Living Greyhawk and Hardcover Dungeon Magazine Adventure Paths [Archive] - Wizards Community

Living Greyhawk and Hardcover Dungeon Magazine Adventure Paths [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
Reznor00
04-15-07, 12:04 PM I posted this over in the Pazio Dungeon Forums but I figured I'd post it here too and see what people thought.

This might have already been discussed on here but in searching I couldn't find anything on this topic, and so if I missed it and it's already been discussed I apologize and would be pleased if someone could point me in the right direction. I have read some stuff that states it's uncertain if there will be any more beyond the already existing Shacked City. I think that you could easily find the demand for a product if it was marketed correctly. If the staff of Dungeon Magazine and the Circle of Living Greyhawk worked together they could allow for these Adventure Paths to be sanctioned for play within the campaign. In doing so there would be lots of perks for both Pazio and the RPGA Living Greyhawk listed below

Perks for Pazio:

1) Sell More Dungeon Magazine: If the hardcovers are exactly the same as the 12 installments in prior in the magazine you would probably get alot of LG DMs that aren't currently subscribed to the magazine that would become such.

2) Target Audience for the Hardcover: It's probably a risky move to publish that big monster hardback book without knowing it probably will sell fairly well. Incorporating it into the biggest longest running 3rd Ed campaign would ensure that alot of them sell.

Perks for RPGA:

1) A module that takes character from level 1-20 with a linked storyline. Only work for the RPGA would be to modify it to work for various party levels which are a lot easier than writing up the whole module and also modifying it. Alternately they could just say a character playing that series can’t play anything else and must play the adventure path in complete chronological order. This works into less work for modifying APLs. There is no need to play anything else since it’s designed to take you close to 20th level. The fact that you would have several parts in the storyline of an adventure path to still play once you hit 16th level (normally in RPGA your character is retired and can only play in a few special modules), so it would work for some players that want to get the chance at higher level play

2) The adventure paths are already set in Greyhawk and they aren’t in regions that really interfere with any other established regions or plotlines that I’m aware, but I’m just getting back involved with the RPGA and I gotta say they have gotten really organized and the restrictions on items from books beyond the 3.5 core is fairly vast and balanced.

I think that the fact that players can play the adventures in Dungeon Magazine and get player reward points is a great starting point. However the fact that it’s for a limited time makes it really hard to do, for example I started DMing the Savage Tide Campaign when it first came out and we play every Friday and we fell behind the latest module so getting player reward points for them won’t be possible unless we have a Weekend Marathon to catch up. Player reward points for playing the module shouldn’t be time sensitive.

Nothing in my post was meant to bash on Pazio, The RPGA, or Wizards I like all three of them. I’m sure the business aspects of doing my suggestions are a lot tougher than I made it sound. I’m just wondering if maybe the idea had been talked about and perhaps in the future something along those lines might be possible. If it’s not a feasible venture that I’m curious if someone could explain why not, I really enjoy the storylines of all the Adventure Paths and think they would be fun to run RPGA character through as well as DM. While I understand that Pazio can't print a HC of either of these without Wizards permission, I was curious with the above mentioned potential benefits why that wouldn't want to give Pazio the rights and make the attempt when if executed properly a business model for the market is already there just waiting to be tapped.

Thanks for any feedback, answers, or light you could shed on this topic.

Thanks & Always Good Gaming,
Matt Butler
Eric Anondson
04-15-07, 12:29 PM 2) The adventure paths are already set in Greyhawk and they aren’t in regions that really interfere with any other established regions or plotlines that I’m aware, The Age of Worms is an unworkable problem. Unignorable portions occur within the Bandit Kingdoms' realm of Redhand.
Reznor00
04-15-07, 12:40 PM I'm DMing that one now, and I can see where that might be a little issue. However, there could be a work-around created I'm sure. I'm sure if the writers would know that Adventure Paths would be playable and used by the RPGA they wouldn't attempt to do anything that really upset the storyline balance like that again.

~MB
Simpi
04-15-07, 01:53 PM There is no need to play anything else since it’s designed to take you close to 20th level.

Question: If this takes you straight to retirement level and hence no need to play anything else, what would possibly be the point for it in actually being in Living Greyhawk?

Sampo Haarlaa
Naerie Triad
Reznor00
04-15-07, 05:29 PM Well the point would just be that fun to play in organized play from start to finish I think. The more options to play in Living Greyhawk the better, and it gives more character options to play for those that have alot of character or have played most the stuff in there region. If someone has played all Regional Moduels and all cores and can't afford to travel to much these Adventure Paths would be excellent to play through parts of while waiting for more core and regional modules to come out.

~MB
Sieylianna
04-15-07, 07:07 PM I don't see it happening. A) It's not putting money in WotC's pocket. B) The Circle reps have already talked about how much time is required to adapt a published adventure. I think you'd need to wait for the complete series before you could begin the adaptation. C) As someone else noted, if the game will take you from level 1 to 20, who cares if it's LG?

Ed
pedr
04-16-07, 06:51 AM Indeed. Seven of our local LG group are playing Age of Worms. We're roughly using LG access rules as we're used to them and it means our DM doesn't have to make too many decisions about what's balanced or not - but we're also enjoying the novelty of a home campaign (many of us, particularly the DM, has been playing mainly LG since 3.0 came out, I think!)... such as rolling for wandering monster hit-points - and for wandering monster treasure :D One of our (two!) paladins has a wonderful +1 greataxe which glows with a purple light from the random item tables.... that doesn't happen in LG too often :D
Timlagor
04-16-07, 11:41 PM Ahh the mythical "Axe of Posing" ;)
Samwise
04-19-07, 02:42 PM The question is now moot. Barring a massive reversal of policy, this will never happen.
Check the Paizo front page, or wait for it somewhere on the WotC site.
Mithreinmaethor
04-20-07, 04:18 AM I read the article. And I just had a terrible, yet paranoid thought. If WOTC produces both magazines, in a e-subscription model, what is to keep them from having you be a subscriber to the magazines to get RPGA core mods ?????

OK I know it sounds crazy and well I dont think its possible. But it could be done if they are wanting to increase money flow. You would have to subscribe to both mags to have access to all of the core mods per year. You would have to download them and request a password from the e-subscription site. And I dont know if its possible but like mp3s you get from subscription services it could have a security feature that makes it unusable after a certain period of time.

Like I said I dont expect this but why not fan the flames of conspiracy :)

The question is now moot. Barring a massive reversal of policy, this will never happen.
Check the Paizo front page, or wait for it somewhere on the WotC site.
pedr
04-20-07, 06:43 AM I think that's unlikely - there's very little cost to Wizards for an LG module (do they even pay, any more?) The justification for organised play is that we who play LG or XE have to buy the books to do so, and are encouraged to buy more books to take advantage of the new rules options. That model probably works, so there's not much point in changing it.

Now, it might be that something slightly 'sneaky' happens, for instance adapting online adventures which are made available to subscribers to the online service for play in LG and providing an incentive, such as special certs or greater-than-normal levels of reward. But given that the RPGA went away from a subscription model only a few years ago - and that LG and XE are considered successes by the RPGA - suggests to me that the current free-to-play campaigns will continue.

All speculation right now, of course!
mindreavertp
04-20-07, 07:01 AM Well considering WoTC is choosing not to renew Paizo's license for D&D, the point at least thru paizo is moot.

See Paizo's website and the FAQ portion. Erik Mona the editor in chief just posted April 19th regarding Dungeon and Dragon magazines as being no more come September. WoTC at least let them continue thru finishing up the Savage Tides series.

WoTC claims they will produce content online via website of the quality Paizo and the former subscribers received. (yeah right)

Just fyi....
Eric Anondson
04-20-07, 01:45 PM I read the article. And I just had a terrible, yet paranoid thought. If WOTC produces both magazines, in a e-subscription model, what is to keep them from having you be a subscriber to the magazines to get RPGA core mods ?????Who do you mean by "them"?

Second, the magazines are not reappearing in an online format. They are ceasing to exist. WotC is starting a whole new endeavor.
Herrbard
04-21-07, 08:42 AM Who do you mean by "them"?

Second, the magazines are not reappearing in an online format. They are ceasing to exist. WotC is starting a whole new endeavor.
Maybe yes, maybe no. To quote Chris Perkins from the WotC website:

Today, twenty years after my first published credit in DUNGEON magazine, I’m part of the Wizards team responsible for creating D&D books, miniatures, and accessories. I want DUNGEON and DRAGON to be part of our plans for the future of the game, and I look forward to having them back in the fold. While this decision marks the end of an era, here are five words that make me feel better about the fate of DRAGON and DUNGEON magazines:

Nothing this good ever dies.

—Christopher Perkins, Design Manager, RPG R&D; Former Editor-in-Chief, DUNGEON Magazine (1997–2000); Former Associate Editor, DRAGON Magazine (1997–2000); 20-year contributor to DUNGEON and DRAGON Magazines

So it may still be called DRAGON or DUNGEON. We just don't know. :confused:

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Reznor00 04-15-07, 12:04 PM	I posted this over in the Pazio Dungeon Forums but I figured I'd post it here too and see what people thought. This might have already been discussed on here but in searching I couldn't find anything on this topic, and so if I missed it and it's already been discussed I apologize and would be pleased if someone could point me in the right direction. I have read some stuff that states it's uncertain if there will be any more beyond the already existing Shacked City. I think that you could easily find the demand for a product if it was marketed correctly. If the staff of Dungeon Magazine and the Circle of Living Greyhawk worked together they could allow for these Adventure Paths to be sanctioned for play within the campaign. In doing so there would be lots of perks for both Pazio and the RPGA Living Greyhawk listed below Perks for Pazio: 1) Sell More Dungeon Magazine: If the hardcovers are exactly the same as the 12 installments in prior in the magazine you would probably get alot of LG DMs that aren't currently subscribed to the magazine that would become such. 2) Target Audience for the Hardcover: It's probably a risky move to publish that big monster hardback book without knowing it probably will sell fairly well. Incorporating it into the biggest longest running 3rd Ed campaign would ensure that alot of them sell. Perks for RPGA: 1) A module that takes character from level 1-20 with a linked storyline. Only work for the RPGA would be to modify it to work for various party levels which are a lot easier than writing up the whole module and also modifying it. Alternately they could just say a character playing that series can’t play anything else and must play the adventure path in complete chronological order. This works into less work for modifying APLs. There is no need to play anything else since it’s designed to take you close to 20th level. The fact that you would have several parts in the storyline of an adventure path to still play once you hit 16th level (normally in RPGA your character is retired and can only play in a few special modules), so it would work for some players that want to get the chance at higher level play 2) The adventure paths are already set in Greyhawk and they aren’t in regions that really interfere with any other established regions or plotlines that I’m aware, but I’m just getting back involved with the RPGA and I gotta say they have gotten really organized and the restrictions on items from books beyond the 3.5 core is fairly vast and balanced. I think that the fact that players can play the adventures in Dungeon Magazine and get player reward points is a great starting point. However the fact that it’s for a limited time makes it really hard to do, for example I started DMing the Savage Tide Campaign when it first came out and we play every Friday and we fell behind the latest module so getting player reward points for them won’t be possible unless we have a Weekend Marathon to catch up. Player reward points for playing the module shouldn’t be time sensitive. Nothing in my post was meant to bash on Pazio, The RPGA, or Wizards I like all three of them. I’m sure the business aspects of doing my suggestions are a lot tougher than I made it sound. I’m just wondering if maybe the idea had been talked about and perhaps in the future something along those lines might be possible. If it’s not a feasible venture that I’m curious if someone could explain why not, I really enjoy the storylines of all the Adventure Paths and think they would be fun to run RPGA character through as well as DM. While I understand that Pazio can't print a HC of either of these without Wizards permission, I was curious with the above mentioned potential benefits why that wouldn't want to give Pazio the rights and make the attempt when if executed properly a business model for the market is already there just waiting to be tapped. Thanks for any feedback, answers, or light you could shed on this topic. Thanks & Always Good Gaming, Matt Butler
Eric Anondson 04-15-07, 12:29 PM	2) The adventure paths are already set in Greyhawk and they aren’t in regions that really interfere with any other established regions or plotlines that I’m aware, The Age of Worms is an unworkable problem. Unignorable portions occur within the Bandit Kingdoms' realm of Redhand.
Reznor00 04-15-07, 12:40 PM	I'm DMing that one now, and I can see where that might be a little issue. However, there could be a work-around created I'm sure. I'm sure if the writers would know that Adventure Paths would be playable and used by the RPGA they wouldn't attempt to do anything that really upset the storyline balance like that again. ~MB
Simpi 04-15-07, 01:53 PM	There is no need to play anything else since it’s designed to take you close to 20th level. Question: If this takes you straight to retirement level and hence no need to play anything else, what would possibly be the point for it in actually being in Living Greyhawk? Sampo Haarlaa Naerie Triad
Reznor00 04-15-07, 05:29 PM	Well the point would just be that fun to play in organized play from start to finish I think. The more options to play in Living Greyhawk the better, and it gives more character options to play for those that have alot of character or have played most the stuff in there region. If someone has played all Regional Moduels and all cores and can't afford to travel to much these Adventure Paths would be excellent to play through parts of while waiting for more core and regional modules to come out. ~MB
Sieylianna 04-15-07, 07:07 PM	I don't see it happening. A) It's not putting money in WotC's pocket. B) The Circle reps have already talked about how much time is required to adapt a published adventure. I think you'd need to wait for the complete series before you could begin the adaptation. C) As someone else noted, if the game will take you from level 1 to 20, who cares if it's LG? Ed
pedr 04-16-07, 06:51 AM	Indeed. Seven of our local LG group are playing Age of Worms. We're roughly using LG access rules as we're used to them and it means our DM doesn't have to make too many decisions about what's balanced or not - but we're also enjoying the novelty of a home campaign (many of us, particularly the DM, has been playing mainly LG since 3.0 came out, I think!)... such as rolling for wandering monster hit-points - and for wandering monster treasure :D One of our (two!) paladins has a wonderful +1 greataxe which glows with a purple light from the random item tables.... that doesn't happen in LG too often :D
Timlagor 04-16-07, 11:41 PM	Ahh the mythical "Axe of Posing" ;)
Samwise 04-19-07, 02:42 PM	The question is now moot. Barring a massive reversal of policy, this will never happen. Check the Paizo front page, or wait for it somewhere on the WotC site.
Mithreinmaethor 04-20-07, 04:18 AM	I read the article. And I just had a terrible, yet paranoid thought. If WOTC produces both magazines, in a e-subscription model, what is to keep them from having you be a subscriber to the magazines to get RPGA core mods ????? OK I know it sounds crazy and well I dont think its possible. But it could be done if they are wanting to increase money flow. You would have to subscribe to both mags to have access to all of the core mods per year. You would have to download them and request a password from the e-subscription site. And I dont know if its possible but like mp3s you get from subscription services it could have a security feature that makes it unusable after a certain period of time. Like I said I dont expect this but why not fan the flames of conspiracy :) The question is now moot. Barring a massive reversal of policy, this will never happen. Check the Paizo front page, or wait for it somewhere on the WotC site.
pedr 04-20-07, 06:43 AM	I think that's unlikely - there's very little cost to Wizards for an LG module (do they even pay, any more?) The justification for organised play is that we who play LG or XE have to buy the books to do so, and are encouraged to buy more books to take advantage of the new rules options. That model probably works, so there's not much point in changing it. Now, it might be that something slightly 'sneaky' happens, for instance adapting online adventures which are made available to subscribers to the online service for play in LG and providing an incentive, such as special certs or greater-than-normal levels of reward. But given that the RPGA went away from a subscription model only a few years ago - and that LG and XE are considered successes by the RPGA - suggests to me that the current free-to-play campaigns will continue. All speculation right now, of course!
mindreavertp 04-20-07, 07:01 AM	Well considering WoTC is choosing not to renew Paizo's license for D&D, the point at least thru paizo is moot. See Paizo's website and the FAQ portion. Erik Mona the editor in chief just posted April 19th regarding Dungeon and Dragon magazines as being no more come September. WoTC at least let them continue thru finishing up the Savage Tides series. WoTC claims they will produce content online via website of the quality Paizo and the former subscribers received. (yeah right) Just fyi....
Eric Anondson 04-20-07, 01:45 PM	I read the article. And I just had a terrible, yet paranoid thought. If WOTC produces both magazines, in a e-subscription model, what is to keep them from having you be a subscriber to the magazines to get RPGA core mods ?????Who do you mean by "them"? Second, the magazines are not reappearing in an online format. They are ceasing to exist. WotC is starting a whole new endeavor.
Herrbard 04-21-07, 08:42 AM	Who do you mean by "them"? Second, the magazines are not reappearing in an online format. They are ceasing to exist. WotC is starting a whole new endeavor. Maybe yes, maybe no. To quote Chris Perkins from the WotC website: Today, twenty years after my first published credit in DUNGEON magazine, I’m part of the Wizards team responsible for creating D&D books, miniatures, and accessories. I want DUNGEON and DRAGON to be part of our plans for the future of the game, and I look forward to having them back in the fold. While this decision marks the end of an era, here are five words that make me feel better about the fate of DRAGON and DUNGEON magazines: Nothing this good ever dies. —Christopher Perkins, Design Manager, RPG R&D; Former Editor-in-Chief, DUNGEON Magazine (1997–2000); Former Associate Editor, DRAGON Magazine (1997–2000); 20-year contributor to DUNGEON and DRAGON Magazines So it may still be called DRAGON or DUNGEON. We just don't know. :confused: