Why is Living Greyhawk so great? :D [Archive] - Wizards Community

Why is Living Greyhawk so great? :D [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
EberronMoses
10-25-06, 09:31 PM Seriously, why is this campaign so much better than the others? Have fun with this one guys :D ....
Cynric
10-25-06, 09:38 PM Ok, personal experience here so it could be wrong.

Mark of Heroes and other campaigns that have level bumps annoy me as I can never keep up with them, trust me I tried it with Mark of Heroes. Plus there is the fact that I lose a great deal of my enjoyment from seeing the character develop. Some builds are only great at some levels, at least with LG, you have to work at it to get to those sweet points.

Secondly, it is like a home game, at least around here. Youi play with the same group of players generally but there is always a bit of mix and match so you do get exposed to new players and character concepts.

The only thing that annoys me, and I can get past this one is that there seems to be runs on certain character types, Bright Sands brought a lot of front liners and divine casters into the local area. Now no one is making clerics or healing capable builds. Rogues\trapfinders, forget it, Although that could be because of the large amount of undead in the old region (Perrenland).
Japangirl
10-26-06, 01:56 AM All games are fun only to the extent they have rules and say NO to a lot of things. LG has a lot of noes, so making a good solid character within the rules requires ingenuity and hard work.

Anyone can break a game if everything is allowed. While "breaking" LG isn't a good goal, making a powerful character is actually an accomplishment and thus a lot of fun.

I don't like the level bump campaigns, they take the challenge out of it. And retooling your stuff allows for too much flexibility and not enough commitment in gear. If I buy a 10,000g ship for flavor reasons, I need to be stuck with it and not have 10,000g next mod to invest in a resurrection or stat item or uber weapon or whatever.
Lupo
10-26-06, 02:55 AM regional flavour and an overall balanced campaign feeling.

ok, level 1 charcters feel weak and tend to be "a not yet developed personality", but that is just normal, from level 3 onwards a character tends to have earned enough "personal" experience through cores, but even more through regionals (in home region but also on some trips abroad) to become a "real" personality.

the APL system (in theory) gives opportunity to characters of almost every level to act "heroic" or at least "significant".

this might differ due to me being able to travel to another region quite regular and one bigger con or additional region once per year.

the ability to run several characters at different levels and with different builds, while still sharing the same "world".

if you really want to do something funny, just write a regional module for your region :)

ciao

martin m.
trollbill
10-26-06, 09:58 AM 1) LG has been around longer and has had a lot more bugs worked out. I played LotGR, MoH and XE. LotGR was rife with delays, errors and other problems that eventually caused our group to drop it after a year. They are getting progressively better with the Campaign system, but they still have problems.

2) 28 point builds versus 25 point builds. With 25 points I have no choice but to Uber-munch to build a character that can survive what the Campaign throws at me. With 28 points, I can build an effective character and still have a few points left over to build one that actually has character.

3) You can start LG at any time without feeling like you've missed something. You can only do that with the Campaigns if you start from the beginning.

4) You earn every level in LG, so you appreciate your character more. In the Campaign system, if you work hard at it, and they get all the mods out on schedule, you might be able to do this, but you don't have to.

5) Regional flavor.

6) Adventure Records. Despite the additional paperwork, the ARs add a lot of personal flavor to each mod and are great for flipping through occasionally to remaniss about old adventures.

7) Equipment purchasing. In LG, I have to purchase equipment like I would in a normal D&D game. The Campaign systems allow me to purchase whatever I want each time I play. The power gamer in me always wants to min-max my purchases, which means I retool the character each time I play it. But buying equipment is one of my least favorite things to do. Constantly changing my equipment also means that my equipment no longer lends itself to part of the actual character of my character.

8) Less obligation. In LG you can play at whatever pace you want. Want to cram 50 adventures under your belt in a year? You can in LG (if you are willing to travel and play multiple characters). Want to play only 5? You can in LG without feeling you are being left behind by those who play more than that.

9) And my biggest reason for liking LG over the Campaign system is a much greater ability to express individuallity. With different regions, different AR results, and no requirment to play every mod you can or in any particular order, it is unlikely you will find another LG player with the exact same experiences and item access as yours. Every character in LG is much more likely to be different from those in the Campaign system even if they were built the same.
Snappa
10-26-06, 12:24 PM I got into LG simply because no one in my gaming group at the time was willing to DM other than myself. After playing and DMing for 15 years, I found myself in the strange position of having DM'd D&D 3.5 for almost 2 years without ever having played a character. LG put me in touch with games where I could actually play, and learn the system from the other side of the table. It made me a better DM at the same time.

Now, I keep with it because of a number of reasons. Playing with new people at cons, each with a slightly different playstyle is a great benefit. It's amazing how many little things you pick up from other players that you never would if you played with the same table of 5 or 6 all the time. Probably the number one reason is, it's Greyhawk, arguably the best campaign setting ever created. If WOTC isn't going to support the setting with published material, the least I can do is keep it alive by helping out the Living Campaign.

There are some things I don't like about the campaign, but the joy of playing more than makes up for those. Funny thing is, I think I've gotten more rewards points for DMing than I have for playing. But, I play enough that I don't burn out from DMing all the time.
EberronMoses
10-26-06, 10:23 PM I've only seen like, one book for Greyhawk, one novel I mean. I'm kind of glad there isn't too much stuff out on it. Then I'd have to argue with my players over what this town's like and what that, cuz so and so read the book and knows that Baldur's Gate is filled with cats.

After a while, the book readers can drive you crazy :banghead:
paigeoliver
10-26-06, 11:53 PM Greyhawk has far more than one book, it is more like 70 or 80 books. Most of them being 1st and 2nd edition RPG modules and accessories.
_m_
10-27-06, 01:02 AM I've only seen like, one book for Greyhawk, one novel I mean. I'm kind of glad there isn't too much stuff out on it. Then I'd have to argue with my players over what this town's like and what that, cuz so and so read the book and knows that Baldur's Gate is filled with cats.

After a while, the book readers can drive you crazy :banghead:

:banghead:? BANGHEAD!!? thats so mean! the poor little red faced guy!

as for lgh, its awsome because:
you get a real sense of accomplishment, of character, of realism, by developing your character over time. a feeling you dont get in home games.

Plus the restrictions make everything more fun. no overpowered idiots ruining every game.
PaulH
10-29-06, 09:24 PM Hi

LG is organised. You know where you are with LG. (Exept when WotC bring out new 'Core' books which everyone HAS to buy)! :mad:

Since everyone plays to same standards, less cheating/munchkins, easier to fit in games with complete strangers, more time to have FUN!

Cheers
Paul H
amnuxoll
10-31-06, 02:56 PM The bottom line is that there is nothing significant that LG does qualitatively better than other campaigns*. The reason LG is great is quantity not quality. There are literally hundreds of mods to play and 10s of thousands of players. It's the largest, easiest and most accessible campaign. In other words, it's McDonalds.

*Possible exception: LG possibly has the best rules balance in terms of keeping the munchkins at bay.
_m_
10-31-06, 05:26 PM The bottom line is that there is nothing significant that LG does qualitatively better than other campaigns*. The reason LG is great is quantity not quality. There are literally hundreds of mods to play and 10s of thousands of players. It's the largest, easiest and most accessible campaign. In other words, it's McDonalds.

*Possible exception: LG possibly has the best rules balance in terms of keeping the munchkins at bay.

+, mcdonalds is bad for you... lgh is only bad for your characters :D
UMiskatonic
11-03-06, 02:34 PM Actually, the sheer numbers of LG players give you something that most games can't offer: convenience

If I can attend a game, great. If I have to skip one, great. It's big enough that it will move on without me, and unlike a homegame, I don't have to worry about 'falling behind' the rest of the group. There's always a table at your APL. You don't have to give up every Thursday night for the rest of time either.

Additionally, the number of players also gives a sort of realism that most homegames have trouble with. All of those other players are effectively NPC's in the campaign, from your point of view. The number of roleplaying opportunities skyrockets upward as a result, giving you ample opportunities to love or hate your fellow players.
solbergb
11-07-06, 03:40 PM 20 core modules a year

6-8 regional modules a year

6-8 metaregional modules a year

many many regions

hundreds of tables forming at large conventions

tens of tables able to form just by advertising a small convention

game days in major metropolitan areas every week

able to play with folks from around the world even if not in a population center

Structured style that lets you play as much or as little as you have time for, while encouraging those who play a lot to not focus all their time in one character (and instead make tables of other levels than their "main")

In short - it's the play opportunities. If I have time, I can play. If I want to DM, I can find players. Plus it's a good setting, etc.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
EberronMoses 10-25-06, 09:31 PM	Seriously, why is this campaign so much better than the others? Have fun with this one guys :D ....
Cynric 10-25-06, 09:38 PM	Ok, personal experience here so it could be wrong. Mark of Heroes and other campaigns that have level bumps annoy me as I can never keep up with them, trust me I tried it with Mark of Heroes. Plus there is the fact that I lose a great deal of my enjoyment from seeing the character develop. Some builds are only great at some levels, at least with LG, you have to work at it to get to those sweet points. Secondly, it is like a home game, at least around here. Youi play with the same group of players generally but there is always a bit of mix and match so you do get exposed to new players and character concepts. The only thing that annoys me, and I can get past this one is that there seems to be runs on certain character types, Bright Sands brought a lot of front liners and divine casters into the local area. Now no one is making clerics or healing capable builds. Rogues\trapfinders, forget it, Although that could be because of the large amount of undead in the old region (Perrenland).
Japangirl 10-26-06, 01:56 AM	All games are fun only to the extent they have rules and say NO to a lot of things. LG has a lot of noes, so making a good solid character within the rules requires ingenuity and hard work. Anyone can break a game if everything is allowed. While "breaking" LG isn't a good goal, making a powerful character is actually an accomplishment and thus a lot of fun. I don't like the level bump campaigns, they take the challenge out of it. And retooling your stuff allows for too much flexibility and not enough commitment in gear. If I buy a 10,000g ship for flavor reasons, I need to be stuck with it and not have 10,000g next mod to invest in a resurrection or stat item or uber weapon or whatever.
Lupo 10-26-06, 02:55 AM	regional flavour and an overall balanced campaign feeling. ok, level 1 charcters feel weak and tend to be "a not yet developed personality", but that is just normal, from level 3 onwards a character tends to have earned enough "personal" experience through cores, but even more through regionals (in home region but also on some trips abroad) to become a "real" personality. the APL system (in theory) gives opportunity to characters of almost every level to act "heroic" or at least "significant". this might differ due to me being able to travel to another region quite regular and one bigger con or additional region once per year. the ability to run several characters at different levels and with different builds, while still sharing the same "world". if you really want to do something funny, just write a regional module for your region :) ciao martin m.
trollbill 10-26-06, 09:58 AM	1) LG has been around longer and has had a lot more bugs worked out. I played LotGR, MoH and XE. LotGR was rife with delays, errors and other problems that eventually caused our group to drop it after a year. They are getting progressively better with the Campaign system, but they still have problems. 2) 28 point builds versus 25 point builds. With 25 points I have no choice but to Uber-munch to build a character that can survive what the Campaign throws at me. With 28 points, I can build an effective character and still have a few points left over to build one that actually has character. 3) You can start LG at any time without feeling like you've missed something. You can only do that with the Campaigns if you start from the beginning. 4) You earn every level in LG, so you appreciate your character more. In the Campaign system, if you work hard at it, and they get all the mods out on schedule, you might be able to do this, but you don't have to. 5) Regional flavor. 6) Adventure Records. Despite the additional paperwork, the ARs add a lot of personal flavor to each mod and are great for flipping through occasionally to remaniss about old adventures. 7) Equipment purchasing. In LG, I have to purchase equipment like I would in a normal D&D game. The Campaign systems allow me to purchase whatever I want each time I play. The power gamer in me always wants to min-max my purchases, which means I retool the character each time I play it. But buying equipment is one of my least favorite things to do. Constantly changing my equipment also means that my equipment no longer lends itself to part of the actual character of my character. 8) Less obligation. In LG you can play at whatever pace you want. Want to cram 50 adventures under your belt in a year? You can in LG (if you are willing to travel and play multiple characters). Want to play only 5? You can in LG without feeling you are being left behind by those who play more than that. 9) And my biggest reason for liking LG over the Campaign system is a much greater ability to express individuallity. With different regions, different AR results, and no requirment to play every mod you can or in any particular order, it is unlikely you will find another LG player with the exact same experiences and item access as yours. Every character in LG is much more likely to be different from those in the Campaign system even if they were built the same.
Snappa 10-26-06, 12:24 PM	I got into LG simply because no one in my gaming group at the time was willing to DM other than myself. After playing and DMing for 15 years, I found myself in the strange position of having DM'd D&D 3.5 for almost 2 years without ever having played a character. LG put me in touch with games where I could actually play, and learn the system from the other side of the table. It made me a better DM at the same time. Now, I keep with it because of a number of reasons. Playing with new people at cons, each with a slightly different playstyle is a great benefit. It's amazing how many little things you pick up from other players that you never would if you played with the same table of 5 or 6 all the time. Probably the number one reason is, it's Greyhawk, arguably the best campaign setting ever created. If WOTC isn't going to support the setting with published material, the least I can do is keep it alive by helping out the Living Campaign. There are some things I don't like about the campaign, but the joy of playing more than makes up for those. Funny thing is, I think I've gotten more rewards points for DMing than I have for playing. But, I play enough that I don't burn out from DMing all the time.
EberronMoses 10-26-06, 10:23 PM	I've only seen like, one book for Greyhawk, one novel I mean. I'm kind of glad there isn't too much stuff out on it. Then I'd have to argue with my players over what this town's like and what that, cuz so and so read the book and knows that Baldur's Gate is filled with cats. After a while, the book readers can drive you crazy :banghead:
paigeoliver 10-26-06, 11:53 PM	Greyhawk has far more than one book, it is more like 70 or 80 books. Most of them being 1st and 2nd edition RPG modules and accessories.
_m_ 10-27-06, 01:02 AM	I've only seen like, one book for Greyhawk, one novel I mean. I'm kind of glad there isn't too much stuff out on it. Then I'd have to argue with my players over what this town's like and what that, cuz so and so read the book and knows that Baldur's Gate is filled with cats. After a while, the book readers can drive you crazy :banghead: :banghead:? BANGHEAD!!? thats so mean! the poor little red faced guy! as for lgh, its awsome because: you get a real sense of accomplishment, of character, of realism, by developing your character over time. a feeling you dont get in home games. Plus the restrictions make everything more fun. no overpowered idiots ruining every game.
PaulH 10-29-06, 09:24 PM	Hi LG is organised. You know where you are with LG. (Exept when WotC bring out new 'Core' books which everyone HAS to buy)! :mad: Since everyone plays to same standards, less cheating/munchkins, easier to fit in games with complete strangers, more time to have FUN! Cheers Paul H
amnuxoll 10-31-06, 02:56 PM	The bottom line is that there is nothing significant that LG does qualitatively better than other campaigns. The reason LG is great is quantity not quality. There are literally hundreds of mods to play and 10s of thousands of players. It's the largest, easiest and most accessible campaign. In other words, it's McDonalds. Possible exception: LG possibly has the best rules balance in terms of keeping the munchkins at bay.
_m_ 10-31-06, 05:26 PM	The bottom line is that there is nothing significant that LG does qualitatively better than other campaigns. The reason LG is great is quantity not quality. There are literally hundreds of mods to play and 10s of thousands of players. It's the largest, easiest and most accessible campaign. In other words, it's McDonalds. Possible exception: LG possibly has the best rules balance in terms of keeping the munchkins at bay. +, mcdonalds is bad for you... lgh is only bad for your characters :D
UMiskatonic 11-03-06, 02:34 PM	Actually, the sheer numbers of LG players give you something that most games can't offer: convenience If I can attend a game, great. If I have to skip one, great. It's big enough that it will move on without me, and unlike a homegame, I don't have to worry about 'falling behind' the rest of the group. There's always a table at your APL. You don't have to give up every Thursday night for the rest of time either. Additionally, the number of players also gives a sort of realism that most homegames have trouble with. All of those other players are effectively NPC's in the campaign, from your point of view. The number of roleplaying opportunities skyrockets upward as a result, giving you ample opportunities to love or hate your fellow players.
solbergb 11-07-06, 03:40 PM	20 core modules a year 6-8 regional modules a year 6-8 metaregional modules a year many many regions hundreds of tables forming at large conventions tens of tables able to form just by advertising a small convention game days in major metropolitan areas every week able to play with folks from around the world even if not in a population center Structured style that lets you play as much or as little as you have time for, while encouraging those who play a lot to not focus all their time in one character (and instead make tables of other levels than their "main") In short - it's the play opportunities. If I have time, I can play. If I want to DM, I can find players. Plus it's a good setting, etc.