Post/Author/DateTime	Post
LGMoses 01-23-07, 11:51 PM	Hey Britt. I need some answered with ur official Circle Power 1. What am I allowed to charge people ingame. reason: I had osme players recently start a barfight in the Blue Dragon Inn. The fight came out of nowhere. They got asked by the maitre D' or whatever 3 times to keep it down. The maitre D' told them to leave. They refused and smashed a chair over a random patron's back. They continued fighting, throwing chairs and stuff. They broke some stuff and resisted arrest a bit. I had them stay in jail a night and made them pay for the broken stuff in the bar. Is there nething else I should have done? Also, am I allowed to charge TU's for players ingame choices. They did assault several people in the bar. If I had not just been shocked by their rude behavior I would have charged them atleast a few 100 gp. It was a fight that they alone provoked in a rather upscale inn. 2. My players messed with an unhallowed altar with a sacrifice to Old Wicked on it. The altar was very evil and radiated an aura that would stun neone. They banged their swords on it and challenged Iuz and said all sorts of nasty things about the fiend of the north. The mod didn't say nething but should something happen for their gross violation of htis altar. Also, someone gave teh certain good aligned sentient being on this altar a proper burial. IE, they removed the sacrifice and buried it on holy ground while praying to their god Kord. What if neting would u suggest happen? 3. Also, one of my players has put ranks into Proffession: pirate? Does that do nething? u know, if ur proffession is illegal? just curious. btw, the stuff from question 2 is in a mod still available for play but u don't know ne of that stuff until the last 3 seconds, and I didn't give nething away. Thanks for all the work u do Britt
Britt 01-24-07, 12:15 AM	1. I'm not sure on this point and need to discuss that with the rest of the Circle. It's probalby not something we would be able to address until after the LGCS and DDXP. 2. This is a problem with having an evil demigod as a major NPC in plot arcs. By the rules, Iuz would know everything they did and would probably show up and kill them all (or all but one). However, we can't really do anything like that except maybe at interactives, where there is direct control by the campaign administration. In this case, you just have to kind of make up a reason in your head that Iuz wouldn't care :/ 3. Doesn't do anything. You can take levels in Dread Pirate, but you have to choose the honorable pirate route. He can be a pirate as a profession if he wants, but he can't be one of those naughty types that have evil alignments :)
LGMoses 01-24-07, 12:25 AM	2. This is a problem with having an evil demigod as a major NPC in plot arcs. By the rules, Iuz would know everything they did and would probably show up and kill them all (or all but one). However, we can't really do anything like that except maybe at interactives, where there is direct control by the campaign administration. In this case, you just have to kind of make up a reason in your head that Iuz wouldn't care :/ Yeah, it was a pretty evil altar. It ddin't require a fort save if u were good adn u got near it but it did make u feel queazy if u were of good alignment. Our paladin was out that day or I'm sure he would have gone blind from detecting evil as the mod said neone would. It had been unhallowed many times. Iuz worshippers appear in a lot of mods I'm sure. I think I'll have something nasty happen next time they come across another worshipper of Iuz. We had a pc die in this mod though. Luckily, they had enough overcap to nearly raise him and the other players chipped in to get him raised. I'm really loving LG. I get to test my skills and grow as a DM and watch my players grow. We used to have guys that never talked that are now the faces of the group. Fighters have discovered they like being wizards and vice-versa. btw, nice response time there Britt. That was quick. ;)
Britt 01-24-07, 12:33 AM	I'm actually just a program in the matrix. All delays are artificially inserted to make it look like I'm a real person. They'll be hiring someone to play me at DDXP. I hope they get someone sexy.
LGMoses 01-24-07, 12:35 AM	I'm actually just a program in the matrix. All delays are artificially inserted to make it look like I'm a real person. They'll be hiring someone to play me at DDXP. I hope they get someone sexy. I'll send u my address and I accept checks, money orders, or COD's. Also, you'll have to provide gas fare there and back as well as ne other travel expenses.
cycloptic_squirrel 01-24-07, 01:17 AM	I'm actually just a program in the matrix. All delays are artificially inserted to make it look like I'm a real person. They'll be hiring someone to play me at DDXP. I hope they get someone sexy. Any chance that the powers responsible will drop the ball and instead of hiring someone who resembles a 30 yr old law student accidently hire a sexy young woman whose prefered attire is a skimpy bathing suit?
Japangirl 01-24-07, 01:43 AM	Any chance that the powers responsible will drop the ball and instead of hiring someone who resembles a 30 yr old law student accidently hire a sexy young woman whose prefered attire is a skimpy bathing suit? I dunno, I think Britt's law student persona is kinda cute . . . :embarrass
Samwise 01-24-07, 02:16 AM	Why must an evil deity show up when an altar is defiled? Do good deities always show up when their altars get defiled? If so, how do all those mega-evil doers manage to survive to continue their rampages? And actually, by the rules, Iuz (or any other demipower) can only remote sense two locations at once, requiring a standard action to do so. What exactly are the chances he will be viewing that particular altar right then? This isn't about Iuz personally, I'm sure he's a wonderfully evil cambion, with a deep and abiding desire to wreak havoc on everything in existence, but a more general concern over the number of divine curses I see tossed around for shutting down evil altars and locations. Once in awhile maybe, but every time an evil altar appears? Heroes are supposed to trash the strongholds of evil. Let them!
Madfox11 01-24-07, 04:36 AM	(1) DMs can punish PCs for criminal behavior according to the laws of the region. Many regions have documents available on how to deal with this, and a few actually seem to include an Appendix with their adventure dealing with it (meta-regionals in Ket certainly do). There is a discussion about this on the main LG board and it includes several examples of PCs that got fines or even sentences to hard labor for up to a year. It also fits the recent discussion about how PC's behavior should impact an adventure. Note though that a PC can complain about their punishments to a higher ranking court, effectively asking the Triad for their opinion. How you should have punished the PCs at your table though depend on the region. I am sure that punishment is different in Sunndi compared with Keoland ;) (2) If it is not in the adventure, there is nothing that can be done about it. Personally though I do think that PCs should be leery about descecrating an altar of any deity unless they do so with direct backup of a deity of their own (a cleric casting consecrate or hallow). The gods are real, and angering gods should not be done lightly. I agree that not every altar should result in a curse, but the ones that radiate magic/evil or are located in major religious centers probably should. (3) Profession (pirate) is a bit silly. Profession (sailor) makes more sense.
gomeztoo 01-24-07, 07:13 AM	Profession is the wrong skill. The accurate skill is Perform(pirate). Hard to get the accent right. Harhar. ;) On (2): If desecerating an altar has effects, it should be in the scenario. Otherwise there should be a general rule. It's a bit like saying "Iuz", or "Vecna". Everone says they can hear you, but in general there are no rules for it. No deities appear, you don't get cursed, there are no repercussions. All a DM can do (unless the scenario specifically says so) is add a spooky atmosphere (flickering lights or deepening shadows). Afaik, only "Spirals" had an effect when saying "Tharizdun". Most of my other PCs follow the customs though. However, my main PC, who is on Iuz' personal blacklist, isn't afraid to speak his name (or that of Vecna or Tharizdun), even if it does draw his attention. She unnerves many people with it, but in her opinion, fearing to speak the name makes them more powerful.
LGMoses 01-24-07, 08:53 AM	true, an evil god not show up everytime u see an altar. Nothing will come of this. However, don't ya think banging on an altar chanting "where are you Iuz, we seek a fite!" oever and over is knid of asking for it :devil: I probly won't do nething for it though cuz we had a player death. I think that could be Iuz's minor annoyance at these fools for destrtoying one of his cults. Where are the lists for breaking laws in Greyhawk city and punishments?
Britt 01-24-07, 09:50 AM	IMO, with regards to Iuz in particular, it's not the desecration of the altar that would anger Iuz. It's the using his name in a challenging manner. Iuz is extremely spiteful and driven by revenge. His minions challenge each other all the time in an attempt to advance up the ranks. In addition, there is a tradition that you shouldn't speak Iuz's name, probably for a reason. Put all that together, and calling out his name and challenging him while defiling one of his altars, and you'd probably end up dead or being tortured. It would likely only take about 18 seconds of his time and would make him quite happy. Just defiling an altar isn't that big of a deal. That probably happens all over the central Flanaess everyday. On a related note, I think it was on the Geoff IC list, someone was using Iuz's name repeatedly, so cooperating with the Geoff Triad, we had quite a bit of mischief go down. I think that really helped reinforce the idea. As said before, though, nothing can really happen without direct intervention of the administration.
The_Jester 01-24-07, 10:15 AM	2: the best thing you can do is any future mods involving those PCs (not those players) and any servants of Iuz is have them target the PC with a personal vendetta. Focus their worst spells on him, etc.
gomeztoo 01-24-07, 10:32 AM	I am curious what the actual effects of speaking the names of Iuz, Vecna, or Tharidun were in game. As I wrote, my char Nesalia (who is admittedly insane) always uses their names, rather than the titles, even though she has the Ire of Iuz. We fool around with it as players sometimes, but for her it is quite serious, almost religious: by speaking their names she shows that she does not fear them (which is different from not realizing that they could squash her like a bug if they so desire). Maybe it is foolish, maybe it will bite her in her scaly behind at some point. But she rather be damned than give into terror.
Britt 01-24-07, 10:45 AM	The in-game effects are in the Deities and Demigods book. Basically, if you say his name, he has the choice of viewing the area and knowing everything that is going on. He can do this at holy sites and worshippers as well. So, by speaking his name, you are giving him an ability he did not have before.
gomeztoo 01-24-07, 11:15 AM	Ah. Well, Nesalia would be ok with that. It's onyl fair that her enemies know what she's up to :P
Munkwunk 01-24-07, 12:40 PM	On a related note, I think it was on the Geoff IC list, someone was using Iuz's name repeatedly, so cooperating with the Geoff Triad, we had quite a bit of mischief go down. Ahh, those were good times. I'm not sure if to something more recent, but I definitely remember the time Iuz was summoned in to the Boor's Knuckle. To be fair, it was really a collective effort on the part of everyone in the area... For anyone who's really curious as to just what happens when you speak a deity's name, the divine portion of the SRD contains the info from Deities and Demigods that Britt mentioned. You can find the relevent information here: http://www.d20srd.org/srd/divine/divineRanksAndPowers.htm#remoteSensing Not that most PCs are aware of this ability; we just know that bad things tend to happen when you speak the names of evil and spiteful deities.
Britt 01-24-07, 12:45 PM	Yep, the time at the Boar's Knuckle is what I was talking about. I even got to roleplay a boneshadow for part of it, too :)
jstorrie 01-24-07, 01:12 PM	You can always make 'ominous things' happen when PCs start challenging Iuz on one of his altars... there are plenty of completely inconsequential but unnerving things you as the DM could make happen, and there's no way for the PCs to know that it's just you showboating and not grey box text. Just be creative (and don't break the mod.)
Britt 01-24-07, 01:13 PM	As an aside, your name always reminds me of one of my favorite sites: jstor.org
Mommy was an Orc 01-24-07, 01:45 PM	You can always make 'ominous things' happen when PCs start challenging Iuz on one of his altars... there are plenty of completely inconsequential but unnerving things you as the DM could make happen, and there's no way for the PCs to know that it's just you showboating and not grey box text. Just be creative (and don't break the mod.) One of the things to remember is that as long as the effect isn't permanent and doesn't actually affect the character, likely anything could happen. I'm sure Iuz would regard some likely low-level characters as not worth his time. So ask for Will Saves from the desecrators - anyone who fails say a DC 25 check gets nauseous for 1d6 rounds. Or goes blind. Or is dazed. Whatever. Do this again a couple more times throughout the mod, at least until they're well aware it is 1d6 rounds of being incapicated(and preferably the kind that doesn't provoke them to cast spells to try to remove it or disrupt their marching order such as fear effects) Then about 3 rounds before a combat without the possibility of surprise, do it again. Miraculously, you rolled low on this one, so it doesn't actually affect them in combat. But if they can be aware that combat is right around the corner and realizing that unless they're ungodly lucky, there's a TPK coming, you'll give 'em more than a good scare never to do that again...
Samwise 01-24-07, 02:13 PM	true, an evil god not show up everytime u see an altar. Nothing will come of this. However, don't ya think banging on an altar chanting "where are you Iuz, we seek a fite!" oever and over is knid of asking for it :devil: I probly won't do nething for it though cuz we had a player death. I think that could be Iuz's minor annoyance at these fools for destrtoying one of his cults. In a home game, sure. In LG, it would be a mess to account for every possible mockery of deities players might come up with. We will need rules for mockery, challenge, and denial of every single deity. We will need rules for sucking up to them as well, and spontaneous intervention when the bad guys mock the PCs faith. No, it can't be left up to DMs discretion at every table. Especially with DMs who feel they don't have to warn players before giving them the -10 to everything curse with no save, or who use it only on people they don't like. Where are the lists for breaking laws in Greyhawk city and punishments? City of Greyhawk boxed set and The Adventure Begins folio.
clannagh 01-24-07, 05:48 PM	In a home game, sure. In LG, it would be a mess to account for every possible mockery of deities players might come up with. We will need rules for mockery, challenge, and denial of every single deity. We will need rules for sucking up to them as well, and spontaneous intervention when the bad guys mock the PCs faith. No, it can't be left up to DMs discretion at every table. Especially with DMs who feel they don't have to warn players before giving them the -10 to everything curse with no save, or who use it only on people they don't like. There is also an issue that in some mods parties are doing the "right" thing by destroying an evil altar and may even gain XP for it. On the otherhand when an evil deity is directly involved in a plot arc it may be a good idea for triads to have special conditions in force ,, much like the unusual rules disrupting scrying in perrenland. Something like " good aligned characters mentioning the name IUZ at any time in (pick region) requires a 15+APL will save or be blinded as per the spell" etc etc
Arvagor 01-24-07, 09:04 PM	IMO, with regards to Iuz in particular, it's not the desecration of the altar that would anger Iuz. It's the using his name in a challenging manner. Iuz is extremely spiteful and driven by revenge. His minions challenge each other all the time in an attempt to advance up the ranks. In addition, there is a tradition that you shouldn't speak Iuz's name, probably for a reason. [...]It's also possible that Iuz is more apt to respond simply because he makes him home on Oerth itself -- he doesn't have to expend the energy to go plane-hopping just to punish the defilers, it's merely a teleport away, something he should be able to manage quite easily...
Maesto 01-25-07, 01:23 AM	IUZ4-01 Dorakka. If you speak the name any time within this module, with the exception of the introduction, you get thwacked in a very bad way. From memory, APL+6 ELs of demons arrive every second round or something stupid. Cheers, Jolyon
Mattastrophic 01-25-07, 12:33 PM	For anyone who's really curious as to just what happens when you speak a deity's name, the divine portion of the SRD contains the info from Deities and Demigods that Britt mentioned. You can find the relevent information here: http://www.d20srd.org/srd/divine/divineRanksAndPowers.htm#remoteSensing Not that most PCs are aware of this ability; we just know that bad things tend to happen when you speak the names of evil and spiteful deities. Strangely enough, even fewer PCs are aware of how Iuz can look at you whenever you speak his title, so "Old One" is just as harmful as "Iuz." -Matt victim of Geoff's "Three Times Three Times" incident
Samwise 01-25-07, 01:17 PM	Strangely enough, even fewer PCs are aware of how Iuz can look at you whenever you speak his title, so "Old One" is just as harmful as "Iuz." -Matt victim of Geoff's "Three Times Three Times" incident He can? That seems peculiar considering that "I spit on the Old One!" is a common greeting in Furyondy according to From the Ashes.
gomeztoo 01-25-07, 01:25 PM	I hope that's true. More ways for me to freak out BK natives ;)
Japangirl 01-25-07, 06:05 PM	Strangely enough, even fewer PCs are aware of how Iuz can look at you whenever you speak his title, so "Old One" is just as harmful as "Iuz." -Matt victim of Geoff's "Three Times Three Times" incident We always call him "Old Wicked" at the tables I play at. Not an official title, so no harm no foul :).
danhenneke 01-25-07, 11:54 PM	I hope that's true. More ways for me to freak out BK natives ;) We live with the big ugly in our backyard. We don't freak out easily. We also do usually go around poking him in the eye. We know what happens to those who do. There is a new decoration on the walls of Doraka, a broken crystal sage - no not the plant, just a formely cocky spellcaster. We know what happens to the people who draw the cranky guys ire. They don't just disappear. They tend to explode then get put back together then explode again. So if you use his name around a BK native, we usually respond with "Hail, IUZ."
gomeztoo 01-26-07, 05:03 AM	We live with the big ugly in our backyard. We don't freak out easily. Not the BK guy I traveled with. He got seriously nervous whenever I said "Iuz". And you guys no nothing about poking Iuz, paying your bribes and disguises after every victory. Nesalia's image is burned on the inner eyelid of every Iuzian priest (and she is easy to recognize), with instructions to kill her in preference to anyone else. Now *that* is what you get for poking...
rockondon 01-29-07, 11:32 PM	I have a question. Lets say I have a +1 large animated shield (+3 to my AC), a +1 buckler shield with light fortification upgrade on my right arm, and a +1 buckler shield with arrow catching upgrade on my left arm, do these stack? I know the shield bonuses don't stack but do I have +3 AC, light fortification, and arrow catching?
Randall Montgomery 01-30-07, 01:44 PM	Not the BK guy I traveled with. He got seriously nervous whenever I said "Iuz". And you guys no nothing about poking Iuz, paying your bribes and disguises after every victory. Nesalia's image is burned on the inner eyelid of every Iuzian priest (and she is easy to recognize), with instructions to kill her in preference to anyone else. Now *that* is what you get for poking... My Wood Elf Ranger 2 will not rest until Iuz and all that follow him are wiped from the world, so I strongly expect she'll eventually be just as hated. She also is not afraid to speak Iuz's name, for exactly the reasons you mentioned. While I wasn't aware of the consequences, that's actually great for her, because she WANTS Iuz to know every time she sends one of his followers to him in the afterlife. So far she's only killed one of them, but everyone's gotta start somewhere.... ;)
Bob_the_Theurge 01-30-07, 05:56 PM	We live with the big ugly in our backyard. We don't freak out easily. We also do usually go around poking him in the eye. We know what happens to those who do. There is a new decoration on the walls of Doraka, a broken crystal sage - no not the plant, just a formely cocky spellcaster. We know what happens to the people who draw the cranky guys ire. They don't just disappear. They tend to explode then get put back together then explode again. So if you use his name around a BK native, we usually respond with "Hail, IUZ." A little birdy told me he wasn't there any more. Of course, then the Cleric in the party turned the birdy and it flew away squawking "brains! brains! rawk brains!".....
Japangirl 01-30-07, 11:30 PM	A little birdy told me he wasn't there any more. Of course, then the Cleric in the party turned the birdy and it flew away squawking "brains! brains! rawk brains!"..... Yeah, there was a special mission to rescue him. Dunno what all happened, I wasn't there, but he's off the wall.
GrahamWills 02-06-07, 12:44 PM	1. I had some players recently start a barfight in the Blue Dragon Inn. 2. My players messed with an unhallowed altar 1. In Verboboc, the law would classify this as "malicious mischief" with penalty: Full reimbursement of property and a fine up to 1,000gp and up to 4 TU. Assuming no other circumstances I'd ask each person for a diplomacy check and assign fines and TUs accordingly, with 0 = full punishment, 20 = no aditional fine/TU. I ould then remind players that they can use favors and meta-org access to evade the penalties if they have them and wish to spend them. 2. Mess with the players in return. Ask exactly what they do, then ask each for a will save and a fortitude save. Anyone who gets less than some random DC feels a chill touch as if something evil has passed over their spine (Good clerics / paladins might get different text). Keep those numbers prominently displayed and before the next fight, or when anything that might be bad happens, refer to them and roll dice. Oh, and note it on their AR's in the notes section.