9th level Sorcerer, what spells? [Archive] - Wizards Community

9th level Sorcerer, what spells? [Archive] - Wizards Community

Post/Author/DateTime Post
Metabubbles
05-11-04, 08:08 AM Assume nothing, and remember everything. Anyways I have a 8th level sorcerer close to becoming 9th and will need a 2nd, 3rd and 4th level spells. Which ones should I pick?

A little background, I am an evocation fiend, I am going to switch my silent door 0-level spell (exact spell i forget) for acid splash so i can attain the feat, "master of the elements" (exact feat I forget also, but lets just say all my spells energies I will be able to change, for example, fireball; from fire to 'acid'). I currently have Improved Invisibility (4th), fireball and lightning bolt (3rd), Web, Scorching Ray (2nd). I would like to get 'dispel magic' 3rd, 'knock' or 'darkvision' 2nd, and I am stuck on what 4th level spell I should take.

Please help, thanks.
Aramas
05-11-04, 09:29 AM Knock and Dispel Magic are both very good choices for your 2nd and 3rd level spells respectively.

4th level spells are tough, there aren't any real stand outs that say "You must pick me"
Since you are a blaster mage, Blast of Flame from the MiniHB would be good. 1d6/level fire in a 60 ft cone. No SR.
Kyuketsukiouji
05-11-04, 11:20 AM I'd consider Shatter, which is a pretty useful spell, expecially combined with Dispel Magic.

It can be quite useful sometimes to be able to disable someone's equipment and then wreck it.
dantedarkstar
05-11-04, 12:59 PM For a blaster type sorcerer, I guess I would get Enervation. It is BAD (as in BBEG, not as in Int 10 Wizard). Anything not immune to it has to fear it.
Can soften almost any target.

If not Enervation, then Dimension Door. Ability to get out of tight situations is always good. All your spells have range, so you want to keep away from baddies. DD helps a lot in that. Unless you are silenced, you can even get out of grapples.
Teydyn
05-11-04, 02:01 PM 4th level spells are tough, there aren't any real stand outs that say "You must pick me"

Hmm, for me Polymorph is real standout:
Flying, burrowing, diving, small, strong creatures.

And its the ultimate sorcerer healing spell (healing your lvl in hp on changing).

And maybe Dimension Door.
Lemmose
05-11-04, 02:41 PM I'd say that alot of what everyone has said is good, but at this point of the game I'd be asking what you're lacking in, which demands greatly on what your DM is pitting you against.

If you're fighting alot and getting into close melee (and taking lots of damage) I'd say Stoneskin (helps out you or a target, thus if your healers spells tend to run out, the party gains more endurance), if its just you having trouble, Dimension Door (as pointed out earlier) would be good.

If you're facing alot of magic users you may want to consider Globe of Invulnerability, Minor (however, if you plan on taking the regular for of this spell later, you may not want to have both of these, as a sorcerer has limited spells).

Enervation and Polymorph are also good (for reasons stated above), but if you want to go with the theme or elemetal attacks as you have, I'd do either Wall of Ice/Fire (face it, you take one you'll have the other with that feat you mentioned), or Fire Shield (anything that gets close gets torched, works as a substatute for Stone Skine and DD), or maybe Ice Storm (I did say maybe, afterall, Blast of Fire does sound better to me, but I don't have the book to judge).

Btw, in which book is Master of the Elements?
Lemmose
smrtgmp
05-11-04, 05:43 PM Originally posted by Lemmose

Btw, in which book is Master of the Elements?
Lemmose
I think hes refering to Energy Substitution. He said he couldnt remember the name, but Energy Substitution fits his description.

Other than the spells mentioned above, I would reccomend Evard's Black Tentacles. Its one of my favorite 4th level spells, simply because they cant be hurt. You can tie up your enemies and then blast them from a far with your magic while they are sitting ducks. This is especially good if a lot of your spells allow reflex saves. Greater Invisiblilty is also any Arcane casters best friend, especially if you're going to pick up fly somewhere along the way.

Edit: If you're going for energy substitution, you might also want to concider its big brother, Energy Admixture. Its in TaB, and its a doozie.
Mizter_Ed
05-11-04, 07:53 PM I agree that Evard's Black Tentacles is a great spell. I played sorcerer that used that spell alot. It can grapple enemies and you can blast em' (they're immune to all damage) with several fireballs (which covers the same radius) before they can get out. Even if they're not grappled their movement is still halved. Great spell IMO.
The Simbul
05-11-04, 08:03 PM Shatter > Knock, not to mention the fact that a Shatter spell can accomplish virtually the exact same thing.
Metabubbles
05-11-04, 09:05 PM I like the fact that knock can loosen shackles and chains. I otherwise agree that shatter is a good spell.

Thank you all who have contributed, I believe I will go for the Wall of fire for the simple fact of the next feat I take.

Thanks again.
Myst
05-11-04, 11:28 PM phantasmal killer is a decent 4th lvl pick. and its definitely great against rogue-ish types, hence is why i like to call it "rogue killer". though enervation is hard to beat, rogue killer is an pretty good pick in some situations.
CaoSlayer
05-12-04, 06:06 AM ummm, at those levels, dispell magic would be useless...

you arent going to fight against 10th level casters.
smrtgmp
05-12-04, 07:52 AM Why wouldnt a 9th level sorcerer be battleing 10th level spell casters? Regardless, dispel magic is never a bad choice for a spell, even if its later replaced with GDM.
CaoSlayer
05-12-04, 12:26 PM Originally posted by smrtgmp
Why wouldnt a 9th level sorcerer be battleing 10th level spell casters?

ops, I didnt readed well the topic, I readed 19th level

:mad:

then, dispell it is a must have spell :D
The Simbul
05-13-04, 01:45 AM Originally posted by Metabubbles
I like the fact that knock can loosen shackles and chains. I otherwise agree that shatter is a good spell.
Shatter can remove Shackles as well...

[edit] just remebered that Knock only has a Verbal component, which can be more handy if you yourself are shackled, whereas Shatter has somatic and material. II was thinking in terms of my Sorcerer builds, which always include all three component removing feats (silent spell, still spell, eschew materials).
Shadowfoot
05-13-04, 02:37 AM I like sorcerer spells that have various applications, to take advantage of your limited spells known, so my vote for 4th would be polymorph. Flying, breathing water, biting, burrowing, disguise, healing, etc. On you or allies. Low on hps? Polymorph. Need to get to the other side of a chasm? Polymorph. Need to be present but not noticed? Polymorph. It's many spells in one.

For 3rd level, dispel magic - will always come in handy. If you have plenty of dispellers in your party (a cleric, say) then of course fireball. Something tells me your evocative sorcerer already has that spell. :smirk:

2nd level: Knock is handy, but it depends on your party. But perhaps three utility spells is too much, so go for web or scorching ray, if you haven't already.
Metabubbles
05-13-04, 11:31 AM Yes I do have Web, Fireball (nice combo if you ask me), & lightning bolt. The reason for the Dispel magic, well we have a wand of dispel magic at the lowest possible level, and well honestly it sucks. So I will make that difference up.

I am leaning towards the feat that elimantes the 3 spell components, which one should I take first? Also are they more important than 'Energy Substitution', or 'Greater Spell Focus' feats? Right now my DC on evocation spells is 19, Greater would jump it to a 20. Or energy substitution will allow all my evoc spells to be whatever energy I decide (I honestly think this will make my sorcerer more flexible in fights).

I almost forgot, polymorph rocks, but I can't cast spells while in polymorph form, if I am to get a feat which one? Should I go w/polymorph AND get the Natural Spell feat. Wow, so many freaking decisions, lol

Thanks again for the info.
Lewin
05-13-04, 12:46 PM I wouldn't vote for polymorph+Natural Spell. You can use your feats for something better, like Energy Substitution or Spell Focus. However, choosing Polymorph does not completely eliminate your ability to do spellcasting. You should still be able to polymorph into elves and humans, and dragons, and other forms that are naturally capable of spellcasting and continue to cast spells. Polymorph also acts as a "Alter Self" spell, which is rather handy at times.

Choosing between those two feats, I would vote for Energy Substition. +1 to DC's is nice, but it's never critical. Being able to use sonic damage when you need to is actually critical sometimes.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
Metabubbles 05-11-04, 08:08 AM	Assume nothing, and remember everything. Anyways I have a 8th level sorcerer close to becoming 9th and will need a 2nd, 3rd and 4th level spells. Which ones should I pick? A little background, I am an evocation fiend, I am going to switch my silent door 0-level spell (exact spell i forget) for acid splash so i can attain the feat, "master of the elements" (exact feat I forget also, but lets just say all my spells energies I will be able to change, for example, fireball; from fire to 'acid'). I currently have Improved Invisibility (4th), fireball and lightning bolt (3rd), Web, Scorching Ray (2nd). I would like to get 'dispel magic' 3rd, 'knock' or 'darkvision' 2nd, and I am stuck on what 4th level spell I should take. Please help, thanks.
Aramas 05-11-04, 09:29 AM	Knock and Dispel Magic are both very good choices for your 2nd and 3rd level spells respectively. 4th level spells are tough, there aren't any real stand outs that say "You must pick me" Since you are a blaster mage, Blast of Flame from the MiniHB would be good. 1d6/level fire in a 60 ft cone. No SR.
Kyuketsukiouji 05-11-04, 11:20 AM	I'd consider Shatter, which is a pretty useful spell, expecially combined with Dispel Magic. It can be quite useful sometimes to be able to disable someone's equipment and then wreck it.
dantedarkstar 05-11-04, 12:59 PM	For a blaster type sorcerer, I guess I would get Enervation. It is BAD (as in BBEG, not as in Int 10 Wizard). Anything not immune to it has to fear it. Can soften almost any target. If not Enervation, then Dimension Door. Ability to get out of tight situations is always good. All your spells have range, so you want to keep away from baddies. DD helps a lot in that. Unless you are silenced, you can even get out of grapples.
Teydyn 05-11-04, 02:01 PM	4th level spells are tough, there aren't any real stand outs that say "You must pick me" Hmm, for me Polymorph is real standout: Flying, burrowing, diving, small, strong creatures. And its the ultimate sorcerer healing spell (healing your lvl in hp on changing). And maybe Dimension Door.
Lemmose 05-11-04, 02:41 PM	I'd say that alot of what everyone has said is good, but at this point of the game I'd be asking what you're lacking in, which demands greatly on what your DM is pitting you against. If you're fighting alot and getting into close melee (and taking lots of damage) I'd say Stoneskin (helps out you or a target, thus if your healers spells tend to run out, the party gains more endurance), if its just you having trouble, Dimension Door (as pointed out earlier) would be good. If you're facing alot of magic users you may want to consider Globe of Invulnerability, Minor (however, if you plan on taking the regular for of this spell later, you may not want to have both of these, as a sorcerer has limited spells). Enervation and Polymorph are also good (for reasons stated above), but if you want to go with the theme or elemetal attacks as you have, I'd do either Wall of Ice/Fire (face it, you take one you'll have the other with that feat you mentioned), or Fire Shield (anything that gets close gets torched, works as a substatute for Stone Skine and DD), or maybe Ice Storm (I did say maybe, afterall, Blast of Fire does sound better to me, but I don't have the book to judge). Btw, in which book is Master of the Elements? Lemmose
smrtgmp 05-11-04, 05:43 PM	Originally posted by Lemmose Btw, in which book is Master of the Elements? Lemmose I think hes refering to Energy Substitution. He said he couldnt remember the name, but Energy Substitution fits his description. Other than the spells mentioned above, I would reccomend Evard's Black Tentacles. Its one of my favorite 4th level spells, simply because they cant be hurt. You can tie up your enemies and then blast them from a far with your magic while they are sitting ducks. This is especially good if a lot of your spells allow reflex saves. Greater Invisiblilty is also any Arcane casters best friend, especially if you're going to pick up fly somewhere along the way. Edit: If you're going for energy substitution, you might also want to concider its big brother, Energy Admixture. Its in TaB, and its a doozie.
Mizter_Ed 05-11-04, 07:53 PM	I agree that Evard's Black Tentacles is a great spell. I played sorcerer that used that spell alot. It can grapple enemies and you can blast em' (they're immune to all damage) with several fireballs (which covers the same radius) before they can get out. Even if they're not grappled their movement is still halved. Great spell IMO.
The Simbul 05-11-04, 08:03 PM	Shatter > Knock, not to mention the fact that a Shatter spell can accomplish virtually the exact same thing.
Metabubbles 05-11-04, 09:05 PM	I like the fact that knock can loosen shackles and chains. I otherwise agree that shatter is a good spell. Thank you all who have contributed, I believe I will go for the Wall of fire for the simple fact of the next feat I take. Thanks again.
Myst 05-11-04, 11:28 PM	phantasmal killer is a decent 4th lvl pick. and its definitely great against rogue-ish types, hence is why i like to call it "rogue killer". though enervation is hard to beat, rogue killer is an pretty good pick in some situations.
CaoSlayer 05-12-04, 06:06 AM	ummm, at those levels, dispell magic would be useless... you arent going to fight against 10th level casters.
smrtgmp 05-12-04, 07:52 AM	Why wouldnt a 9th level sorcerer be battleing 10th level spell casters? Regardless, dispel magic is never a bad choice for a spell, even if its later replaced with GDM.
CaoSlayer 05-12-04, 12:26 PM	Originally posted by smrtgmp Why wouldnt a 9th level sorcerer be battleing 10th level spell casters? ops, I didnt readed well the topic, I readed 19th level :mad: then, dispell it is a must have spell :D
The Simbul 05-13-04, 01:45 AM	Originally posted by Metabubbles I like the fact that knock can loosen shackles and chains. I otherwise agree that shatter is a good spell. Shatter can remove Shackles as well... [edit] just remebered that Knock only has a Verbal component, which can be more handy if you yourself are shackled, whereas Shatter has somatic and material. II was thinking in terms of my Sorcerer builds, which always include all three component removing feats (silent spell, still spell, eschew materials).
Shadowfoot 05-13-04, 02:37 AM	I like sorcerer spells that have various applications, to take advantage of your limited spells known, so my vote for 4th would be polymorph. Flying, breathing water, biting, burrowing, disguise, healing, etc. On you or allies. Low on hps? Polymorph. Need to get to the other side of a chasm? Polymorph. Need to be present but not noticed? Polymorph. It's many spells in one. For 3rd level, dispel magic - will always come in handy. If you have plenty of dispellers in your party (a cleric, say) then of course fireball. Something tells me your evocative sorcerer already has that spell. :smirk: 2nd level: Knock is handy, but it depends on your party. But perhaps three utility spells is too much, so go for web or scorching ray, if you haven't already.
Metabubbles 05-13-04, 11:31 AM	Yes I do have Web, Fireball (nice combo if you ask me), & lightning bolt. The reason for the Dispel magic, well we have a wand of dispel magic at the lowest possible level, and well honestly it sucks. So I will make that difference up. I am leaning towards the feat that elimantes the 3 spell components, which one should I take first? Also are they more important than 'Energy Substitution', or 'Greater Spell Focus' feats? Right now my DC on evocation spells is 19, Greater would jump it to a 20. Or energy substitution will allow all my evoc spells to be whatever energy I decide (I honestly think this will make my sorcerer more flexible in fights). I almost forgot, polymorph rocks, but I can't cast spells while in polymorph form, if I am to get a feat which one? Should I go w/polymorph AND get the Natural Spell feat. Wow, so many freaking decisions, lol Thanks again for the info.
Lewin 05-13-04, 12:46 PM	I wouldn't vote for polymorph+Natural Spell. You can use your feats for something better, like Energy Substitution or Spell Focus. However, choosing Polymorph does not completely eliminate your ability to do spellcasting. You should still be able to polymorph into elves and humans, and dragons, and other forms that are naturally capable of spellcasting and continue to cast spells. Polymorph also acts as a "Alter Self" spell, which is rather handy at times. Choosing between those two feats, I would vote for Energy Substition. +1 to DC's is nice, but it's never critical. Being able to use sonic damage when you need to is actually critical sometimes.