Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Jay_Ibero_911 12-28-07, 09:42 AM	I've asked it before, and it was fuzzy then, but with the PHB2 erratta out and no correction made, I guess it's finally safe to assume that it was intentional. While Flurry of Blows specifically states it can't be done in armor, Decisive Strike does not, and so I'm inclined to believe the ability can be used in armor...it also makes sense to a degree, that while in order to perform a flurry you must be unencumbered, that is not the case for a single powerful strike...thoughts/opinions? Also, is anyone aware of an open access 1 handed exotic monk weapons? I was considering a Monk/Fighter/Exotic Weapon master for GHR, combining decisive strike and uncanny blow to effectively get 4x strength bonus to a single attack...
RtrnofdMax 12-28-07, 10:59 AM	I've asked it before, and it was fuzzy then, but with the PHB2 erratta out and no correction made, I guess it's finally safe to assume that it was intentional. While Flurry of Blows specifically states it can't be done in armor, Decisive Strike does not, and so I'm inclined to believe the ability can be used in armor...it also makes sense to a degree, that while in order to perform a flurry you must be unencumbered, that is not the case for a single powerful strike...thoughts/opinions? Also, is anyone aware of an open access 1 handed exotic monk weapons? I was considering a Monk/Fighter/Exotic Weapon master for GHR, combining decisive strike and uncanny blow to effectively get 4x strength bonus to a single attack... The monk is proficient with all four light exotic weapons from the PHB. It doesn't say anything about treating these weapons as martial or simple, so there's 4 to choose from.
MwaO 12-28-07, 11:22 AM	Also, is anyone aware of an open access 1 handed exotic monk weapons? I was considering a Monk/Fighter/Exotic Weapon master for GHR, combining decisive strike and uncanny blow to effectively get 4x strength bonus to a single attack... There are a couple of double-weapons(Longstaff, Lajatang), but there aren't any one-handed ones.
Jay_Ibero_911 12-28-07, 11:49 AM	There are a couple of double-weapons(Longstaff, Lajatang), but there aren't any one-handed ones. Figured as much. Scoured the books myself and couldn't find one either...At least the quarterstaff can benefit from Brambles/Spikes/Shillelagh for some good fun.
Jay_Ibero_911 12-28-07, 11:50 AM	The monk is proficient with all four light exotic weapons from the PHB. It doesn't say anything about treating these weapons as martial or simple, so there's 4 to choose from. I said one handed, not light.
RtrnofdMax 12-28-07, 12:45 PM	I said one handed, not light. Only in DnD, where a weapon you wield in one hand isn't one handed unless the table says so... Good news about that quarter staff is you can wield it in one hand with those buffs. I dunno what you're planning on doing with your other hand (shield?) but this seems to solve your problem until your unarmed strike increases.
Jay_Ibero_911 12-28-07, 01:12 PM	Only in DnD, where a weapon you wield in one hand isn't one handed unless the table says so... Good news about that quarter staff is you can wield it in one hand with those buffs. I dunno what you're planning on doing with your other hand (shield?) but this seems to solve your problem until your unarmed strike increases. The build right now plans on using the quarterstaff exclusively, due to the benefit of getting 2 handed power attack multiplied by the decisive strike. As far a wielding a quarterstaff one handed, it's debateable, but irrelevant to this build anyway. Race:Human Alignment: STR-15 (8) DEX-14 (6) CON-14 (6) INT- () WIS- () CHA- () Lv1(Fighter)Power Attack, Weapon Focus (Quarterstaff)* Lv2(Monk)Decisive Strike Lv3(Monk) Lv4(Fighter)Feat*, +1 STR Lv5(Fighter) Lv6(Barbarian)Extra Rage Lv7(Fighter)Weapon Specialization (Quarterstaff)* Lv8(Fighter)+1 STR Lv9(Fighter)Melee Weapon Mastery (Bludgeoning), Brutal Strike Decisive Strike at 9th level w/+1 quaterstaff, +4 Strength item, raging 8 bab +7 str, +3 feats, +1 weapon, -2 decisive Strike=+17 (1d6, +10 str, +4 feats, +1 weapon)x2= 2d6+30 Or full power attack for +9 for 2d6+62, Brutal Strike fort save DC=42 (32 damage from power attack) And yes, it requires an alignment hop...oh well.
MwaO 12-28-07, 01:28 PM	Why not Monk at 1st level - you're trading a really nice skill list of Monk for the lousy one of Fighter. Nothing stops a Monk, especially of your kind, from wearing MW Studded Leather and MW Buckler. Especially as a human, you can easily pick up 5 ranks in Balance, Tumble, Listen, and Spot. I'm not really sure how Decisive Strike is worth that much. There are a lot of times where I'd rather just swing a big Greatsword twice than hit once with a Quarterstaff, even for double damage. You might also consider Longstaff for this - you can pick up Flurry from Exotic Weapon Master for an extra attack where you do Str*1.5 throughout. Not to mention, you fight defensively, you're immune to being flanked. Finally, I'd figure out how to get at least a 16 Str in there. Having a 16 Str makes a pretty big difference in the early going. I remember having people being really surprised by my Monk swinging a greatsword non-proficiently, hitting, and then doing around 11 hp of damage.
Jay_Ibero_911 12-28-07, 06:57 PM	Why not Monk at 1st level - you're trading a really nice skill list of Monk for the lousy one of Fighter. Nothing stops a Monk, especially of your kind, from wearing MW Studded Leather and MW Buckler. Especially as a human, you can easily pick up 5 ranks in Balance, Tumble, Listen, and Spot. I'm not really sure how Decisive Strike is worth that much. There are a lot of times where I'd rather just swing a big Greatsword twice than hit once with a Quarterstaff, even for double damage. You might also consider Longstaff for this - you can pick up Flurry from Exotic Weapon Master for an extra attack where you do Str*1.5 throughout. Not to mention, you fight defensively, you're immune to being flanked. Finally, I'd figure out how to get at least a 16 Str in there. Having a 16 Str makes a pretty big difference in the early going. I remember having people being really surprised by my Monk swinging a greatsword non-proficiently, hitting, and then doing around 11 hp of damage. The reason for fighter 1st is the better HP and ability to afford chainshirt right off the bat. I don't want to have to invest that much in wisdom really. Also, double damage on one attack makes massive damage much easier to pull off, and if something is rolling for massive damage frequently, they are bound to fail here and there. As far as exotic flurry with longstaff over decisive strike with or without it, well it's just a matter of preference. I have bad enough luck with rolls that most of the time my secondary attacks and beyond don't hit anyway, so I like being able to lump everything into one roll and still have it hurt. Also makes play much simpler when you only have one attack to worry about. The nice thing about decisive strike in conjunction with brutal strike is it makes the DC's almost impossible without a 20 since it's based on how much damage you did with power attack on a given attack. Also, this character is like my 7th or 8th PC in total, so I don't care much about him anyway, as long as he can make it through the ruins.
KShaver 12-31-07, 04:31 PM	Why that much dex? Since you can wear armor why not go all the way and save those points for more strength or other attribute? At least thats my thinking, my build was paladin/monk with ascetic knight. A full smite doubled does a lot of damage and if you need a high attack value you don't have to power attack to still deal decent damage.
MwaO 12-31-07, 04:44 PM	Yeah, that's one of the things I was thinking would be an issue - a half-orc monk with an 18 Str does 2d6+12 with a Quarterstaff swing. Plus he has +1.5 to hit over the other build. At 3rd level, if the 18 Str Monk does Power Attack, it does 2d6+20 damage for the same to-hit for which this build is doing 2d6+6...
Jay_Ibero_911 01-02-08, 12:36 AM	Why that much dex? Since you can wear armor why not go all the way and save those points for more strength or other attribute? At least thats my thinking, my build was paladin/monk with ascetic knight. A full smite doubled does a lot of damage and if you need a high attack value you don't have to power attack to still deal decent damage. Ooh, I do like the idea of using ascetic knight with for a decisive smite...that's awesome. I may have to borrow that.
Arvagor 01-02-08, 11:19 AM	I've asked it before, and it was fuzzy then, but with the PHB2 erratta out and no correction made, I guess it's finally safe to assume that it was intentional. While Flurry of Blows specifically states it can't be done in armor, Decisive Strike does not, and so I'm inclined to believe the ability can be used in armor...it also makes sense to a degree, that while in order to perform a flurry you must be unencumbered, that is not the case for a single powerful strike...thoughts/opinions? It could be argued that because the Decisive Strike feature replaces Flurry of Blows, that it in fact replaces all references to Flurry of Blows in the monk's class description, leading to the statement, "When wearing armor, using a shield, or carrying a medium or heavy load, a monk loses her AC bonus, as well as her fast movement and decisive strike abilities." Just another argument to consider...
Jay_Ibero_911 01-02-08, 12:00 PM	It could be argued that because the Decisive Strike feature replaces Flurry of Blows, that it in fact replaces all references to Flurry of Blows in the monk's class description, leading to the statement, "When wearing armor, using a shield, or carrying a medium or heavy load, a monk loses her AC bonus, as well as her fast movement and decisive strike abilities." Just another argument to consider... I can see your point, but I don't know why they wouldn't just tag in onto the ability itself by begining the text with "When unarmored..." just like flurry of blows. In contrast, they did explicitly state that the Scout alternate class feature is lost when wearing medium or heavy armor or carrying a medium or heavy load, when both the abilities replaced (Fast movement, evasion) are lost under the same circumstances.
Istaran 01-03-08, 05:44 PM	It seems like there may be some table variation, but the text of the ability itself clearly does not require you to be unarmored. I would allow it at my tables, certainly, but check with any judges you frequently play under and have problems with.
katrick 01-04-08, 07:55 AM	Nae worries if your a dwarf katixck
Arvagor 01-04-08, 07:14 PM	Nae worries if your a dwarf katixck Why? If your thinking of the dwarf's ability to move at his normal land speed while armored, then that has no bearing on the issue of an armored monk... :confused: