, and adventurers • By hit: rapiers, combatants choose whether to attack for non-lethal or normal damage, combat until one opponent has been hit (pierced) three times or unconscious or submits, mostly selected by nobles and adventurers • By blood: long swords, combatants choose whether to attack for non-lethal or normal damage, combat until one opponent has lost one-half their hit points or unconscious or submits, mostly selected by nobles and adventurers. It is considered dishonorable to suggest a method that your opponent is unskilled at. The weapons used must be of equal quality and design. Either opponent may select a champion to fight in their place. It is illegal to hire a champion; they must be volunteers. Killing an opponent in a duel is a crime and is punishable under the law as murder or manslaughter (magistrate's choice). Use of magic during a duel is considered dishonorable. This is the kind of fun stuff I find when delving for obscure metaorgs.
_m_ 11-13-06, 05:10 PM	Duels to the death could possibly be a triad special mission, but otherwise are a no-no that would get one character dead and the other one pulled, I imagine. Page 94 of the Bissel Meta-Activities Handbook v1.1.pdf has some interesting stuff on dueling. This is the kind of fun stuff I find when delving for obscure metaorgs. i kind of liked: use of magic is considererd 'dishonourable'... but not illegal. you come into a fistfight, only to find a hill giant enlarged, bull strengthed, nightstalkered, mage armoured, standing in front of you... 'what... must haave been something i ate...'
LGMoses 11-13-06, 09:37 PM	o god, must u look for loopholes in every rule? Seeing some of the crap people try and get away with on this forum makes me so sad. :weep:
_m_ 11-13-06, 10:22 PM	o god, must u look for loopholes in every rule? Seeing some of the crap people try and get away with on this forum makes me so sad. :weep: um... given that it wasnt a rule in the first place, nor do i think technically anything in this whole thread is legal in lgh... lighten up kid. joking around is fun! besides, why the hell would a wizard duel anyway?
LGMoses 11-14-06, 01:08 AM	never said wizard. Bard going for dualist :D I'll try and lighten up a tad. Just reading that about the charging cheetah was making my head hurt at the INSANITY of it. :eek:
_m_ 11-15-06, 05:07 PM	never said wizard. Bard going for dualist :D I'll try and lighten up a tad. Just reading that about the charging cheetah was making my head hurt at the INSANITY of it. :eek: lol @ charging cheetah. i mean really... they aint exactly weight bearing animals. imagine a cheetah actually trying to run with someone ono its back. if any1 has actually seen the way it's shoulders move, it would be totally restricted with a person or saddle on its back. meanwhile, u must remember... insanity is a GOOD thing :D
LGMoses 11-15-06, 10:27 PM	If u want insanity go to Eberron. I'm still running XE for some buds that play it but every mission its crazy new monsters I've never heard of and its driving me nuts. Just always these crazy monsters with crazy abilities. Lets see... there was two legged, clawed, one big eye having monster with a "flesh rotting gaze", a redcap, and a bunch of other crazy monsters I've never heard of.
Gelth 11-16-06, 01:33 PM	LGCS, page 61: "A character that purposefully attacks other PCs is immediately removed from play. See the FAQ in chapter 9 for more details." Page 71, in a question about attacking DM-controlled PCs (for instance, by Dominate): "On the other hand, as soon as you freely attack another character to cause serious physical harm while not defending yourself, your character is removed from the campaign." The upshot here is that what exactly constitutes an attack will vary by region and by Judge. I personally feel that anything that does damage of any kind to a PC, or forces a save from a PC, would qualify unless the player of that PC agreed and it was in my judgement that the circumstances warranted it. Nonlethal damage will be viewed somewhat more leniently, but still requires (non-coerced) player consent. Killing another PC is obviously and blatantly right out, as is attacking at all in a situation where it isn't necessary. My personal opinions: Catching a party member in a fireball is only acceptable if there is no better option and the PC being caught agrees freely. If there is any hesitation, then no. Dueling is right out, unless done nonlethally. You will get variation, though, on parts of this. --Penn, Ket Triad
Japangirl 11-16-06, 03:47 PM	The way I see it, catching a PC in a fireball is an unfortunate event but sometimes there is no other option. Depending on the situation, even if the player of the PC is vociferously opposed, I wouldn't stop the caster as a DM (it's the only hope to get everyone else out alive, the PC in the fireball did something moronic and put him/herself in the situation, etc). As long as the caster isn't going out of their way to kill a party member, sometimes the battlefield is just ugly. Things happen. Sometimes, it's a good thing to be the dominate target of a vampire . . .
trollbill 11-16-06, 04:42 PM	i kind of liked: use of magic is considererd 'dishonourable'... but not illegal. I've always loved rules of 'honor' that grossly bias a contest. Isn't 'honor' supposed to be about fairness? How fair is it for a 9th level Wizard to have to duel without spells against a 9th level fighter? Since they are supposed to be roughly equivalent power levels, then forbiding the use of spells effectively requires the wizard to fight with 2 legs and an arm tied behind his back. How honorable is that? The problem with applying the standard Medieval/Renaissance dueling codes to a fantasy environment is that a fantasy environment has a much broader array of weapons and fighting styles, and the rules regarding honor break down and are not representative of the actual society. besides, why the hell would a wizard duel anyway? What? A wizard can't be dishonored?
_m_ 11-16-06, 05:04 PM	What? A wizard can't be dishonored? no, its not that. its just... why would i duel (and risk mild bodily harm) when i could simply turn the opponent in question into a frog and be done with it? :P
Britt 11-16-06, 05:18 PM	That's why there are wizard duels and the like. A fighter would suck in a wizard duel or summoner's chess and that has nothing to do with common medieval stereotypes. There are different classifications of one-on-one fights and the solitary word "duel" has the conversational implicature of a melee fight entailing several "honour" rules. Most people wouldn't call a fight between a wizard and a fighter using spells and weapons a duel.
trollbill 11-16-06, 05:23 PM	That totally dismisses the entire point of most duels, i.e. to redress an injustice or dishonor. Dishonor can come from anyone, be they fighter or wizard, so a society that allows duels would consider such a possibility in its establishment of the rules of dueling. You can't just go, "Well, your words dishonored me, but because I'm a Wizard and you are a Fighter, I must remain dishonored." No one would accept such a judgement. Like I said, the Medieval dueling rules break down in a fantasy setting, and this is why. They do not represent the society they are being used for.
trollbill 11-16-06, 05:25 PM	no, its not that. its just... why would i duel (and risk mild bodily harm) when i could simply turn the opponent in question into a frog and be done with it? :P By that logic, a fighter could just stab someone with a sword and be done with it. Doing so defeats the entire purpose of a duel of honor.
_m_ 11-16-06, 05:28 PM	That totally dismisses the entire point of most duels, i.e. to redress an injustice or dishonor. Dishonor can come from anyone, be they fighter or wizard, so a society that allows duels would consider such a possibility in its establishment of the rules of dueling. You can't just go, "Well, your words dishonored me, but because I'm a Wizard and you are a Fighter, I must remain dishonored." No one would accept such a judgement. Like I said, the Medieval dueling rules break down in a fantasy setting, and this is why. They do not represent the society they are being used for. aye. duels kind of cropped in societies where... wizards werent. i mean in d&d, realistically, other than at low level, from about 7 and up, a wizard really ought to win 1v1 against a fighter. fly, fireball, fireball, fireball, phantasmal killer... that sort of thing.
Britt 11-16-06, 06:29 PM	Like I said, the Medieval dueling rules break down in a fantasy setting, and this is why. They do not represent the society they are being used for. I don't think they break down; I just think you would have other types of things as well as dueling. Sure, they might call them all the same thing, but we play the game, so when we say dueling, we mean that thing where two people get together and hit or shoot each other, typically over a point of honour. They would have wizard duels for casters and some other thing for cross-genre honour settling. I don't know what that thing would be called, or if there already is a word or rules for something like that. Anyways, it's all semantics and not really on-point :)
LGMoses 11-16-06, 11:29 PM	someone should get some land, start a wizard school, and introduce the spell dueling rules from Complete Arcane. Man, I've wanted to do that ever since I read that.
_m_ 11-16-06, 11:31 PM	someone should get some land, start a wizard school, and introduce the spell dueling rules from Complete Arcane. Man, I've wanted to do that ever since I read that. well, i own 4 properties in differnt areas, im a wizzard, im a ritter, and im part of the ratik wizards college... which hasnt actually yet been accessable (ie. it dosent exist yet)... im up for it.