Psionics in Living Greyhawk? [Archive] - Wizards Community

Psionics in Living Greyhawk? [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
beyowulf
12-09-04, 10:36 PM Is it possible to play a Psion in Living Greyhawk? I can see not having access to Psionic items except perhaps the ones you make yourself. But is rolling up a Psion or any other Psionic class out of the question?

I actually thought not, since its the 3.5 Psionics handbooks isn't listed in the Campaign Sourcebook, but something caught my eye. Under "Class Guidebook Spells" is the power listed 'Genesis'. Its a Psionic Shaper power. Its not a Cleric or Wizard spell, but a Psionic power. True it says it can't be used during normal gameplay and requires special dispensation, but the fact that its listed at all, raised an eyebrow.

Secondly, in the Keoland Campaign overview, its says that under the Joten mountains, there are Illithids, a psionic race.

So whats the story here?
kenobi65
12-09-04, 11:58 PM Is it possible to play a Psion in Living Greyhawk? I can see not having access to Psionic items except perhaps the ones you make yourself. But is rolling up a Psion or any other Psionic class out of the question?

I actually thought not, since its the 3.5 Psionics handbooks isn't listed in the Campaign Sourcebook, but something caught my eye. Under "Class Guidebook Spells" is the power listed 'Genesis'. Its a Psionic Shaper power. Its not a Cleric or Wizard spell, but a Psionic power. True it says it can't be used during normal gameplay and requires special dispensation, but the fact that its listed at all, raised an eyebrow.

Secondly, in the Keoland Campaign overview, its says that under the Joten mountains, there are Illithids, a psionic race.

Nope, no psionic PCs in Living Greyhawk.

On what page are you finding "Genesis" listed? I can't find it anywhere in my copy. Even if it's in there, I sure wouldn't view it as a tacit allowance for psionics.

(Edit: Ah, found it, p. 47. It's undoubtedly referring to the older "Genesis" spell, which appeared in "Defenders of the Faith". Keep in mind that when this version of the Sourcebook was issued, the campaign was in the middle of a transition from "Defenders of the Faith" to "Complete Divine", and so the rules had to cover both.)

Illithids are psionic, but (a) they're not a PC race, and (b) they can be used just fine as monsters without use of the psionic rules beyond what's in their write-up in the Monster Manual.
SteveMND
12-10-04, 01:19 AM "Secondly, in the Keoland Campaign overview, its says that under the Joten mountains, there are Illithids, a psionic race."

In the classic tradition of TSR, WotC has continued to use the same terms to mean any number of things. :-) Illithids are indeed psionic, but if you look at their write-up in the MM, you'll see that the "psionics" they talk about there are simply mental spell-like abilities, and not actual "Psionics Handbook-type" psionics.

Psionics (in the sense you are asking about) are not used in the Living Greyhawk campaign.
oroborous
12-10-04, 02:48 AM If you want to play a psion in an RPGA campaign, you'll have to check out the Eberron game "Mark of Heroes". The Kalishtar Race ( I think that's their name anyway :confused: )are psionic, but you will need a campaign card in order to play that race.
beyowulf
12-10-04, 07:41 AM Okay rhanks,
WCrawford
12-10-04, 06:44 PM If you want to play a psion in an RPGA campaign, you'll have to check out the Eberron game "Mark of Heroes". The Kalishtar Race ( I think that's their name anyway :confused: )are psionic, but you will need a campaign card in order to play that race.

Or you could play Living Arcanis. Vals (a variant human) may be psionic.
beyowulf
12-11-04, 11:56 PM Thanks. But all my friends are playing Living Greyhawk, so I am probably not going to be playing much else. Anyway, I am not going to make an issue of it.
Emirikol
12-18-04, 12:36 PM Our living greyhawk group recently decided that we're going to play half-time EBERRON: MARK OF HEROES and half-time LG. It's not always easy to figure out what people have and haven't played.

What I 'like about Eberron is:
1. There will be a continuous plot
2. You can make your own adventures (DM's mark) or adapt ones from DUNGEON or the published adventures to be DM's mark adventures
3. You have Psions, Wilders, Psychic Warriors, and Mindblades (or whatever they're called).
4. It's a new world (afterall) with lots of support (Greyhawk is dead)

Anyway's, I've always been a Greyhawker at heart, but it's time to keep my options open :)

jh

..
Greyson
12-20-04, 11:29 PM What I 'like about Eberron is:
1. There will be a continuous plot
2. You can make your own adventures (DM's mark) or adapt ones from DUNGEON or the published adventures to be DM's mark adventures
3. You have Psions, Wilders, Psychic Warriors, and Mindblades (or whatever they're called).
4. It's a new world (afterall) with lots of support (Greyhawk is dead). These are exactly the reasons I like Eberron. While I don't think Greyhawk is dead, it sure can broaden its appeal if the Circle relents and allows psionics. One of our local triad members told me that "psionic PCs are not allowed in Living Greyhawk because its against Greyhawk flavor."

Right.

As long as Eberron and Mark of Heroes fills the psionics niche, I guess a lot of pressure is off of Living Greyhawk to accommodate that particular element of the game.

Happy gaming, wherever your PCs end up searching for adventure.
beyowulf
12-21-04, 12:57 AM These are exactly the reasons I like Eberron. While I don't think Greyhawk is dead, it sure can broaden its appeal if the Circle relents and allows psionics. One of our local triad members told me that "psionic PCs are not allowed in Living Greyhawk because its against Greyhawk flavor."

Speaking of that, but wasn't at least 1st Edition Psionics part of Greyhawk? Or possibly Mystara, as I am just guessing here.
SteveMND
12-21-04, 05:30 AM "Speaking of that, but wasn't at least 1st Edition Psionics part of Greyhawk?"

Yes, but even then, it was implied to be so rare as to not even be worth adding in a campaign of this size -- maybe ten or twenty people out of the whole 20,000 LG players would be 'psychic' in that sense, and it's hardly worth adding an entirely new rulesset onto the game for just that.

And even then, the 'earlier' brew of psionics was so different in flavor and application from the 3.0 version that just because they have the same name doesn't mean they can't be done better with some other aspect of the rules now.
qstor
12-21-04, 09:54 AM If you're REALLY set on psionics, I'd try introducing your friends to Living Arcanis. My two cents...

Mike
Mixmaster15
12-22-04, 06:39 PM or Living Kindoms of Kalamar (Psion & Psychic Warriors are PC's)
Greyson
12-22-04, 11:15 PM ... in a campaign of this size ... 20,000 LG players ... Now that's a lot of potential sales of the Expanded Psionics Handbook. In this business, we have seen that the need to drive sales eventually trumps "flavor" and intended "theme." I imagine that with the potential to sell books to those 20,000 LG players and judges, that there will eventually be a sudden burgeoning of psychics in Living Greyhawk. We got the builder books. We got the Complete books. We'll get psionics. LG will probably even get warforged, if Forgotten Realms doesn't siphon them off first, lol.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
beyowulf 12-09-04, 10:36 PM	Is it possible to play a Psion in Living Greyhawk? I can see not having access to Psionic items except perhaps the ones you make yourself. But is rolling up a Psion or any other Psionic class out of the question? I actually thought not, since its the 3.5 Psionics handbooks isn't listed in the Campaign Sourcebook, but something caught my eye. Under "Class Guidebook Spells" is the power listed 'Genesis'. Its a Psionic Shaper power. Its not a Cleric or Wizard spell, but a Psionic power. True it says it can't be used during normal gameplay and requires special dispensation, but the fact that its listed at all, raised an eyebrow. Secondly, in the Keoland Campaign overview, its says that under the Joten mountains, there are Illithids, a psionic race. So whats the story here?
kenobi65 12-09-04, 11:58 PM	Is it possible to play a Psion in Living Greyhawk? I can see not having access to Psionic items except perhaps the ones you make yourself. But is rolling up a Psion or any other Psionic class out of the question? I actually thought not, since its the 3.5 Psionics handbooks isn't listed in the Campaign Sourcebook, but something caught my eye. Under "Class Guidebook Spells" is the power listed 'Genesis'. Its a Psionic Shaper power. Its not a Cleric or Wizard spell, but a Psionic power. True it says it can't be used during normal gameplay and requires special dispensation, but the fact that its listed at all, raised an eyebrow. Secondly, in the Keoland Campaign overview, its says that under the Joten mountains, there are Illithids, a psionic race. Nope, no psionic PCs in Living Greyhawk. On what page are you finding "Genesis" listed? I can't find it anywhere in my copy. Even if it's in there, I sure wouldn't view it as a tacit allowance for psionics. (Edit: Ah, found it, p. 47. It's undoubtedly referring to the older "Genesis" spell, which appeared in "Defenders of the Faith". Keep in mind that when this version of the Sourcebook was issued, the campaign was in the middle of a transition from "Defenders of the Faith" to "Complete Divine", and so the rules had to cover both.) Illithids are psionic, but (a) they're not a PC race, and (b) they can be used just fine as monsters without use of the psionic rules beyond what's in their write-up in the Monster Manual.
SteveMND 12-10-04, 01:19 AM	"Secondly, in the Keoland Campaign overview, its says that under the Joten mountains, there are Illithids, a psionic race." In the classic tradition of TSR, WotC has continued to use the same terms to mean any number of things. :-) Illithids are indeed psionic, but if you look at their write-up in the MM, you'll see that the "psionics" they talk about there are simply mental spell-like abilities, and not actual "Psionics Handbook-type" psionics. Psionics (in the sense you are asking about) are not used in the Living Greyhawk campaign.
oroborous 12-10-04, 02:48 AM	If you want to play a psion in an RPGA campaign, you'll have to check out the Eberron game "Mark of Heroes". The Kalishtar Race ( I think that's their name anyway :confused: )are psionic, but you will need a campaign card in order to play that race.
beyowulf 12-10-04, 07:41 AM	Okay rhanks,
WCrawford 12-10-04, 06:44 PM	If you want to play a psion in an RPGA campaign, you'll have to check out the Eberron game "Mark of Heroes". The Kalishtar Race ( I think that's their name anyway :confused: )are psionic, but you will need a campaign card in order to play that race. Or you could play Living Arcanis. Vals (a variant human) may be psionic.
beyowulf 12-11-04, 11:56 PM	Thanks. But all my friends are playing Living Greyhawk, so I am probably not going to be playing much else. Anyway, I am not going to make an issue of it.
Emirikol 12-18-04, 12:36 PM	Our living greyhawk group recently decided that we're going to play half-time EBERRON: MARK OF HEROES and half-time LG. It's not always easy to figure out what people have and haven't played. What I 'like about Eberron is: 1. There will be a continuous plot 2. You can make your own adventures (DM's mark) or adapt ones from DUNGEON or the published adventures to be DM's mark adventures 3. You have Psions, Wilders, Psychic Warriors, and Mindblades (or whatever they're called). 4. It's a new world (afterall) with lots of support (Greyhawk is dead) Anyway's, I've always been a Greyhawker at heart, but it's time to keep my options open :) jh ..
Greyson 12-20-04, 11:29 PM	What I 'like about Eberron is: 1. There will be a continuous plot 2. You can make your own adventures (DM's mark) or adapt ones from DUNGEON or the published adventures to be DM's mark adventures 3. You have Psions, Wilders, Psychic Warriors, and Mindblades (or whatever they're called). 4. It's a new world (afterall) with lots of support (Greyhawk is dead). These are exactly the reasons I like Eberron. While I don't think Greyhawk is dead, it sure can broaden its appeal if the Circle relents and allows psionics. One of our local triad members told me that "psionic PCs are not allowed in Living Greyhawk because its against Greyhawk flavor." Right. As long as Eberron and Mark of Heroes fills the psionics niche, I guess a lot of pressure is off of Living Greyhawk to accommodate that particular element of the game. Happy gaming, wherever your PCs end up searching for adventure.
beyowulf 12-21-04, 12:57 AM	These are exactly the reasons I like Eberron. While I don't think Greyhawk is dead, it sure can broaden its appeal if the Circle relents and allows psionics. One of our local triad members told me that "psionic PCs are not allowed in Living Greyhawk because its against Greyhawk flavor." Speaking of that, but wasn't at least 1st Edition Psionics part of Greyhawk? Or possibly Mystara, as I am just guessing here.
SteveMND 12-21-04, 05:30 AM	"Speaking of that, but wasn't at least 1st Edition Psionics part of Greyhawk?" Yes, but even then, it was implied to be so rare as to not even be worth adding in a campaign of this size -- maybe ten or twenty people out of the whole 20,000 LG players would be 'psychic' in that sense, and it's hardly worth adding an entirely new rulesset onto the game for just that. And even then, the 'earlier' brew of psionics was so different in flavor and application from the 3.0 version that just because they have the same name doesn't mean they can't be done better with some other aspect of the rules now.
qstor 12-21-04, 09:54 AM	If you're REALLY set on psionics, I'd try introducing your friends to Living Arcanis. My two cents... Mike
Mixmaster15 12-22-04, 06:39 PM	or Living Kindoms of Kalamar (Psion & Psychic Warriors are PC's)
Greyson 12-22-04, 11:15 PM	... in a campaign of this size ... 20,000 LG players ... Now that's a lot of potential sales of the Expanded Psionics Handbook. In this business, we have seen that the need to drive sales eventually trumps "flavor" and intended "theme." I imagine that with the potential to sell books to those 20,000 LG players and judges, that there will eventually be a sudden burgeoning of psychics in Living Greyhawk. We got the builder books. We got the Complete books. We'll get psionics. LG will probably even get warforged, if Forgotten Realms doesn't siphon them off first, lol.