Necromancer, without being evil? [Archive] - Wizards Community

Necromancer, without being evil? [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
astromist
04-25-07, 03:21 PM Can you play a Necromancer, without being considered evil by the DM right off the bat? I was thinking tormented, not evil (CN). If this would cause more problems than its worth I will just play a generalist (NG).
Redfist
04-25-07, 03:22 PM Definitely.

There are plenty of Nec spells without the [evil] descriptor.
LachlarlanIII
04-25-07, 03:37 PM Can you play a Necromancer, without being considered evil by the DM right off the bat? I was thinking tormented, not evil (CN). If this would cause more problems than its worth I will just play a generalist (NG).

Avoid spells with the Evil descriptor and the Create/Summon Undead spells.

Here's a good combo for a necromancer:

Spectral Hand + Bestow Curse = cursing people from a distance
copper_wyrmling
04-25-07, 03:39 PM What Redfist said. I play a Chaotic Good sorcerer who's been developing an awfully necromantic emphasis recently - in-character, it's primarily due to her habit of playing with ancient evil artifacts. (Azrien: "Hey, I wonder what happens if I touch the ominous black Ur-Flan obelisk?" GM: "You sense an immense magical force surging towards you. Make a Reflex save to jump away in time." Azrien: "No way! I like magic!" - and that's why Azrien now flinches away from Radiant Servants...) She can cast Spiritwall, (Split Ray) Enervation, (Empowered) False Life, and (Split Ray Empowered) Ray of Enfeeblement - nothing with the [Evil] descriptor, note, she's just very good at manipulating negative energy.

She's never had any trouble with GMs, or with other good-aligned PCs for that matter. She had an amusing conversation with a cleric of Pholtus recently where the cleric ended up praising her for a plan that involved energy-draining people to death and then disintegrating the bodies ;) Stick to the nasty necromancy debuffs and you should be fine. If you want to raise armies of the undead, that might be more of a problem, since those spells are [Evil].
taylorj
04-25-07, 03:51 PM (Azrien: "Hey, I wonder what happens if I touch the ominous black Ur-Flan obelisk?" GM: "You sense an immense magical force surging towards you. Make a Reflex save to jump away in time." Azrien: "No way! I like magic!" - and that's why Azrien now flinches away from Radiant Servants...)

That could almost be a thread unto itself.

"Funny times a PC has turned down a chance to make a saving throw..."
astromist
04-25-07, 04:13 PM What Redfist said. I play a Chaotic Good sorcerer who's been developing an awfully necromantic emphasis recently - in-character, it's primarily due to her habit of playing with ancient evil artifacts. (Azrien: "Hey, I wonder what happens if I touch the ominous black Ur-Flan obelisk?" GM: "You sense an immense magical force surging towards you. Make a Reflex save to jump away in time." Azrien: "No way! I like magic!" - and that's why Azrien now flinches away from Radiant Servants...) She can cast Spiritwall, (Split Ray) Enervation, (Empowered) False Life, and (Split Ray Empowered) Ray of Enfeeblement - nothing with the [Evil] descriptor, note, she's just very good at manipulating negative energy.

She's never had any trouble with GMs, or with other good-aligned PCs for that matter. She had an amusing conversation with a cleric of Pholtus recently where the cleric ended up praising her for a plan that involved energy-draining people to death and then disintegrating the bodies ;) Stick to the nasty necromancy debuffs and you should be fine. If you want to raise armies of the undead, that might be more of a problem, since those spells are [Evil].

LOL, that is interesting. I know not to animate undead, even in [edit]an evil campaign that I was in,(not lg) I never did. We had a cleric that could do a much better job. Amazingly that campaign lasted to 16th level without us killing each other.
DerekSTheRed
04-27-07, 08:09 PM It depends on where you play. Here in the BK necromancy is almost encouraged since it provides a cheap source of labor. Oh and Necromancers have their own Meta-Org.

Derek
cheeky_ktty
04-28-07, 02:54 AM Is rebuking undead evil? My brother did that with one of his characters recently, and I'm not entirely sure he can.
_metz_
04-28-07, 03:02 AM 1. You can only rebuke undead if you channel negative energy. (Must be a neutral cleric non good) - THis means thier cleric cannot spontaneoulsy cast heal. If theri character casts cures spontaneously, or has in the past, then they cannot rebuke.

2. If you do rebuke the undead and take control of them, and command undead minions, that would surely have to be logged as an evil act. You are controlling undead.

3. From the SRD:

Neutral Clerics and Undead
A cleric of neutral alignment can either turn undead but not rebuke them, or rebuke undead but not turn them. See Turn or Rebuke Undead for more information.

Even if a cleric is neutral, channeling positive energy is a good act and channeling negative energy is evil.

- There is your 'evil' statement.

Finally, As a DM I would not say channelling inflict spells instead of cure's is evil, but the act of rebuking would be. There may be table variation on that one.
cheeky_ktty
04-28-07, 03:14 AM I thought that was the case Metz, but I heard from a different person that it was OK to do.
My brother will not be happy when I ruin his fun :devil:
My weekend just got more enjoyable :D
_metz_
04-28-07, 04:48 AM Which Brother? I assume the older cos he would be the one to try something even remotely morally dubious...
pedr
04-28-07, 06:00 AM It is 'OK' as in permitted by the campaign. Your DM cannot say 'You can't do that in LG'.

It is 'Evil', which means that your DM has to remind you that it is evil before you do it, and can report the character to the triad if he thinks it is substantially evil, or if it is done often enough to make it worth noting.

Evil acts are not prohibited, but acts which are substantial enough (in quantity or quality) to lead to the triad and circle concluding that the character itself is evil will get that character removed from the game.
Vamroc
04-28-07, 01:59 PM An evil act that helps out the party and is used thwart a greater evil will be over looked by a DM nearly every time. Its when you harm commoners that evil acts become a problem. So you should only use evil spells when fighting evil and when no commoners are around.
mindreavertp
04-29-07, 07:37 AM Just ask the judge up front if casting certain spells (be specific) would in their official opinion be something that warrants actually entering an evil act on the AR.

I've cast several 'evil' spell descriptors and not had judges have a problem with it.

Depends on the how you view alignment. Does a single evil act (or spell) an evil person make? Or is it repeated castings of 'evil' descriptor spells that begin to shift a person's alignment?

Just ask....bottom line. If they tell you casting animate dead isnt an evil act warranting noting it on the AR and then at the end of the mod proceed to do that, appeal. As long as you didnt do anything 'too gross' with it....it will likely get overturned.

But yes, it's possible to play a necromancer and not be 'evil'....I play a gray elf necromancer who is definitely 'naughty'. I have a pair of horses and cart around a wagon full of decaying cow corpses that I'm studying....that's typically how I introduce my pc to the other players. I usually then start conversations with those that look 'goody goody' like to find out their philosophical opinions about undead and the finer arts of necromancy. Based on that I know how to act or conceal my actions so the goody goodies can keep doing what they do, and I can do my thing. (so as not to cause party and table strife....I prep my spell list accordingly)
Puggle Halfwine
04-29-07, 07:43 AM As someone who play(ed) a cleric who channeled negative energy, who regularly controlled undead and was eventually removed from the campaign for doing too much evil, I feel your brother's pain Cheeky. :)
pedr
04-29-07, 11:45 AM Puggle could you talk us through the process you faced?

Many of us have no experience whatsoever with the results of evil acts being reported to triads and it would be illustrative to hear, if it isn't too sore a subject, how it all happened with your character.

Particular questions I have: Did you expect it to happen? How much warning did your triad give you? Were you given an opportunity to change your character's behaviour?
copper_wyrmling
04-29-07, 03:11 PM Puggle's character is not a good example. He was removed from the campaign for a one-off evil act, not a pattern of behaviour - he regularly commanded undead slaves and cast Death Knell on prisoners, but as far as I know, that didn't cause him any particular problems (although my sorcerer believed he was an agent of Iuz and refused to either cast beneficial spells on him or accept spellcasting from him). The act that got him removed was very obviously evil with a capital E, and I'm pretty sure Puggle knew exactly what the consequences would be :P ("Will you destroy the ancient evil artifact that was made to control the minds of everyone in Perrenland, or will you try to take its power for yourself?" "MINE!")
opa
04-29-07, 07:16 PM In Bissel, you would have CONSIDERABLE difficulty being a necromancer...
cheeky_ktty
04-29-07, 11:43 PM As someone who play(ed) a cleric who channeled negative energy, who regularly controlled undead and was eventually removed from the campaign for doing too much evil, I feel your brother's pain Cheeky. :)

I was relatively nice in my heartbreaking news-(he buys me lunch, I love a free lunch :D). I'm sure he will eventually get over it.
He is quite use to his random, and some times cool, ideas not working.

-Metz I'm not going to mention names on the forums for privacy reasons, but it was the older one.

-And thanks for your replies guys, I'm still learning alot.
AtmaWeapon
04-30-07, 01:36 AM My Bright Sands character is a halfling necromancer, with fearsome necromancy and all. You can easily avoid problems by simply not casting spells with the evil descriptor.
Hariman
05-01-07, 01:46 AM In Bissel, you would have CONSIDERABLE difficulty being a necromancer...

Keoland too. Keoland has an entire set of rules and punishments for casting necromancy spells.

You can cast necromancy/forbidden spells in keoland, just not in front of any witnesses who can recognize spells.
gomeztoo
05-01-07, 04:07 AM I've played one necromancer (a dwarf) but he died horribly at the hands of a a mummy (and was abandoned by the party, probably thought he'd come back as an undead) before he could get into trouble.
Had he not died, he might have gotten himself into trouble eventually by using the bad type of magic, but I was willing to take that risk.
Lupo
05-01-07, 01:10 PM In Bissel, you would have CONSIDERABLE difficulty being a necromancer...

i am not entirely sure, at least NPC necromancer have no problem in innspa/ahlissa . . . . :rolleyes:

PC necromancers might find the sometimes "free" available raw material components a nice boon ;)

but

when such a character leaves the safety of innspa, the folks of the adri might declare him "persona non grata" and use him for target practice :D

ciao

martin m.
Southernskies
05-02-07, 08:04 AM This means thier cleric cannot spontaneoulsy cast heal. If theri character casts cures spontaneously, or has in the past, then they cannot rebuke.

A cleric cannot spontaneously cast heal anyway. PHB pg32
The cleric can "lose" any prepared spell that is not a domain spell in order to cast any cure spell of the spall spell level or lower (a cure spell is any spell with "cure" in its name).
Madfox11
05-03-07, 03:47 AM In short: necromancers are not necessarily evil, but using these spells in many regions is illegal. Even in liberal Sunndi you get executed if you cast animate dead or start commanding them to do your bidding - assuming there are witnesses and you get caught of course.
_metz_
05-03-07, 06:18 AM A cleric cannot spontaneously cast heal anyway. PHB pg32

That was a typo - was supposed to say "heals". Its pretty clear what I mean. Read the second line please, before getting on your high horse.
Will_DM_for_Pizza
05-17-07, 01:33 AM Yeah if you don't want to play an evil necromancer Lawful Neuteral is the most popular way to go.

In terms of evil spells, I don't think any magic is considered evil, there are those that do read as evil but I think that they're cleric spells for the most part.
Golorious
05-18-07, 06:47 PM I play N Necromancer and he is now 11th level. Evil and good are limitations on rational thought.

It is often about appropriate places to play a necromancer. Core modules in Greyhawk, Pomarj... not so bad. Furyondy, the shield lands.... maybe not a good idea. But there are a good number of non-evil necromancy spells, but some of the best are evil.

I have cast many evil spells and I still do. I just try to make sure I use it now when it is necessary. I'm proud to say that this character's homeland is Dyvers. Where you can say yes I'm a Necromancer and I would be happy to do a favor for the Church of Nerull! Praise the Reaper! If I could I would worship Nerul and because a necromancer has nothing on the "A" Team as I call them for truly evil acts then I often feel like a good guy. Though I wouldn't mind seeing the gnarly forest burned down, and paved. The so called protectors of the forest keep getting ****** when I cast blight.

Though there was this one time... in KET, that I lost it and started casting Wrack, Quickened wrack (raging spell card), crushing despair, rays of enfeeblement etc... (nothing lethal but not very nice) I'm an elf, and was "owned" by a Halfling barbarian. I wore a shirt that said in Elven I'm with Stupid, with and arrow pointing down and to the right. It was like the 3rd or 4th VTF module in a row that I was "property" and had just had enough.

His favorite spell was wrack which is evil. Until the recent LG rules changes on evil acts it was a very common spell for him I would usually have 2 or 3 of them. But after I retrained away weapon finesse for spell school focus necromancy and picked up split ray I usually take 2 split ray enervations instead. I still take wrack but cast it slightly less often.

Now I have come to the conclusion that if I am removed from play for casting evil spells on evil guys then that is life. There was a change in the way rules can be reported, I don't see that as a reason to revamp my entire character. If I make it to 15th level that will be fine. If I don't then life will go on.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
astromist 04-25-07, 03:21 PM	Can you play a Necromancer, without being considered evil by the DM right off the bat? I was thinking tormented, not evil (CN). If this would cause more problems than its worth I will just play a generalist (NG).
Redfist 04-25-07, 03:22 PM	Definitely. There are plenty of Nec spells without the [evil] descriptor.
LachlarlanIII 04-25-07, 03:37 PM	Can you play a Necromancer, without being considered evil by the DM right off the bat? I was thinking tormented, not evil (CN). If this would cause more problems than its worth I will just play a generalist (NG). Avoid spells with the Evil descriptor and the Create/Summon Undead spells. Here's a good combo for a necromancer: Spectral Hand + Bestow Curse = cursing people from a distance
copper_wyrmling 04-25-07, 03:39 PM	What Redfist said. I play a Chaotic Good sorcerer who's been developing an awfully necromantic emphasis recently - in-character, it's primarily due to her habit of playing with ancient evil artifacts. (Azrien: "Hey, I wonder what happens if I touch the ominous black Ur-Flan obelisk?" GM: "You sense an immense magical force surging towards you. Make a Reflex save to jump away in time." Azrien: "No way! I like magic!" - and that's why Azrien now flinches away from Radiant Servants...) She can cast Spiritwall, (Split Ray) Enervation, (Empowered) False Life, and (Split Ray Empowered) Ray of Enfeeblement - nothing with the [Evil] descriptor, note, she's just very good at manipulating negative energy. She's never had any trouble with GMs, or with other good-aligned PCs for that matter. She had an amusing conversation with a cleric of Pholtus recently where the cleric ended up praising her for a plan that involved energy-draining people to death and then disintegrating the bodies ;) Stick to the nasty necromancy debuffs and you should be fine. If you want to raise armies of the undead, that might be more of a problem, since those spells are [Evil].
taylorj 04-25-07, 03:51 PM	(Azrien: "Hey, I wonder what happens if I touch the ominous black Ur-Flan obelisk?" GM: "You sense an immense magical force surging towards you. Make a Reflex save to jump away in time." Azrien: "No way! I like magic!" - and that's why Azrien now flinches away from Radiant Servants...) That could almost be a thread unto itself. "Funny times a PC has turned down a chance to make a saving throw..."
astromist 04-25-07, 04:13 PM	What Redfist said. I play a Chaotic Good sorcerer who's been developing an awfully necromantic emphasis recently - in-character, it's primarily due to her habit of playing with ancient evil artifacts. (Azrien: "Hey, I wonder what happens if I touch the ominous black Ur-Flan obelisk?" GM: "You sense an immense magical force surging towards you. Make a Reflex save to jump away in time." Azrien: "No way! I like magic!" - and that's why Azrien now flinches away from Radiant Servants...) She can cast Spiritwall, (Split Ray) Enervation, (Empowered) False Life, and (Split Ray Empowered) Ray of Enfeeblement - nothing with the [Evil] descriptor, note, she's just very good at manipulating negative energy. She's never had any trouble with GMs, or with other good-aligned PCs for that matter. She had an amusing conversation with a cleric of Pholtus recently where the cleric ended up praising her for a plan that involved energy-draining people to death and then disintegrating the bodies ;) Stick to the nasty necromancy debuffs and you should be fine. If you want to raise armies of the undead, that might be more of a problem, since those spells are [Evil]. LOL, that is interesting. I know not to animate undead, even in [edit]an evil campaign that I was in,(not lg) I never did. We had a cleric that could do a much better job. Amazingly that campaign lasted to 16th level without us killing each other.
DerekSTheRed 04-27-07, 08:09 PM	It depends on where you play. Here in the BK necromancy is almost encouraged since it provides a cheap source of labor. Oh and Necromancers have their own Meta-Org. Derek
cheeky_ktty 04-28-07, 02:54 AM	Is rebuking undead evil? My brother did that with one of his characters recently, and I'm not entirely sure he can.
_metz_ 04-28-07, 03:02 AM	1. You can only rebuke undead if you channel negative energy. (Must be a neutral cleric non good) - THis means thier cleric cannot spontaneoulsy cast heal. If theri character casts cures spontaneously, or has in the past, then they cannot rebuke. 2. If you do rebuke the undead and take control of them, and command undead minions, that would surely have to be logged as an evil act. You are controlling undead. 3. From the SRD: Neutral Clerics and Undead A cleric of neutral alignment can either turn undead but not rebuke them, or rebuke undead but not turn them. See Turn or Rebuke Undead for more information. Even if a cleric is neutral, channeling positive energy is a good act and channeling negative energy is evil. - There is your 'evil' statement. Finally, As a DM I would not say channelling inflict spells instead of cure's is evil, but the act of rebuking would be. There may be table variation on that one.
cheeky_ktty 04-28-07, 03:14 AM	I thought that was the case Metz, but I heard from a different person that it was OK to do. My brother will not be happy when I ruin his fun :devil: My weekend just got more enjoyable :D
_metz_ 04-28-07, 04:48 AM	Which Brother? I assume the older cos he would be the one to try something even remotely morally dubious...
pedr 04-28-07, 06:00 AM	It is 'OK' as in permitted by the campaign. Your DM cannot say 'You can't do that in LG'. It is 'Evil', which means that your DM has to remind you that it is evil before you do it, and can report the character to the triad if he thinks it is substantially evil, or if it is done often enough to make it worth noting. Evil acts are not prohibited, but acts which are substantial enough (in quantity or quality) to lead to the triad and circle concluding that the character itself is evil will get that character removed from the game.
Vamroc 04-28-07, 01:59 PM	An evil act that helps out the party and is used thwart a greater evil will be over looked by a DM nearly every time. Its when you harm commoners that evil acts become a problem. So you should only use evil spells when fighting evil and when no commoners are around.
mindreavertp 04-29-07, 07:37 AM	Just ask the judge up front if casting certain spells (be specific) would in their official opinion be something that warrants actually entering an evil act on the AR. I've cast several 'evil' spell descriptors and not had judges have a problem with it. Depends on the how you view alignment. Does a single evil act (or spell) an evil person make? Or is it repeated castings of 'evil' descriptor spells that begin to shift a person's alignment? Just ask....bottom line. If they tell you casting animate dead isnt an evil act warranting noting it on the AR and then at the end of the mod proceed to do that, appeal. As long as you didnt do anything 'too gross' with it....it will likely get overturned. But yes, it's possible to play a necromancer and not be 'evil'....I play a gray elf necromancer who is definitely 'naughty'. I have a pair of horses and cart around a wagon full of decaying cow corpses that I'm studying....that's typically how I introduce my pc to the other players. I usually then start conversations with those that look 'goody goody' like to find out their philosophical opinions about undead and the finer arts of necromancy. Based on that I know how to act or conceal my actions so the goody goodies can keep doing what they do, and I can do my thing. (so as not to cause party and table strife....I prep my spell list accordingly)
Puggle Halfwine 04-29-07, 07:43 AM	As someone who play(ed) a cleric who channeled negative energy, who regularly controlled undead and was eventually removed from the campaign for doing too much evil, I feel your brother's pain Cheeky. :)
pedr 04-29-07, 11:45 AM	Puggle could you talk us through the process you faced? Many of us have no experience whatsoever with the results of evil acts being reported to triads and it would be illustrative to hear, if it isn't too sore a subject, how it all happened with your character. Particular questions I have: Did you expect it to happen? How much warning did your triad give you? Were you given an opportunity to change your character's behaviour?
copper_wyrmling 04-29-07, 03:11 PM	Puggle's character is not a good example. He was removed from the campaign for a one-off evil act, not a pattern of behaviour - he regularly commanded undead slaves and cast Death Knell on prisoners, but as far as I know, that didn't cause him any particular problems (although my sorcerer believed he was an agent of Iuz and refused to either cast beneficial spells on him or accept spellcasting from him). The act that got him removed was very obviously evil with a capital E, and I'm pretty sure Puggle knew exactly what the consequences would be :P ("Will you destroy the ancient evil artifact that was made to control the minds of everyone in Perrenland, or will you try to take its power for yourself?" "MINE!")
opa 04-29-07, 07:16 PM	In Bissel, you would have CONSIDERABLE difficulty being a necromancer...
cheeky_ktty 04-29-07, 11:43 PM	As someone who play(ed) a cleric who channeled negative energy, who regularly controlled undead and was eventually removed from the campaign for doing too much evil, I feel your brother's pain Cheeky. :) I was relatively nice in my heartbreaking news-(he buys me lunch, I love a free lunch :D). I'm sure he will eventually get over it. He is quite use to his random, and some times cool, ideas not working. -Metz I'm not going to mention names on the forums for privacy reasons, but it was the older one. -And thanks for your replies guys, I'm still learning alot.
AtmaWeapon 04-30-07, 01:36 AM	My Bright Sands character is a halfling necromancer, with fearsome necromancy and all. You can easily avoid problems by simply not casting spells with the evil descriptor.
Hariman 05-01-07, 01:46 AM	In Bissel, you would have CONSIDERABLE difficulty being a necromancer... Keoland too. Keoland has an entire set of rules and punishments for casting necromancy spells. You can cast necromancy/forbidden spells in keoland, just not in front of any witnesses who can recognize spells.
gomeztoo 05-01-07, 04:07 AM	I've played one necromancer (a dwarf) but he died horribly at the hands of a a mummy (and was abandoned by the party, probably thought he'd come back as an undead) before he could get into trouble. Had he not died, he might have gotten himself into trouble eventually by using the bad type of magic, but I was willing to take that risk.
Lupo 05-01-07, 01:10 PM	In Bissel, you would have CONSIDERABLE difficulty being a necromancer... i am not entirely sure, at least NPC necromancer have no problem in innspa/ahlissa . . . . :rolleyes: PC necromancers might find the sometimes "free" available raw material components a nice boon ;) but when such a character leaves the safety of innspa, the folks of the adri might declare him "persona non grata" and use him for target practice :D ciao martin m.
Southernskies 05-02-07, 08:04 AM	This means thier cleric cannot spontaneoulsy cast heal. If theri character casts cures spontaneously, or has in the past, then they cannot rebuke. A cleric cannot spontaneously cast heal anyway. PHB pg32 The cleric can "lose" any prepared spell that is not a domain spell in order to cast any cure spell of the spall spell level or lower (a cure spell is any spell with "cure" in its name).
Madfox11 05-03-07, 03:47 AM	In short: necromancers are not necessarily evil, but using these spells in many regions is illegal. Even in liberal Sunndi you get executed if you cast animate dead or start commanding them to do your bidding - assuming there are witnesses and you get caught of course.
_metz_ 05-03-07, 06:18 AM	A cleric cannot spontaneously cast heal anyway. PHB pg32 That was a typo - was supposed to say "heals". Its pretty clear what I mean. Read the second line please, before getting on your high horse.
Will_DM_for_Pizza 05-17-07, 01:33 AM	Yeah if you don't want to play an evil necromancer Lawful Neuteral is the most popular way to go. In terms of evil spells, I don't think any magic is considered evil, there are those that do read as evil but I think that they're cleric spells for the most part.
Golorious 05-18-07, 06:47 PM	I play N Necromancer and he is now 11th level. Evil and good are limitations on rational thought. It is often about appropriate places to play a necromancer. Core modules in Greyhawk, Pomarj... not so bad. Furyondy, the shield lands.... maybe not a good idea. But there are a good number of non-evil necromancy spells, but some of the best are evil. I have cast many evil spells and I still do. I just try to make sure I use it now when it is necessary. I'm proud to say that this character's homeland is Dyvers. Where you can say yes I'm a Necromancer and I would be happy to do a favor for the Church of Nerull! Praise the Reaper! If I could I would worship Nerul and because a necromancer has nothing on the "A" Team as I call them for truly evil acts then I often feel like a good guy. Though I wouldn't mind seeing the gnarly forest burned down, and paved. The so called protectors of the forest keep getting ****** when I cast blight. Though there was this one time... in KET, that I lost it and started casting Wrack, Quickened wrack (raging spell card), crushing despair, rays of enfeeblement etc... (nothing lethal but not very nice) I'm an elf, and was "owned" by a Halfling barbarian. I wore a shirt that said in Elven I'm with Stupid, with and arrow pointing down and to the right. It was like the 3rd or 4th VTF module in a row that I was "property" and had just had enough. His favorite spell was wrack which is evil. Until the recent LG rules changes on evil acts it was a very common spell for him I would usually have 2 or 3 of them. But after I retrained away weapon finesse for spell school focus necromancy and picked up split ray I usually take 2 split ray enervations instead. I still take wrack but cast it slightly less often. Now I have come to the conclusion that if I am removed from play for casting evil spells on evil guys then that is life. There was a change in the way rules can be reported, I don't see that as a reason to revamp my entire character. If I make it to 15th level that will be fine. If I don't then life will go on.