Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Wraith235 06-17-07, 11:41 AM	just ran through a Mod ... was generally Written Badly from the Way our DM Was telling us .... (things Bolded that wernt supposed to be ... as well as the oppisite)... and afterwords Looking at the AR I Think I agree with him we have 3 Items (adventure access all of them) Which are listed "CV" now with enuf Time I could probably make the determination ... but its Fathers day and Im being lazy
smerwin29 06-17-07, 11:42 AM	CV is Complete Adventurer, because CA is Complete Arcane. Shawn
_metz_ 06-17-07, 11:43 AM	Complete Adventurer. AFAIK And DMs shouldn't be saying modules are badly written during a game. Its one of the big no nos in RPGA. Most of the time in my experience its more the case of the DM being under prepared and 'reading' the module instead of adequately prepping it.
Wraith235 06-17-07, 11:45 AM	well when the DM Says he "Needs to bring a highlighter to the game because Text is Bold that shouldnt be and Not bold that should be" ya ... I think he ment more "Badly edited" or the final printing was rushed ... ect ect
Howie23 06-17-07, 12:46 PM	well when the DM Says he "Needs to bring a highlighter to the game because Text is Bold that shouldnt be and Not bold that should be" ya ... I think he ment more "Badly edited" or the final printing was rushed ... ect ect Could be. Or, it could be that he printed it with an old version of Acrobat. The one time that I've been aware of a problem like you refer to, it was a technology issue at the DM's end. Not a definitive answer, of course. David
Timlagor 06-17-07, 01:42 PM	You might suggest that he use the highlighter before the game ;)
Britt 06-17-07, 03:36 PM	CV was used for a while as the abbreviation for Complete Adventurer, but the proper abbreviation is CAd. You can go to any of the consolidated lists on WotC's site and scroll to the very bottom for a complete list of official abbreviations. There was an issue with a couple of Core modules a few months back where the formatting between Creighton and HQ got messed up somehow. It was fixed, but an old copy of the mod would still be messed up.
Wraith235 06-17-07, 03:46 PM	do we need to somehow aquire new ARs or are the ones we have at the moment acceptable this was a Late Cor6 Module
Britt 06-17-07, 03:53 PM	I can't see the ARs, so I have no idea :) If they are messed up, try to get a new copy.
Wraith235 06-17-07, 03:54 PM	its just they are Listed as CV instead of CAd
Britt 06-17-07, 04:00 PM	Same book, just a different abbreviation for it. CV has not be used to refer to any book other than Complete Adventurer. That's an insignificant difference and the AR will not have been updated to change that.
Vamroc 06-18-07, 11:42 AM	Complete Adventurer. AFAIK And DMs shouldn't be saying modules are badly written during a game. Its one of the big no nos in RPGA. Most of the time in my experience its more the case of the DM being under prepared and 'reading' the module instead of adequately prepping it. Uhhh no a badly written mod can cause a TPK !! If a DM wants to gripe about a mod he is well within his rights to do so. You tell me if it's ok to write an APL6 mod with a vampire that has 8 levels of wizard. Lop sided APL mods are never fun for the PC and even less fun for the DM. Becuase as hard as it is to believe most DMs don't like TPKs especially if it happens early in a mod. Then there are those mods that have botched boxed text or monster stat omissions. I have a problem with mods that seem to be spell checked by first graders.
gomeztoo 06-18-07, 11:52 AM	Could be. Or, it could be that he printed it with an old version of Acrobat. I recall a TSS metaregional (The Medegian Job) that was created without embedded fonts. Messed up severely when you printed it - boxed text was near illegible. Nothing wrong with the mod or the editing though (afaik anyway, I had fun). Gomez
smerwin29 06-18-07, 12:17 PM	Uhhh no a badly written mod can cause a TPK !! If a DM wants to gripe about a mod he is well within his rights to do so. That's not the point. The DM certainly has a right to gripe about an adventure, but it is preferably after the adventure is over. When I sit down at a table to play, the last thing I want to hear is a judge saying is how good/bad/hard/easy the adventure is. I want him to run the adventure the best he can so I can enjoy it. After it is done, and he has done the best he can to make it enjoyable, I'd love to hear his opinion. It would be like going to a play and having the director come out before the curtain opens and say, "I just wanted to let you all know this play really sucks, and the playwrite is a moron, but we'll do our best." If there are problems with the adventure, hopefully the DM contacts the Triad or the Circle before running it, rather than just inflicting it on the players and then making everyone miserable.
Britt 06-18-07, 02:21 PM	Shawn is right, and it's even in the LGCS now: "As the GM, try to avoid extraneous commentary and never complain about the adventure to the players, as that decreases the likelihood of the players enjoying the adventure."
Mocoso 06-18-07, 03:17 PM	Shawn is right, and it's even in the LGCS now: "As the GM, try to avoid extraneous commentary and never complain about the adventure to the players, as that decreases the likelihood of the players enjoying the adventure." Who you should complain to when it is badly written or poorly thought bad and has no story or something is worng (like vampire/wizard)? otherwise the party gets mad at you. so tell them when it's written wrong. Period. some modules have ten or twenty minutes of box text thatt means nothing. why waste time with that?
Howie23 06-18-07, 03:20 PM	I recall a TSS metaregional (The Medegian Job) that was created without embedded fonts. Messed up severely when you printed it - boxed text was near illegible. Nothing wrong with the mod or the editing though (afaik anyway, I had fun). Gomez Ok, sounds like there are a few example of production errors. My general take about DMs complaining about a mod during the game is that it says more about the DM than then mod though. :) David
Britt 06-18-07, 03:28 PM	Who you should complain to when it is badly written or poorly thought bad and has no story or something is worng (like vampire/wizard)? otherwise the party gets mad at you. so tell them when it's written wrong. Period. some modules have ten or twenty minutes of box text thatt means nothing. why waste time with that? You should email the author, triad, and/or Circle member BEFORE the adventure, when you're supposed to be prepping the adventure. You should NEVER complain about the adventure during the adventure. This accomplishes absolutely nothing except making the players less likely to appreciate the adventure and making the GM feel like he successfully passed the buck, neither of which is a valid justification. You can complain all you want after the adventure, but doing so during the adventure is a disservice to the players, author, campaign, and all the volunteers that work on the campaign.
Mocoso 06-18-07, 03:50 PM	You should email the author, triad, and/or Circle member BEFORE the adventure, when you're supposed to be prepping the adventure. You should NEVER complain about the adventure during the adventure. This accomplishes absolutely nothing except making the players less likely to appreciate the adventure and making the GM feel like he successfully passed the buck, neither of which is a valid justification. You can complain all you want after the adventure, but doing so during the adventure is a disservice to the players, author, campaign, and all the volunteers that work on the campaign. Author is Triad in my region, and doesn't answer e-mail and none form Circle either, after I e-mail them twice. So monster is <<<<SPOILER REMOVED>>>>> so how can i not say to the party good luck, you will need it because this mod is to kill all players?
Britt 06-18-07, 03:57 PM	You need to edit that spoiler out of your response. Based on what you listed, it is obviously intended not to be fought, as there is no way any author, Triad, or Circle would consider that even close to an appropriate challenge. You can also post on your regional discussion list and ask for people that have GMed adventure X to contact you, as you have a problem and have not gotten a response from the Triad. That will likely get you responses from both the Triad and other GMs.
Mocoso 06-18-07, 04:42 PM	i'm not allowed on regional list, but it specificlly says "he will go all out to kill party members, especially ones who have" a enemity for him. i have tpk two tables with this guy, one was apl 5 maybe and weak but other was apl 8 and still no chance.
pedr 06-18-07, 04:57 PM	How can you be 'not allowed' on your regional list?
Britt 06-18-07, 04:59 PM	How are you not allowed on the regional list? And does "go out" mean that the PCs do not necessarily end up there, so it might be a fault of a decision the PCs make? Have you tried finding the author's email and contacting them?
_metz_ 06-18-07, 06:45 PM	I came to respond about talking about Modules whilst GMing - fortunately Britt has weighed in! yay LGCS precedent! As I said, it shouldn't be done DURING a module, its giving yourself an excuse to kill someone, whinging about something you yourself may have missed, and who knows. Maybe it isn't the writer's fault, maybe the party thought of something completely outlandish. It is better to talk to the author, or double check your prepping. Talking a module down in game will mean some people will not take it seriously, and some of the players who are there to have fun will lose out.
Mattastrophic 06-18-07, 07:01 PM	Agreed. Complaining about the mod is starting to become a personal peeve. I mean, I came to the gameday to enjoy LG, not listen to the GM's whining about it. There's one particular GM I've begun to avoid like a plague because of his constant complaining. That and how he'll gip us on rewards if we manage to succeed where he failed while playing the mod. Grr... But anyways, complaining about the mod = bad. This goes for players AND GMs, by the way. I've also developed the opinion that a good GM can take the worst of modules and make them fun. So GMs, if you come across a bad module, use your creativity! Make it fun! -Matt
Tellack 06-19-07, 01:02 AM	I've seen some tough fights in modules. As far as "tough fights" go, it is usually party composition or "not being prepared" that will TPK. For example, if fighting a creature with a strong melee attack, DR10/cold iron, and lots of HP, it's going to be tough for PCs who are in melee with low AC and others who simply do not have Cold Iron damage by switching out weapons. Sure, some rolls are going to not be in the favor of the PCs sometimes, but you should be able to trust the authors/playtesters/etc that the adventure is a *challenge*, but is "beatable", by the PCs. What fun is an adventure that the PCs can steamroll over and "defeat" in 1.5 hours? One game I played in had the party literally sitting and discussing an answer to a single riddle for 2 hours in real time (maybe more). Riddles can sometimes be harder than Vampire/wizards :P, but they are so easy when you get the answer. A different game I GM'd had the party sitting at 5 different riddles for about 2 hours in real time, only to give an incorrect answer and get attacked by a "guardian". As far as players go, it is a generally good idea to purchase weapons of Different types (as)Cold Iron (as)Alch. Silver A simple 200 gold can save you 5000, if you know what I mean...... As far as "DM griping" goes, it was addressed here and in several other threads. If you don't understand what is written even after you've prepared the mod simply take a short pause, collect your thoughts, and resume. Surely, sometimes PCs can do something completely different than what the mod intends or gives consequences for. Sometimes PCs go out of order. A common problem though that can arise is technology,as was mentioned. A DM can read the module on Adobe Reader and then print it out, finding a break in the page somewhere or faded text. The modules are guidelines, so what you see fit. It's not a big deal if a NPC says a word you can't pronounce and you alter the diolague. As far as running a mod cold (such as Midnight Madness), things can get iffy. Stay creative, have fun :) .... And yes, CV is Complete Adventurer, as is CAd.
LGMoses 06-19-07, 01:21 AM	That is the book Complete Villain slated for release later this year. This is the first "Complete" book that is meant solely for DM's so that they can tailor fit villains for your campaign. Complete Villain comes out in November. I'm really looking forward to seeing it on shelves :D
kenobi65 06-19-07, 10:24 AM	That is the book Complete Villain slated for release later this year. Assuming you're not being facetious...I kinda doubt he's got AR access for an item from a book that won't even be out for 5 months. CV was the initial abbreviation for Complete Adventurer.
Mocoso 06-19-07, 11:02 AM	How are you not allowed on the regional list? And does "go out" mean that the PCs do not necessarily end up there, so it might be a fault of a decision the PCs make? Have you tried finding the author's email and contacting them? the author is a triad who banned me from the regional list so I post here.
LGMoses 06-19-07, 12:27 PM	Assuming you're not being facetious...I kinda doubt he's got AR access for an item from a book that won't even be out for 5 months. CV was the initial abbreviation for Complete Adventurer. I was but you have to admit its a good idea :D I'd buy Complete Villain, wouldn't you? Get on it Wizards, but I want some credit. ;)
gomeztoo 06-22-07, 03:08 AM	We're still waiting for Complete Riding Dog.
Howie23 06-22-07, 10:41 AM	We're still waiting for Complete Riding Dog. You mean CRuD? David
LGMoses 06-25-07, 12:44 AM	I'd like to make a dnd villain that is a clone of Ming the Merciless from the Flash Gordon movie. Love his theme music. I think I'll put theme music to all my npc's now. :thinks:
clannagh 06-25-07, 03:35 AM	We're still waiting for Complete Riding Dog. Thats a wee bit too specialised. Expect to see "Complete Hound" by Q3 2008 though.
paigeoliver 06-25-07, 11:46 PM	Actually I have already started writing a Riding Dog book as a 3rd party sourcebook. It isn't the first thing on my list, but should be done by Christmas. :D Also, not kidding. Thats a wee bit too specialised. Expect to see "Complete Hound" by Q3 2008 though.