Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Bob_the_Theurge 02-05-07, 10:30 AM	Looking through my region's meta-orgs, I've discovered a problem; just about every one has a "residency requirement" tagged on to it. The character has to reside in the region to belong to the meta-org. Now, I know the first reason for this; back before the Circle started cracking down on meta-org access certain regions were stacking their meta-orgs super-full and allowing anyone to join, no matter where they were from. And I do understand that for the flavor and roleplaying reasons, certain regions and secretive meta-orgs can require this. My problem is: this causes a decent amount of hurt for characters whose region is a "Core" region (Bright Sands or, when it comes out, the Greyhawk Ruins series). Is there something that can be done so that these characters - who don't play their "regional" mods exclusively by any means - could still join up with some meta-orgs? Have them designate a "secondary" home region perhaps?
blood_kite 02-05-07, 11:39 AM	As of right now, Nyrond has a few metaorgs that don't require Nyrond as a Home Region. You just have to have played a Nyrond Regional. Thieves' Guild (Must play a mod that gives access or play with someone already in it) Monastic Order (Because all Daggerspell's should have monk levels) AAAA (Because gnomes need love too) Oerth Theater Guild (Because it's famous throughout the Flanness) Rel Mord University (Because it's famous throughout the Flanness) Nyrond Religious Organizations (Because all Bonded Summoner's should have cleric levels) The Nyrond Wilderness Alliances (Because all Wild Mage's should have levels in something not arcane) The Pale also has some metaorgs that only require you to be a member of a Region in the Nyrond and Her Environs metaregion.
gomeztoo 02-05-07, 12:44 PM	There are several other regions with MOs that you can join while out of region. Then again, you do need to think whether joining makes sense. If you are a Bright Sands PC, it makes little sense to be a member of the Mounted Borderers. If your PC wants to join such an MO, it makes sense that he/she moves. Remember, MOs are there primarily for flavor, not for goodies.
Bob_the_Theurge 02-05-07, 01:21 PM	There are several other regions with MOs that you can join while out of region. Then again, you do need to think whether joining makes sense. If you are a Bright Sands PC, it makes little sense to be a member of the Mounted Borderers. If your PC wants to join such an MO, it makes sense that he/she moves. Remember, MOs are there primarily for flavor, not for goodies. Oh, I agree MO's are there for flavor primarily. The problem is, my "Bright Sands" character has played all the BS mods, and probably twice as many mods in his region/metaregion under the course of his play. I'm not asking for a TU favor, but for a character that will quite necessarily - by virtue of the relative scarcity of the BS storyline mods - have a "second home" of sorts, it seems silly that they can't get into MO's in that region. Oh, and for those who say that "other regions" have MO's without residency requirements that's great: we have a grand total of ONE in my region.
gomeztoo 02-05-07, 01:35 PM	Sunndi has several. The TSS Metaregion also has a few. Probably not the meta-region you are looking for... Still, it may be worth it to concider moving the PC to the new region, and think of the 'Bright Sands' as your old home. It is hardly as strange as my elf, who is the mate of a guy that lives on one side of the country, while she is required (MO rules) to 'live' at the other side. She now 'offically' lives in Ketter's Hearth, but 'unofficially' spends most of her time in Glory. Basically the same thing, just on a smaller scale.
JamesMaissen 02-05-07, 03:17 PM	There are several other regions with MOs that you can join while out of region. Then again, you do need to think whether joining makes sense. If you are a Bright Sands PC, it makes little sense to be a member of the Mounted Borderers. If your PC wants to join such an MO, it makes sense that he/she moves. Remember, MOs are there primarily for flavor, not for goodies. While I grant there are some MOs that residency (or stronger) is quite reasonable (armies, etc) most regions go way overboard with this requirement for out of game reasons. I'd rather see metaorgs give NO goodies if that's what it takes to divest themselves from the out of character arbitrary restrictions on them. Removing magic item access from metaorgs feels more like a compromise solution than a directed move. Now magic items have simply been replaced by limited mundane items, feats and PrC access. Arbitrary 'in region' requirements are counter-productive to the game imho. The game is global and should be accepted that way. Making requirements that don't make in game sense does nothing for regional flavor.. if anything it causes it great harm, drawing distinctions out of game rather than focusing on in-character feel, James
Simpi 02-05-07, 03:48 PM	Arbitrary 'in region' requirements are counter-productive to the game imho. The game is global and should be accepted that way. Making requirements that don't make in game sense does nothing for regional flavor.. if anything it causes it great harm, drawing distinctions out of game rather than focusing on in-character feel Counter-productive? Give me an example as I simply see no merit whatsoever in your argument. Cherry picking by power gamers was an acknowledged fact of life with older MOs and if regions put restrictions on who can join their MOs and get access to items/feats/prestige classes, look into the mirror folks. Sampo Haarlaa Naerie Triad
Lupo 02-05-07, 03:56 PM	While I grant there are some MOs that residency (or stronger) is quite reasonable (armies, etc) most regions go way overboard with this requirement for out of game reasons. I'd rather see metaorgs give NO goodies if that's what it takes to divest themselves from the out of character arbitrary restrictions on them. Removing magic item access from metaorgs feels more like a compromise solution than a directed move. Now magic items have simply been replaced by limited mundane items, feats and PrC access. Arbitrary 'in region' requirements are counter-productive to the game imho. The game is global and should be accepted that way. Making requirements that don't make in game sense does nothing for regional flavor.. if anything it causes it great harm, drawing distinctions out of game rather than focusing on in-character feel, James i hope that this year's LGCS will pass without a round of the MO nerfing bat ;) my bright desert wizard needs a certain sunndian MO for prestige class access (only MotAO) :). switching home region is a power suicide like action for a bright desert character, it would instantly stop unique access, so not an reasonable option :rolleyes: . in innspa/ahlissa and sunndi there is a reasonable balance between resident only/special invitation/ and free MOs. i still will only join the MO after playing at least one regional adventure - already done and will likely happen several times from now on - i still hope for discount on the huge costs :P. ciao martin m.
Nutation 02-05-07, 08:23 PM	Counter-productive? Give me an example as I simply see no merit whatsoever in your argument. Every metaorg in PoU requires residency. This includes bards, druids, and other traditional wanderers; small chaotic good churches with no ties to the government; clandestine opponents of the regional-wide threat that is the Pomarj; everyone. There really is no in-story reason why every metaorg in the region should require residency.
TimRat 02-05-07, 08:37 PM	the meta-orgs aren't really touched in teh LGCS. as far as the core part i believe there was talk of this and something was decided. if not i can bring this up to the rest of the circle.
zigspatty 02-05-07, 10:38 PM	Counter-productive? Give me an example as I simply see no merit whatsoever in your argument. One of the goals of metaorgs is to involve characters in the storyline and give them some loyalties beyond their own selfish needs. Scenarios frequently involve metaorgs and subsequently reward (or punish) their members for their choices on the AR. Characters visiting from other regions sometimes find that though they support a group consistently, assist them in innumerable ways, and even turn over valuable items to further their cause, they are not allowed to join. Imagine a church or other divine organization that would turn away a fellow follower of their deity from tithing and serving faithfully solely because they reside in a neighboring region - even when there is NO formal religious organization of their deity in that neighboring region.... Or a university that did not welcome scholars from beyond their regional borders....Or an independent group aimed at fighting a specific evil (slavers, evil outsiders, etc.) that turns away assistance based on where they reside.... So a character visits a new region and gets involved with members of a metaorg, shares their goals, and helps them out. He asks to join, but they turn him down. He helps some more anyway. They reward their members with access to a couple special goodies, but he doesn't get any because he's not a member. Why should he continue to help out? Is there any reason for him to visit again? Patty
zigspatty 02-05-07, 10:57 PM	Every metaorg in PoU requires residency....There really is no in-story reason why every metaorg in the region should require residency. Actually, there is one PoU group that does not require residency (The Web) but you must play particular scenarios and be invited to join. It makes sense for most metaorgs to require residency - armies, local civic organizatrions or guilds, and particularly provincial groups - but not ALL. Benefits tend to be limited to circumstance bonuses & upkeep that apply only in the local region. Items and other benefits also tend to be available only in the local region. But metaorgs are largely under the control of each region's triad. If you're unhappy with your region's metaorgs, make some polite suggestions to your triad. Be specific and offer logical reasons why a particular group should be opened to non-residents. Be prepared to offer your triad IC role-play reasons for such a change and some assistance with the extra workload that your suggestions might entail. And listen to your triad's reasoning for why metaorgs are the way they are - they're probably doing the best they can with the limited resources they've got. Patty
clannagh 02-05-07, 11:32 PM	The mercenary branch of the Perrenland Army .. the Pax Mercuri .. doesnt have a residency requirement .. it is a bit like the foriegn legion only sort of prussian/swedish/highlander. To initially join you have to either have played a Perrenland Regional with the PC or alternatively email for permission from both your own and the perrenland triad.
Bob_the_Theurge 02-06-07, 11:34 AM	One of the goals of metaorgs is to involve characters in the storyline and give them some loyalties beyond their own selfish needs. Scenarios frequently involve metaorgs and subsequently reward (or punish) their members for their choices on the AR. Characters visiting from other regions sometimes find that though they support a group consistently, assist them in innumerable ways, and even turn over valuable items to further their cause, they are not allowed to join. Imagine a church or other divine organization that would turn away a fellow follower of their deity from tithing and serving faithfully solely because they reside in a neighboring region - even when there is NO formal religious organization of their deity in that neighboring region.... Or a university that did not welcome scholars from beyond their regional borders....Or an independent group aimed at fighting a specific evil (slavers, evil outsiders, etc.) that turns away assistance based on where they reside.... So a character visits a new region and gets involved with members of a metaorg, shares their goals, and helps them out. He asks to join, but they turn him down. He helps some more anyway. They reward their members with access to a couple special goodies, but he doesn't get any because he's not a member. Why should he continue to help out? Is there any reason for him to visit again? Patty Nope, no reason. In fact, I've had one character already say "screw you guys" to one of those meta-orgs in a module (not my Bright Sands character, another one) because of this, because in-character that's how he would react.
Samwise 02-06-07, 12:58 PM	Meta-orgs need to be more restrictive. There is too much "reporting for duty" that negates the TU costs, and too many adventure rewards dependent on meta-org membership, as well as way too much multiple meta-org membership. Despite revisions they remain sources of cherry-picked benefits instead of background enhancing participation.
Lupo 02-06-07, 03:15 PM	Meta-orgs need to be more restrictive. There is too much "reporting for duty" that negates the TU costs, and too many adventure rewards dependent on meta-org membership, as well as way too much multiple meta-org membership. Despite revisions they remain sources of cherry-picked benefits instead of background enhancing participation. you seem to have had some bad encounters lately :rolleyes: or your region's meta-orgs are much much much better than anything around here. my cleric 13 is a member of the local branch of his church, still lowest ranks, yields FREE STANDARD UPKEEP, any promotion WOULD YIELD ZERO:rolleyes: my druid 10 is a proud member of three meta-orgs. - in his resident region - one just for rp reasons (granted from an AR), another one again for rp reasons, the last one was the one he choose to be in, only to be now "volunteer" in the army :rant:, he is chaotic and dislikes hierarchies :P, now all kinds of "army specific" AR access pops up, but hey, in sunndi nowadays basically EVERYONE is in the army :P my cleric 4 is a member of another "AR-based" meta org - out of region, ok, this one hands out three limited spells WOW ;) and some limited prestige-classes. basically you have to pay every year's TU cost to be able to use the AR favor. my wizard 4 is going to be member of a meta org - out of region as he is a bright sands dwarf - to get access to a prestige class and some limited spells. ciao martin m.
gomeztoo 02-06-07, 04:14 PM	now all kinds of "army specific" AR access pops up, but hey, in sunndi nowadays basically EVERYONE is in the army :P Hey, when Bren's men join the army, you know there is *big* trouble. Anyway, I realize that residential requirments do not make sense for all MOs. That's why I designed some Sunndi MOs to not require it (or to allow some leeway). But that is, as someone else said, a triad decision. Sometimes though, it does make sense. Bren's Men do not only require you to live in region, they require you to live in a certain *town*, which means you can't join certain other MOs that have similar requirements. It makes sense as this is the town they protect.
zigspatty 02-06-07, 04:54 PM	Meta-orgs need to be more restrictive. <snip> Despite revisions they remain sources of cherry-picked benefits instead of background enhancing participation. Huh? I like metaorgs, really, I do. But they do NOT need to be more restrictive. When it makes in-character sense for their members to be limited to local residents - a nation's army, local theives' guild, political party, protector of a sacred grove - then I'm all for it. When it doesn't make sense in-character, such restriction is needless and deprives characters of an opportunity to be more thoroughly immersed in a region. Metaorgs no longer offer a lot of benefits to "cherry pick". They offer circumstance bonuses that normally apply only in the region (or sometimes metaregion). They offer a few limited feats or prestige classes (I've yet to see a metaorg that offers more than 2 limited feats or p-classes). Many offer free upkeep that is often limited to a single city in a region. Whoo hoo! A savings of 12 gp for an investment of 2+ TUs. They seem to offer a lot of regional access to mundane items (regional access means available after only 8-10 scenarios per year IF you play them all with that character) Hardly unbalancing. Many offer an opportunity to earn a rank or title of some sort. Such "bragging rights" are nice but tend to require sufficient hurdles to make them worthwhile for some players. Many are featured in scenarios and sometimes offer special goodies on the AR to their members. This can be very fair, though it is sometimes used poorly granting stuff on the basis of metaorg membership rather than additional effort within the scenario. Triads need to watch such rewards carefully. Most offer a hook of some sort that makes it easier to immerse your PC in the region. A member becomes more than just a wandering do-gooder, he becomes a part of the community that supports other institutions, groups, and goals. THIS is what's cool about metaorgs. Patty
Mommy was an Orc 02-06-07, 05:04 PM	Meta-orgs need to be more restrictive. There is too much "reporting for duty" that negates the TU costs, and too many adventure rewards dependent on meta-org membership, as well as way too much multiple meta-org membership. Despite revisions they remain sources of cherry-picked benefits instead of background enhancing participation. I'd really like to see a 1 TU option in metaorgs - you gain no other benefits except the ability to claim membership in the metaorg. No specials or very limited from adventures, no item or PrC access, and you must meet all Tier 1 prereqs. Call it Tier 0. There's metaorgs I'd like to join, but there's no benefit to joining for whatever reason.
Mortepierre 02-06-07, 06:48 PM	my bright desert wizard needs a certain sunndian MO for prestige class access (only MotAO) :) First, it's OotEO (better make sure you wear the right color at their meetings :P ), unless I'm mistaken. Second, I hope you noticed what happens to those who don't keep their membership secret. Believe me, those MO are deadly serious about that part. Finally, as a resident of Sunndi, I find this disturbing because it sounds very much like cherry-picking. I know the PrC you want isn't easy to qualify for given the special requirement but becoming member of a MO based on an eco-system radically different from your own (forest vs desert) which you'll never - in all likelihood - help/visit (beyond the 5 TU annual cost) just to gain access to a PrC makes little sense from a role-play point of view. You said it yourself. Being from the Bright Desert gives you "unique" access already. So, joining the OotEO is done only to gain a limited access (since you're unwilling to switch region first). To me that defeats the very purpose of the MO :surrender the last one was the one he choose to be in, only to be now "volunteer" in the army :rant:, he is chaotic and dislikes hierarchies :P, now all kinds of "army specific" AR access pops up, but hey, in sunndi nowadays basically EVERYONE is in the army :P Eh, tell me about it. We have the only army in the world which both believes in discipline AND is strongly aligned with the most chaotic deity out there (Trithereon in case someone wondered). That's about the only reason my chaotic wizard still serves in it.
Bob_the_Theurge 02-06-07, 06:54 PM	First, it's MotEO (better make sure you wear the right color at their meetings :P ) Second, I hope you noticed what happens to those who don't keep their membership secret... Finally, as a resident of Sunndi, I find this disturbing because it sounds very much like cherry-picking. I know the PrC you want isn't easy to qualify for given the special requirement but becoming member of a MO based on an eco-system radically different from your own (forest vs desert) which you'll never - in all likelihood - help/visit (beyond the 5 TU annual cost) just to gain access to a PrC makes little sense from a role-play point of view. You said it yourself. Being from the Bright Desert gives you "unique" access already. So, joining the MotEO is done only to gain a limited access (since you're unwilling to switch region first). To me that defeats the very purpose of the MO :surrender Well isn't that an insulting comment. I play my Bright Sands character in "my" region's mods - not Bright Sands Cores, but MY home region, where I live - all the time. I'm sure it's the same for this Sunndi player who has a Bright Sands character. I'm sure this isn't something the Circle thought about at all when Bright Sands was being created - because most MO's back then didn't have stupid residency requirements - but it's causing problems now.
Mortepierre 02-06-07, 07:08 PM	Well isn't that an insulting comment. Not an insult, only a personal opinion. Consider it from a local PC's point of view. You see a perfect stranger coming one day and asking to join a secret society whose purpose is to deal with local problems. Well, sure, why not? As long as he qualifies and is willing to do his part, fine. But it doesn't end there. The stranger joins, asks for a certain service (available only to members) and then immediately leaves. Again, I can talk only for myself but it would disturb my PC a bit. I play my Bright Sands character in "my" region's mods - not Bright Sands Cores, but MY home region, where I live - all the time. I'm sure it's the same for this Sunndi player who has a Bright Sands character. Then wouldn't it make more sense for your PC to switch region? I mean, if he spends most (if not all) of his time there anyway... I know it would mean no more access to BS special stuff but then again it seems strange you should continue accessing them while living far from it, no? I'm sure this isn't something the Circle thought about at all when Bright Sands was being created - because most MO's back then didn't have stupid residency requirements - but it's causing problems now. On that point, we agree. I'm a firm believer that there should be "international" MO created specifically for characters who belong to regions not under the control of local triads. We already have the Bright Desert. Pretty soon we'll have Greyhawk City too. Clearly, the need is there.
Bob_the_Theurge 02-06-07, 07:19 PM	Not an insult, only a personal opinion. Consider it from a local PC's point of view. You see a perfect stranger coming one day and asking to join. Well, sure, why not? As long as he qualifies and is willing to do his part, fine. But it doesn't end there. The stranger joins, asks for a certain service (available only to members) and then leaves. Again, I can talk only for myself but it would disturb my PC a bit. The stranger joins, asks for a certain service... and then shows up 4 months later to help again. But you personally aren't at that table. You probably (in character that is) don't party with the same people at any time. He's paid his dues and TU's, and even if you personally don't see him again, who are you to think he's just run off? He's probably just doing other things for the Meta-Org that don't involve you personally. Then wouldn't it make more sense for your PC to switch region? I mean, if he spends most (if not all) of his time there anyway... I know it would mean no more access to BS special stuff but then again it seems strange you should continue accessing them while living far from it, no? Funny you should ask that - how many BS mods are there, total? He plays regionals, metas, and everything else just to fill out the other however many TU's in the year, and if that means he plays more regionals (at 2 TU each) than Bright Sands, that's a problem of them not writing very many Bright Sands mods. But Bright Sands doesn't have meta-orgs. None. And When he's not in the Bright Sands, he's on the lower APL stuff at my home region, and I don't see where we should be penalized for that when he's got IP's and everything else he'd need. On that point, we agree. I'm a firm believer that there should be "international" MO created specifically for characters who belong to regions not under the control of local triads. We already have the Bright Desert. Pretty soon we'll have Greyhawk City too. Clearly, the need is there. No kidding.
LGMoses 02-06-07, 08:01 PM	You see a perfect stranger coming one day and asking to join a secret society whose purpose is to deal with local problems. Well, sure, why not? As long as he qualifies and is willing to do his part, fine. U trust strangers? Better make sure he's not a Scarlet Brotherhood spy!!!:incog:
Samwise 02-06-07, 08:52 PM	you seem to have had some bad encounters lately :rolleyes: Why? Maybe I just don't like the meta-orgs offering more than they require. Or offering it at in an uneven manner. Or do you mean "bad encounters" such as threads like this where people begin comparing the benefits across the regions, and demanding that all meta-orgs be universal so they can get whatever access and benefits they want whenever they want them? If the intent is regional immersion, then be from the region. That hardly seems excessive or onerous. If you want it that much, abandon what ever other region you were in and "join" the new one. Why is having to make that choice so horrible? As for multiple organizations, past a certain point, most people aren't interested in such divided loyalties. They want people loyal to their group, serving their cause, without wondering if they will have to answer to someone else about something of grave importance. NPCs have motivations too.
RedKnightofKet 02-06-07, 09:02 PM	The stranger joins, asks for a certain service... and then shows up 4 months later to help again. But you personally aren't at that table. You probably (in character that is) don't party with the same people at any time. He's paid his dues and TU's, and even if you personally don't see him again, who are you to think he's just run off? He's probably just doing other things for the Meta-Org that don't involve you personally. Funny you should ask that - how many BS mods are there, total? He plays regionals, metas, and everything else just to fill out the other however many TU's in the year, and if that means he plays more regionals (at 2 TU each) than Bright Sands, that's a problem of them not writing very many Bright Sands mods. But Bright Sands doesn't have meta-orgs. None. And When he's not in the Bright Sands, he's on the lower APL stuff at my home region, and I don't see where we should be penalized for that when he's got IP's and everything else he'd need. No kidding. Bob, unless I've missed it somewhere, you've given no response to the suggestion of switching regions. My BS Badlands dwarf moved to Ket at the start of Year 6 - you know, new immigrant, fiercely loyal to his adopted homeland... good roleplay as far as I see it. He's all about the military meta-orgs in Ket, and fighting for his country. And I think someone earlier made a good point that access to the Sandstorm stuff is like a meta-org in itself. Extra spells, feats, equipment, etc...
copper_wyrmling 02-06-07, 10:18 PM	If the intent is regional immersion, then be from the region. That hardly seems excessive or onerous. If you want it that much, abandon what ever other region you were in and "join" the new one. Why is having to make that choice so horrible? *shrugs* I moved to the other side of the world in September. I could either pay double TUs for every module in my new physical region + metaregion (my original region's mods are a 30-hour plane flight away, and due to the Perrenland/Ratik changeover, I can't even play them on visits home unless I take a fairly significant detour), or forsake the meta-org commitments I've spent three years on. It would be kind of nice if my sorcerer with teleport, or my cleric with word of recall and wind walk, could maintain their Perrenland metaorg memberships (perhaps at an increased TU cost) while residing in Bissel, especially since I can't join Bissel orgs with those PCs - they all require membership in the army, and I can't IC justify joining the army of a foreign nation with characters sworn to the service of Perrenland. There are sometimes fairly good and unavoidable real-life reasons that you would like your PCs to be resident in one region while maintaining meta-org memberships in another. Sadly, my request to have my sorcerer act as Den Zauber Guild's local agent in Bissel was laughed at ;) So all my PCs above L6 pay double for any of my local regionals and metaregionals, and can't craft in those mods: it's a fairly hefty penalty, but better than abandoning three years of meta-org membership. Just thought I'd throw in my 2cp, and my appreciation of regions that don't restrict their orgs to in-region PCs.
Arvagor 02-07-07, 01:10 AM	[...] with characters sworn to the service of Perrenland.Given Perrenland's history/background, isn't that kind of an oxymoron? ;)
clannagh 02-07-07, 01:19 AM	*shrugs* I moved to the other side of the world in September. I could either pay double TUs for every module in my new physical region + metaregion (my original region's mods are a 30-hour plane flight away, and due to the Perrenland/Ratik changeover, I can't even play them on visits home unless I take a fairly significant detour), or forsake the meta-org commitments I've spent three years on. It would be kind of nice if my sorcerer with teleport, or my cleric with word of recall and wind walk, could maintain their Perrenland metaorg memberships (perhaps at an increased TU cost) while residing in Bissel, especially since I can't join Bissel orgs with those PCs - they all require membership in the army, and I can't IC justify joining the army of a foreign nation with characters sworn to the service of Perrenland. There are sometimes fairly good and unavoidable real-life reasons that you would like your PCs to be resident in one region while maintaining meta-org memberships in another. Sadly, my request to have my sorcerer act as Den Zauber Guild's local agent in Bissel was laughed at ;) So all my PCs above L6 pay double for any of my local regionals and metaregionals, and can't craft in those mods: it's a fairly hefty penalty, but better than abandoning three years of meta-org membership. Just thought I'd throw in my 2cp, and my appreciation of regions that don't restrict their orgs to in-region PCs. The perrenland metaorgs tend to also add up to a fair whack of TU every year as well. Combining 15 or more TU spent on metaorg's and double time for your local game will mean a pretty slow advancement for the high levels. I suppose as the low levels with more time units eventually catch up and overtake the Perrenders the old characters may get kept for trips back to Australia but its still pretty sucky.
copper_wyrmling 02-07-07, 01:35 AM	Given Perrenland's history/background, isn't that kind of an oxymoron? ;) :P One of them is a Sacred Exorcist ordained by the Old Kerk of Perrenland (i.e. she's vowed to protect Perrenland against the fiendish/undead armies of Iuz) and is also a noble of the Khund Clan as well as a war hero several times over, the other is a member of Den Zauber Guild and thus has sworn an oath of loyalty and obedience to the Voormann (the leader of Perrenland). And clannagh yes it's horrible :( By the time Azrien finishes the Year 6 mods in the various series that she's involved in, she'll have only 12 TUs left :weep: There's something wrong about having all but 12 TUs allocated by the end of January... (To be fair, the majority of that TU expenditure is on Cores, not local regionals.)
Lupo 02-07-07, 02:52 AM	First, it's OotEO (better make sure you wear the right color at their meetings :P ), unless I'm mistaken. Second, I hope you noticed what happens to those who don't keep their membership secret. Believe me, those MO are deadly serious about that part. :eek: it is only "the queen's hall" not one of those "nowbody-knows-about-secret-organisations" (i will not name them for fear of dire consequences ;)) Finally, as a resident of Sunndi, I find this disturbing because it sounds very much like cherry-picking. I know the PrC you want isn't easy to qualify for given the special requirement but becoming member of a MO based on an eco-system radically different from your own (forest vs desert) which you'll never - in all likelihood - help/visit (beyond the 5 TU annual cost) just to gain access to a PrC makes little sense from a role-play point of view. most likely, my bright desert wizard will play a lot of sunndian modules this year :) and in addition, a vast part of the benefits of said meta-organisation are only acessable WHEN playing sunndian modules. :P to me the sunndian eco system is SWAMP :P, that is just sand with lots of water :P You said it yourself. Being from the Bright Desert gives you "unique" access already. So, joining the OotEO is done only to gain a limited access (since you're unwilling to switch region first). To me that defeats the very purpose of the MO :surrender i thought the queen's hall was a cosmopolitian organisation:( there is something that disturbes my dramatically with the whole "bright desert" concept, after playing half way through the modules with my bright desert character, i have noticed a strange thingy :rolleyes: : nearly every bright desert module gives away some serious amount of all the limited spells and features that were declared "unique" for the bright desert.:confused: so the "uniqueness" of a bright desert's character is grossly diluted, if one plays the modules with non-natives (actually the perfect "cherry-picking" would have been to play all but the first module with an outsider). and some of the bright desert specifics are rarely used, even in the bright desert modules. ciao martin m.
gomeztoo 02-07-07, 03:37 AM	First, it's OotEO (better make sure you wear the right color at their meetings :P ), unless I'm mistaken. OotEO (Order of the Emerald Oak (http://www.sunndi.org/downloads/pdf/certs/Order%20of%20the%20Emerald%20Oak%20AR.pd f)) is a MO. MotAO (Mage of the Arcane Order) is a Prestige Class (access to which is gained through the Queens' Halls MO). The Queens Halls (http://www.sunndi.org/downloads/pdf/certs/Queens%20Halls%20AR.pdf) welcomes people from other regions. They WANT people from other regions as members. That's the best way to get your library filled with unique works.
Mortepierre 02-07-07, 04:22 AM	it is only "the queen's hall" not one of those "nowbody-knows-about-secret-organisations" (i will not name them for fear of dire consequences ;)) Aaaah, my apologies then. I thought the abbreviation was for the MO, not the PrC linked to it. most likely, my bright desert wizard will play a lot of sunndian modules this year :) and in addition, a vast part of the benefits of said meta-organisation are only acessable WHEN playing sunndian modules. Correct. Welcome to the land of freedom and crazy-mutant-frog-berserkers :D to me the sunndian eco system is SWAMP :P, that is just sand with lots of water :P :heehee Touché! I've to admit my PC has been spending a lot of time knee-deep in the swamp lately. Damn bullywugs! i thought the queen's hall was a cosmopolitian organisation:( Oh, It is. My fault. I thought you were talking about another MO. Yeah, QH is the one MO in Sunndi where they want foreigners to join. Just don't be surprised if the Scarlet Brotherhood (not to mention Ahlissa's secret police) starts taking an unhealthy interest in what you're doing ;)
Cardinal Teplin 02-07-07, 09:11 AM	Over in onnwal we don;t tend to get benefits from joining the metaorgs. You may get access to a few core spells, or non-magical equipment from books, and maybe the odd circumstance bonus here or there or free upkeep in the region, but not feat or prestige classes. People still join them. Even the ones that cost money to join. It's about being part of something. I suspect the real problem is that Bright Sands characters don't have an active region to be part of. There are bright sands mods, sure, but not much in the way of regional events or organisations. You don't get the feel of an active region outside the adventures. Considering that the region features all sorts of strange alliances against and for Rary, this is a little odd. "We must unite to oppose him!" "What have you done to do that?" "Umm... well nothing really." Can't even make deals with organisations outsdie the bright Sands because of the residency requirements. I can see the problem. I can see why some metaorgs have these restrictions, and why people would want to restrict those metaorgs that could end up being used as a conduit for channeling rewards to players, but as a blanket restriction it doesn't make much sense. H
Lupo 02-07-07, 10:10 AM	Aaaah, my apologies then. I thought the abbreviation was for the MO, not the PrC linked to it. <snip> Oh, It is. My fault. I thought you were talking about another MO. Yeah, QH is the one MO in Sunndi where they want foreigners to join. Just don't be surprised if the Scarlet Brotherhood (not to mention Ahlissa's secret police) starts taking an unhealthy interest in what you're doing ;) :drool: of course my little halfling druid (he IS resident of sunndi, particular hollow highlands, member of the sunndi irregulars, member of the chtaan tribe and a burrower and now shanghaied by the army :rant: -, would be pleased and feel honored to be invited to the specific very secret organization. though i am not sure he would actually join, to few "halflingish activities" :P. what is the fun of a practical joke when you are not allowed to tell it???? i think chaotic/neutral does not really suits the organization ;) ciao martin m.
Japangirl 02-07-07, 05:10 PM	Over in onnwal we don;t tend to get benefits from joining the metaorgs. You may get access to a few core spells, or non-magical equipment from books, and maybe the odd circumstance bonus here or there or free upkeep in the region, but not feat or prestige classes. People still join them. Even the ones that cost money to join. It's about being part of something. I suspect the real problem is that Bright Sands characters don't have an active region to be part of. There are bright sands mods, sure, but not much in the way of regional events or organisations. You don't get the feel of an active region outside the adventures. Considering that the region features all sorts of strange alliances against and for Rary, this is a little odd. "We must unite to oppose him!" "What have you done to do that?" "Umm... well nothing really." Can't even make deals with organisations outsdie the bright Sands because of the residency requirements. I can see the problem. I can see why some metaorgs have these restrictions, and why people would want to restrict those metaorgs that could end up being used as a conduit for channeling rewards to players, but as a blanket restriction it doesn't make much sense. H Honestly, I think there should also be a meta-org devoted to helping Rary, if one for opposing him every does develop. My rogue doesn't understand why Karistyne doesn't want the desert to bloom again (she doesn't follow politics very well) and the bard got screwed over by Karistyne. Being CN, she's not very happy about that and would support Rary mostly for the hell of it.