Common language [Archive] - Wizards Community

Common language [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
Arcainite
08-01-07, 01:01 AM This website on Greyhawk languages leads one to believe that Common = Oeridian. Is this the case? Anyone know?
http://www.dangermouse.net/gurps/demesnes/languages.html
_metz_
08-01-07, 01:10 AM As far as I know, Common is modern Oeridian, yes.
Arvagor
08-01-07, 07:06 AM There is no "modern" Oeridian. I don't know who, or what, the "Demesnes" is, but I think you'll be better off using the description of Common from the LGG:Common: A combination of Ancient Baklunish and the dialect of Old Oeridian spoken in the GreatKingdom was the basis of this traders’ tongue. Beginning centuries ago as Middle-Common, the language contained many obviously Oeridian elements, and the contributions of Baklunish grammatical structure and vocabulary are clearly identifiable. Regional variations were also pronounced, but all these elements became blended and standardized during the years of Aerdi dominance, resulting in the birth of the Overking’s Common Tongue, later simply called Common. Any traveler must learn Common or be greatly handicapped. Very often, a language must be translated into Common before it can be translated into another language.

[...]

Baklunish, Ancient: An ancestor of Common, Baklunish bears its offspring little resemblance. Many colloquial Baklunish dialects (some used by the Paynims) are based upon the classical language and collectively called Low Baklunish. Ancient Baklunish, however, is the standard literary form of the language and is used in religion, mythology, and poetry. It is also the language of all official documents and courtly proceedings west of the Yatils. Despite this, Common is widely known and used in the west, especially by traders and the educated.

[...]

Oeridian, Old: A young language, Oeridian took in few outside influences until a few centuries ago. As a result, translation into any language except Common is difficult at best. Many books and documents of the GreatKingdom were written in Old Oeridian, and in the far east the language is still widely known and used in speech and writing.
In LG, at least Common = Common, and Oeridian = Old Oeridian; a speaker of just one will not understand a speaker of just the other (other than a term here or there).
Frumpkis
08-02-07, 04:16 AM This website on Greyhawk languages leads one to believe that Common = Oeridian. Is this the case? Anyone know?
http://www.dangermouse.net/gurps/demesnes/languages.html

This website looks to be for a private home Greyhawk campaign, and as such, the information therein should not be considered binding for LG.
Eric Anondson
08-02-07, 02:20 PM As far as I know, Common is modern Oeridian, yes.Close. According to an AD&D Greyhawk sources and the LGG, Common is a mix of Old Oeridian and Ancient Baklunish. [Source: Player's Guide 1998, and LGG 2000]
_metz_
08-02-07, 11:55 PM Close. According to an AD&D Greyhawk sources and the LGG, Common is a mix of Old Oeridian and Ancient Baklunish. [Source: Player's Guide 1998, and LGG 2000]

Hmm, If you Know ancient Baklunish and Old Oerdien, do you know Common then? (interesting for my Kobold who may not come with it...)

Do we have a definitive list for these things? I know Ancient Flan counts for Flan, but not Ur-Flan etc...
Eric Anondson
08-03-07, 12:16 AM Hmm, If you Know ancient Baklunish and Old Oerdien, do you know Common then? (interesting for my Kobold who may not come with it...)Likely no. There was not a definitive language tree until the LGG made it up. The LGG says this about Common:

"A combination of Ancient Baklunish and the dialect of Old Oeridian spoken in the Great Kingdom was the basis of this traders' tongue. Beginning centuries ago as Middle Common, the language contained many obviously Oeridian elements, and the contributions of Baklunish grammatical structure and vocabulary are clearly identifiable. Regional variations were also pronounced, but all these elements became blended and standardized during the years of Aerdi dominance, resulting in the birth of the Overking's Common Tongue, later simply Common. Any traveller must learn Common or be greatly handicapped. Very often, a language must be translated into Common before it can be translated into another language."

So if you stick to how the LGG says the two became blended, no, you shouldn't be able to speak Common if you know Old Oeridian and Ancient Baklunish.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Arcainite 08-01-07, 01:01 AM	This website on Greyhawk languages leads one to believe that Common = Oeridian. Is this the case? Anyone know? http://www.dangermouse.net/gurps/demesnes/languages.html
_metz_ 08-01-07, 01:10 AM	As far as I know, Common is modern Oeridian, yes.
Arvagor 08-01-07, 07:06 AM	There is no "modern" Oeridian. I don't know who, or what, the "Demesnes" is, but I think you'll be better off using the description of Common from the LGG:Common: A combination of Ancient Baklunish and the dialect of Old Oeridian spoken in the GreatKingdom was the basis of this traders’ tongue. Beginning centuries ago as Middle-Common, the language contained many obviously Oeridian elements, and the contributions of Baklunish grammatical structure and vocabulary are clearly identifiable. Regional variations were also pronounced, but all these elements became blended and standardized during the years of Aerdi dominance, resulting in the birth of the Overking’s Common Tongue, later simply called Common. Any traveler must learn Common or be greatly handicapped. Very often, a language must be translated into Common before it can be translated into another language. [...] Baklunish, Ancient: An ancestor of Common, Baklunish bears its offspring little resemblance. Many colloquial Baklunish dialects (some used by the Paynims) are based upon the classical language and collectively called Low Baklunish. Ancient Baklunish, however, is the standard literary form of the language and is used in religion, mythology, and poetry. It is also the language of all official documents and courtly proceedings west of the Yatils. Despite this, Common is widely known and used in the west, especially by traders and the educated. [...] Oeridian, Old: A young language, Oeridian took in few outside influences until a few centuries ago. As a result, translation into any language except Common is difficult at best. Many books and documents of the GreatKingdom were written in Old Oeridian, and in the far east the language is still widely known and used in speech and writing. In LG, at least Common = Common, and Oeridian = Old Oeridian; a speaker of just one will not understand a speaker of just the other (other than a term here or there).
Frumpkis 08-02-07, 04:16 AM	This website on Greyhawk languages leads one to believe that Common = Oeridian. Is this the case? Anyone know? http://www.dangermouse.net/gurps/demesnes/languages.html This website looks to be for a private home Greyhawk campaign, and as such, the information therein should not be considered binding for LG.
Eric Anondson 08-02-07, 02:20 PM	As far as I know, Common is modern Oeridian, yes.Close. According to an AD&D Greyhawk sources and the LGG, Common is a mix of Old Oeridian and Ancient Baklunish. [Source: Player's Guide 1998, and LGG 2000]
_metz_ 08-02-07, 11:55 PM	Close. According to an AD&D Greyhawk sources and the LGG, Common is a mix of Old Oeridian and Ancient Baklunish. [Source: Player's Guide 1998, and LGG 2000] Hmm, If you Know ancient Baklunish and Old Oerdien, do you know Common then? (interesting for my Kobold who may not come with it...) Do we have a definitive list for these things? I know Ancient Flan counts for Flan, but not Ur-Flan etc...
Eric Anondson 08-03-07, 12:16 AM	Hmm, If you Know ancient Baklunish and Old Oerdien, do you know Common then? (interesting for my Kobold who may not come with it...)Likely no. There was not a definitive language tree until the LGG made it up. The LGG says this about Common: "A combination of Ancient Baklunish and the dialect of Old Oeridian spoken in the Great Kingdom was the basis of this traders' tongue. Beginning centuries ago as Middle Common, the language contained many obviously Oeridian elements, and the contributions of Baklunish grammatical structure and vocabulary are clearly identifiable. Regional variations were also pronounced, but all these elements became blended and standardized during the years of Aerdi dominance, resulting in the birth of the Overking's Common Tongue, later simply Common. Any traveller must learn Common or be greatly handicapped. Very often, a language must be translated into Common before it can be translated into another language." So if you stick to how the LGG says the two became blended, no, you shouldn't be able to speak Common if you know Old Oeridian and Ancient Baklunish.