Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Puggle Halfwine 07-29-06, 12:45 PM	Hey guys, I play a mounted character and, stuck for what to take for my next few levels, I had an interesting idea. Said mounted character has 14 intelligence. If I took a level of wizard, I'd be losing a BAB- but I'd be gaining the ability to cast True Strikes in the occasional rounds when I'm lining up a charge, and every normal round cast Invisibility, Swift (both of which have no semantic components so I can wear armour) so that I get +2 to hit on my charges (and my targets lose their dex which in a lot of cases is a lot of lost AC). It would also get me a familiar (good for roleplaying; I have a neat familiar 'personality' idea) and a much needed bonus to my will save. It's even characterful- the character's history included a rejection from wizard school and often plays with other wizards, so... yeah. Any other suggestions? And anyone know of a full bab class or neat feat which will allow me to utilize the arcane spells a little further?
Swiftbrook 07-29-06, 02:11 PM	I play a mounted character ...{snip}... I'd be gaining the ability ...{snip}... every normal round cast Invisibility, Swift (both of which have no semantic components so I can wear armour) My initial reaction, does Invisibility affect just you or you and your mount? -Swiftbrook
ShinAkuma2 07-29-06, 02:57 PM	I've got a charger going that I think will work out pretty well. Paladin6, Fighter1, Hospitaler1, Cavalier10 (I'm assuming he probably won't get high enough to have to worry about anything after that) Feats include, of course, Mounted Combat, Ride-By Attack, Spirited Charge, Power Attack, and I decided Trample and Cavalry Charger would work out well. I believe I also decided to throw Sacred Vengeance in there. Hospitaler, at level one, is actually the same as the first level of Fighter (+1 BAB, +2 Fort, bonus feat), so I felt that'd be better than Fighter2. Also, it stacks with Paladin levels for Lay on Hands. As for your idea of using Invisibility, I know in Keoland, nothing ever has a Dex bonus. It's all natural armor around here. If it does have Dex, it's a Rogue/Barbarian with Uncanny Dodge, so Invis still wouldn't help. Your results may vary, however. I'd say stick with the full BAB so you can dump lots of Power Attack into a Spirited Charge. :D
boogahwoof 07-29-06, 08:28 PM	youde need a invis sphere for you and your mount my first question is why not sorcerer since you are focuses on what spells youll get youll have more castings a day with them
ShinAkuma2 07-29-06, 10:04 PM	youde need a invis sphere for you and your mount my first question is why not sorcerer since you are focuses on what spells youll get youll have more castings a day with them However, he needs Charisma for that. If he's a typical Fighter-type, he doesn't have enough Charisma to cast anything.
Puggle Halfwine 07-29-06, 11:18 PM	My initial reaction, does Invisibility affect just you or you and your mount? Just me, I'm afraid. Still, that works for charging. youde need a invis sphere for you and your mount my first question is why not sorcerer since you are focuses on what spells youll get youll have more castings a day with them However, he needs Charisma for that. If he's a typical Fighter-type, he doesn't have enough Charisma to cast anything. Bingo. :) 8 charisma. Still, wizard is a lot more characterful, and I can just recover the spells with pearls after every combat... I'm already at 7th level of the build (half way to 8th) and I have barbarian levels, so throwing in paladin would just be complicated. The way I see it- every point of attack bonus I get means I can a) power attack for one more on every charge and/or b) have more of a chance to hit. (unsurprisingly). When you're only doing one hit a round, you *want* to hit.
kjenks 07-30-06, 08:28 AM	There are so many feats that will help a charger that you can almost never go wrong by adding a level of fighter, even a fighter level where you don't get a bonus feat (like fighter 5). Don't just plan for the short term, like what level you're taking next. Plan for the long term, like what do you want your character to look like at level 15. If you make a long-term plan, your choice for your next level should be pretty clear.
Paul H 07-30-06, 09:01 PM	Hi Not sure if you've invested heavily in metal armour, but what about Druid? One level, with Natural Bond feat (CV Pg 111) allows you to have a Dire Bat as a mount.* Ride by attack, ending up out of reach? I agree with KJenks though - best to plan ahead. (Playing 'Nature's Warrior' concept in non-LG campaign. Barbarian/Druid, going Dire Bat rider. Usual suspects for cavalry feats). Cheers Paul H *Dire Bat companion is Druids' lvl -3, so Natural Bond reqd. (+3 Druid lvl for comapnions).
Herrbard 07-30-06, 11:52 PM	Not sure if you've invested heavily in metal armour, but what about Druid? One level, with Natural Bond feat (CV Pg 111) allows you to have a Dire Bat as a mount.* Ride by attack, ending up out of reach? Don't you mean Fly by Attack? ;)
Puggle Halfwine 07-31-06, 12:34 AM	The problem is that adding more fighter levels means that I have exp penalities- not such a bad idea at higher level, but as I'm not even half way to retirement yet (level 7) I don't think I'm quite at that stage yet... perhaps at level 10 or 12 I might consider it. Improved Bullrush/Shock Trooper seems to be very, very appealing right now...
Iswald 07-31-06, 08:28 AM	Don't you mean Fly by Attack? ;) Flyby Attack is for the mount. Ride-by Attack is for the rider. Invisibility, swift is an assassin 2, bard 1 spell. I don't know if any way to get assassin spells in LG. Two levels of bard and having at least 12 charisma doesn't seem to fit the OP's build.
kjenks 07-31-06, 08:38 AM	Mounted Combat + Ride-by Attack + Spirited Charge A human fighter could have all of those at level 1. Power Attack + Improved Bull Rush + Shock Trooper That same human fighter could have all of those by level 6. He would even have room in the build for a level of barbarian and either Extra Rage or Reckless Rage. That's some really serious damage, there, something like +13 attack, 3d8+57 damage with a mounted lance charge (assuming 18 Str, +1 lance), and it scales up well as you level up. You won't do as much damage per round as an in-your-face raging half-orc, but you'll live longer because you and your mount use RBA to avoid sticking around for an enemy's full attack. If I were you, I'd suck up the XP penalty and get Shock Trooper ASAP. Shock Trooper also helps in the many situations where you can't use your mount and you have to charge on foot. It even helps when you can't charge; the Domino Rush tactic is just plain fun.
RLWilde 08-08-06, 02:36 AM	Mounted Combat + Ride-by Attack + Spirited Charge A human fighter could have all of those at level 1. Yeah, I did that on a secondary character... even dumped most of the starting gold into a light warhorse. :D
clannagh 08-08-06, 02:46 AM	i have often added a level of ranger to my fighter types giving them the ability to use cure light wands and a favored enemy (i usually choose human if they are not human themselves or otherwise undead to help against damage reduction)
Paul H 08-09-06, 04:49 PM	Hi Not sure what all the fuss is about re ShockTrooper. Cavalry Charger seems much more appropriate, especially with 'Fell Trample'. Still think one level Druid, with Natural Bond feat is better. What's the 'worst' case example of a charger? Thinking of Druid 9/Fighter1: Druid (Dire Ape, str 22) on 10HD Rhino mount (animal companion, Gtr Magic Fang). Round one: Animal Growth Rhino, mount up on rhino. Round 2: CHARGE! The maths is diabolical. Worse is the fact you get 2 attacks with the lance with Lions' Pounce feat! Cheers Paul H
Iswald 08-10-06, 09:12 AM	Assuming your judge lets a ape or dire ape wield a lance, greatsword or any other type of weapon...
paigeoliver 08-10-06, 12:20 PM	I wouldn't really call that a worst example. I have a 5th level charging character who rolls 3d8+51 on a charge (and that is WITHOUT weapon specialization). It is even more if someone buffs her or there is a bard creeping around. Hi Not sure what all the fuss is about re ShockTrooper. Cavalry Charger seems much more appropriate, especially with 'Fell Trample'. Still think one level Druid, with Natural Bond feat is better. What's the 'worst' case example of a charger? Thinking of Druid 9/Fighter1: Druid (Dire Ape, str 22) on 10HD Rhino mount (animal companion, Gtr Magic Fang). Round one: Animal Growth Rhino, mount up on rhino. Round 2: CHARGE! The maths is diabolical. Worse is the fact you get 2 attacks with the lance with Lions' Pounce feat! Cheers Paul H
Paul H 08-10-06, 07:30 PM	Hi And how, exactly can you get that! Triple damage for lance, so basic D8+17? (Special damage, such as sneak, Warmage edge, divine feats, etc don't multiply up - they're added at end). Cheers Paul H
Puggle Halfwine 08-10-06, 08:16 PM	Hi And how, exactly can you get that! Triple damage for lance, so basic D8+17? Not that difficult... 20 str: +5 dmg, +7 if two handed 5th level: 5 points of power attack, doubled when two handed... = +17. Spirited Charge can get nasty... but so many times I've found I spend a round lining up my charge, roll a natural one on it, then spend another round positioning myself... and then the raging barbarian take out the big bad anyway. Opps.
paigeoliver 08-10-06, 09:52 PM	Oh yes, that is also without power attack as well. Raging 26 str, use lance 2-handed and 18 charisma with marshall charge damage aura. (+12 str, +1 magic, +4 aura)x3
Lomiat 08-11-06, 12:38 PM	Oh yes, that is also without power attack as well. Raging 26 str, use lance 2-handed and 18 charisma with marshall charge damage aura. (+12 str, +1 magic, +4 aura)x3 Just trying to figure out how both those stats are so high while expecting that you also have some CON, maybe DEX: Buy a 16 STR and 14 CHA, racial +2 bump to STR (wood elf), 2 bumps to CHA by 8th level, Cloak +2 and Gauntlets +2. and Reckless Rage? Or a Belt +4 instead of the racial bump? Or buy two 16s? Nonetheless, fairly impressive.
paigeoliver 08-11-06, 08:25 PM	Original stats STR 18 and Charisma 15. Race human. Everything else is 8s and 10s. Bumped charisma to 16 at level 4. Purchased cloak of charisma +2 and gloves of STR+2. Reincarnated as half orc leaving me with STR 22, charisma 18. Rage for str 26. My con and dex are 10. I have died twice. I expect I will probably die more in the future. I'll be bumping charisma at 8 and 12. Since I am also taking the full outcast champion progression I figure the extra charisma will be more helpful to the party than the extra damage another 2 points of str would give me. I won't be getting power attack until maybe 9th level. That is about where I will need it since by then I will no longer be way ahead of the damage curve. In a minor unfortunate note at a recent convention I spent gold and a time unit to get access to powerful charge, I didn't have that book with me at the time and I came home and read the feat and found out it didn't work while mounted!!! I am mounted almost all the time, even when indoors (tunnel riding feat). So that was a big waste.
clik_ml 08-12-06, 02:09 AM	Regarding unique mounts, does anyone know what the rule is on the Marble Elephant figurine of wonderous power? It has 4 activations per month at 24 hours a pop. I'm hoping that comes out to 4 activations per adventure (even double rounders) since time units are not technically considered weeks. I could imagine having DMs keep it check by noting how many times I used it on each AR, and once it totals 48 then it's done for the year. My spirited-charge character is considering nabbing one of the wonderous figurines for a stand-in mount (as my animal companion mounts are dropping more often lately at APL 8-10), and the elephant looks awfully tempting. Once I start throwing down some animal growth on that puppy and set it to trampling it should at least be distracting to enemies if not scary. The griffon is nice too, but its HP are kinda lowish for the long term, and at 2 activations per week for 6 hours, it just seems too short a duration. Also, if slain in the air, I have to worry about rescuing it before breaking from the fall. Decisions, decisions. - Erik
paigeoliver 08-12-06, 02:20 AM	I would imagine you would encounter serious table variations with the elephant figurine. I would try to come up with an honest way to track it, since I imagine it isn't an issue most GMs have ever had to deal with. An easy seat of the pants way to track it would be one activation per time unit spent in the adventure. That might add up to a couple more activations per year, but it is less hassle than trying to track a year's worth. Or another way to do it might be to make an "annual activations of elephant" list on your MIL under the wands section (crossing off the last 2 before you begin) and track your activations that way.
clannagh 08-14-06, 07:09 PM	Not that difficult... 20 str: +5 dmg, +7 if two handed 5th level: 5 points of power attack, doubled when two handed... = +17. Spirited Charge can get nasty... but so many times I've found I spend a round lining up my charge, roll a natural one on it, then spend another round positioning myself... and then the raging barbarian take out the big bad anyway. Opps. and of course a level of ranger and teh feat that lets you do triple damage when power attacking your favoured enemy would boost that even further against that type of enemy
Paul H 08-14-06, 07:35 PM	Hi There is always the potential 10d6+8 electrical damage on a charge for Swashbuckler 3/Warmage 3 casting Shocking Grasp, holding charge, then using Spirited Charge, Practiced Spellcaster & Swashbuckler's Insightful Strike. (Both seperate class abilities, so stack). 15d6+8 if you successfully crit. But that's bit beardy, using Grey Elf with Int 18. Taking Extra edge at 9th only adds extra 3 points damage. Note: Any spell that requires an attack roll & does HP or Ability damage, not drain, counts as a weapon for feats & abilities. There are other, potentially worse combinations for some higher level Cleric spells. Cheers Paul H
Gwumph 09-06-06, 10:22 AM	I just got on the forums, and have been reading several charger questions. I notice we start talking about a small sized character mounted, and then somehow we start talking about mounted human and elf characters!! (kjenks is definitly a guilty party:) ) I just review my last 4 mods i played. out of those 4 mods there was roughly 16 different instances we rolled for initative. out of the 16 battles a human sized character would have only been able to be mounted for 3 of them, where a small sized character could be mounted for all of them. percentage wise it makes no sense to put all those feats into being a mounted medium character since u will only use them about 18% of your characters career.
Paul H 09-06-06, 07:32 PM	youde need a invis sphere for you and your mount my first question is why not sorcerer since you are focuses on what spells youll get youll have more castings a day with them Hi Actually no - any spell that you cast (including potions) can also affect your mount, as long as it stays within 5' of you. (PHB) Cheers Paul H
JamesMaissen 09-07-06, 01:48 AM	I just review my last 4 mods i played. out of those 4 mods there was roughly 16 different instances we rolled for initative. out of the 16 battles a human sized character would have only been able to be mounted for 3 of them, where a small sized character could be mounted for all of them. percentage wise it makes no sense to put all those feats into being a mounted medium character since u will only use them about 18% of your characters career. Well two things there.. this can be highly variant on region firstofall. Secondly you can make efforts to mitigate this to a great degree. It's true that a small character can be mounted more readily than a medium sized one, but there's alot the medium character can do to compete (including armbands of reduction amongst other things!). -James
paigeoliver 09-07-06, 07:29 AM	The tunnel riding feat goes a long way towards making medium sized mounted characters more useful. Although you have to have tunnel fighting first, which means spending 2 feats on the ability. Also remember horses have a pretty good jump check due to their speed and str. You can jump as part of a charge, and making a DC 5 or 10 jump check to jump 5 or 10 feet of rough terrain is quite simple. With all that said. Small characters still make better mounted characters. I'd only suggest a medium one if I had a specific concept in mind.
JosephKell 09-07-06, 02:32 PM	It's true that a small character can be mounted more readily than a medium sized one, but there's alot the medium character can do to compete (including armbands of reduction amongst other things!).Seriously? Why spend gold on an item that effectively makes you a halfling? That is just silly.