MIC items that change prerequisites [Archive] - Wizards Community

MIC items that change prerequisites [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
crimsonsky
07-11-07, 09:39 AM My apologies if this has already been asked, but I couldn't find an answer to my question.

Let's say I have access to craft a Mantle of Second Chances from DMG II.

Prerequisites: Craft Wondrous Item.
Cost to Craft: 3,000 gp; 240 xp; 2 TU.

The item has been updated in MIC.

Prerequisites: Craft Wondrous Item, Luck Domain.
Cost to Craft: 6,000 gp; 480 xp; 3 TU.

My question is, what happens when the MIC is adopted as the current rules for the campaign if my character doesn't have the Luck Domain?

Will I be forced to sell the item because I no longer meet the prerequisites to craft it, or will I be allowed to pay the difference in gold, XP, and TUs to keep it?

Would the answer be any different if there wasn't a change to the cost of the item?

I'm not sure if any other items changed prerequisites, I only noticed this one.

Thanks.
eleran
07-11-07, 11:36 AM I'm not sure any of us can help you with this as I would think it would be up to the DM of the campaign your in at the time. My own persoanl ruling would be to grandfather you in at the old prerequisites but make you get assistance from someone who has access to the Luck Domain and have you pay them the difference in gold for their help.
Shaudius
07-11-07, 12:32 PM I imagine he is referring to LG. I'm no one official, but I think this would work similar to what happened this year with the crafting change. You used to be able to craft anything in the DMG once you hit its caster level + 2 levels even without AR access. This is no longer the case. If you crafted it when you were able, you can keep it, but you can't use the old rules now.

So if you craft it now, and have crafting access to the non-MIC version, you can craft it. If you have access to the MIC version and no luck domain you can't craft it.

Magic items use the source you have access to, old or MIC, until there is a conversion. This has been specifically answered by the circle, and is not the same as the general rule about always using the latest rules source.

Once the conversion happens they will answer the question, I do believe that you'll be able to keep the item, whether or not you'll have to pay the difference remains to be seen.

Thats all my opinion, someone with official capacity can correct it if I'm wrong.
crimsonsky
07-11-07, 12:34 PM I'm not sure any of us can help you with this as I would think it would be up to the DM of the campaign your in at the time. My own persoanl ruling would be to grandfather you in at the old prerequisites but make you get assistance from someone who has access to the Luck Domain and have you pay them the difference in gold for their help.

This is a forum for the Living Greyhawk campaign.

The question was directed at the Circle, or anyone else who can point me to a prior ruling from the Circle.

Thank you.
pedr
07-11-07, 12:42 PM I've been asking since MIC came out for information about when we're likely to see a conversion to the MIC similar to the SpC conversion. I seem to recall that Britt mentioned that this is harder to do for magic items as no-one has a list of what items have changed between the original source and the MIC so step one for the Circle would be to create such a list, which is going to be very time-consuming and error-prone. It might, in fact, be better to simply leave the campaign as-is with both original and MIC items in play depending on when the access was given, but this feels like grandfathering so is unlikely.

The conversion, if and when it happens, could be very significant for some characters and will probably require 'correcting' what is owned in the same way that the 3.0 to 3.5 and builder book conversions did. Finding a way of being sure what the proper source for a particular item is in future is going to be another challenge: SpC reprinted (practically) every spell from a list of books; MIC is different and so there is a lot of room for people to inadvertantly purchase an outdated version of an item, even years into the future, unless someone checks every item access entry on every AR against a list and issues errata, which would be unfeasibly time consuming!
Lupo
07-11-07, 01:45 PM My apologies if this has already been asked, but I couldn't find an answer to my question.

Let's say I have access to craft a Mantle of Second Chances from DMG II.

Prerequisites: Craft Wondrous Item.
Cost to Craft: 3,000 gp; 240 xp; 2 TU.

The item has been updated in MIC.

Prerequisites: Craft Wondrous Item, Luck Domain.
Cost to Craft: 6,000 gp; 480 xp; 3 TU.

My question is, what happens when the MIC is adopted as the current rules for the campaign if my character doesn't have the Luck Domain?

Will I be forced to sell the item because I no longer meet the prerequisites to craft it, or will I be allowed to pay the difference in gold, XP, and TUs to keep it?

Would the answer be any different if there wasn't a change to the cost of the item?

I'm not sure if any other items changed prerequisites, I only noticed this one.

Thanks.

taking the example of the recent changes regarding CMI in general like the issues with "Pearls of Power" or "Ioun Stones" you will most likely have to pay the difference but can keep the item. though you will not be able to craft another one.

ciao

martin m.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
crimsonsky 07-11-07, 09:39 AM	My apologies if this has already been asked, but I couldn't find an answer to my question. Let's say I have access to craft a Mantle of Second Chances from DMG II. Prerequisites: Craft Wondrous Item. Cost to Craft: 3,000 gp; 240 xp; 2 TU. The item has been updated in MIC. Prerequisites: Craft Wondrous Item, Luck Domain. Cost to Craft: 6,000 gp; 480 xp; 3 TU. My question is, what happens when the MIC is adopted as the current rules for the campaign if my character doesn't have the Luck Domain? Will I be forced to sell the item because I no longer meet the prerequisites to craft it, or will I be allowed to pay the difference in gold, XP, and TUs to keep it? Would the answer be any different if there wasn't a change to the cost of the item? I'm not sure if any other items changed prerequisites, I only noticed this one. Thanks.
eleran 07-11-07, 11:36 AM	I'm not sure any of us can help you with this as I would think it would be up to the DM of the campaign your in at the time. My own persoanl ruling would be to grandfather you in at the old prerequisites but make you get assistance from someone who has access to the Luck Domain and have you pay them the difference in gold for their help.
Shaudius 07-11-07, 12:32 PM	I imagine he is referring to LG. I'm no one official, but I think this would work similar to what happened this year with the crafting change. You used to be able to craft anything in the DMG once you hit its caster level + 2 levels even without AR access. This is no longer the case. If you crafted it when you were able, you can keep it, but you can't use the old rules now. So if you craft it now, and have crafting access to the non-MIC version, you can craft it. If you have access to the MIC version and no luck domain you can't craft it. Magic items use the source you have access to, old or MIC, until there is a conversion. This has been specifically answered by the circle, and is not the same as the general rule about always using the latest rules source. Once the conversion happens they will answer the question, I do believe that you'll be able to keep the item, whether or not you'll have to pay the difference remains to be seen. Thats all my opinion, someone with official capacity can correct it if I'm wrong.
crimsonsky 07-11-07, 12:34 PM	I'm not sure any of us can help you with this as I would think it would be up to the DM of the campaign your in at the time. My own persoanl ruling would be to grandfather you in at the old prerequisites but make you get assistance from someone who has access to the Luck Domain and have you pay them the difference in gold for their help. This is a forum for the Living Greyhawk campaign. The question was directed at the Circle, or anyone else who can point me to a prior ruling from the Circle. Thank you.
pedr 07-11-07, 12:42 PM	I've been asking since MIC came out for information about when we're likely to see a conversion to the MIC similar to the SpC conversion. I seem to recall that Britt mentioned that this is harder to do for magic items as no-one has a list of what items have changed between the original source and the MIC so step one for the Circle would be to create such a list, which is going to be very time-consuming and error-prone. It might, in fact, be better to simply leave the campaign as-is with both original and MIC items in play depending on when the access was given, but this feels like grandfathering so is unlikely. The conversion, if and when it happens, could be very significant for some characters and will probably require 'correcting' what is owned in the same way that the 3.0 to 3.5 and builder book conversions did. Finding a way of being sure what the proper source for a particular item is in future is going to be another challenge: SpC reprinted (practically) every spell from a list of books; MIC is different and so there is a lot of room for people to inadvertantly purchase an outdated version of an item, even years into the future, unless someone checks every item access entry on every AR against a list and issues errata, which would be unfeasibly time consuming!
Lupo 07-11-07, 01:45 PM	My apologies if this has already been asked, but I couldn't find an answer to my question. Let's say I have access to craft a Mantle of Second Chances from DMG II. Prerequisites: Craft Wondrous Item. Cost to Craft: 3,000 gp; 240 xp; 2 TU. The item has been updated in MIC. Prerequisites: Craft Wondrous Item, Luck Domain. Cost to Craft: 6,000 gp; 480 xp; 3 TU. My question is, what happens when the MIC is adopted as the current rules for the campaign if my character doesn't have the Luck Domain? Will I be forced to sell the item because I no longer meet the prerequisites to craft it, or will I be allowed to pay the difference in gold, XP, and TUs to keep it? Would the answer be any different if there wasn't a change to the cost of the item? I'm not sure if any other items changed prerequisites, I only noticed this one. Thanks. taking the example of the recent changes regarding CMI in general like the issues with "Pearls of Power" or "Ioun Stones" you will most likely have to pay the difference but can keep the item. though you will not be able to craft another one. ciao martin m.