Post/Author/DateTime	Post
EberronMoses 10-28-06, 07:46 PM	ok, i'm a sixth level ranger. I took the archery style so i now have rapid shot and many shot. I full round attack against an ogre who is 60 ft away. I'm rapid shotting and many shotting. I'm a six level ranger so my BAB is +6/+1. Here is what I'm wondering: would I attack once, using many shot to put out 2 arrows at the +6 bonus(not counting penalties for manyshot or rapid shot), then put out 2 more arrows for my +1 bonus, then put out 2 more at +6 for rapid shot? Is this how that works? It says u rapid shot as a full round action and u manyshot as a standard so whats going on?
Mommy was an Orc 10-28-06, 08:11 PM	ok, i'm a sixth level ranger. I took the archery style so i now have rapid shot and many shot. I full round attack against an ogre who is 60 ft away. I'm rapid shotting and many shotting. I'm a six level ranger so my BAB is +6/+1. Here is what I'm wondering: would I attack once, using many shot to put out 2 arrows at the +6 bonus(not counting penalties for manyshot or rapid shot), then put out 2 more arrows for my +1 bonus, then put out 2 more at +6 for rapid shot? Is this how that works? It says u rapid shot as a full round action and u manyshot as a standard so whats going on? You've got 2 options: You can Manyshot as a standard action and fire 2 arrows at +2/+2. You can Rapid Shot as a full action and fire 3 arrows at +4/+4/-1. You can't combine the actions - Manyshot is primarily good for when you want to move, then fire(or vice versa) or when you want to ready an action to shoot a spellcaster.
Swiftbrook 10-28-06, 10:25 PM	You've got 2 options: You can Manyshot as a standard action and fire 2 arrows at +2/+2. You can Rapid Shot as a full action and fire 3 arrows at +4/+4/-1. You can't combine the actions - Manyshot is primarily good for when you want to move, then fire(or vice versa) or when you want to ready an action to shoot a spellcaster. You can't Manyshot at 60'. Manyshot states "As a standard action, you may fire two arrows at a singlw opponent within 30 feet." -Swiftbrook
EberronMoses 10-28-06, 11:00 PM	sorry about the 30 ft thing, my main question was "how many arrows can i get out per turn" thanks for answering htis my half orc friend.
Maesto 10-29-06, 08:09 AM	Note that with manyshot, you only make one attack roll; you just get a penalty on it. Also note that because you're within 30 feet, you're always getting point blank shot.
retro 10-30-06, 09:53 PM	Note that, if your ranger chooses to take levels in the Order of the Bow Initiate prestige class, the ranged precision class ability also does not stack with either Rapid Shot or Manyshot. The description of ranged precision states specifically that the character must take a standard action to fire one arrow that does the extra ranged precision damage. Likewise, taking a Manyshot requires a standard action to fire 2+ arrows with a single attack, while Rapid Shot takes a full-round action to make one extra ranged attack at your highest attack bonus. Remember- if you're moving, use Manyshot. If you're not, use Rapid Shot.
clannagh 10-30-06, 10:21 PM	AFAIK manyshot does however stack with skirmish and sneak attack making scout/rogue archers fairly viable
_m_ 10-30-06, 10:28 PM	AFAIK manyshot does however stack with skirmish and sneak attack making scout/rogue archers fairly viable or highland stalker/rogue archers... you could go scout, stalker, range, um... hell theres like a lot of them... :D
Japangirl 10-30-06, 10:40 PM	You only get sneak attack once with Manyshot, and just a second arrow's damage for the second arrow. One attack roll, one precision damage. It makes archer rogues very sad.
_m_ 10-30-06, 10:47 PM	do you get multiple sneak attacks with rapid shot? say, if you had grtr invis on, so they were always sneak attackable... would your rapid shots all sneak attack?
kenobi65 10-31-06, 12:02 AM	do you get multiple sneak attacks with rapid shot? say, if you had grtr invis on, so they were always sneak attackable... would your rapid shots all sneak attack? Yes...if the action of the first attack doesn't change the condition that allows you to sneak attack (i.e., regular invisibility goes away after your first attack), then you would get the sneak attack damage for all attacks. So, yes, greater invisibility, which isn't dispelled by the first attack, would allow you to do this.
Gwumph 10-31-06, 02:11 AM	So What you want is a Rogue/Fighter archer that is hasted has GRinvis on Has rapid shot and is within 30 feet Once you get a +11 BAB, you would be able to make 5 attacks which would include sneak attack damage for every attack. Trust me its awesome!!! My DM HATES! my archer guy. Gwumph p.s want to make it really sick, make your character mounted. the enemy is 75 feet away. Ride up 50', do a full attack (all 5 arrows) plus sneak attack, Then ride back 50'. Your mount is now the orginal 75 feet away, out of charging distance for most enemies and you are still invisible. Next round Repeat process!! BTW at this point u really need to start carrying alot of arrows, since you can go through a quiver in 4 rounds
_m_ 10-31-06, 05:39 PM	So What you want is a Rogue/Fighter archer that is hasted has GRinvis on Has rapid shot and is within 30 feet Once you get a +11 BAB, you would be able to make 5 attacks which would include sneak attack damage for every attack. Trust me its awesome!!! My DM HATES! my archer guy. Gwumph p.s want to make it really sick, make your character mounted. the enemy is 75 feet away. Ride up 50', do a full attack (all 5 arrows) plus sneak attack, Then ride back 50'. Your mount is now the orginal 75 feet away, out of charging distance for most enemies and you are still invisible. Next round Repeat process!! BTW at this point u really need to start carrying alot of arrows, since you can go through a quiver in 4 rounds if you already have greater invisibility on, why bother riding around, thus needing another feat to negate the penalites. y not just stand there? or better still, get the girl who put invisibility on you to give you fly as well.
ezreal2001 10-31-06, 06:32 PM	do you get multiple sneak attacks with rapid shot? say, if you had grtr invis on, so they were always sneak attackable... would your rapid shots all sneak attack? Your PC gets a ranged Sneak Attack anytime his victim is within 30 feet is denied its dex bonus. This can occur when the Assailant is invisible, but the following conditions can cause a victim to be denied dex: the victim is flat footed (shock and awe will help ensure that a victim who misses the surprise round won't last long enough to act in the first round); the victim is stunned (God, how I miss the Stagering Strike card); the victim is blind (Glitterdust helps here); the victim is balancing and dosen't have 5 ranks of balance(Grease is good for this); the victim is climbing. And if your PC casts Sniper's Shot the 30 foot range limitation no longer applys.
ezreal2001 10-31-06, 06:41 PM	if you already have greater invisibility on, why bother riding around, thus needing another feat to negate the penalites. y not just stand there? or better still, get the girl who put invisibility on you to give you fly as well. Speaking out of turn here. There is no penalty to missile if the mount only single moves, so being mounted means having the option to close, shoot separate. While beng airbourne is generally better than being on the ground since you can play with 3 dimensions rather than 2, not having a mount to do the moving for you means your options are full attack (allways the best attack option for an archer) or single move and single attack. As such the options are either cast fly on the mount or cast mass fly on the rider and the mount.
_m_ 10-31-06, 06:49 PM	Speaking out of turn here. There is no penalty to missile if the mount only single moves, so being mounted means having the option to close, shoot separate. While beng airbourne is generally better than being on the ground since you can play with 3 dimensions rather than 2, not having a mount to do the moving for you means your options are full attack (allways the best attack option for an archer) or single move and single attack. As such the options are either cast fly on the mount or cast mass fly on the rider and the mount. incidentally, as for the mounted option, you need to burn a futher invisibility on the horse. Otherwise, even the dumbest npc will notice that when the horse moves towards it, it gets hurt, and consequently, kills the horse. as for making the horse fly, again, thats another spell you really dont need to waste. given that time is precious in combat, i doubt the sorcerer / wiz wants to spend 4 times making you and your horse flying and invisible (or 2, if he burns higher level spells). either get fly and g/invis, or even just g/invis, and you'll be fine.
clannagh 10-31-06, 06:57 PM	incidentally, as for the mounted option, you need to burn a futher invisibility on the horse. Otherwise, even the dumbest npc will notice that when the horse moves towards it, it gets hurt, and consequently, kills the horse. as for making the horse fly, again, thats another spell you really dont need to waste. given that time is precious in combat, i doubt the sorcerer / wiz wants to spend 4 times making you and your horse flying and invisible (or 2, if he burns higher level spells). either get fly and g/invis, or even just g/invis, and you'll be fine. potentially just two spells .. - fly on the horse and do not fall off - invisibilty sphere the real question is why bother with the horse once you are flying and invisible
EberronMoses 10-31-06, 07:00 PM	just rereading this post and want to say, I don't have a sixth level ranger. Not yet anyways. I have a 1st level ranger thats never played b4. I'm just wanting help on his progression. He's human, but I won't be making one of his first two feats Mounted combat cuz he's not really mounted focused at first. Ah well, I'll just play him and give him the feats he deserves all willy/nilly like. :w00t:
_m_ 10-31-06, 07:29 PM	potentially just two spells .. - fly on the horse and do not fall off - invisibilty sphere the real question is why bother with the horse once you are flying and invisible fly on the horse and do not fall off? like you have control over wether you fall off lol. but yeah, i really cant work out y on earth you'd want a flying horse with you when you could just sit there invisibly anyway. as for ranger progresion, my range is a move and shoot 1 shotter: ranger, rogue, highland stalker, scout. stackable sneak attack and skirmish damage. shes mostl;y just there for tracking, holding up mobs and such, as shes only a cohort.
clannagh 10-31-06, 10:29 PM	just rereading this post and want to say, I don't have a sixth level ranger. Not yet anyways. I have a 1st level ranger thats never played b4. I'm just wanting help on his progression. He's human, but I won't be making one of his first two feats Mounted combat cuz he's not really mounted focused at first. Ah well, I'll just play him and give him the feats he deserves all willy/nilly like. :w00t: OK ... assuming you want a shooty ranger and actually go six levels of ranger (which eliminates weapon specialisation etc which need fighter levels).... lets look at the build ... the following feats are simply essential for any archer: - Point Blank Shot - Precise Shot you then need to decide are you a stand and shoot ranger or a move/hide shoot ranger .. its pretty difficult to build a good archer that excels at both stand and shoot rangers will benefit most from: - woodland archer - improved rapid shot - levels of rogue to get sneak attack when enemies are flat footed single shot archers will benefit from - levels of rogue, scout and oath bow initiate to add extra dice to your damage rolls (note OBI precision damage does not work with many shot or rapid shot) - if a hiding rogue .. able sniper make sure you use the new rangers spells, the standard spells are so pathetic that most shooty rangers had wisdom 8 .. teh new spells like arrow mind actually make ranger spells a must for a ranger archer
GrahamWills 11-01-06, 06:11 PM	And for all you people who need to deal with archers, the simplest way is to ready an action to charge them when they approach within 50'. Then, depending on your niceness, disarm them (an almost certain success), grapple them (just a very likely success), or sunder their bows (if you hate the *player*). Or trip, I guess.
_m_ 11-01-06, 06:16 PM	or: go invisible yourself dispel their invisibility blink hell, like a million spells do the trick my personal favourite spell atm it ottilukes resiliant sphere. just put em in one of those and youve got no annoying archer for 10ish minutes :D
clannagh 11-01-06, 06:28 PM	And for all you people who need to deal with archers, the simplest way is to ready an action to charge them when they approach within 50'. Then, depending on your niceness, disarm them (an almost certain success), grapple them (just a very likely success), or sunder their bows (if you hate the *player*). Or trip, I guess. with far shot a distance bow and arrows of flight available my archer never approaches within 50 feet unless the mod absolutely forces it
_m_ 11-01-06, 06:39 PM	with far shot a distance bow and arrows of flight available my archer never approaches within 50 feet unless the mod absolutely forces it ive seen her hit from over 1000 feet. heck, with a few levels of cragtop archer, a far shooting greatbow, and some nice arrows, you can hit at over 10-thousand feet on a regular basis.
paigeoliver 11-02-06, 10:31 PM	I took a level of Barbarian with my archer precisely to get out of grapples, it had been happening too often. Also, another archer trick is finding out before the start of the module if their is a druid playing, if so you can ask them to bring a Dire Bat companion, which you can ride and stay out of melee. Some players are more amicable to this than others. Druids who are companion based will probably tell you to smeg off, but those that are more into summoning and wild shape might let you use the bat. Or, you can make that 8th ranger level and get a bat yourself, or burn a feat to take beastmaster for a level and get a bat that way.
SgtHulka 11-09-06, 09:04 AM	my personal favourite spell atm it ottilukes resiliant sphere. just put em in one of those and youve got no annoying archer for 10ish minutes :D At lower levels Web is interesting as well. So long as they're 10 feet deep in it you've got full cover against them, and they're entangled even if they fail their saving throw. Put them on the outer edge of it and you've got several rounds of not having to deal with them. Though you need vertical terrain to attach the web to. It synergizes well with burning hands and fireball, too. Solid Fog works great, too. Though it can get messy because you can't dismiss it. Baleful Transposition is one of the funnest ones to use against archers and spellcasters, if you can gain access to it. Have your familiar move up next to the big dumb fighter and baleful transpose the archer and the familiar. Granted, if he makes the save you're out of luck. But seeing an archer or spellcaster suddenly get pounded by a big dumb fighter full attack is priceless.
_m_ 11-09-06, 10:39 PM	At lower levels Web is interesting as well. So long as they're 10 feet deep in it you've got full cover against them, and they're entangled even if they fail their saving throw. Put them on the outer edge of it and you've got several rounds of not having to deal with them. Though you need vertical terrain to attach the web to. It synergizes well with burning hands and fireball, too. Solid Fog works great, too. Though it can get messy because you can't dismiss it. Baleful Transposition is one of the funnest ones to use against archers and spellcasters, if you can gain access to it. Have your familiar move up next to the big dumb fighter and baleful transpose the archer and the familiar. Granted, if he makes the save you're out of luck. But seeing an archer or spellcaster suddenly get pounded by a big dumb fighter full attack is priceless. 2 things... 1, that would work really well with my incorporeal familiar... move him 40 feet underground, transpose someone with him... damage as they get shunted up... to beside the fighter :D 2. FUNNEST!!! best word EVER :D