Post/Author/DateTime	Post
soonerpat 08-23-07, 01:55 PM	Hi Chris (or anyone else with good info) Can you tell us yet what the final decision is on TU's? I organized a local group of 15 or so players last spring and they're all out of TU's and low APL adventures... Some of them are interested in the whole thing enough to head to a couple of Con's this fall.. But mostly they are wondering if we can play this fall... In addition to this group at Oklahoma Christian, there's an RPG group at OU which is in much the same boat... they just started last fall/spring and players who are about out of TU's... I know you guys are working hard, and I *very* much appreciate that you're considering dropping TU limits in '07 and '08! I'm just anxious because there are lots of people trying to plan schedules and with college starting this week or next, being able to put up a schedule soon means getting commitment to play.. If we wait much longer students will commit to other activities... So... Any word on the final decision, or can you give us an estimate of when we could expect it so we can plan accordingly? Info on '07 obviously has the greater urgency, but '08 is great for planning purposes. Thank you very much, Pat Smith
mregecko 08-23-07, 02:46 PM	I think the Circle has been busy trying to cope with the 4e announcement and the laying to rest of LG... The Dispel Confusion for Greyhawk Ruins hasn't even come out yet, and that was expect on Aug 14th (unless I just missed it somehow). I'm sure they will get to it eventually, but I imagine they are kinda pressed for time presently. -- Gecko
soonerpat 08-23-07, 04:37 PM	With all that's happened, I'm sure they are buried... I was hoping that this particular issue would be a short blurb that could be put out quickly to enable some planning... I'm trying to find a way, in my clumsy way, to politely and humbly ask if it's possible to get an answer soon... I strongly want to be respectful of the circle and Chris' pressures and recognize that they've got more than this issue on their plate. Soonerpat /*goes back to work... rerolls his patience check... sweet! 18 this time! :D */
WotC_Tulach 08-23-07, 10:08 PM	An article regarding the TU decision is forthcoming. It should appear on the web next week. If you read it, make sure you disseminate it to players that don't often come to the boards so the word gets out.
_metz_ 08-23-07, 10:09 PM	With all that's happened, I'm sure they are buried... I was hoping that this particular issue would be a short blurb that could be put out quickly to enable some planning... I'm trying to find a way, in my clumsy way, to politely and humbly ask if it's possible to get an answer soon... I strongly want to be respectful of the circle and Chris' pressures and recognize that they've got more than this issue on their plate. Soonerpat /*goes back to work... rerolls his patience check... sweet! 18 this time! :D */ Yeah I agree, if its any sort of incentive, I'll go out and buy Red Hand of Doom immediately if the TU restrictions are removed ;)
soonerpat 08-23-07, 10:19 PM	Thanks Chris! Pat
Arvagor 08-24-07, 10:03 AM	An article regarding the TU decision is forthcoming. It should appear on the web next week. If you read it, make sure you disseminate it to players that don't often come to the boards so the word gets out.Chris -- an issue that was raised elsewhere... What will upkeep costs be for the remaining mods if TUs go away? Several people have pointed out that 12gp x 0 TUs = 0gp for upkeep. It might be advisable to include a note that your upkeep costs are whatever you would otherwise have had to pay if the mods still had a TU cost -- otherwise, you know people will cheese it, and say they're taking luxury upkeep for free because there's no cost associated with -- leaving DMs with another headache... ;)
Madfox11 08-24-07, 11:41 AM	We already thought of that... ;) Pieter Sleijpen RPGA LG Circle Member The Splintered Suns
Swiftbrook 08-24-07, 12:39 PM	Chris -- an issue that was raised elsewhere... What will upkeep costs be for the remaining mods if TUs go away? Several people have pointed out that 12gp x 0 TUs = 0gp for upkeep. It might be advisable to include a note that your upkeep costs are whatever you would otherwise have had to pay if the mods still had a TU cost -- otherwise, you know people will cheese it, and say they're taking luxury upkeep for free because there's no cost associated with -- leaving DMs with another headache... ;) Make sure it still works the other way for those of us who haven't payed upkeep in years. My 10th level ranger has paid 0 gp in upkeeep since like 3rd level. -Swiftbrook
Komi 08-24-07, 12:49 PM	Chris -- an issue that was raised elsewhere... What will upkeep costs be for the remaining mods if TUs go away? Several people have pointed out that 12gp x 0 TUs = 0gp for upkeep. It might be advisable to include a note that your upkeep costs are whatever you would otherwise have had to pay if the mods still had a TU cost -- otherwise, you know people will cheese it, and say they're taking luxury upkeep for free because there's no cost associated with -- leaving DMs with another headache... ;) An easy fix. Eliminate the TU limit rather than the TU cost. This way TU's are still tracked, but people can still play all they want.
dragon2007 08-24-07, 05:23 PM	An article regarding the TU decision is forthcoming. It should appear on the web next week. If you read it, make sure you disseminate it to players that don't often come to the boards so the word gets out. Chris (and Circle reps too), Could we also have an update on: 1) How many Core modules will be released next year? 2) Will the remaining three parts of 'Greyhawk Ruins' still be released? 3) Will the adaptation of 'Expedition to the Ruins of Greyhawk' still be released? Thanks! Dan
TimRat 08-24-07, 10:51 PM	For the greyhawk ruins stuff all that is intended to come out as if the campaign wasn't going away.
Wraith235 08-25-07, 06:36 AM	will the rumors about possible PrC Access removal be addressed as well ?
_metz_ 08-25-07, 06:56 AM	will the rumors about possible PrC Access removal be addressed as well ? I doubt that, and personally am ok with it not being removed. Its about seeing off the campaign, not getting the uber optimised character you always wanted.
DerekSTheRed 08-25-07, 11:04 AM	An easy fix. Eliminate the TU limit rather than the TU cost. This way TU's are still tracked, but people can still play all they want. This could lead to belligerent players taking advantage of this rule to assault say Greyhawk Watch members or intentionally get arrested. The penalty is 26 TUs but if you have an infinite amount then who cares. I would rather see mods cost zero TUs with a set upkeep cost then unlimited TUs for this reason. Derek
Marcia_S 08-25-07, 11:41 AM	This could lead to belligerent players taking advantage of this rule to assault say Greyhawk Watch members or intentionally get arrested. The penalty is 26 TUs but if you have an infinite amount then who cares. I would rather see mods cost zero TUs with a set upkeep cost then unlimited TUs for this reason. Derek Hmmmm, really good point. Yeah, I would say that only MOD TUs have 0 cost. Anything else, jail time, meta-orgs, crafting, performing, "getting lost", etc. all cost their regular number of TUs. If you get down to 0 or less TUs from those activities, you can't play any mods, at all, with that character until they reset. However, I DO have a couple of characters that for different reasons don't have to pay upkeep - one of them will even be kicked out of her druidic meta-org if she does - so the "set cost" for lifestyle could be a problem for some characters. It would have to be something like if you have a favor or the Survival skill that eliminates the need for paying lifestyle, you may use that, otherwise, you are assumed to be paying "standard" lifestyle for the TUs you would have spent. Marcia
Timlagor 08-25-07, 01:50 PM	IF you have players like that you have bigger worries than how many TUs they use up.
Wraith235 08-25-07, 02:53 PM	I doubt that, and personally am ok with it not being removed. Its about seeing off the campaign, not getting the uber optimised character you always wanted. well I have stated in other places I dont know optimazation well and the only reason this is a NONC is because I have to Meet one of them in order to do it ... (Blasted Shadowbanes)... and its more for Flavor than anything and personally ... I hope this doesnt go into effect till the start of next year .... I'll have the issue solved by then ... and I dont really want to play any of my other chars since the campaign is dying
DerekSTheRed 08-26-07, 01:06 PM	However, I DO have a couple of characters that for different reasons don't have to pay upkeep - one of them will even be kicked out of her druidic meta-org if she does - so the "set cost" for lifestyle could be a problem for some characters. It would have to be something like if you have a favor or the Survival skill that eliminates the need for paying lifestyle, you may use that, otherwise, you are assumed to be paying "standard" lifestyle for the TUs you would have spent. Marcia When I said set amount for lifestyle, I assumed that one of the costs would be zero. For the sake of ease, they should let everyone choose 0, 12, 50, or 100 for lifestyle and each cost gives a corresponding bonus/penalty to charisma checks like normal. By having set amounts, you don't have to worry about multiplying the lifestyle cost and the tus. You just pay the lifestyle cost for whatever lifestyle your character chooses. Derek
tuscaloosasteve 08-26-07, 01:55 PM	Thanks for all the work Chris. I'll be hitting the boards this week in anticipation. The Tuscaloosa team just ran two tables of Barrow... if they can get in RHOD due to TU restraints laxed for this year, they will actually get to experience high level LG :). If not they'll still get to play almost anything in 2008. I'm sure the Circle is going to come up with a good system to maximize play. -Steve
clannagh 08-27-07, 07:25 PM	I am adding a vote of support for 0 TU starting earlier rather than later. Adaptables this year have meant many people I know are out of TU on all their high levels (my four highest characters as of this weekend will be on negative one TU, negative 12 TU, 3 TU and 11 TU) When it was apparently a continuing campaign people were happy to spend the rest of 2007 using up expiring year 6 mods to gradually build up low level secondaries that would come into serious play in 2009, but that plan is now out the window.
Vamroc 08-28-07, 02:19 PM	This could lead to belligerent players taking advantage of this rule to assault say Greyhawk Watch members or intentionally get arrested. The penalty is 26 TUs but if you have an infinite amount then who cares. I would rather see mods cost zero TUs with a set upkeep cost then unlimited TUs for this reason. Derek You forget when you get arrested there is a hefty fine. Many times charactors are asked to leave and not return. As you have committed a crime and most people don't want criminals living in their city. Also who wants to get sold in to slavery that's worse than prison. Regardless of the TU cost those should be very good reasons not to commit criminal acts.
DerekSTheRed 08-28-07, 06:29 PM	You forget when you get arrested there is a hefty fine. Many times charactors are asked to leave and not return. As you have committed a crime and most people don't want criminals living in their city. Also who wants to get sold in to slavery that's worse than prison. Regardless of the TU cost those should be very good reasons not to commit criminal acts. At this point TUs are far more valuable then gold so now tus are the biggest deterrent to any unwanted activity. Also, an LG judge can't tell the pcs that there characters cannot ever enter Greyhawk (or any city for that matter) since the next judge may be someone completely different. Derek