Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Maesto 02-04-07, 10:52 PM	Hi, If I've got a sorceror/Mage of the Arcane Order, can I use Craft Wondrous Item to make things that need a spell that I don't have selected as my sorceror spells known, but can pull through from MooAO? Cheers, Jolyon
Mithreinmaethor 02-04-07, 11:32 PM	Well for one a Mage of the Arcane Order has the requirement for you to be able to PREPARE 2nd level spells. Sorcerers dont prepare spells. Even with the Arcane Preparation Feat the Spellpool ability would be unusable to you as a Sorcerer. I hope that you have not spent too many levels in MotAO. Hi, If I've got a sorceror/Mage of the Arcane Order, can I use Craft Wondrous Item to make things that need a spell that I don't have selected as my sorceror spells known, but can pull through from MooAO? Cheers, Jolyon
magebeast 02-05-07, 12:29 AM	Well for one a Mage of the Arcane Order has the requirement for you to be able to PREPARE 2nd level spells. Sorcerers dont prepare spells. Even with the Arcane Preparation Feat the Spellpool ability would be unusable to you as a Sorcerer. I hope that you have not spent too many levels in MotAO. It was suggested to me that you would prepare an empty slot. A friend of mine was trying to convince me to do what the above poster has done. I didn't like it, because it weirded me out. Looking at the feat description, I could see that it might be a problem, since it specifically says the feat may be used to memorize spells you know - an empty slot not being a spell you know.
Mithreinmaethor 02-05-07, 01:21 AM	You are correct. A prepared slot has a spell in it. An open/unused spot does not. Making the use of this feat and Sorcerer levels for the MotAO is impossible. Arcane Preperation - Each day you can use one or more of your spell slots to prepare spells you know. Prepared Spell Retention - Once a wizard prepares a spell, it remains in her mind as a nearly cast spell until she uses the prescribed components to complete and trigger it or until she abandons it. Spell Selection and Preparation - When preparing spells for the day, a wizard can leave some of these spell slots open. Later during that day, she can repeat the preparation process as often as she likes, time and circumstances permitting. During these extra sessions of preparation, the wizard can fill these unused spell slots. She cannot, however, abandon a previously prepared spell to replace it with another one or fill a slot that is empty because she has cast a spell in the meantime. MotAO Calling a Spell - Calling a spell from the spellpool can be done at any distance but requires the caster to have an open, unused spell slot. It was suggested to me that you would prepare an empty slot. A friend of mine was trying to convince me to do what the above poster has done. I didn't like it, because it weirded me out. Looking at the feat description, I could see that it might be a problem, since it specifically says the feat may be used to memorize spells you know - an empty slot not being a spell you know. Maybe if he explains his mistake to his Triad real nicely they will let him correct his mistake. Instead of just outright taking the character when he gets caught.
Maesto 02-05-07, 02:20 AM	I don't have my books on me at the moment, but I seem to remember believing that the spellpool worked when used in conjunction with arcane preparation. Regardless, using arcane preparation allows a sorceror to qualify for mage of the arcane order, and even if the spellpool is unusable, the character is still legal, having met the prerequisites etc etc etc.
Mithreinmaethor 02-05-07, 03:13 AM	Yes with the feat they could qualify for the PRC. But clearly can not use the spell pool. The feat requires you to prepare a spell, the PRC Spellpool requires an unprepared slot. They dont work in conjunction. And the PRC does not offer much to it outside of the Spellpool. I don't have my books on me at the moment, but I seem to remember believing that the spellpool worked when used in conjunction with arcane preparation. Regardless, using arcane preparation allows a sorceror to qualify for mage of the arcane order, and even if the spellpool is unusable, the character is still legal, having met the prerequisites etc etc etc.
magebeast 02-05-07, 12:29 PM	Yes with the feat they could qualify for the PRC. But clearly can not use the spell pool. The feat requires you to prepare a spell, the PRC Spellpool requires an unprepared slot. They dont work in conjunction. And the PRC does not offer much to it outside of the Spellpool. Actually, go back and read the description of spellpool again. Isn't every slot on a spontaneous caster open and unused until it's cast?
copper_wyrmling 02-05-07, 12:31 PM	Just so people have the exact wording: Prerequisites: "Able to prepare and cast 2nd-level arcane spells". -The Arcane Preparation feat unambiguously fulfils this condition. Spellpool: "calling a spell from the spellpool... requires the caster to have an open, unused spell slot of the appropriate level. Wizards preparing spells for the day decide at that time whether to leave some spell slots open." "Spell slots" are defined on p.178 of the PHB and are not specific to prepared spellcasters. There is a fairly strong argument that a sorcerer starts with ALL their spells / day as "open unused spell slots", and thus can call spells from the spellpool into any of their slots (although they still need Arcane Prep to enter the class). I know there are existing sorcerer / mages of the arcane order in the campaign that assume that interpretation. I do not have a strong opinion on the crafting question since it's really an LG-specific question (on one hand, we know that scrolls work, on the other, temporary CL-boosters do not). I would lean towards allowing it due to the scroll precedent. (note: I have never had to rule on the first issue in-game but would not deny a PC their major prestige class benefit without ironclad rules support, my sorc is not a mage of the arcane order and never will be)