Post/Author/DateTime	Post
morganwolf 05-11-07, 02:46 AM	Anyone know where one can get access to a whip-dagger thru a region or even belonging to a meta-org?
paigeoliver 05-11-07, 02:59 AM	The only whip dagger I have ever seen in Living Greyhawk belonged to a Bard from the Yeomanry, and I believe came from a retired yeomanry module.
Japangirl 05-11-07, 03:20 AM	I believe at least one BK metaorg allows access to a whip-dagger but I am unsure which one.
gomeztoo 05-11-07, 04:31 AM	I got access to one in a year 4 metaregional. Quite useful.
clik_ml 05-11-07, 08:29 AM	Whip daggers all function like 3.0 whips (i.e. ranged weapons) instead of 3.5 whips, right? I'm not aware of any whip dagger that has been presented in an available book that works like a 3.5 whip, so correct me if I'm wrong. This oddity is likely what keeps whip dagger access out of our hands. I was a little giddy during a regional special mod wherein access was granted to a masterwork longsword that as a swift action could be turned into a whip dagger (much like the BBEG's weapon in Brotherhood of the Wolf, I imagine), but that access was revoked sadly, probably due to the 3.0/3.5 issue on whip daggers.
DerekSTheRed 05-11-07, 08:52 AM	I believe at least one BK metaorg allows access to a whip-dagger but I am unsure which one. The circle of crimson stone meta-org from the BK gives access. The character's home region must be Dyvers or the BK and you have to have played in one BK regional. http://www.bandit-kingdoms.net/meta/ARs/Western%20Reaches/CrimsonStoneAR.pdf Derek S
gomeztoo 05-11-07, 08:57 AM	A whip-dagger acts like a whip. Since there is no 3.0 whip, it acts like a 3.5 whip. Iow it's an exotic melee weapaon with up to 15 foot range, but grants no AoO. At least, that's how I used it so far.
clik_ml 05-11-07, 11:22 AM	A whip-dagger acts like a whip. Since there is no 3.0 whip, it acts like a 3.5 whip. Iow it's an exotic melee weapaon with up to 15 foot range, but grants no AoO. At least, that's how I used it so far. Well if it is a whip-dagger from the Arms and Equipment Guide, then it is listed as a ranged exotic weapon. I don't know of any printings of whip-daggers that postdate the AEG.
gomeztoo 05-12-07, 02:39 AM	Well if it is a whip-dagger from the Arms and Equipment Guide, then it is listed as a ranged exotic weapon. I don't know of any printings of whip-daggers that postdate the AEG. The whip was reprinted though. I think that counts as reference. If not, we'd need a clarification. It doesn't make sense that whip is a melee weapon and whip-dagger is not. Without an explicit statement that whip-daggers are fundamentally different from whips, I'll treat them as melee weapons (unless the DM says otherwise).
LachlarlanIII 05-16-07, 12:18 PM	It doesn't make sense that whip is a melee weapon and whip-dagger is not. Especially since the whip-dagger states it functions as a whip.
Vamroc 05-16-07, 02:11 PM	I got access to a ribbon dagger once it's not very good.
gomeztoo 05-16-07, 02:33 PM	I got access to a ribbon dagger once it's not very good. Found it. Bought it. Never used it.
clik_ml 05-16-07, 03:47 PM	I was gonna drop this, but since you're gonna make stuff up Lachlarlan, I guess I'm still on. Especially since the whip-dagger states it functions as a whip. It actually never states that, but rather that proficiency in a whip grants proficiency with a whip-dagger... and then goes on to explain the mechanics of whip-daggers, which are nearly identical to 3.0 whips difference being that it actually hurts enemies... pretty much. It also has a table where it is a ranged weapon. Hell, I'll just repost AEG's who whip-dagger summary since you didn't read it. Whip-Dagger and Whip-Dagger, Mighty: A character who takes the Exotic Weapon Proficiency (whip) feat is also proficient with the whip-dagger. Unlike standard whips, the whip-daggers ability to deal damage is unhindered by armor bonuses and natural armor bonuses. Although you keep it in hand, the whip-dagger is treated as a ranged weapon with a maximum range of 15 feet and no range penalties. Because the whip-dagger can wrap arond an enemy's leg or other limb, you can make trip attacks with it. If you are triped during your own trip attempt, you can drop the whip dagger to avoid being tripped. You get a +2 bonus on your opposed attack roll when attempting to disarm an opponent (including the roll to keep frmo being disarmed yourself if you fail to disarm your oppponent). A mighty whip-dagger is made with especially heavy material that allows a strong user to take advantage of an above-average Strength score. The mighty whip-dagger allows you to add your Strength bonus to damage, up to the maximum bonus included. And the table went on to list it as a small exotic ranged weapon (note, no 3.5 weapon sizes, since this is a 3.0 weapon) which costs 25gp, does 1d6 slashing damage (19-20/x2 Crit) with a 15' range increment. Oddly the mighty whip-dagger's table listed them as only having X2 Crit... since there's no errata for the whip-dagger (or AEG even) that's another worry point. I will grant that gomeztoo is working from what the intent of the designers almost certainly would be if the weapon were ever reprinted in a 3.5 book... but currently it is statted out quite specifically as a 3.0 small ranged weapon. So there is very legitimate grounds for table variation on stuff like: "Do I have to use Dex modifier as my attack bonus?"; "Do I get to use Dex modifier as my attack bonus without Weapon Finesse?"; "Can I rapid shot with it?"; "Can I power attack with it?".
LachlarlanIII 05-16-07, 04:47 PM	I was gonna drop this, but since you're gonna make stuff up Lachlarlan, I guess I'm still on. First, there's no need to be rude. :mad: Second, I admit I was mistaken. I was misremembering the rules for the Whip-dagger with the rules from the Scourge. And for the record, I have read it. I was considering using it for my trip-fighter.
clik_ml 05-16-07, 06:07 PM	Sorry, I guess I'm edgy today.
dkay807 05-19-07, 01:32 AM	I played a Halfling Lasher that used a Whip Dagger in 3.0 and continued to use one in 3.5 (along with Weapon Finesse and Two-Handed Power Attack). It was insanely powerful and I was quite upset when Sword and Fist was finally phased out of the campaign and I only had one more Lasher level to go before I got Death Spiral (Reflex Save DC = My Attack roll or everyone in a 15 foot radius around me is stunned for 1d4+1 rounds, and then helpless for 1d4-1 rounds). I'm pretty sure you can get a Whip-Dagger in Bissel these days STILL, but hey, without the Lasher prestige class, it's probably no longer worthwhile. ~Dave (still remembers his Stunning Snap, Crack of Doom and Crack of Fate with a Holy, Wounding Adamantine Whip-Dagger)