Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Harmor 02-18-04, 01:04 AM	Lesser Magic Missile Evocation [Force] Level: Sor/Wiz 0 Components: V, S Casting Time: 1 standard action Range: Close (25 ft. + 5 ft./2 levels) Targets: One creature Duration: Instantaneous Saving Throw: None Spell Resistance: Yes A missile of magical energy darts forth from your fingertip and strikes its target, dealing 1 point of damage per four caster levels (maximum 3 at level 12). The missile strikes unerringly, even if the target is in melee combat or has less than total cover or total concealment. Specific parts of a creature can’t be singled out. Inanimate objects are not damaged by the spell.
jokotoko 02-18-04, 02:56 AM	Euuh...sure why not....doesn't seem to be too powerful or anything...
smrtgmp 02-18-04, 05:47 AM	If youre going to cap the damage at three, why not make it increase every level? It still might come in handy at 3rd level, but by the time your casting 6th level spells, this will be completely useless.
Bloodtide_the_Red 02-18-04, 06:16 AM	Waiting for 12th level to do a whole 3 points of damage is a bit much. I like the one per level idea. Though maybe make the cap 5, at 5th level. I can see some use for this spell in getting rid of wounded creatures/vermin. The auto hit is nice...I've seen a battle or two where the opponent is down to like four hit points...but the players just keep missing. Then it's always nice to be able to take out a rat or such without wasting a 'real' spell. BT
Harmor 02-18-04, 06:21 AM	It would exceed the damage cap for a 0th level arcane spell. A 0th level spell should not do any more than 1/2 a die of damage. UNLESS its further restricted. Example: Acid Splash is a ranged touch attack that does 1d3. Example: Distrupt Undead does 1d6 but only to Undead A level 1 Magic missle cast by a level 1 caster does 1d4+1 (average 3.5 or 2-5 and maxes at 5d4+5, average 17.5 or 10-25). If it was 1 point per level then it would do more than the average damage by level 18. And remember a 0th level spell should not do more than 1/2 die damage, especially with no save/no miss spell.
Bloodtide_the_Red 02-18-04, 06:44 AM	A 0th level spell should not do any more than 1/2 a die of damage. UNLESS its further restricted Is this a house rule...the DMG table does not even list 0 level spells. If it was 1 point per level then it would do more than the average damage by level 18. Not with a damage cap of 5. At 5th level, and above, the spell does five points of damage. And remember a 0th level spell should not do more than 1/2 die damage, especially with no save/no miss spell. When we figure '1/2 die damage' what die are we using? Five points of damage would be less then half a 1d12? It's hard to say a 'magic missle' spell is over powered...as magic missle is of course overpowered. Most people let magic missle slip by though..... Maybe limit the spell by reducing the range to just 25'? BT
Seeker95 02-18-04, 09:51 AM	Lesser Magic Missile Evocation [Force] Level: Sor/Wiz 0 Components: V, S Casting Time: 1 standard action Range: Close (25 ft. + 5 ft./2 levels) Targets: One creature Duration: Instantaneous Saving Throw: None Spell Resistance: Yes A missile of magical energy darts forth from your fingertip and strikes its target, dealing 1 point of damage per caster level (maximum 4 at level 4). The missile strikes unerringly, even if the target is in melee combat or has less than total cover or total concealment. Specific parts of a creature can’t be singled out. Inanimate objects are not damaged by the spell. ***** Changes? 1. Damage is one point / level 2. Max damage is 4 While there are no "damage caps" listed for cantrips/orisons, there is precedence. Disrupt undead is the only cantrip to cause more than 3 points of damage (without resorting to metamagic.)
Sproik 02-18-04, 09:54 AM	Don't forget the other damaging cantrips need an attack roll to hit. If I let someone make an instant-hit force attack at level 0, it would deal 1 point of damage - that's it. Just 1.
SpellMaster 02-18-04, 11:11 AM	Make it just like the Psionic Power Far Punch. One point of damage at range that auto hits. No scaling except for range. Remember, Ray of Frost does only d3, and requires a ranged touch attack. Something that does four points, with no attack roll needed, is beyond a cantrip.
dantedarkstar 02-18-04, 12:02 PM	Yep, yep. SpellMaster is right. It's probably still better than Far Punch, because it's force effect, so it can hit incorporeal and even ethereal opponents w/o problem. (dunno if that Far Punch is force or not).
SpellMaster 02-18-04, 01:48 PM	I thought it was a force effect, but I'm not currently certain. Oh well, maybe a set range then to balance it. Say, 15 or 25 feet.
Sancus 02-18-04, 02:52 PM	ranged touch attack cantrips are more powerful than this because you can get sneak attack damage on them. 1d3 damage doesn't seem like a lot, until you realize that an arcane trickster/rogue can stack many d6s of damage on top of that for the cost of only a cantrip. Consequently, 1/caster level up to level 3 or 4 seems fine.
gpstar 02-18-04, 03:13 PM	Originally posted by Bloodtide_the_Red It's hard to say a 'magic missle' spell is over powered...as magic missle is of course overpowered. Most people let magic missle slip by though..... BT saying magic missle is overpowered is saying D&D is broken...I'm sorry that arguement is nothing more than melee character favored player propaganda. Oh, the poor wizard gets a spell that does some damage that you dont' have an at least 50% chance to avoid. OH my! WotC please stop this! a wizard's spell actually working? NO NO NO! I want crapy DCs of spells so I can resist all magic with my ridiculously high saving throws and evasion skill making magic completely unrealiable and spell casting classes useless!
Seeker95 02-18-04, 03:17 PM	gpstar, So are you in favor of the spell as presented, making a suggested change, or otherwise approving or disapproving of the porposed spell? :P
Beamup 02-18-04, 03:29 PM	I think Seeker's version is good.
gpstar 02-18-04, 03:39 PM	I approve of the spell....max of 3 dmg. but my stance on magic still stands!
Seeker95 02-18-04, 04:21 PM	For the record, please let it be said that I do not consider what I typed above to be "my version". Rather, I just took the time to type up what should be known as Harmor's Revised Version.
FlyingCowKing 02-18-04, 05:36 PM	C'mon! let's try harder!!! Lesser Lesser Lesser Magic Missile Evocation [Force] Level: Sor/Wiz 0 Components: V, S Casting Time: 1 standard action Range: Close (25 ft. + 5 ft./2 levels) Targets: One creature Duration: Instantaneous Saving Throw: None Spell Resistance: Yes A missile of magical energy darts forth from your fingertip and strikes its target, dealing 0 points of damage per caster level (maximum 0 at level 20!), but parting the targets hair on the other side. The missile strikes unerringly, even if the target is in melee combat or has less than total cover or total concealment, although any hat or fancy hairband the target wears negates the spell's effect. Bald creatures and comb-over creatures can’t be singled out. Inanimate objects are not damaged by the spell, unless they are chia pets, or idle, unused toupee's. Too ova powered?! Whad'ya think!! :D
Mutant for Hire 02-18-04, 05:58 PM	I like Seeker's with a slight modification: It shoots out one missile per level, each doing 1 hp of damage, with a maximum of three missiles. In some ways that makes it comparable to the cure cantrip and simulates the "multiple missile" effect of the more powerful spell.
Harmor 02-18-04, 06:28 PM	I like Seeker95's version too. I'll submit it to my DM and see what he says. Remember this is 'Lesser' Magic missle so keeping the multiple targets concept is good. Thanks for your critique guys.
Tehril 02-18-04, 07:48 PM	Have it deal 1d3 points of force damage, auto hit. No Sneak Attack allowed, damage is precisely the same as the other cantrips. The auto hit and Forece descriptor should make up for the inability to SA. Case closed.
sneak_Blast 02-12-06, 08:06 PM	look at ray of frost... 1d3 damage... need ranged touch... makes spell useless compared to....
Nom 02-12-06, 08:58 PM	My preference would be 1 point per missile, 1 missile +1 per two levels (max 3 at level 5). This seems in line with both the "real" MM and the acid splash / ray of frost cantrips (which require a to-hit roll).
legowarrior 02-12-06, 09:54 PM	You could make it a little more powerful if you made it 1d4-1, +1 missile per 2 levels after 1st, with a maximun of 5 missiles, just like magic missile. So in the end, at 9th level, it would be 5d4-5 damage. Could be really weak, or not. so a max of 15 damage. Maybe a little powerful, but it is between - and 15 damage.
tuffn00gies 09-17-06, 12:42 PM	Make it just like the Psionic Power Far Punch. One point of damage at range that auto hits. No scaling except for range. Remember, Ray of Frost does only d3, and requires a ranged touch attack. Something that does four points, with no attack roll needed, is beyond a cantrip. It's 4 points at 4th level. That's a big difference.
Neutronium_Dragon 09-17-06, 01:10 PM	Cantrips don't normally scale, so it's probably better not to scale it. It's probably fine at 1d3 damage for several reasons: You can't sneak attack with it, you can't critical with it, and you can't get added damage from fire/cold vulnerability. Plus there's the fact that the damage output is relatively inconsequential in any case, as would be any die size fiddling to try to distinguish it from the rest. The alternative would be for it to do 1 point of damage and have some secondary effect like Horizakul's Cough/Sonic Snap does. In this case perhaps 1 damage and -1 to attack for one round (you're pushed slightly off balance).
jaelis 09-17-06, 01:40 PM	I would add a line that the missile can be blocked by a Brooch of Shielding, but that it doesn't use up one of the Brooch's charges.
M.E. Charm 02-06-07, 11:18 AM	I liked the idea untill I saw the damage increases with level. 1 point of damage which always hits is as good as Virtue giving +1 hp. Just one missle, 1 point of damage. Why, you could kill a cat or lizard with two castings!
Bladegeek 02-06-07, 11:37 AM	What is the point.......damage spells and cantrips seem a little silly. One point of damage? Use a dagger instead.
boozerker 02-06-07, 01:41 PM	Magic Punch Evocation [Force] Level: Sor/Wiz 0 Components: V, S Casting Time: 1 standard action Range: Close (25 ft. + 5 ft./2 levels) Targets: One creature Duration: Instantaneous Saving Throw: None Spell Resistance: Yes A fisted ball of magical energy darts forth from your hand and strikes its target, dealing 1 point of nonlethal damage per caster level (maximum 4 at level 4). The ball strikes unerringly, even if the target has less than total cover or total concealment. Specific parts of a creature can’t be singled out. ------------- There fixed :)
Shaftiel 02-06-07, 03:04 PM	Actually, I think this spell is more useful at a flat 1 point. Then you can use it to wake up sleeping companions, distract people who are confused, stuff like that. Barring that I'd cap it at 3 pts, although I can't see how 4 points is broken. Just a personal decision. -Shaftiel